The Jordan Love Thread

[OldSchool101]

Any first round draft pick who isn’ta starter during his rookie contract, in my opinion, is a terrible draft pick. Arguments otherwise are simply weird and only ever come from people defending the Love pick. No other first round pick that i can think of has received this kind of support.

I would agree in part. A Notable Exception would be at the QB position, because it’s by far the toughest position to grasp. There has never been a Rookie QB who has played in a SB (if you research this and find it’s the truth.. be sure to leave me a “like” for being informative and truthful)

We don’t need to go far to disprove this needing to start Rookie season bit, as Rashan Gary did not start and we largely supported him from similar attacks. Several posters said he was a complete waste if I recall?

I’ll just add that I don’t think our plan A was to ever stick Jordan in year 1 as our starter. By all scouting accounts he was always more projection than production. That might sound weird, but it just is what it is. Apparently everything sounds weird these days. Someone can tell me the sky is Red, but if I say otherwise? I’ve then insulted them because they are color blind (they react in a defensive and vindictive manner).

 

[PikeBadger]

I'll try to clear it up for you Pike. Didn't think it was that complicated. If all Love was doing was replacing Rodgers, immediately after he was drafted or in a year, he'd have the "baggage" of following two HOF QBs. It was the same with Rodgers when he replaced Favre.

Now it turns out Gluten was wrong and Rodgers is fine. He's played two years since Love was picked and won two MVPs and Love, a first round pick, just sits while Rodgers signs a new, huge contract. Now the weight, or "baggage", on love is even greater. And the fans who never thought he should have been drafted in the first place are getting more and more vocal. "We shoulda picked a WR dammit!" More "baggage" for Love to carry.

Maybe "baggage" isn't a good metaphor. My point is that through no fault of his own, Love is gonna have a tough time in GB. IMO it's best to trade him to a team where he has a chance, and doesn't have the "baggage" he's accumulated in GB. He seems like a good guy and I'm sure he wants to play and prove himself.

Hope that helps.

You're right. Baggage isn't a good metaphor.

Someone will eventually replace Rodgers. I want it to be someone good.

I hope for your sake and others here who have made such declarations that Gutekunst was wrong, that Rodgers never publicly states that drafting Love put a chip on his shoulder and provided him with great motivation to improve his game.

 

[Heyjoe4]

This better explains your disappointment with Love being drafted. Most fans of college football and anyone vesting a bit of time into the pre-draft stuff, knew who Love was. Some Scouts actually put him top 10, with a very high upside.

Now I understand your dislike for the pick better.

I'm still more dissatisfied with the pick than Love. I would have preferred a WR. Higgins and Pittman were available at #30. But yeah, usually the top QB prospects get a ton of press on draft night. I don't remember Love's name mentioned until GB took him. I guess whatever upside some scouts saw has vanished. Top 10 QBs are rare. I think some GMs would have made an offer for him by now. Well, maybe they have.

 

[Heyjoe4]

You're right. Baggage isn't a good metaphor.

Someone will eventually replace Rodgers. I want it to be someone good.

I hope for your sake and others here who have made such declarations that Gutekunst was wrong, that Rodgers never publicly states that drafting Love put a chip on his shoulder and provided him with great motivation to improve his game.

I don't think Love's selection had anything to do with Rodgers subsequent performance. But not to worry. I think Love will get his chance in GB for all of his fanboys. I'm just not one of them.

 

[sschind]

Agree with all you said sschind. "Pressure to perform" is the best way to describe Love's situation. All the 90 guys in camp feel the pressure to perform. Some more than others. Even Rodgers, with that new contract, will feel the pressure to perform to justify it. And it's kinda hard to top back to back MVPs. Hey Aaron, how about you get the SB MVP this year?

And I like your notion that baggage is what a player brings, for all the reasons you listed. Good way to look at it. And again, some players, like Deshaun Watson, have a lot more baggage (and in his case, money) to bring along than others.

Anyway thanks. Great clarification.

I figured it was just a miscommunication. It was Pike who said Lol, Jordan Love has too much baggage??? Just what do you know about him that no one else knows? but I'm willing to bet he was thinking the same way I was. I'm a firm believer that many of the problems we experience are the result of miscommunication.

