Packers have $29.3 million in cap space

[Deleted member 6794]

A portion of their base doesnt count is what is in the article I posted

I don´t want to copy the entire CBA into the forum here, but you are wrong about it.

 

[longtimefan]

As an example from that article I posted

http://russellstreetreport.com/an-explanation-of-how-the-rookie-salary-cap-really-work/

The team’s 7th round pick signs a contract that contains a first year base salary of $390K (the minimum base salary for a rookie) and receives a Signing Bonus of $48K.
That Signing Bonus is prorated over the 4 years of the contract and counts $12K against the Cap in each year (assuming the player remains with the team for all 4 years).

The player’s first year Cap number would be $402K ($390K + 12K).

That Cap number would be below the team’s top 51, so, while the entire $402K would count against the team’s Rookie Cap, only the player’s bonus proration of $12K would actually count against the team’s overall Salary Cap

So, of the team’s 7 draft picks, only the 1st, 2nd and 3rd round picks have a Cap number of greater than $510K, which was the team’s 49th highest Cap number. As such, those three will replace the Cap numbers of the team’s 49th, 50th and 51st Cap numbers under the Rule of 51.

The remaining draft picks would not count amongst the top 51 Cap numbers, so the base salaries of those players, while counting against the Rookie Cap, will not count against the team’s overall Salary Cap.

So, to calculate the exact impact of the Rookie Cap on the team’s overall Cap, the amount of $390K for each of the lower 4 draft picks ($1.56M) can be deducted from the overall number of $4.303M. Then, for the top 3 draft picks, while their Cap numbers do count against the overall Cap (by virtue of being part of the top 51 Cap numbers), they replace 3 players with base salaries of $465K, so those 3 base salaries ($1.395M) will be removed from the team’s overall Cap.

When those two numbers ($1.56M and $1.395M) are deducted from the team’s Rookie Cap ($4.303M), the actual impact of the signing of the team’s rookies – $1.348M – is revealed.

So, that is how the Year One Rookie Allocation, a.k.a Rookie Salary Cap – the “cap within a cap” – actually works and demonstrates the actual impact of the Rookie Cap on the team’s overall Salary Cap and how it is fair less than most realize.

 

[longtimefan]

I don´t want to copy the entire CBA into the forum here, but you are wrong about it.

Then explain it, I dont want to go around thinking one thing if it is wrong.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

That Cap number would be below the team’s top 51, so, while the entire $402K would count against the team’s Rookie Cap, only the player’s bonus proration of $12K would actually count against the team’s overall Salary Cap.

That it true for every player on the roster. The signing bonus is prorated over the entire length of a contract, no matter if the player´s a rookie or a veteran.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Then explain it, I dont want to go around thinking one thing if it is wrong.

The salary cap number of a single player is calculated like this:

The entire base salary, plus roster and workout bonuses (they count 100% as well) and the prorated signing bonus (which is calculated over the entire length of a contract - maximum of five years).

Here are the signing bonuses of some of last year´s rookies which they received from the Packers as well as how much they counted against the cap in 2013 (as well as in every other year over the lenght of the contract):

Datone Jones: Signing bonus: $3,992,072 - which counts $998,018 against the cap each season
Eddie Lacy: $847,208 bonus - $211,802 cap hit
David Bakhtiari: $455,400 bonus - $113,850 cap hit

For example, when Rodgers signed his extension he received a $35 million signing bonus, which will count $7 million against the cap in each of the next five seasons.

 

[longtimefan]

The salary cap number of a single player is calculated like this:

The entire base salary, plus roster and workout bonuses (they count 100% as well) and the prorated signing bonus (which is calculated over the entire length of a contract - maximum of five years).

