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AmishMafia

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It is a pretty thin line, for now, separating all of these C candidates, including Myers. And right now, I agree on the lineup you list being the best. I'd be pretty happy with that starting OL in September. I'm assuming someone else steps up at C.

Well, that's what TC and PS games are for. Fortunately, the Packers have nothing to lose by letting this play out, and maybe something to gain.
Had me worried when you start a post discussing the OL with saying "It is a pretty thin line".

Whatever we decide is our top 5, I hope they have it figure out soon if they are going to start moving folks around to unfamiliar spots.

I'm thinking it will be Walker, Jenkins, Myer, Morgan and Tom.

Keep Monk working at C for next year.
 

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I'll say this much Gute at least on paper and on what we've seen in many senses has built/constructed one of the most depth oriented teams (especially on offense) in a while where I there is SO much to be positive about:

QB - has his starter, an experienced back up but then added a rookie to the mix that some had as a top 100 prospect....

RB - Bonafide starter replaces Jones, you bring back an experienced (recharged it seems) past starter for you in Dillon...add a high level rookie and you still have your #3 from last year's end as well in house.

TE - Two studs, an ascending Sims and to boot a guy in Tyler Davis with many starts under his belt coming back from injury - Gute though brings in a BIG TE from Arizona state that I see as a perfect PS stache project (dude can block and did that primarily but has the athleticism to slide to slot which he did 1/3 of his snaps in college).

WR - Arguably we have 6 deep guys I trust (Watons/Doubs/Reed/Wicks/Melton/Heath)...and that excludes Toure who many forget has looked really good at times plus Dubose who we spent a draft pick on.

OL - Four of our main five starters back, a part time starter type in Rhyan, drafted a high level guy in Morgan who can play out and in, a top 175 pick in Monk who has showcased immense interior ability, a big body checker in Glover picked up and then the UDFA steal of all some would argue in Jennings who I wouldn't be shocked earns playing time either...oh and we picked up Andre Dillard CHEAP who if he even gets close to his athletic profile and the prospect many saw coming out and pre-injury watch out for a sneak surprise starter.

I don't recall a year I felt this good about the direction of the offensive side of the ball...but a lot of the defense has the potential to be loaded too:

Off ball LBs - I still think a veteran pick up could be nice but Quay and McDuffie are still here and Gute loads up with Cooper and Hopper plus Goforth as well was added. Don't forget Eric Wilson who seems to be coming into his own...albeit late for a guy now in 7+ seasons.

DL/DEs - this is a DEEP full group which Gute has been feeding constantly in the draft for years....

CB - Jaire seems rejuvenated, Stokes if healthy (seems he is) is playing for a contract somewhere, Valentine is for sure going to have the game slow down more, Rochell an experienced highly athletic guy and Ballentine both have been proven roster spot holders....now add in Kalen King to the mix and don't forget the returner Nixon that is serviceable in the slot if needed.

S - this spot is the thinnest with proven guys but it arguably may have the single most highest #1 guy though in McKinney. Johnson Jr. comes back and will have every chance to hold it....throw in Bullard (who I think may play a ton of slot, Evan Williams and Oladapo the chance of this position shaping into one not to worry about is for sure there. Not too mention the crazy fast Zayne Anderson is still in house as well is Benny Sapp hoping to cling to a role.
 

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Had me worried when you start a post discussing the OL with saying "It is a pretty thin line".

Whatever we decide is our top 5, I hope they have it figure out soon if they are going to start moving folks around to unfamiliar spots.

I'm thinking it will be Walker, Jenkins, Myer, Morgan and Tom.

Keep Monk working at C for next year.
Oops. I hope that wasn't a Freudian slip. I'm also glad you read further past my poor choice of words.

And yeah, the sooner they get the ultimate starters in position, the better. There is a lot to be said for a regular group of guys on any line, offense or defense. They need to communicate, and swapping guys in and out doesn't work.

