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Packers Front Office Under Fire

Discussion in 'Green Bay Packers Fan Forum' started by El Guapo, Jan 25, 2021.

  1. El Guapo

    El Guapo Cheesehead

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    In one of the other threads, someone mentioned that Mark Murphy and Brian Gutekunst should be removed for not putting a better team around Rodgers. I thought that this deserved its own thread.

    The Jerry Jones, the McCaskeys, the Fords, the Wilfs, and other team owners can state their intention to win a Super Bowl and expect that their front office will do what they can to appease the owner. They might go all-in for the win. A Super Bowl might bring the owner/team a new stadium, owner prestige, a new fanbase, etc...

    My impression of the Packers, is that since they are community owned and essentially run like a corporation that they have a different set of goals and values. There is no single owner demanding that we draft so-and-so in order to win it all this year. The Packers president is supposed to keep the revenue flowing. Here is an excerpt that I found in an article about the board of directors from 2016:

    “We’re directors of a very financially successful organization, but we’re also stewards of basically a national treasure and an international icon. We understand that and try to act appropriately.” -Thomas Olson
    https://www.packersnews.com/story/news/2016/07/22/no-one-owner-directors-guide-packers/87289304/

    This reinforces what I was thinking. The board and front office aren't trying to win a Super Bowl necessarily. It would be great of course, but their main goal is to ensure that nearly ever season is a winning season in Green Bay. That keeps the profit margins high and sustains the 'national treasure.' A singular owner may push Super Bowls in order to increase the team value. I don't think that the Packers care how the franchise is valued. Their singular focus is a healthy bottom line which means winning every season.

    This approach helps explain why Jordan Love was picked. It wasn't about this year - it's about the next decade. The Packers organizational structure takes the long view, whereas singular owners can be driven by desire/pride/ego to take a short view in hopes have winning the title.

    Thoughts?
     
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  2. thisisnate

    thisisnate Cheesehead

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    gute lives or dies with love, not rodgers, imo
     
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  3. Snoops

    Snoops Cheesehead

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    Exactly why Green Bay should have a owner.. it’s all about money I had this conversation with a friend yes winning would be great but being consistently good and making money is what they want. Also gutekunst wants to start his own legacy and draft his own qb
     
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  4. PikeBadger

    PikeBadger Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    Some owner saying I want you to draft Joe Schmoe at pick 29 this year so we can win the next super bowl is something only a Jets, Lions, Or Bengals et al. owner would say. You have to let the football people make football decisions.
     
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  5. Mondio

    Mondio Cheesehead

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    I think that's reading too much into things. None of these guys gets into it to settle for good. they all want to be the best. That includes being considered the best president, the best coach, the best GM, have the best team, etc. I think they saw an aging Qb and had a chance at a guy they really really liked. That's it.

    Our season ended at the same place last years did too, but I think it was pretty clear this year's team was very deserving and improved quite a bit over last year's. They have their work cut out for them for next year, but with the right choices hitting, we could be right back or better.

    I think you're right in that they care about the future more than a fan or a player might, but I think they make the decisions based on what keeps a team fighting for championships, not gives the best player a chance at winning a championship. I happen to agree for the most part. I'm not crazy about the Love pick, if turns out to be good, I'm fine with it. if he's not, we'll have a new GM then.

    I'm not sure they have to worry a ton about winning or just being good enough in GB, they fill the stadium year after year, even when we sucked.
     
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  6. PackerfaninCarolina

    PackerfaninCarolina Cheesehead

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    Well, I can get behind that reasoning to a certain extent. But Gute's philosophy has still been different than that of the late Ted Thompson who I might have better put in that mold since he went out trying to make the Packers competitive year in and year out without spending money on free agents. Gute has done this, so that would suggest to me the GMs here still have enough autonomy that they can go all in on either short term or long-term personnel decisions depending on how they see fit.

    I'd say I haven't always been on board with Gute's picks, but some are starting to turn into pretty damn good impact players.