Here are the signing bonuses of some of last year´s rookies which they received from the Packers as well as how much they counted against the cap in 2013 (as well as in every other year over the lenght of the contract):

Datone Jones: Signing bonus: $3,992,072 - which counts $998,018 against the cap each season
Eddie Lacy: $847,208 bonus - $211,802 cap hit
David Bakhtiari: $455,400 bonus - $113,850 cap hit

For example, when Rodgers signed his extension he received a $35 million signing bonus, which will count $7 million against the cap in each of the next five seasons.

I know about vets or non rookies and how it works..that isnt my issue, as I only have questioned the rookie cap

Once again

Maybe I heard wrong, but I am under impression the rookies have a different set of rules towards the cap..

This is getting frustrating...

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I know about vets or non rookies and how it works..that isnt my issue, as I only have questioned the rookie cap

Maybe I heard wrong, but I am under impression the rookies have a different set of rules towards the cap..

This is getting frustrating...[/quote]

The rookie compensation pool is a totally different story and works like that:

Total Rookie Compensation Pool: “Total Rookie Compensation Pool” means the League-wide limit on the total amount of Rookie Salary for which all Clubs may contract with Drafted and Undrafted Rookies over the entire term of such Rookie Contracts. By way of example, a Drafted Rookie selected in the second round who signs a four-year contract with Rookie Salary of $1,000,000 in year one, $1,100,000 in year two, $1,200,000 in year three, and $1,300,000 in year four would have $4,600,000 count against the Total Rookie Compensation Pool.

Year-One Rookie Compensation Pool: “Year-One Rookie Compensa-tion Pool” means the League-wide limit on the total amount of Year-One Rookie Salary for which all Clubs may contract with Drafted Rookies and Undrafted Rookies in the first year of such Rookie Contracts. By way of example, a Drafted Rookie selected in the second round who signs a four-year contract with Rookie Salary of $1,000,000 in year one, $1,100,000 in year two, $1,200,000 in year three, and $1,300,000 in year four would have $1,000,000 count against the Year-One Rookie Compensation Pool.

Rookies count against a team´s salary cap in the same way like any other player on the team.

 

[longtimefan]

Then what about what I posted from the article on 1st page?

it does not have a dollar-for-dollar impact on the team’s overall Salary Cap.

while all of the Salary Cap numbers of a team’s draft picks must fit under the team’s Rookie Salary Cap, very rarely will all of that amount actually impact the team’s overall Salary Cap.

Ok- I was misreading...

it says rarely will all of it impact the overall cap.

That is why I was confused...I was under impression it said doesnt count vs the cap

 

[TJV]

LTF, perhaps this will help. From the portion of the story you bolded, "That Cap number would be below the team’s top 51, so, while the entire $402K would count against the team’s Rookie Cap, only the player’s bonus proration of $12K would actually count against the team’s overall Salary Cap" the important part of that sentence is, "That Cap number would be below the team’s top 51..." It's talking about just the top paid 51 players. Once the regular season starts, all rookie compensation counts.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Then what about what I posted from the article on 1st page?



Ok- I was misreading...

it says rarely will all of it impact the overall cap.

That is why I was confused...I was under impression it said doesnt count vs the cap

I´m not sure we´re already on the same page, so I try to explain it one last time:

A team´s salary cap is calculated by the top 51 contracts with the highest cap number during the offseason and every single player during the regular season (including guys on IR, PUP and practice squad).

The rookie compensation pool limits the salary cap number a team can spend on its drafted rookies in the first year and over the entire length of the contract (the amount of it is based on how many picks and on when the players were picked). But it´s a total separate thing than a team´s total salary cap.

But teams have to be under both of those caps.

 

[HardRightEdge]

A portion of their base doesnt count is what is in the article I posted...

This writer is making it more complicated than it is.

First, note that all of the gyrations involved in the examples relate to calculating cap during the Rule of 51 period which runs from now through the build up to 90 players and then right up until the final cut down to 53 a couple days before opening day.

