Rajion Neal

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Russell Breunig

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I saw an article which said McCarthy wants to keep Lacy fresh and so might add another RB. Last year in preseason I was very impressed with Rajion Neal. Then I think he got hurt and got placed on the practice squad. I was wondering if anyone else saw what I saw in him?

Yes, I have been wondering about this kid too. He runs hard & hangs onto the ball. I am not impressed with TT's draft & develope idea. Ron Wolf went out to get Reggie White & Woodson who turned the defense around completely. I just question his ability in the NFL to have the vision that Hall of Famer Ron Wolf could see...
 

Mondio

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hard to tell if that post is sarcasm or not? Who got Woodson? Where is Neal now? and anybody criticising TT for not using FA like Wolf did, should sit down and read Ron Wolf's own words on how the system is different and one of the big reasons he got out of football when he did.
 

thisisnate

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Yes, I have been wondering about this kid too. He runs hard & hangs onto the ball. I am not impressed with TT's draft & develope idea. Ron Wolf went out to get Reggie White & Woodson who turned the defense around completely. I just question his ability in the NFL to have the vision that Hall of Famer Ron Wolf could see...

wat...
 

longtimefan

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Ron Wolf went out to get Reggie White & Woodson who turned the defense around completely. I just question his ability in the NFL to have the vision that Hall of Famer Ron Wolf could see...

Wolf's vision so good he got woodson even before woodson was available
 

TJV

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And HOFer Wolf's vision resulted in the exact same number of titles as Thompson's.
 

PackerDNA

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And HOFer Wolf's vision resulted in the exact same number of titles as Thompson's.

Would have been more if not for the misfortune of existing at the same time as the Cowboys mini dynasty. As it is, 3 consecutive trips to the NFC title game and 2 straight super bowl appearances is more than Thompson.
Wonder if it has something to do with being willing to participate in something other than the draft.
 

longtimefan

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Would have been more if not for the misfortune of existing at the same time as the Cowboys mini dynasty. As it is, 3 consecutive trips to the NFC title game and 2 straight super bowl appearances is more than Thompson.
Wonder if it has something to do with being willing to participate in something other than the draft.
Ted
3 nfccg?

Brett int
Beat Chicago
Lost to Seattle


Should been 2 SB

Correct?
 

PackerDNA

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3 straight trumps 3 in 8 seasons.
2 trips- total and consecutive - to the super bowl trumps one.
"Did" trumps "should have" every time.
 

Mondio

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Would have been more if not for the misfortune of existing at the same time as the Cowboys mini dynasty. As it is, 3 consecutive trips to the NFC title game and 2 straight super bowl appearances is more than Thompson.
Wonder if it has something to do with being willing to participate in something other than the draft.
and yet Wolf himself still admits he did not want to be constrained by today's game with the salary cap and how FA is structured. Things are way different in 2015 than they were in the early 1990's.

The fact that I probably wouldn't trade positions with any fan base other than maybe the Patriots in the past decade says something about Thompson and the teams he has been the GM over.
 

PackerDNA

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Wolf 's tenure began with the onset of free agency and the salary cap. Maybe not such a valid comparison since Thompson does not participate in free agency.
 

longtimefan

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Wolf 's tenure began with the onset of free agency and the salary cap. Maybe not such a valid comparison since Thompson does not participate in free agency.

Shields

Bj

Pepper

Bulaga

Those just in last two years
 
D

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Shields

Bj

Pepper

Bulaga

Those just in last two years

Geez, stop acting like Thompson is using all ways to acquire talent by re-signing the Packers own free agents. Every other team in the league does that as well but there's only one not participating in free agency or adding players via trades.
 

Half Empty

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Outside of Peppers, those are resigns of our own players.

Oh, please don't open that can. You will shortly be reminded that, for the sake of someone's argument, the other three were really free agents, too.
 

longtimefan

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Geez, stop acting like Thompson is using all ways to acquire talent by re-signing the Packers own free agents. Every other team in the league does that as well but there's only one not participating in free agency or adding players via trades.


When signed, I think they were free agents


You off all people know that sometimes what someone says can be researched and proved wrong..