And Monk is certainly a project. Maybe he makes a huge jump in TC. More likely he learns to play in the NFL and is primed for better things ahead.
 

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I don't recall a year I felt this good about the direction of the offensive side of the ball...but a lot of the defense has the potential to be loaded too
With full acknowledgement that my hopes for this team in 2024 may not match reality, I also feel about as confident as I ever have about the team. Going into the 1997 was probably the last time that I felt this way.

Most of my good vibes for the defense lies in that I know that we have talent, and I know that we don't have Joe Barry. I have bountiful optimism for our new defensive coordinator. Couple that with a pretty good, young offense and I've got my optimism.
 

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With full acknowledgement that my hopes for this team in 2024 may not match reality, I also feel about as confident as I ever have about the team. Going into the 1997 was probably the last time that I felt this way.

Most of my good vibes for the defense lies in that I know that we have talent, and I know that we don't have Joe Barry. I have bountiful optimism for our new defensive coordinator. Couple that with a pretty good, young offense and I've got my optimism.
There's always good reason to be optimistic, when you see how well they've addressed their on-field problems. I have high hopes too. I see them making the playoffs at this point, but how well they'll do depends on how well certain pieces fit into place, and how the whole defense gels.
 
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With full acknowledgement that my hopes for this team in 2024 may not match reality, I also feel about as confident as I ever have about the team. Going into the 1997 was probably the last time that I felt this way.

Most of my good vibes for the defense lies in that I know that we have talent, and I know that we don't have Joe Barry. I have bountiful optimism for our new defensive coordinator. Couple that with a pretty good, young offense and I've got my optimism.
Interesting about that because I have been thinking that this team feels very much like our 2009 team in many ways. The parallels are there.
-A Young, talented QB coming into his 2nd starting season. Who, btw, sat on the sidelines learning exactly the same 3 years.
-a dynamic 1000+ RB in Ryan Grant plus Brandon Jackson behind him with Kuhn as FB (We now have Jacobs, Lloyd, Dillon)
- a dynamic Slot 1000 yard WR in Driver (we now have a similarly talented Reed)
-a Stud TE in Finley in his 2nd season(we now have Musgrave)
-a veteran 4th year 1,000+ WR in Jennings who was 1-2 years away from his peak (we have several WR any of which wouldn’t surprise me to churn 1000+. (Watson, Doubs, Wicks are best candidates here)
-the FA veteran addition of Woodson at CB/S who strengthened that missing piece. (We just picked up McKinney in FA)

Now Im not claiming it’s equal Rosters, our 2024 squad is MUCH younger, but we still can’t deny 2024 has really favorable potential. I wouldn’t be at all shocked to see us crack the Top 10 on scoring Defense.

Our OL is much Younger than that established 2009 OL, but the talent and coaching is there to get early results also. It’s not like we’re a bunch of novices here. Jenkins, Myers and Tom are all established starters. Our starting LT from last year is competing with an Day1 selection so that’s formidable. We also seem to have adequate + depth. Lots of versatility and competition for some upgrades across our OL this year.

With the heavy resources spent on D this offseason, 5 Defenders in 5 draft Rounds is basically like spending an ordinary draft going after 100% Defense.
 
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With full acknowledgement that my hopes for this team in 2024 may not match reality, I also feel about as confident as I ever have about the team. Going into the 1997 was probably the last time that I felt this way.

Most of my good vibes for the defense lies in that I know that we have talent, and I know that we don't have Joe Barry. I have bountiful optimism for our new defensive coordinator. Couple that with a pretty good, young offense and I've got my optimism.
I agree with you on the defense. We had talent and we added more but the most exciting addition IMO was Hafley. How many times in the past couple of years did we say with all these first round picks we should be better than we are. Well, we've still got them and now it looks like we might finally have a guy who can do something with them.
 