You are right about Watson. He probably has the most baggage of any player right now.

 

[Heyjoe4]

I figured it was just a miscommunication. It was Pike who said Lol, Jordan Love has too much baggage??? Just what do you know about him that no one else knows? but I'm willing to bet he was thinking the same way I was. I'm a firm believer that many of the problems we experience are the result of miscommunication.

You are right about Watson. He probably has the most baggage of any player right now.

Thanks sschind. Yeah miscommunication is a hazard of our e-communications world. Some people take things a little too personally, and some are outright rude. But it's all good.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I didn't know you were from Austria! I had the good fortune of going to Vienna for a few days a long time ago for work. Lovely city, great people.

I agree that Vienna is a beautiful city but we will have to disagree about any great people living there

As you might realize I'm from a different city in Austria and we don't like the Viennese that much, although it's mostly in good fun.

As for Love, he could do a lot worse than playing in Austria! I've been to a number of places in Europe and certainly wouldn't mind living there. Well, if I could learn how to speak German......

While Austria is a great place to live in it's impossible to make money playing American football though. Therefore it wouldn't be a great choice for Love.

Hindsight is usually 20/20 and if Gute had a crystal ball back in 2020, he never selects Love.

There was no need for a crystal ball to realize trading up to select Love was a bad idea in the first place.

Those of you that have determined that Love is a bust and thus a wasted pick, are doing so with very limited knowledge.

I don't think anyone has claimed that Love is a bust but a wasted pick for the Packers based on having a HOF starting quarterback who obviously was not in decline. That's what most of you defending the selection don't seem to understand.

Spending an entire rookie contract on a player who doesn't play is a wasted pick.
I’m confused. Love is not done with his rookie contract. It’s 4+1 and he’s only had 2 seasons. 1 being virtual. Can you guarantee he will never get to play in GB or elsewhere?

It's all but guaranteed Love won't get anywhere close to starting in the next two seasons. Nobody in their right mind would suggest it would be a good idea to exercise the fifth-year option on him, paying him $20 million in 2024 when he hasn't proven to be a capable starter at the NFL level.

Love might become a very good quarterback but the Packers will have faced multiple seasons without a player who could have been the difference in one or two Super Bowl wins.
Did Aaron Rodgers win a Super Bowl on a Rookie contract? The answer is NO (he was 6 years in and 3rd year as a starter! So.. that means you are holding Jordan Love to a more strict standard than Rodgers? Really? Love now has to exceed HOF status to win your approval?

Who has mentioned anything about Love having to win a Super Bowl while on his rookie contract? At least one decent start would be somehow promising though.

Trivia Question:
How many Rookie starting QB’s (that we’re drafted) have won a Super Bowl their first season?

In NFL history, no rookie quarterback has ever won a Super Bowl. In fact, no rookie quarterback has ever made the Super Bowl.

Trivia question:
Since the NFL introduced the rookie wage scale how many quarterbacks selected in the first round have thrown less passes than Love over their first two seasons?
Answer:
None out of 39 quarterbacks.

Follow up trivia question:
How many of those 39 QBs have had a lower passer rating than him in the first two seasons?
Answer:
One, Josh Rosen is the only one.

I’m not sure about HOF or even GB at this point as the probability severely narrowed when we gave Rodgers a new deal. It almost seems like we want our cake and to eat it too.
The anti-Love posters were adamant about resigning Rodgers (for good reason). Yet once Rodgers got resigned? they now attack Love for not being a major contributor! How the heck do you lose that argument!

You just don't get it. Nobody is attacking Love but criticizing Gutekunst for trading up to select him in the first place.

Although He’s had 1 Start. He was not a starter against the Lions. He played just 2 quarters in relief in a game where we were pulling starters (week 18) Hardly enough to make career prognostications. Although if you recall Love took the lead 30-27 with 4 min left. Was it his fault our Defense gave up a game winning drive ended by a gashing 14 yard Run?

Jordan Love had close to nothing to do with the Packers taking the lead on Deguara's 62-yard touchdown reception. In addition I'm quite it didn't help he threw two interceptions after the Lions reclaimed the lead.

