Move CB up draft board

[bozz_2006]

Be that as it may, the guys currently on the roster will be worse on inexperience alone, if not on the basis of talent.

That's an assumption. And not an unreasonable one. But not one I agree with. Experience is big, but with as successful as our team has been, with how young we have been, surely inexperience isn't something that our coaching staff and front office fear.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Everybody here wanted Hawk and Jones gone...

Not quite. I would have liked to see Hawk back at a reduced salary for backup, spot duty and insurance, though at this point there's nothing much to insure. Everybody seems to forget the improvement in the run defense post-bye was with Hawk in base D. You just don't wouldn't want to give him coverage responsibility.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

There is rarely a team that is solid at every position, and if they are they don't sustain over multiple years. The current format in the NFL makes it virtually impossible. There's no question that we are thinner on defense than offense, but it's not panic territory.

Packers, if they're legitimate Super Bowl contenders, shouldn't be compared to most teams. They should be compared to other Super Bowl contenders. The Packers are currently very weak at ILB, CB and NT. ILB isn't that important but NT and CB are very important positions. Sure, maybe the Seahawks have flaws on the oline but a very good QB/RB combo negate much of that. A weak NT and ILB aren't helped by any other position and that particular combo only feeds on itself.

 

[rodell330]

I honestly think Hyde is going to be the guy on the outside and Hayward stays on the inside with Goodson at the dime and a rook at the fifth spot. I'm not worried about corner as much as some others because Hyde shows flashes that he can be a player and so has HayWard. It would be great if TT could sign Spikes and Raji.

 

[HardRightEdge]

That's an assumption. And not an unreasonable one. But not one I agree with. Experience is big, but with as successful as our team has been, with how young we have been, surely inexperience isn't something that our coaching staff and front office fear.

You're entitled to your own assumptions about players you either have not seen take an NFL snap or were undistinguished when they did. The beauty of inexperienced players is they have not had the opportunity to disprove their potential.

There's nothing wrong with a little inexperience. There's a lot wrong with a lot of inexperience. I would say the number of players lost to the defense with nobody of particular note coming off the bench is unprecedented even for Thompson. And even if a couple of those guys pan out, there's zero depth.

I was inclined to think Thompson would dip into the mid-priced FA pool to shore things up, as many others believed. At this juncture the pool is severely depleted. He's going to have to count on the charity of others cutting players at some point, nothing under his control, if he wants to get a vet or two that can play.

I think you're right...he's going to play the hand he has, maybe bring back a Kuhn or Flynn, and then count on the draft.

One wonders if it's a cash issue rather than a cap issue. Maybe Murphy has his eye on a few more gas stations and hotels.

 

[adambr2]

I'm a big Ted Thompson guy, but Goodson over Rolle hurts right now.

If we have Jumal Rolle right now, we really don't have a CB problem. Hayward and Rolle compete for a starting spot and we still have the other + Hyde for nickel packages and Hyde can still play some safety.

With that said, even if we had kept Rolle we may not know yet what we had in him. So hopefully we'll end up with a Rolle this year. Maybe, hopefully, it's Goodson.

 

[Vrill]

"All we need" for what, exactly?

What I said is self explanatory. Figure it out.

 

[bozz_2006]

I definitely think our free agency approach is a cash issue. We can't afford to hand out mountains of cash and couldn't afford to cut our losses if we did hand out mountains of cash.

I think everything that has happened with our free agents is what Ted & Company expected. Sign Cobb and Bulaga, see House and Tramon leave, cut Jones and Hawk. And I think he expects to have Guion and Raji back.

If Tramon and House were the pieces that made the difference, they'd still be in town.

And at ILB, their was no mid priced free agent to sign as an improvement.

I'd love for us to have strengthened our ILB and CB starting positions during free agency, but it wasn't going to happen because there isn't anyone who would fit the bill.

I wish the roster was stronger too. I wish we had 11 All Pros on D. If you're not happy with the roster, that's fine. I'm not either. But what was Ted supposed to do differently here?

 

[adambr2]

In the 2010-11 season, when we won the Super Bowl, some of our major contributors on defense in one way or another included Sam Shields, Frank Zombo, Howard Green, Charlie Peprah, and Erik Walden. No doubt that on 3/16/10, none of us had even heard of any of these guys. Or if we had, we certainly didn't think anything of them.

My point is not we're necessarily going to have as good of a defense as that year, but that with a constantly evolving roster, a need in March will not necessarily mean a disaster in the fall, and we'll have contributors on this defense later this year that we still don't even know about yet.

 

[AKCheese]

Could see Hawk back at least for camp, but ideally they'll bring in faster guys. If we see Hawk back, even at a vet minimum deal, it means TT was not able to accomplish what he hoped at ILB.

 

[adambr2]

Could see Hawk back at least for camp, but ideally they'll bring in faster guys. If we see Hawk back, even at a vet minimum deal, it means TT was not able to accomplish what he hoped at ILB.

Hawk has already signed with the Bengals.

 

[GreenBaySlacker]

I honestly think Hyde is going to be the guy on the outside and Hayward stays on the inside with Goodson at the dime and a rook at the fifth spot. I'm not worried about corner as much as some others because Hyde shows flashes that he can be a player and so has HayWard. It would be great if TT could sign Spikes and Raji.

Im of the understanding that Hyde doesnt have the ability to play cover CB. Too much safety, not enough CB. But the kid can tackle! So we have him roaming the middle covering TEs, RBs, and #3Wrs if need be. If all fails he is always found at the ball when the play is over. Hayward is a little under sized IMO. Compared to megatron for instance. But he will make up for it with his ball hawking. He plays big. Im looking forward to Sheilds taking their #1. Hayward and Hyde backing him up... very good trio.