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I agree with you on the defense. We had talent and we added more but the most exciting addition IMO was Hafley. How many times in the past couple of years did we say with all these first round picks we should be better than we are. Well, we've still got them and now it looks like we might finally have a guy who can do something with them.
Expectations are very, very high for this defense - for this team. The offense is probably good enough to win a lot of games. Campionships are almost always won by the better defense, or lost by the weaker defense. That was certainly the deciding factor in the Niners loss, the inability to stop the Niners from driving and scoring a TD. Well that and a missed chip shot and an unnecessary INT to end it. But hey......
 
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Had me worried when you start a post discussing the OL with saying "It is a pretty thin line".

Whatever we decide is our top 5, I hope they have it figure out soon if they are going to start moving folks around to unfamiliar spots.

I'm thinking it will be Walker, Jenkins, Myer, Morgan and Tom.

Keep Monk working at C for next year.
Totally agree. I don’t think Myers is this bad. I’d agree he might have not lived up to 2nd Round grade but would he be terrible had he been drafted in Round4? No.
Honestly. I think we got spoiled with Linsley. Myers is pretty average but I don’t see anyone that can verifiably be an upgrade and saying anyone is an upgrade just isn’t true. I watched filming him the other night and he was 15 yards down field running his man out of bounds for a huge play. This was 2023 not 3 seasons ago.

There’s an old saying be careful what you wish for.. meaning the grass ain’t always greener. Myers has a full season + with Love and played with #12 for longer than that. I think that would be risky to venture into the unknown in a “Win Now” season. It really doesn’t match anything we’ve done to this point truth be told. Cutting Myers would be a total and complete anomoly.

Myers is getting all the 1st team reps right now. Why would we neglect all these other Centers if he was that bad?
 
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Totally agree. I don’t think Myers is this bad. I’d agree he might have not lived up to 2nd Round grade but would he be terrible had he been drafted in Round4? No.
Honestly. I think we got spoiled with Linsley. Myers is pretty average but I don’t see anyone that can verifiably be an upgrade and saying anyone is an upgrade just isn’t true. I watched filming him the other night and he was 15 yards down field running his man out of bounds for a huge play. This was 2023 not 3 seasons ago.

There’s an old saying be careful what you wish for.. meaning the grass ain’t always greener. Myers has a full season + with Love and played with #12 for longer than that. I think that would be risky to venture into the unknown in a “Win Now” season. It really doesn’t match anything we’ve done to this point truth be told. Cutting Myers would be a total and complete anomoly.

Myers is getting all the 1st team reps right now. Why would we neglect all these other Centers if he was that bad?
Yes! I think we have several players who may become better centers, but someone learning the position AND developing chemistry with rest of OL and Love? Myer is our best bet for 2024. After that? No.
 

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Yes! I think we have several players who may become better centers, but someone learning the position AND developing chemistry with rest of OL and Love? Myer is our best bet for 2024. After that? No.
I agree with all of this. And Old School makes the point that Myers has experience, including one season with Love. It gives Monk a chance to learn as well without being tossed into the expectations of a very good season, or else. He'll get snaps and be part of all that, but he doesn't have to be that guy yet, if he ever is. And communications can't be over emphasized, and Myers gets that. The rest of the line looks to be very talented.

And they'll find a place for Morgan to start. Probably RG, or RT if they move Tom in. One new guy on the line is enough for now.
 

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Another sneaky way to move Myers, keep Tom where he is and only add “one” is Rhyan at center (he is getting snaps there) and Morgan to RG. I don’t necessary see it happening but Rhyan is getting center snaps and it is for sure just to see what it might look like
 

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We don’t know do we? That’s Too bad

What we do know is IF #12 had been there from DAY1 we wouldn’t have to have a debate on it we could both agree it didn’t matter.