I'd be curious as to what the record was in those first three seasons under Favre.

Favre was 17-12 in his first two seasons with the Packers. I have no idea why OldSchool included his numbers while with the Falcons during his rookie campaign.

Listen. As a Packer fan we should want him to succeed.. it would show that our GM isn’t as dumb as we thought. Also, might get a day 2 type selection or whatever if he shows he’s growing. Plus, why would we want anyone who is a Packer to fail?? I just don’t get that part at all and there’s sentiment in some posters that think that way. Just Weird but I guess people are just off their Rockers. Look around! Sanity is in short supply

I believe that true fans root for their team/players even in its lows. That’s a true fan to me anyway.

Of course I want Love to succeed with the Packers as well. Taking a look at the circumstances and the early returns it's unrealistic for it to happen at this point though.

Aren't most QB's "developmental" when drafted? Most QB's end up flaming out in the NFL, no matter what round they are picked in. However, I'm sure history has shown that the higher the QB is picked, the better chance of success. If fans are upset that Gute used a first round pick, for what they claim was "for no substantial reason", since in their minds Rodgers would play well past the 4 years said QB would be under contract, why suggest using any picks on a QB? Your logic is flawed and contradicts itself, if that is really what you think.

There's a huge difference between spending a first rounder on a backup and advocating to use a day three pick on one.

Yup, pass on a guy who you have all the confidence in the world in so you can pick someone who might be OK later in the draft. Thats not how I want my GM to react to a perceived need. Whether that need turned out to be real or not was irrelevant at the time. Gute saw a need and reacted the way a GM should on that situation.

I do agree that GMs get paid millions to understand and manage their roster. Thats why when a GM thinks there may be a need in the future his job is to address it and I'd prefer he do it in a way he has confidence in rather with a half hearted attempt.

You ignore that a general manager gets paid millions of bucks to correctly identify positions of need as well. Gutekunst completely failed evaluating Rodgers though.

If Rodgers forced the trade or retired and Love started and played well this year, everyone would be talking about Gute being the next Nostradamous. Much like the Gary pick.

Rodgers was adamant about wanting to end his career in Green Bay before Love was drafted. There was absolutely no reason to believe he would force a trade or retire at the point of the 2020 draft.

It's a completely different story drafting an outside linebacker in the first round, even with the starting spots being taken care of as several players get snaps at the position in the course of a game. That's not the case at QB though.

I’ll just add that I don’t think our plan A was to ever stick Jordan in year 1 as our starter. By all scouting accounts he was always more projection than production.

Gutekunst had signed Rodgers to an extension through the 2023 season in the summer of '18. While it's pretty obvious he didn't expect Love to start during his rookie campaign please enlighten me on how he expected Love to develop while sitting on the bench for most of his rookie contract?

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

That's what most of you defending the selection don't seem to understand.

Yup and I would have to guess that Gute and the Packer organization, would defend the selection of Love in the exact same manner as most of us have been.

 

[Heyjoe4]

I agree that Vienna is a beautiful city but we will have to disagree about any great people living there

As you might realize I'm from a different city in Austria and we don't like the Viennese that much, although it's mostly in good fun.



While Austria is a great place to live in it's impossible to make money playing American football though. Therefore it wouldn't be a great choice for Love.



There was no need for a crystal ball to realize trading up to select Love was a bad idea in the first place.



I don't think anyone has claimed that Love is a bust but a wasted pick for the Packers based on having a HOF starting quarterback who obviously was not in decline. That's what most of you defending the selection don't seem to understand.



It's all but guaranteed Love won't get anywhere close to starting in the next two seasons. Nobody in their right mind would suggest it would be a good idea to exercise the fifth-year option on him, paying him $20 million in 2024 when he hasn't proven to be a capable starter at the NFL level.



Who has mentioned anything about Love having to win a Super Bowl while on his rookie contract? At least one decent start would be somehow promising though.



Trivia question:
Since the NFL introduced the rookie wage scale how many quarterbacks selected in the first round have thrown less passes than Love over their first two seasons?
Answer:
None out of 39 quarterbacks.

Follow up trivia question:
How many of those 39 QBs have had a lower passer rating than him in the first two seasons?
Answer:
One, Josh Rosen is the only one.