 

[Carl]

I've never seen so much concern over a position in which a team has three solid guys. Somehow we now have a big weakness because we aren't four deep.

How many teams in the league even have a really good dime back? I'd bet not many. The Patriots just won the Super Bowl with a third corner who consistently got burned by our rookie WR. We won it all with Bush as the dime back.

The corner need is being blown out of proportion.

 

[HardRightEdge]

What I said is self explanatory. Figure it out.

It certainly was not. Good enough for what? Another division championship against weak competition? It's becoming thin gruel. Hit me with another of your reflexive disagrees. I consider a badge of honor.

 

[GreenBaySlacker]

I've never seen so much concern over a position in which a team has three solid guys. Somehow we now have a big weakness because we aren't four deep.

How many teams in the league even have a really good dime back? I'd bet not many. The Patriots just won the Super Bowl with a third corner who consistently got burned by our rookie WR. We won it all with Bush as the dime back.

The corner need is being blown out of proportion.

It time to draft the next generation and promote the keepers. Hayward/Hyde in. Williams/House out. Add a draft pick or two for depth. No problem

 

[Carl]

It time to draft the next generation and promote the keepers. Hayward/Hyde in. Williams/House out. Add a draft pick or two for depth. No problem

Exactly.

 

[Ogsponge]

Exactly.

Wait a second, so you two actually believe that two guys who were not good enough to wrest the starting job away from Tramon Williams (who by all accounts was a bottom tier cb last year) are just going to step in and everything is going to be golden? Really? Can you point me to some factual evidence to support this hypothesis?

 

[brandon2348]

I don't know why some people are freaking out over losing a bunch of guys that everyone complained about not playing well all year. The only one I wanted to see them keep was House. So we lost one guy so far that had some potential upside. Look around the league and see what other teams are losing. If TT would of paid Tramon 7 mill next year people would of not been happy about that at all. TT offered him what he is worth.

Free agency isn't over yet and TT usually makes his moves in the 2nd tier of free agency. It's not time to hit the "panic button."

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Nobody is freaking out about losing Hawk, Jones, House and Tramon. I was one of the posters strongly advocating to release both Hawk and Jones after the season and there´s no way the Packers should have re-signed House and Tramon for what they got from the Jags and Browns.

Taking a look at the current depth chart on defense there´s absolutely reason for concern though. Mike Pennel is the lone NT under contract, Barrington the only ILB to have played a single regular season snap at the position and even if Hayward proves he´s capable of playing outside the Packers would have to line up either Demetri Goodson or Tay Glover-Wright in the slot in dime.

It´s possible Thompson will re-sign Raji and/or Guion (who will most likely get suspended for a few games) and bring in a free agent at ILB but so far he has done nothing to improve the defense. I´ve said repeatedly that it doesn´t make sense to take an educated guess about the strength of the defense until after the draft is done but don´t tell me I´m crazy for wondering if the unit is headed in the right direction.

 

[Dr. Kenneth Noisewater]

The good thing about corners is that you can find a good one anywhere in the draft if you know what to look for.

I'm concerned about the defense, though, and no one's convincing me otherwise. Even if we re sign Raji and Guion (and I'm not convinced that will happen) that's not a significant upgrade over where we were last year. I think we need someone else there and I don't want to see it being left to the draft.

We need at least two ILBs with one or both of them being starter quality. I'm sick of hearing this 'move Clay out there'. It was a contingency plan that worked well but going into the season like that is a huge waste of talent and cap money.

Fortunately it looks like there are a couple of decent ILBs with non-first round grades, so the plan is as follows:
1. Free agent NT
2. CB in 1st round
3. ILB in 2nd round and another in 3rd or 4th
4. Beat the ******* 49ers

 

[Deleted member 6794]

The good thing about corners is that you can find a good one anywhere in the draft if you know what to look for.

I'm concerned about the defense, though, and no one's convincing me otherwise. Even if we re sign Raji and Guion (and I'm not convinced that will happen) that's not a significant upgrade over where we were last year. I think we need someone else there and I don't want to see it being left to the draft.

We need at least two ILBs with one or both of them being starter quality. I'm sick of hearing this 'move Clay out there'. It was a contingency plan that worked well but going into the season like that is a huge waste of talent and cap money.

Fortunately it looks like there are a couple of decent ILBs with non-first round grades, so the plan is as follows:
1. Free agent NT
2. CB in 1st round
3. ILB in 2nd round and another in 3rd or 4th
4. Beat the ******* 49ers

I agree with most of your post but I´d rather re-sign Raji and Guion and spend an early pick on a NT while signing an ILB in free agency.

 

[Dr. Kenneth Noisewater]

I agree with most of your post but I´d rather re-sign Raji and Guion and spend an early pick on a NT while signing an ILB in free agency.

In theory, yeah, but TT is terrible at drafting defensive linemen and I like some of the ILBs on offer this year.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

In theory, yeah, but TT is terrible at drafting defensive linemen and I like some of the ILBs on offer this year.

The Packers need two or three ILBs though and some experience would be helpful as well.

 

[Dr. Kenneth Noisewater]

The Packers need two or three ILBs though and some experience would be helpful as well.

We've probably got enough money to go after both positions in free agency but I'm not sure how important experience is at a specific position so long as we've got a decent amount on the field, which we should do.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

We've probably got enough money to go after both positions in free agency but I'm not sure how important experience is at a specific position so long as we've got a decent amount on the field, which we should do.

I´m fine with having a mostly young roster. There´s not enough experience at ILB though with Barrington (367 total regular season snaps) being the only guy having played a single regular season snap at the position.