During the Rule of 51 period, the top 51 cap hits for 2014 + dead cap money count toward the cap. The one thing in that article that I had not heard before is that prorated signing bonuses for anybody outside the top 51 also count toward the cap. But when you think about it, how much money could that be considering the guys in slots 52+ are under minimum contracts...their cumulative prorated signing bonuses amount to a rounding error.

Second, what he seems to be saying is that as each rookie gets signed the top 51 is redetermined. As a practical matter, the first and second round picks' cap numbers are likely to be higher than the 50th. and 51st. guys who counted toward the cap prior to the draft who are likely to be making the 2nd. year minimum + maybe some very minor signing bonus proration amount.

In other words, the top two picks will take the place of 2nd. year minimum guys in the 50 and 51 slots, and that's it in a nutshell. The difference between the top 2 picks and those minimum salary guys can be ballparked as about $1.5 - $2 mil.

The singing of one moderately priced free agent would likely have more impact on the Rule of 51 number than the entire draft as he too would replace some minimum salary guy in the top 51.

 

[Raptorman]

The only cap you need to worry about is the 53 man cap. The 51 man cap is meaningless to most teams. Since during training camp team have 80+ players in camp. The 51 player cap if I remember right, is to prevent teams from signing a bunch of players to big contracts then cutting them before the season starts. It's to protect he players from being screwed over.

 

[longtimefan]

I´m not sure we´re already on the same page, so I try to explain it one last time:

No...We are on same page

I mis read the one sentence..

 

[paulska]

Is it only me, or are there instances for vested veteran players where their whole salaries don't count against the cap- players with a certain number of years of service get a higher minimum salary (for discussion sake, let's say an 8th year vet is entitled to a min 850K salary) but his cap hit is only 625K.

If I recall correctly, this practice was installed so that older veterans didn't operate at a competitive disadvantage to younger vets simply because their minimum salary made it more prohibitive to have them around.

Any cap geeks out there who can clarify/shed light on this? Did this get tossed under the new CBA?

 

[HardRightEdge]

Is it only me, or are there instances for vested veteran players where their whole salaries don't count against the cap- players with a certain number of years of service get a higher minimum salary (for discussion sake, let's say an 8th year vet is entitled to a min 850K salary) but his cap hit is only 625K.

If I recall correctly, this practice was installed so that older veterans didn't operate at a competitive disadvantage to younger vets simply because their minimum salary made it more prohibitive to have them around.

Any cap geeks out there who can clarify/shed light on this? Did this get tossed under the new CBA?

The entire amount of the base salary counts against the cap in that year provided the guy makes it to opening day at which point that base salary becomes fully guaranteed.

That's if he's a vested vet, a guy with 4+ years of service. I couldn't say what the deal is with younger guys.

The various bonuses have different provisions.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Is it only me, or are there instances for vested veteran players where their whole salaries don't count against the cap- players with a certain number of years of service get a higher minimum salary (for discussion sake, let's say an 8th year vet is entitled to a min 850K salary) but his cap hit is only 625K.

If I recall correctly, this practice was installed so that older veterans didn't operate at a competitive disadvantage to younger vets simply because their minimum salary made it more prohibitive to have them around.

Any cap geeks out there who can clarify/shed light on this? Did this get tossed under the new CBA?

The entire amount of the base salary counts against the cap in that year provided the guy makes it to opening day at which point that base salary becomes fully guaranteed.

That's if he's a vested vet, a guy with 4+ years of service. I couldn't say what the deal is with younger guys.

The various bonuses have different provisions.

Actually paulska is right about that, it is called the veteran minimum salary benefit. The cap hit of a player with at least four credited seasons, who signs a one year, veterans minimum deal, will be the same as the minimum salary of a player with two credited seasons.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Actually paulska is right about that, it is called the veteran minimum salary benefit. The cap hit of a player with at least four credited seasons, who signs a one year, veterans minimum deal, will be the same as the minimum salary of a player with two credited seasons.

I stand corrected.

http://overthecap.com/explaining-the-minimum-salary-benefit/