Rocky11
Superbowl bound Pack
Hey forget favre. I was banned this week because I asked a question. I asked if Brett hated the Packers and the fans as much as all of them did. I was close a couple of other times. I am a Favre fan but he is not God.
Still trying to dissect an entire post without reading it in toto. I think most reasonable people would understand what I was saying by reading my posts 88 and 95 in their entirety.My mistake. You contradicted yourself in one post, not two. Now, if you want to continue with this, please tell us the plain meaning of the phrase, "Defense Still Wins Championships".
No, like the loss to the Chiefs, I was just worried for the fans who had this notion that we were Superman, infallible, unbeatable.So, your saying that we, as fans should have assumed we would probably lose? The weather Had not a a thing to do with it. We played a crappy game, period.
The day football becomes more serious than fun is the day I quit watching. This is a kids game played by men. It's all about fun. You can analyze, and predict, but in the end it's all about having a good time, rooting for your team and beliving they are invicible come sunday. It's really easy when your teams 15-1. If you ain't having fun whats the point.No, like the loss to the Chiefs, I was just worried for the fans who had this notion that we were Superman, infallible, unbeatable.
I've learned thru decades of serious football watching that it isn't the case. I believe this was the 8th straight season where the team with the best W-L record did not win the Super Bowl. The best regular season record doesn't mean much.
Also, I still am quite sure that the weather had something to do with us playing a crappy game.
We do not fumble balls, miss passes, drop catches like that in nice weather.
Here’s a recap of our interaction the last couple of pages: You posted it 'boils down to the defense'. Not in response to you in particular but certainly including you, I posted how the playoff teams finished the regular season and noted it’s difficult to argue defense wins championships because the team that was TWENTY FIFTH in scoring defense just beat the team that finished the regular season FIFTEETH for the title. I ended that post with, “Perhaps another more narrow saying now applies. How about, 'Playing good defense in the playoffs is important' ?”Still trying to dissect an entire post without reading it in toto.
I agree with this post as I have been mentioning similar things as well.Did the Giants just beat New England because of their defense?
Or was it Eli, the game's MVP?
I would argue that it was pretty much both, almost evenly.
Also, I would argue that our 4 fumbles, many dropped passes, and a few bad throws by Rodgers were almost equally to blame for our loss to the Giants as our bad 3rd down defense in the first half was, and the Hail mary failures.
I believe it was pretty equal, as it was last year when our defense stopped Big Ben on that final drive.
It takes two. Does anyone disagree with that?
A team with a bad offense but great defense cannot win a Super Bowl very easily anymore in today's NFL.
Did the Giants just beat New England because of their defense?
Or was it Eli, the game's MVP?
I would argue that it was pretty much both, almost evenly.
Also, I would argue that our 4 fumbles, many dropped passes, and a few bad throws by Rodgers were almost equally to blame for our loss to the Giants as our bad 3rd down defense in the first half was, and the Hail mary failures.
I believe it was pretty equal, as it was last year when our defense stopped Big Ben on that final drive.
It takes two. Does anyone disagree with that?
A team with a bad offense but great defense cannot win a Super Bowl very easily anymore in today's NFL.
I believe we will go 19-0 next year. Wanna make a bet? the odds are in your favor.
My rule is: football is allowed to "make" my day. It is not allowed to de-rail my day.
I have addressed your comment. You don't like my argument or it seems any other I make. You say this isn't your fathers, grandfathers or greatgrandfathers NFL. Until a team with the 32 ranked defense wins the Super Bowl I have the better argument.Here’s a recap of our interaction the last couple of pages: You posted it 'boils down to the defense'. Not in response to you in particular but certainly including you, I posted how the playoff teams finished the regular season and noted it’s difficult to argue defense wins championships because the team that was TWENTY FIFTH in scoring defense just beat the team that finished the regular season FIFTEETH for the title. I ended that post with, “Perhaps another more narrow saying now applies. How about, 'Playing good defense in the playoffs is important' ?”
You responded with “offense might get you there but Defense Still Wins Championships”. I made the point that the teams with the best defenses didn’t win a championship. Just to be clear, I posted that and the other stats to show that “defense wins championships” certainly did not apply to this season. IMO you contradicted yourself by posting a team needs a “modicum of defense” and if a team is single faceted they fail. Seriously do you not see the obvious contradiction between these two ideas? ‘A modicum of defense still wins championships.’?
As far as my tone, I agree it was over the top. But so was yours – “I guess you are saying we don’t need a defense. That’s laughable.” Nowhere did I suggest that, I just challenged your bolded statement. At the very least “defense wins championships” implies defense is more important than offense. IMO it's a stronger statement than that. Why are you so reluctant to address what that phrase means?
Very very true.The Packers to me just got their butts kicked. It was not even close at times to me. They were chasing the Giants too much in the game. The refs even tried to help US. Sadly it was a loss they actually deserved. It was not a last second fluke loss or something either.
Where did I say you posted something stupid? You did accuse me of being dishonest by saying I had changed a post and going on a tirade about how I had not even used the word. That is where the escalation started. Futhermore, I understand that if we had Played a "bit" of defense we might be Super Bowl Champions. Yes I still think defense is more important than offense in winning a championship. If the Packers don't improve theirs we will be in the same pickle next year and I guess you will still be saying offense is more important.I’ve already spent way too much time on this so this is my last post on this topic. The saying you quoted has been around for a very long time. I’ll bet most NFL fans understand its meaning and it means defense is more important than offense or special teams when it comes to winning a title. “Defense wins championships” is unambiguous. Many fans, including me, believe with the changes in rules which favor offense and the passing game in particular, it no longer applies: Defense is not the most important aspect of the game.
Perhaps you are having a problem with language. For example, “bromide” does not mean “bore” in the context in which I used it. I posted, “…I only refuted your overly broad bromide that "defense wins championships". You apparently understand that to mean, “I only refuted your overly broad bore that "defense wins championships". That doesn’t make any sense in that context, does it? What it means in this context is “an unoriginal or trite saying”.
When you post ‘until a team with the 32nd ranked defense wins the Super Bowl’ it leads me to believe you don’t understand what “Defense wins championships” means. The team with the 25th scoring defense won it – a team in the bottom quarter of the league. And by posting that you contradict your argument you were just talking about the playoffs.
Here’s the definition of modicum: A small amount; a little. So what you have said in your posts is “defense still wins championships”. The plain meaning of that is defense is the most important aspect of football to win a title; defense is preeminent. You have also said a team needs a ‘modicum of defense’. Arguing that a team must be balanced in offense and defense contradicts the bromide you used: If a team needs both, one isn’t most important. And saying a team needs a ‘small amount of defense’ contradicts saying defense is most important even more. If you can’t understand that I can’t help you. And I’m done trying.
BTW, alleging that I posted something stupid when I posted no such thing escalates an argument IMO.
...this is my last post on this topic.
... I'm done trying as well.
Agreed with the summary by Jules. I do not believe that any of the various strong statements hold water (e.g. "Defense wins championships", "Offense is all that matters").
This is like saying rock always wins, in a game of Rock-Paper-Scissors. Unless you are playing my little nephew, who chooses scissors 100% of the time.
At times, having a high octane offense is necessary while other times having a solid run game or a stuff-defense reigns. It simply depends on the situation.
It seems that having a balanced team with a top quality QB provide the best case for a winning formula. Then, hope for the team to emotionally and physically peak as the playoffs begin. These past two seasons are strong evidence. Both the Packers and Giants were not the dominant force throughout the season, up until the last few weeks. Both had QB/Offenses that could dominate when needed and Defenses that played extremely well throughout the playoffs.