It’s intriguing how our season came down to 1 throw to make the playoffs isn’t it? I don’t think it’s a coincidence that slight under throw was to a Rookie player who he didn’t get a FULL benefit of time with. Maybe he had 97%, but 97% don’t cut it in this league.
Just Don’t have regrets. The best way to not have regrets is giving it 100% and not 99%. You don’t score a 100% missing practices with Rookie Wideouts in my opinion.
No. I agree with Joe Theisman when he answered an important question in an interview a few years back (BEFORE RODGERS skipped OTA’s) that the 1 thing that propelled his career more than anything else??
SHOWING UP EARLY.
Joe said the one thing that he can definitively say that propelled greatness was that he showed up at the facility 1 month BEFORE the other players. Not a week. Not a couple of OTA practices that were voluntary. He showed a FULL calendar month early.

Now that said, I always thought what an interesting response. Not arm strength. Not skill. Not athletic ability. Not mental awareness or any other hosts of answers he could’ve said. He said
“I showed up a month early”.
#1 most impactful thing that impacted his football career was essentially… DEVOTION.

Devotion is doing the things for the ones or the things we love that go far beyond mandatory.
I didn't realize the Packers only lost one game that year and Rodgers only threw one interception.
 

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On a scale of 1 to 10, I'd call Myers a 5.5 to 6.0. That's not real good, but it's not bad enough that you jettison him. If nothing else, he'd be a valuable asset in depth. This is the one thing the Packers have lacked over the last few years, on the offensive line, due to injuries to guys like Bakh.

Even if.... as an example..... Tom moved over to play center, and Morgan was plugged in to replace him, at RT, he'd be an asset, because Monk would get time to improve his game before possibly being thrown to the wolves at center. What Gute has done right, related to our offensive line, is to get players who can play multiple positions. As an example, Morgan, both tackle positions, Tom, both tackle positions and potentially center, and so on down the line. Yes, it does mean musical positions if there's an injury, but that keeps all of them sharp, knowing multiple applications to the jobs for each position. When you understand other jobs on the line, it helps you blend yours into theirs.
 

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This response is to Tyni's trade scenarios. IMO this would be plausible. I would be happy with getting a 6th for Newman and a 7th.
 

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Another sneaky way to move Myers, keep Tom where he is and only add “one” is Rhyan at center (he is getting snaps there) and Morgan to RG. I don’t necessary see it happening but Rhyan is getting center snaps and it is for sure just to see what it might look like
Interesting. Maybe that's a plan if Myers misses time. Rhyan seems like a pretty versatile guy. Gluten has drafted well in terms of talent at a position, and the ability of the OL guys to play multiple positions. Although ideally, the OL should be set by game 1 with little change until the inevitable injury. And for that there is depth.

Moving off the subject of Myers just a bit, it will be interesting to see where top pick Morgan plays. Seems like Tom is the obvious RT, if Walker continues his solid play, he stays at LT. In that case, Morgan probably plays RG, Jenkins at LG, and Myers at C. I don't know where that leaves Rhyan though, other than the scenario you outlined.
 

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Interesting. Maybe that's a plan if Myers misses time. Rhyan seems like a pretty versatile guy. Gluten has drafted well in terms of talent at a position, and the ability of the OL guys to play multiple positions. Although ideally, the OL should be set by game 1 with little change until the inevitable injury. And for that there is depth.

Moving off the subject of Myers just a bit, it will be interesting to see where top pick Morgan plays. Seems like Tom is the obvious RT, if Walker continues his solid play, he stays at LT. In that case, Morgan probably plays RG, Jenkins at LG, and Myers at C. I don't know where that leaves Rhyan though, other than the scenario you outlined.
The beautiful point about this collection of linemen is the flexibility. Knowing you can have emergency plans available makes them formidable.
 
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Another sneaky way to move Myers, keep Tom where he is and only add “one” is Rhyan at center (he is getting snaps there) and Morgan to RG. I don’t necessary see it happening but Rhyan is getting center snaps and it is for sure just to see what it might look like
Yes. Another thought would be to let Myers compete where he was a standout in HS. His position? Guard

He can play Guard at a high level. We know this because he was the #1 Recruit from Ohio after being a 1st team All-American Guard. So I’d offer that If someone can play at or above his level at C? have him compete at RG. He’s got the body type and demeanor to slide over if it’s our best 5.