Now-- if some one says Ted doesn't sign free agents from other teams I would agree... No argument...

but the technical part of me says they are wrong as they were free agents, that is correct

I would absolutely LOVE for Ted to go outside his little box and spend money-- or do trades..as I do think if he did we very well good be in the SB..

But hearing things I hear--- there are good parts and bad, but because it isn't reported doesn't mean he isn't trying

With that said...I can't change what he does..all I can do is accept and hope for the best...or should I ***** every chance i get?
 

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That didn't take long, did it? ;)
No matter how long it took, LTF’s argument “has the added advantage of being true” (a pet phrase of Henry Kissinger in the Nixon Whitehouse). Signing UFAs from other teams and signing one’s own UFAs are different things, but they are both signing UFAs. IMO post #167 is well put.
 

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Free agents are risky and I'm going to take a wild guess, which could be absolutely wrong, but I encourage you to prove it, and say they work out 50% of the time, at most. I'm going to give the Packers history here under Thompson, in my admittedly could- be-biased personal rankings and see how it stacks up.

Free agents become even more risky when you invest serious $ into a player whose never played for your team/ scheme/ locker room. See Jarius Byrd and the league last defense in New Orleans, who an unnamed member here encouraged us to sign. While Ted doesn't sign a lot of these guys, he is batting 100% when doing so getting major contributions from (Woodson, Pickett, Peppers).

Result: 3/3

Most fans here I think take the more level-headed approach of looking for cheaper, lower profile second or third tier guys to sign. Even in this case, these can go wrong, just look at the Patriots signing of Brandon Spikes this past year, who said member also encouraged us to sign. While the long term ramifications have obviously been negligible in this case, I think we can all agree the BB/TB organization/ locker room is a special one and that signing was still a mistake. While it has worked out for the Packers in the case of Samkon Gado, Brandon Chillar, Tim Masthay, Tramon Williams, and Letroy Guion. Though I really hestate to even include most of these guys here as most were bargain-bin free agents whose careers could have been over if not signed such as Cedric Benson who I grade out as neither helpful nor exactly hurtful but also with no one better in the wings behind him which ultimately warranted him a spot in neither category. Thompson has missed on these more often than not with the bad play, and taking of roster spots and playing time that could have been used by a younger player with more upside and most likely at least equal, if not better current play. Examples are Matt O'Dwyer, Adrian Klemm, Marquand Manuel, Ben Taylor, Frank Walker, Anthony Hargrove, Philip Merling, Daniel Muir, Jeff Saturday and Jeremy Ross.

Result: 5/15
\1

*Disclaimer: I'm not including UDFA's here as I feel they fit better within the drafts peramiters, as well as waiver wire pickups as I feel they are equally separate. The same goes for signing our own free agents, as they've already been in our system, and could be considered an added moritorium of our own signing period.
Also: The case of Jeff Saturday remains an interesting one as he was a high profile free agent, but an aged one at that. Not exactly a highly priced free agent at 2 years and 7.5 million, but not nearly at the veteran's minimum either. In hindisght, he was on his last legs, literally, the day we signed him and while I think his heart still wanted to play football it was obvious his body would not cooperate at a high level. While I think this signing remains quite the opposite, and a little pricier of the Cedric Benson "filling a major plug" signing it is still tough to decide where to classify all of this.


My point here in conclusion, is for pricey free agents, I'd rather have a GM who finds exceptional value, and treads carefully with caution, which Thompson has, hitting on every single one at 3/3. Quality > Quantity when the stakes are high. Though when it comes to second and third tier free agents, especially as of late he hasn't had the success, even at the money invested I think you would hope for at 5/15 and 1/6 as of late. Has to do a better job solely for the roster spot that could be used elsewhere positively for the reasons stated above, and time invested. While I likely am grading Thompson out harsh here, with his ability to sign top of the line UDFA's to compete with these exact players, I'm hoping my point stands. Ultimately I think he grades out below average here with a negative grade in recent history. If your going to ask Ted to sign more of these second and third tier guys on the market, maybe the current pro-scouting department should be analyzed first.

Overall at 8/18 my 50% theory has held up though I am open to what I could be obviously overlooking as I tiredly write to finish this up, spending way too much time on this tangent. Though I hope some find it useful to why I find myself agreeing with Thompson's general premise for the most part, at least in his circumstances, or at the very least a spark to a counter argument in which I can better learn myself. I'm just going to stop typing here...:unsure::roflmao:
 
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When signed, I think they were free agents

You off all people know that sometimes what someone says can be researched and proved wrong..