    Rashaan Gary for one, not a guy I wanted, but he's turning out to be a winner. Love the Dillon pick too. He needs to get more playing time and take over as number 1 RB. He's the only back on this team who can knock over and drag defenders with him. MVS I was tough on for a while, but he's really proved his worth as a WR this year. And with our two ILBs, Martin and Barnes, there's a lot to love there.

    The picks he struck out on were Josh Jackson, Jimon Moore, ESB, DeGuara, Stepaniak, and ... fill in the blank.

    Bottom line, the organization may not always invest in the best draft picks or FAs that would get us over the top immediately, but I think Murphy and co leave most of that up to the GM himself. Nor do I think Murphy was involved with the Love pick.
     
  7. gopkrs

    gopkrs Cheesehead

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    two of those haven't even been able to play. Sometimes I wonder where you pull out these statements from.
     
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  8. PackerfaninCarolina

    PackerfaninCarolina Cheesehead

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    Once again ... I cannot disagree with this ridiculosity enough. An owner fixes absolutely nothing. Especially when 90% of these owners are idiots and egomaniacal on steroids.

    Only about 2 owners I consider to be major successes in their trade, and they would be Bob Kraft and Clark Hunt. Maybe Jody Allen up there in Seattle to some degree, or one of the Rooneys in Pittsburgh, but that's about it.
     
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  9. Old Guy

    Old Guy Cheesehead

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    All true. But as the NFC championship records show, it is a failing strategy when it comes to getting to Super Bowls, more or less win one.A good team, but not great.
     
  10. XPack

    XPack Cheesehead

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    I don't get it how you picked all that from the article. :confused: Any CEO or BoD worth their salt will have to balance sustained profitability and immediate success. Very easy to go bust chasing the boom, esp in these financially uncertain times.

    Given the big contracts we've given ARod, Adama, Bakht etc, they do value talent in short term and we've genuinely made efforts to beef up the team. We were one bad PI, One dropped TD, one bad play call away from SB!

    I really don't get anything to support the bottom line is the boss kinda theme here.
     
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  11. Sunshinepacker

    Sunshinepacker Cheesehead

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    It's fun to be good year after year. It sucks to give up on Super Bowl caliber teams to hope you have the start of another run in 3-4 years.
     
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  12. Fredrik87

    Fredrik87 Cheesehead

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    In the end I think the Love pick was stupid because A: I think Rodgers will be good for at least another 5 years and B: I was never and still am not a huge fan of Love as a prospect.

    But no GM's bats 1000% and Gute has had a good deal of great moves to counteract the imo bad.


    As for Mark Murphy I'm more on the fence I'm still mad that he prevented Lafleur from hiring Darren Rizzi
     
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  13. gbgary

    gbgary Cheesehead

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    FO under fire is ridiculous. this loss had nothing to do with their first round pick. this team had weapons. it was a terrific offense when they ran the MLF O. nfl record breaking production in the red zone. highest scoring O in the league. a rookie WR wouldn't have mattered yesterday.
     
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  14. Southside

    Southside Cheesehead

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    The Love pick may end up to be brilliant. No one knows. Not many quarterbacks picked in the 1st round of the draft become stars or even end up starters. That's a fact. Sometimes star quarterbacks come in later rounds. They are a gamble. I would not be shocked to see the Packers draft another QB this year and next as the Packers have started to look for a replacement for Rogers. They are taking their time and will continue to attempt to strike gold in the draft. How incredibly lucky the Packers have been to have had Favre and Rogers these many years. How many other NFL teams have been that lucky? Wouldn't it be great if they found another? They can't do that if they don't try. They are not going to get a top 3 pick in the drsft s long as A Rod is playing for them.
     
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  15. El Guapo

    El Guapo Cheesehead

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    I didn't pick all that from the article. In fact, the only thing I got from that article was the quote.

    I've been on this forum for many years now, and I consistently hear the groan from some factions that the Packers just don't make the moves to "win now." I offered up my thoughts and then, as I stated, found a quote from a board member that seemed to reflect that the Board is focused on the brand more than the trophies. It was the first article that popped up in my search, but the topic was firmly planted in these forums.
     
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  16. gbgary

    gbgary Cheesehead

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    i agree that they'll draft more QB's...just as Wolf did. it's only good business. Love has first-round talent. i hope he's their 3rd HOF'er in a row. every Packers fan should feel that way.
     