You just don't get it. Nobody is attacking Love but criticizing Gutekunst for trading up to select him in the first place.



Jordan Love had close to nothing to do with the Packers taking the lead on Deguara's 62-yard touchdown reception. In addition I'm quite it didn't help he threw two interceptions after the Lions reclaimed the lead.



Favre was 17-12 in his first two seasons with the Packers. I have no idea why OldSchool included his numbers while with the Falcons during his rookie campaign.



Of course I want Love to succeed with the Packers as well. Taking a look at the circumstances and the early returns it's unrealistic for it to happen at this point though.



There's a huge difference between spending a first rounder on a backup and advocating to use a day three pick on one.



You ignore that a general manager gets paid millions of bucks to correctly identify positions of need as well. Gutekunst completely failed evaluating Rodgers though.



Rodgers was adamant about wanting to end his career in Green Bay before Love was drafted. There was absolutely no reason to believe he would force a trade or retire at the point of the 2020 draft.

It's a completely different story drafting an outside linebacker in the first round, even with the starting spots being taken care of as several players get snaps at the position in the course of a game. That's not the case at QB though.



Gutekunst had signed Rodgers to an extension through the 2023 season in the summer of '18. While it's pretty obvious he didn't expect Love to start during his rookie campaign please enlighten me on how he expected Love to develop while sitting on the bench for most of his rookie contract?

Yeah as far as Vienna v. Other Cities in Austria, it's a lot like Milwaukee v. Green Bay and other small Wisconsin towns. We kid each other a lot. And thanks for the stats on Favre.

 

[sschind]

I don't think anyone has claimed that Love is a bust but a wasted pick for the Packers based on having a HOF starting quarterback who obviously was not in decline. That's what most of you defending the selection don't seem to understand.

What do you call it when something is less than the season before. I might be wrong but I think they call that a decline. Thankfully the decline did not continue.

You ignore that a general manager gets paid millions of bucks to correctly identify positions of need as well. Gutekunst completely failed evaluating Rodgers though.

I do agree that GMs get paid millions to understand and manage their roster.

Thats what I said. Kinda hard to say I ignored it when I actually said it. I've also said before that Gute was wrong in his evaluation. He couldn't have known that at the time without being able to see the future however.


Sorry Poker. You owe me another buck.

 

[Heyjoe4]

What do you call it when something is less than the season before. I might be wrong but I think they call that a decline. Thankfully the decline did not continue.



I do agree that GMs get paid millions to understand and manage their roster.

Thats what I said. Kinda hard to say I ignored it when I actually said it. I've also said before that Gute was wrong in his evaluation. He couldn't have known that at the time without being able to see the future however.


Sorry Poker. You owe me another buck.

Kinda sounds like you and Cap and me agree that it was a wasted pick, and the jury is till out on Love - that is, he is not a bust right now.

Where there is disagreement I think is in Gluten's evaluation of where Rodgers was when Love was drafted. I'm not the GM, but I saw that Rodgers and other players were getting tired of playing under MM, that MM had gotten stale, and the frustration was reflected in Rodgers' play. Personally I never saw a decline in Rodgers that suggested it was permanent. So I was stunned when Gluten moved up to pick Love.

We all know what Rodgers has done since. He's not done, maybe not even close. Mistakes have consequences. If Gluten held steady at #30 he could have had Higgins or Pittman, as Cap pointed out, and kept a 4th round pick. The WR room would look a lot better today with one of those guys heading into his third season than Love also heading into his third season.

 

[PikeBadger]

I agree that Vienna is a beautiful city but we will have to disagree about any great people living there

As you might realize I'm from a different city in Austria and we don't like the Viennese that much, although it's mostly in good fun.



While Austria is a great place to live in it's impossible to make money playing American football though. Therefore it wouldn't be a great choice for Love.



There was no need for a crystal ball to realize trading up to select Love was a bad idea in the first place.



I don't think anyone has claimed that Love is a bust but a wasted pick for the Packers based on having a HOF starting quarterback who obviously was not in decline. That's what most of you defending the selection don't seem to understand.