Now-- if some one says Ted doesn't sign free agents from other teams I would agree... No argument...

but the technical part of me says they are wrong as they were free agents, that is correct

I would absolutely LOVE for Ted to go outside his little box and spend money-- or do trades..as I do think if he did we very well good be in the SB..

But hearing things I hear--- there are good parts and bad, but because it isn't reported doesn't mean he isn't trying

With that said...I can't change what he does..all I can do is accept and hope for the best...or should I ***** every chance i get?

Actually, to be absolutely precise, Shields and Bulaga were set to become free agents but re-signed with the Packers only days before hitting the market.

It doesn't matter to me though as we all know we're talking about other teams free agents and some of us would like Thompson to selectively address position of needs with some other players than draft picks.

Free agents are risky and I'm going to take a wild guess, which could be absolutely wrong, but I encourage you to prove it, and say they work out 50% of the time, at most. I'm going to give the Packers history here under Thompson, in my admittedly could- be-biased personal rankings and see how it stacks up.

Free agents become even more risky when you invest serious $ into a player whose never played for your team/ scheme/ locker room. See Jarius Byrd and the league last defense in New Orleans, who an unnamed member here encouraged us to sign. While Ted doesn't sign a lot of these guys, he is batting 100% when doing so getting major contributions from (Woodson, Pickett, Peppers).

Result: 3/3

Most fans here I think take the more level-headed approach of looking for cheaper, lower profile second or third tier guys to sign. Even in this case, these can go wrong, just look at the Patriots signing of Brandon Spikes this past year, who said member also encouraged us to sign. While the long term ramifications have obviously been negligible in this case, I think we can all agree the BB/TB organization/ locker room is a special one and that signing was still a mistake. While it has worked out for the Packers in the case of Samkon Gado, Brandon Chillar, Tim Masthay, Tramon Williams, and Letroy Guion. Though I really hestate to even include most of these guys here as most were bargain-bin free agents whose careers could have been over if not signed such as Cedric Benson who I grade out as neither helpful nor exactly hurtful but also with no one better in the wings behind him which ultimately warranted him a spot in neither category. Thompson has missed on these more often than not with the bad play, and taking of roster spots and playing time that could have been used by a younger player with more upside and most likely at least equal, if not better current play. Examples are Matt O'Dwyer, Adrian Klemm, Marquand Manuel, Ben Taylor, Frank Walker, Anthony Hargrove, Philip Merling, Daniel Muir, Jeff Saturday and Jeremy Ross.

Result: 5/15
\1

*Disclaimer: I'm not including UDFA's here as I feel they fit better within the drafts peramiters, as well as waiver wire pickups as I feel they are equally separate. The same goes for signing our own free agents, as they've already been in our system, and could be considered an added moritorium of our own signing period.
Also: The case of Jeff Saturday remains an interesting one as he was a high profile free agent, but an aged one at that. Not exactly a highly priced free agent at 2 years and 7.5 million, but not nearly at the veteran's minimum either. In hindisght, he was on his last legs, literally, the day we signed him and while I think his heart still wanted to play football it was obvious his body would not cooperate at a high level. While I think this signing remains quite the opposite, and a little pricier of the Cedric Benson "filling a major plug" signing it is still tough to decide where to classify all of this.


My point here in conclusion, is for pricey free agents, I'd rather have a GM who finds exceptional value, and treads carefully with caution, which Thompson has, hitting on every single one at 3/3. Quality > Quantity when the stakes are high. Though when it comes to second and third tier free agents, especially as of late he hasn't had the success, even at the money invested I think you would hope for at 5/15 and 1/6 as of late. Has to do a better job solely for the roster spot that could be used elsewhere positively for the reasons stated above, and time invested. While I likely am grading Thompson out harsh here, with his ability to sign top of the line UDFA's to compete with these exact players, I'm hoping my point stands. Ultimately I think he grades out below average here with a negative grade in recent history. If your going to ask Ted to sign more of these second and third tier guys on the market, maybe the current pro-scouting department should be analyzed first.