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  17. Snoops

    Snoops Cheesehead

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    If they even considered drafting a qb with a conditional 7th round pick they are stupid lol
     
  18. XPack

    XPack Cheesehead

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    Fair enough. That might have been the case in last few years in TT era, but I think the perception has changed since MLF was hired. Two back to back Championship games means we are trying for the title, despite it having eluded us.
     
  19. GleefulGary

    GleefulGary Cheesehead

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    GB had a good enough team to win it all this year. They just faced a team that was a really good matchup for this offense.

    It it disappointing? Absolutely.

    Is it a failure? No!

    People act like a Super Bowl should be expected. They’re morons.
     
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  20. rdawsoniii

    rdawsoniii Cheesehead

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    When you have nearly 30 straight years with a HOF quarterback, you should darn well get to the Super Bowl more than 3 times. It’s been ten years since the last one. Four NFC championship game losses since then. That doesn’t cut it.

    This organization has wasted the careers of TWO HOF quarterbacks by refusing to surround them with the support they needed. Ted Thompson’s failure to dip into free agency (except on rare occasions) is borderline criminal.
     
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  21. pacmaniac

    pacmaniac Cheesehead

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    With a supposedly GOAT-level QB, I do expect a Super Bowl, maybe not this season, but AT LEAST ONCE IN THE PAST 10 SEASONS. Guess that is too much to expect, or Rodgers GOAT-worthiness should be reassessed.
     
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  22. gopkrs

    gopkrs Cheesehead

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    Personally, I put that on MM for keeping all his coaches no matter what and not really giving young players much of a chance e.g., Aaron Jones. Did I mention he had a really lousy offensive plan for several years?
     
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  23. PackerfaninCarolina

    PackerfaninCarolina Cheesehead

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    Yeah, QB is by far the toughest position to get right in the draft. But right now, I think the frustration is that most of us feel Rodgers's career should not end with only one SB, and getting a good successor QB just doesn't feel like it would make that any better, considering that even if Love turned out to be good, the chances of him getting us multiple SB wins are still low.


    Now, if you were to ask me hypothetically if we were to go back in time to the 2005 draft, and say the Packers were to draft another position and not Rodgers, and that pick ended up in us winning the 2007 nfccg and subsequently the SB for Favre, but the trade off was in every year following that game and Favre's departure up till now we stayed mediocre and uncompetitive, would I have traded that for the Rodgers era and where we are now? Well, it's a tough one because beating that undefeated Patriots team would have for sure sent Favre off in the biggest wave of glory in NFL history. But honestly I think I'd rather history remain unchanged because we got to trade out a QB whose play was often too risky, maverick, and gunslingy and ... well all those crazy multiple interception games he had in the playoffs were a big black mark on his career, and we got a more measured passer who is great and would have even more accomplishments to his name with better defenses on his team, and potentially better coaches not making certain hair-brained decisions -- aimed at McCarthy and Capers btw, not necessarily LaFleur.

    But today ... I just don't think I'd trade off Rodgers not winning another SB for even a successful Love career over the next 16-17 years if it meant only one SB win in that span. So hence ... I think the organization should focus more on what will win us a SB now even if the trade off was a significant gap in future success. Besides, while I want Love to be given a chance and hope he does well, the odds aren't on his side, so ... this organization had better be careful about thinking Love is going to bring another 10 plus years of this kind of success.
     
  24. lambeaulambo

    lambeaulambo Cheesehead

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    Look at what Ron Wolf did for the Green Bay Packers. He made all the difference. He made tough decisions. He placed the crown jewel of the the NFL back where it belonged, and did so by bringing in a fantastic coaching regime that made player personnel a premium.

    Imagine Arod with AB, Gronk, Godwin, Evans. He'd take KC behind the woodshed. This front office is building again, but it is a slower process to do so. Just my take.
     
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  25. rmontro

    rmontro Cheesehead

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    Yeah, I know GB has been spoiled with great quarterbacks for a long while now, but having Rodgers was an opportunity that shouldn't have been squandered. And yet it was.
     

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