Dairyland Express

“Like his predecessor Corey Linsley, Myers has the ability to also play guard if needed, he is well-versed in making pre-snap calls, and if there was a big run by an Ohio State running back, then there was a good chance that Myers was at the second level and downfield making blocks–he did an excellent job of this in college.”

Let’s also keep in mind that Myers started just 2 seasons at Center for Ohio State before being drafted. He then was injured in his Rookie season in Game 6 for us and missed the remainder of 2021. So to be fair, he’s really got 2.4 seasons with the Packers after paying C for just 2 seasons at Ohio State. I’d argue in his behalf that most often a drafted Junior with just 2 years experience needs a year at minimum to acclimate as they are still somewhat raw. He was thrown into duty day 1. Then he injured in his 6th start during the 2021 season.
That means 2022 was his first full season playing Center in the NFL after coming off injury.

Let’s forward a year to 2023. His QB changes. Remember too that each QB has their own nuances, signals, preferences, etc.
There is a good probability that Myers is still peaking. That can be aided by elevating the play around him.

These are not excuses. These are facts. I presented similar facts when everyone attacked Jordan Love for “leading ALL of college in INT”. But we have to dig deeper than a top onion layer attack. He had changes going on all around him and it’s no wonder that instability impacted him. Then we heard “but he’s a weak Conference Player there in Mountain West” blah blah blah came the doubters. The point of the exercise is we’ve got to peel the layers a little deeper. Maybe Josh is a terrible player if he had the full array of college snaps and he was truly in his 4th full season with the same QB. He’s not though. Nowhere close. I’m coming to his Defense until I see him play at least TWO CONSECUTIVE with the same or similar or better grouping. I’m not insinuating he deserves a $50mil contract but he’s a good deal at $1.4mil
 
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sschind

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Totally agree. I don’t think Myers is this bad. I’d agree he might have not lived up to 2nd Round grade but would he be terrible had he been drafted in Round4? No.
Honestly. I think we got spoiled with Linsley. Myers is pretty average but I don’t see anyone that can verifiably be an upgrade and saying anyone is an upgrade just isn’t true. I watched filming him the other night and he was 15 yards down field running his man out of bounds for a huge play. This was 2023 not 3 seasons ago.

There’s an old saying be careful what you wish for.. meaning the grass ain’t always greener. Myers has a full season + with Love and played with #12 for longer than that. I think that would be risky to venture into the unknown in a “Win Now” season. It really doesn’t match anything we’ve done to this point truth be told. Cutting Myers would be a total and complete anomoly.

Myers is getting all the 1st team reps right now. Why would we neglect all these other Centers if he was that bad?
I keep coming back to the fact that many people were pretty high on Meyers at center before his injury and even in 2022. So much so that some were saying we wouldn't miss Linsley. Now for whatever reason so many people are really down on him after a down 2023. I guess recency bias tends to make us forget what guys did before last season (Josh Jacobs anyone) but IMO having a guy like Meyers at least competing for the starting center and maybe the top backup is not really a bad thing. Now if there is anything to the idea that he could play guard that makes him even more valuable. The bottom line for me is we have had much worse players than Josh Meyers make our 53 man roster over the past several years. If he doesn't make the cut this year so be it but I think that just means we have a pretty damn deep O line.
 