It's all but guaranteed Love won't get anywhere close to starting in the next two seasons. Nobody in their right mind would suggest it would be a good idea to exercise the fifth-year option on him, paying him $20 million in 2024 when he hasn't proven to be a capable starter at the NFL level.



Who has mentioned anything about Love having to win a Super Bowl while on his rookie contract? At least one decent start would be somehow promising though.



Trivia question:
Since the NFL introduced the rookie wage scale how many quarterbacks selected in the first round have thrown less passes than Love over their first two seasons?
Answer:
None out of 39 quarterbacks.

Follow up trivia question:
How many of those 39 QBs have had a lower passer rating than him in the first two seasons?
Answer:
One, Josh Rosen is the only one.



You just don't get it. Nobody is attacking Love but criticizing Gutekunst for trading up to select him in the first place.



Jordan Love had close to nothing to do with the Packers taking the lead on Deguara's 62-yard touchdown reception. In addition I'm quite it didn't help he threw two interceptions after the Lions reclaimed the lead.



Favre was 17-12 in his first two seasons with the Packers. I have no idea why OldSchool included his numbers while with the Falcons during his rookie campaign.



Of course I want Love to succeed with the Packers as well. Taking a look at the circumstances and the early returns it's unrealistic for it to happen at this point though.



There's a huge difference between spending a first rounder on a backup and advocating to use a day three pick on one.



You ignore that a general manager gets paid millions of bucks to correctly identify positions of need as well. Gutekunst completely failed evaluating Rodgers though.



Rodgers was adamant about wanting to end his career in Green Bay before Love was drafted. There was absolutely no reason to believe he would force a trade or retire at the point of the 2020 draft.

It's a completely different story drafting an outside linebacker in the first round, even with the starting spots being taken care of as several players get snaps at the position in the course of a game. That's not the case at QB though.



Gutekunst had signed Rodgers to an extension through the 2023 season in the summer of '18. While it's pretty obvious he didn't expect Love to start during his rookie campaign please enlighten me on how he expected Love to develop while sitting on the bench for most of his rookie contract?

seven scroll through pages of your OPINIONS. Absolutely no one on this forum is that d@mn interesting. Especially on a 2 year old topic. Smh, smh, smh.

 

[Heyjoe4]

seven scroll through pages of your OPINIONS. Absolutely no one on this forum is that d@mn interesting. Especially on a 2 year old topic. Smh, smh, smh.

Yeah but it's a 2-year topic (drafting Love) that has taken on a life of its own. We won't let it die! I'm guilty as well.... Would much rather discuss the upcoming season, and that will increase as TC approaches.

 

[longtimefan]

Yeah but it's a 2-year topic (drafting Love) that has taken on a life of its own. We won't let it die! I'm guilty as well.... Would much rather discuss the upcoming season, and that will increase as TC approaches.

It's the same argument over and over again

the packers (and a few here) felt Aaron was declining..

No matter how many times people say it was a mistake, doesn't change it. At the time it wasn't a mistake, because they felt he was declining

we should just lock this thread.
It's a broken record

 

[sschind]

I've never scrolled through seven pages of any thread unless I wanted to. There is an ignore thread feature that works very well. Never have to read an opinion on the Jordan Love draft pick ever again.

If you lock this one it will just pop up in another one eventually anyway. It probably still will but it may be less tempting.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

It's the same argument over and over again

the packers (and a few here) felt Aaron was declining..

No matter how many times people say it was a mistake, doesn't change it. At the time it wasn't a mistake, because they felt he was declining

we should just lock this thread.
It's a broken record

Not just that, but people have very short term memories here. Just a year ago, nobody knew if Rodgers was going to retire, force a trade, sit out the year or play for the Packers. Same thing when the season ended. The fact that he is still a Packer is great, but for people to blindly ignore the fact that there were many things that could have and almost happened, that would have put Love as the #1 QB this season and potentially last. Would all these people complaining about Gute making the pick, be complaining that he should have been prepared if Rodgers no longer was our QB and Love was never picked?

 

[Heyjoe4]

It's the same argument over and over again

the packers (and a few here) felt Aaron was declining..

