Jess
Movement!
If you guys can't discuss this without arguing with each other then you both should stay out of this thread.
Or I could close it, but I'd rather not do that.
Or I could close it, but I'd rather not do that.
Your age definetely shows.
You're right. I did say that and I still mean it. If you had a Conservative thought in your head, you wouldn't have said what you said. You say you're all over the board politically? I call ********. I'm a fierce Independent who's all over the board politically. I would NEVER dream of saying it was alright to take one's Freedom of Speech away from them. THAT is a purely Liberal thing to do.
Just dont get into a pissing match
It starts to get that way it will be stopped...
So pleaseeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee keep it civil a tad
If you guys can't discuss this without arguing with each other then you both should stay out of this thread.
Or I could close it, but I'd rather not do that.
Pete, Ivo, I am going to ask the two of you to notice what was written above by two mods.
Please do not ruin this thread for others by having it close down by your back-and-forth arguing.
Please, just drop it.
Agree to disagree.
Shake hands :handshake:
Make up.
Discuss other things, like the Packers.
Put each other on "ignore."
Do whatever it takes to cool your jets.
Thank you.
I was more than willing to drop with ivo. He didn't take the hint though. Dropping it and backing down are two seperate things. I'll drop it LONG before I back down.
(At the risk of bumping this, please, no more arguing amongst ourselves. Thank you.)
You probably already know about this but earlier this week ****** got a prank phone call froma blogger claiming to be a supporter.
You can either read the abridged transcript or scroll down to listen to the conversation or both.
Either one, this is awesome!
http://www.buffalobeast.com/?p=5045
http://bloximages.chicago2.vip.town...01cc4c002e0-revisions/4d6679b51db5a.image.jpg
This is a really good take on the situation.
Puts things in perspective.
Scott Walker's War - Isthmus | The Daily Page
Walker claims the state's budget crisis is so gaping and horrific he had no choice but to unilaterally extract benefit concessions from some public employees and minimize the collective bargaining rights of nearly all of them, at the state and local level. But Wisconsin's fiscal situation is not as grave as that of other states, nor is its current budget deficit as large as what Walker's predecessor was able to plug two years ago, without drastic measures.
Moreover, Walker's sense of urgency over reining in employee benefits has not prompted him to be otherwise tightfisted. In just the last several weeks, Walker and the GOP have passed $140 million in new tax breaks for businesses, with more to come. (As a candidate, he promised more than a billion dollars of givebacks to corporations and the state's wealthiest residents.)
From reading this here's what I think:
1) Why or how the heck did ****** think that the majority of State workers would be OK with what he is proposing? He's gotta be the dumbest moron if he really thought that they would be fine with him taking away their bargaining rights and making changes to their pay checks.
You just don't mess around with stuff like that and not expect consequences or people to not be mad as hell.
2) It really is not about balancing the state budget at all. It's all about union busting, taking charge and making sure that the Republicrats will be in power for a long time.
3) It's good that those senators left the state. They did the right thing.
4) It really is a war on the working class. More power to them.
Eh, so what. If this same thing happened to someone from the other side, the context and content would have been similar.
Frankly, I think ALL public worker unions should be decertified and disbanded. They have too much power to hold the city hostage and are just unnecessary. Here's the job, here's what it pays, here's the benefits. Don't like it, you're free to work somewhere else. Not sure why you need a union for that.
Well if one wants good pay and benefits then one could go work for the state. They could take your example in the first quote.I mean, seriously, why should ANYONE get automatic job security and a Cadillac pension plan just because they work for the state? Shouldn't the jobs go to the people who are willing to work hard, and shouldn't people be expected to pay for their own retirement and health care benefits? Why should state workers be exempt from those things the rest of us have to be responsible for?
Well if one wants good pay and benefits then one could go work for the state. They could take your example in the first quote.
And they are working at paying for their own retirement and health care benefits. Your acting like they shouldn't get those things just because it's subsidized by the state? You think they should work for free?
And we're not talking about folks who will be making millions at their jobs. We're talking about common hard working people who make a difference in our lives everyday. Snow plow drivers, construction workers, cops, fire fighters, teachers, nurses etc etc.
Don't you (Or anyone else) thinks they should get some good stuff in return?
Walker's proposals is something that goes against the common working folks. The middle class. The working class. How can anyone be against that?
And the unions are willing to compromise, to meet Walker half way. They (And the workers) are willing to concede with the pay cuts for the benefits and pensions but Walker is being stubborn and still insists on taking away their bargaining rights.
You know, if this same thing was happening to the Packers, no doubt those who are on the forum on Walker's side would turn against him and be crying out for the player's rights.
Forget Favre,
Thank you, Charles, for having our backs. Unions are all about negotiating the best deal possible just like businesses negotiate the best deal possible. My product is my skilled labor and contracts are negotiated and agreed to by BOTH parties. That's capitalism at work right there. Envious of what your union member neighbor earns? That's just petty thinking. Instead of being jealous maybe you should unionize. Solidarity forever. And, yes, we are taxpayers too.
So do I and so does the Madison mayor and police chief.I worry about a governor that would consider planting trouble makers in a peaceful rally.