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I keep coming back to the fact that many people were pretty high on Meyers at center before his injury and even in 2022. So much so that some were saying we wouldn't miss Linsley. Now for whatever reason so many people are really down on him after a down 2023. I guess recency bias tends to make us forget what guys did before last season (Josh Jacobs anyone) but IMO having a guy like Meyers at least competing for the starting center and maybe the top backup is not really a bad thing. Now if there is anything to the idea that he could play guard that makes him even more valuable. The bottom line for me is we have had much worse players than Josh Meyers make our 53 man roster over the past several years. If he doesn't make the cut this year so be it but I think that just means we have a pretty damn deep O line.
Good points by you and Old School. I was part of comments dissing Myers ability, and I over did it. As for recency bias (although it's not so recent), Linsley really was very good, and Myers was picked ahead of Creed Humphrey who I'd argue is a better center. So there are some sour grapes that we lost a v good C, made the wrong draft choice, and now we have an average to above average C. What else is new? It's not a perfect process. But it's fair to say that Myers has held his own.

Even that doesn't tell the whole story. He's certainly a long way from a bust, and until Old School posted it, I had no idea he played G at one point. And the guy was a standout at OSU, so his pedigree was intact. And it's not fair to engage in whataboutism and say Gluten should have drafted Humphrey. Past is past.

So as of right now, I'd be pretty happy with a starting OL that has Walker at LT, Jenkins or Morgan at LG, Myers at C, Jenkins or Morgan at RG, and Tom at RT. That does leave Rhyan as the odd man out, but I think they have to make room for Morgan. That also allows for good depth with Rhyan and the rookie Monk, and some other guys I'm forgetting. And Rhyan is an established part of this group and he'll get his snaps with little to no drop off. And we all should know there will be injuries......

I think Amish suggested playing Linsley at C in 2024 and then moving on next season. That makes sense, minimizes the number of new faces on the line to Morgan, and provides solid backup.
 
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I didn't realize the Packers only lost one game that year and Rodgers only threw one interception.
Cute Schultz!
All that will be remembered is Rodgers final decision to crash. We lost 1 play that ultimately mattered in our final 2022 season Demise against the Lions.
It goes down in the history books that Rodgers last pass was to a Rookie WR for a very slight underthrow for an INT. One foot or 0.1 sec in timing cost us a Playoff birth and even possibly another SB appearance.

The only way you can definitively say you did everything possible in this sport? To give it 100% attention preparing for a game of inches. What we know is 99.9% effort gets you
1. Knocked out of Greatness
Or
2. The same results, but the black cloud of “what could’ve been?”

Live life with no regrets
 
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Pokerbrat2000

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Packers released their upcoming training camp schedule.

With all the money that is involved in the NFL and players salaries, it is always kind of shocking to me how little these guys actually practice as a team. I realize the dangers of practice, but as someone who competed in HS Sports, I practiced more than these guys do.

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Heyjoe4

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Packers released their upcoming training camp schedule.

With all the money that is involved in the NFL and players salaries, it is always kind of shocking to me how little these guys actually practice as a team. I realize the dangers of practice, but as someone who competed in HS Sports, I practiced more than these guys do.

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Well they practice between PS games as well. The season is a long one, and injury prevention is probably the reason they don't start camp earlier. Even so, I think college players practice more.
 

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Packers released their upcoming training camp schedule.

With all the money that is involved in the NFL and players salaries, it is always kind of shocking to me how little these guys actually practice as a team. I realize the dangers of practice, but as someone who competed in HS Sports, I practiced more than these guys do.
No kidding. It's certainly come a long way from 50, 60 years ago, when training camp ran 6 or 7 weeks, or even a little longer - and they had 6 preseason games every year. By the time the season started, the teams were hitting on all cylinders right from Week One. Nowadays, the first few games of the seasonn are almost like an extensiopn of the preseason as far as the learning curve is concerned for younger players.

There is some talk now of changing that, moving the spring classes and OTAs into late June/early July and making training camp a continuous 8-week process ramping up to the season opener. The players' union is considering proposing that, on the theory that it would reduce soft tissue injuries. They feel that two periods of high-level physical activity packed into small time frames (separated by long periods of relative inactivity) are causing injuries because the players are pushing themselves too hard in the shorter blocks of time.

 

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