No matter how many times people say it was a mistake, doesn't change it. At the time it wasn't a mistake, because they felt he was declining

we should just lock this thread.
It's a broken record

Agree, lock the thread.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Agree, lock the thread.

You must be logged in to see this image or video!

 

[Heyjoe4]

You must be logged in to see this image or video!

LOL. I don't think anyone is going to change their mind at this point. So longtime is right. Shut it down. It will be preserved for all time anyway.

 

[Schultz]

Negative ghostrider on locking the thread.

 

[PikeBadger]

I've never scrolled through seven pages of any thread unless I wanted to. There is an ignore thread feature that works very well. Never have to read an opinion on the Jordan Love draft pick ever again.

If you lock this one it will just pop up in another one eventually anyway. It probably still will but it may be less tempting.

I only counted it because I couldn't believe how much ranting and refuting he was doing. It got way past the point of being ridiculous.

Right or wrong, as a Mod, I feel compelled to attempt to monitor all the threads I have time for. And as a mod, I feel a little guilty when I put people on ignore........ though I do from time to time.

 

[longtimefan]

Negative ghostrider on locking the thread.

Have 2 to 2 to lock

 

[sschind]

I only counted it because I couldn't believe how much ranting and refuting he was doing. It got way past the point of being ridiculous.

Right or wrong, as a Mod, I feel compelled to attempt to monitor all the threads I have time for. And as a mod, I feel a little guilty when I put people on ignore........ though I do from time to time.

The thread is repetitive, in part due to my own contributions I admit. Still it has remained civil. I just don't see a reason to lock it. I have tried to walk away but I keep getting sucked back in. I don't know if ignoring the thread would the same as ignoring a person but I see your point as a mod. For others though its a great option.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Some day the Jordan Love thread will actually have some new news to talk about. Until then, some of us still enjoy the back and forth that Love has given us for each other, it keeps us together.

You must be logged in to see this image or video!

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Yup and I would have to guess that Gute and the Packer organization, would defend the selection of Love in the exact same manner as most of us have been.

While that might be true they would be wrong about it just like too many posters around here.

Yeah as far as Vienna v. Other Cities in Austria, it's a lot like Milwaukee v. Green Bay and other small Wisconsin towns. We kid each other a lot.

Yeah, while I live in a city (Graz) that's larger than any in Wisconsin aside of Milwaukee we still enjoy to banter with folks from Vienna.

What do you call it when something is less than the season before. I might be wrong but I think they call that a decline. Thankfully the decline did not continue.

I was actually talking about Rodgers obviously not having been in decline the past two seasons.

I do agree that GMs get paid millions to understand and manage their roster.

Thats what I said. Kinda hard to say I ignored it when I actually said it. I've also said before that Gute was wrong in his evaluation. He couldn't have known that at the time without being able to see the future however.

That's where I disagree. Gutekunst is being paid millions of bucks to correctly evaluate the players on the roster. He made a huge mistake in doing so with Rodgers after the 2019 season.

seven scroll through pages of your OPINIONS. Absolutely no one on this forum is that d@mn interesting.

I wasn't aware that I needed to ask for your permission to reply to posts in a thread I haven't been able to post in for several days. Here's some advice for you though. If you don't want to read responses to a specific topic just ignore it. There's no reason to take a shot at a poster who, besides giving his opinion on a topic, posted some facts in his response as well. Especially for a moderator.

Especially on a 2 year old topic. Smh, smh, smh.

That's absolutely hilarious coming from you, especially considering you pumped a thread in which nobody had posted in for more than six years on a player who isn't even with the team anymore just a few days ago.

Not just that, but people have very short term memories here. Just a year ago, nobody knew if Rodgers was going to retire, force a trade, sit out the year or play for the Packers. Same thing when the season ended. The fact that he is still a Packer is great, but for people to blindly ignore the fact that there were many things that could have and almost happened, that would have put Love as the #1 QB this season and potentially last. Would all these people complaining about Gute making the pick, be complaining that he should have been prepared if Rodgers no longer was our QB and Love was never picked?

Once again, you conveniently ignore that the Packers drafting Love was the main reason Rodgers thought about moving on in the first place. In addition people defending the pick can't come up with anything else than "What ifs" to make their point.