Overall at 8/18 my 50% theory has held up though I am open to what I could be obviously overlooking as I tiredly write to finish this up, spending way too much time on this tangent. Though I hope some find it useful to why I find myself agreeing with Thompson's general premise for the most part, at least in his circumstances, or at the very least a spark to a counter argument in which I can better learn myself. I'm just going to stop typing here...:unsure::roflmao:

It's no secret I was advocating for Thompson to bring in Byrd in 2014 and take a look at Spikes this past offseason.

While Byrd hasn't worked out in New Orleans he was by far the most talented safety becoming a free agents in years and there's no way of telling how it would have worked out for the Packers if they had signed him.

Spikes would have been a low risk addition, I have to admit I was wrong about him though.

Overall I would like Thompson to use free agency to add second- or third-tier players to add a veteran at positions of need and help develop our younger players.
 

PackerDNA

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Again, the point I - and I believe Captain WIMM and others make- is that Thompson does not use free agency and trades nearly as much as he could or should. And if he doesn't get off his hands and do so more than he's comfortable with in the next 2 off seasons, this team will take a step or two back. It will become a numbers game , and even hitting on an inordinately high percentage of draft picks, he won't be able to staunch all the bleeding.
Shawnsta3 does a great job- thanks for the time and effort. But face it gang, that's a pretty short and thin on talent list , especially considering the guy's in his 11th season as GM. He doesn't begin to compare to Wolf in activity or effectiveness. The argument that resigning your own players who's contracts are ending is free agency activity is a real stretch.
Even the ""technically" argument is shaky when you consider how many of those own free agents had resigned or agreed to contracts before they "technically"even became free agents?
The guy does not use 'all the tools in the toolbox'. I would submit that that is a form of dereliction of duty. If as a Marine I refused to use mortars or artillery in support of my men because I didn't believe in indirect fire weapons, I'd be derelict in my duty. Think of any profession where you refuse to use some of the tools of your trade and tell me you think that's a good thing.
Even the argument of Woodson- Pickett- Peppers loses some of it's lustre when looked at more closely.
Woodson, at the time , was widely regarded as an injury/ attitude risk, and wasn't part of the initial big bidding rush. As I recall, it was between us and Tampa Bay, and their insistence that he played safety led him to sign here.
Pickett, although sought after as one of the best defensive linemen of the time, was really a second tier signing.
Peppers? A surprise out of the blue signing. Any one recall a big bidding war for him?
These are pointed to as proof that TT does indeed use free agency. But in addition to the above comments, these signings came over a period of 11 freaking seasons.
I had come around after Thompson's first couple of seasons to understand what he was trying to do and get on board with it. But the pendulum is starting to swing the other way for me. The complete lack of interest or effort when Vernon Davis was available really gave me pause. Positions of need remain problematic for far too long, and then are only addressed in the form of hit or miss 3rd round picks and such.
If this continues, and the team falls on it's face in the playoffs again, then maybe the next "Fire (fill in the blank) "thread should feature the name Thompson.
 

longtimefan

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That didn't take long, did it? ;)

Actually, to be absolutely precise, Shields and Bulaga were set to become free agents but re-signed with the Packers only days before hitting the market.

It doesn't matter to me though as we all know we're talking about other teams free agents and some of us would like Thompson to selectively address position of needs with some other players than draft picks.



It's no secret I was advocating for Thompson to bring in Byrd in 2014 and take a look at Spikes this past offseason.

While Byrd hasn't worked out in New Orleans he was by far the most talented safety becoming a free agents in years and there's no way of telling how it would have worked out for the Packers if they had signed him.

Spikes would have been a low risk addition, I have to admit I was wrong about him though.

Overall I would like Thompson to use free agency to add second- or third-tier players to add a veteran at positions of need and help develop our younger players.

I think 2014 fa was odd as you could negotiate with players before the true time hit.

Shields--- Packers didn't want to pay him.. He was going to get more from others and the team knew it. They were only going to 6 mill..So right before fa hit, team up'd their pay..very un Ted like


Bulaga had offers from about 3 other teams..Cobb was going to Oakland.

But yes, people should say other team's free agents...I am agreeing Ted doesn't sign other teams fa and I wish he would..but I also recognize if a GB player is a free agent and they sign him..that still counts
 
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