Amish Mafia running the Packer Draft

[Sunshinepacker]

Reed wont kick any field goals either, but.thats okay. A NT in Capers defense is not to sack but to stack. Reed plays smart and uses his talents wisely. He routinely pushes the LOS back despite even 2 blockers. He will make life better for our ILBs to do.their jobs. His only drawback is late in games late in plays he starts playing tall. all in all I think he is better suited fpr our defense than those you mentioned.

The guys you list could all be good too. Never saw so many good DL. Two other names are Butler and Reeds teammate, A'shawn robinson. Either of those two would be as about a s good and Robinson would be better. But I expect him likely to be gone.

I'm aware that he can't kick field goals...and no player on the dline is asked NOT to sack the QB. The NT role isn't focused on sacking the QB but I doubt Capers would tell a guy that could do his job AND get pressure to not get pressure. My point with Reed is that I'm not sure a run stopping NT who can't rush the passer is worth a first round pick.

 

[AmishMafia]

IMO Reed is the better prospect than both Robinson and Butler. I expect both of them to be drafted in the second round.

Bold! I expect Butler to be there, but A'Shawn will likely be gone. And I'm not sure Reed will be there. I give him a 65% chance.

I'm aware that he can't kick field goals...and no player on the dline is asked NOT to sack the QB. The NT role isn't focused on sacking the QB but I doubt Capers would tell a guy that could do his job AND get pressure to not get pressure. My point with Reed is that I'm not sure a run stopping NT who can't rush the passer is worth a first round pick.

I'm sure Capers would want him to sack the QB if he has an easy opportunity. But his role is to push the pocket which is also effective in shutting down the passing game. Don't allow the QB to step up will restrict his opportunities. Sacks are great in helping the defense shut down another team and it is an easy stat to track. But collapsing the pocket on a consistent basis is very effective as well.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Bold! I expect Butler to be there, but A'Shawn will likely be gone. And I'm not sure Reed will be there. I give him a 65% chance.

I'm convinced Reed will be a first-round pick and will likely be gone by the time the Packers are on the clock. IMO Butler and Robinson aren't first-round talents though.

 

[GreenBaySlacker]

Bad news for you. Unless Ragland or Lee drop I dont think the Packers go ILB. I also dont think the ILB position is as dire as dome here think. Both Ryan and Barrington showed some promise. I dont see any ILBs beyond those 2 who show any immediate promise. Cassanova will be great on STs for a couple of years while we see if he develops.

I think one of our safety hybrids like hyde, would be a fine ilb...just a thought.

 

[Poppa San]

I think one of our safety hybrids like hyde, would be a fine ilb...just a thought.

That's my thinking on the tweener ILB chatter.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I think one of our safety hybrids like hyde, would be a fine ilb...just a thought.

Hyde isn't good enough defending the run to play inside linebacker.

 

[GreenBaySlacker]

Hyde isn't good enough defending the run to play inside linebacker.

Obviously thats the weakness in the plan. But hyde can tackle. He can cover better than any ilb we will find this year....get a dline in front of him and he would be just fine...for an option...

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Obviously thats the weakness in the plan. But hyde can tackle. He can cover better than any ilb we will find this year....get a dline in front of him and he would be just fine...for an option...

NFL teams are great in exploiting weaknesses and opposing offenses would for sure figure out a way to do it with that one by running Hyde´s way. He would most likey be fine as the dime linebacker on obvious passing downs but other than that doesn´t offer the needed upgrade at the position.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Hyde at ILB at 6', 200 lbs.? What a bad idea. It's one thing to see a guy come up from the back end or out of the slot and make a slicing tackle from time to time. It's a whole different thing to stick him in the middle of the field and expect him to take on O-Linemen at the second level. If teams always threw the ball in nickel and dime, they'd have thrown it 80% of the time last season. There are far too many tweener run/pass downs for him to be playing the position.

 

[HardRightEdge]

NFL teams are great in exploiting weaknesses and opposing offenses would for sure figure out a way to do it with that one by running Hyde´s way. He would most likey be fine as the dime linebacker on obvious passing downs but other than that doesn´t offer the needed upgrade at the position.

It would make a lot of sense to have a guy like Hyde at dime backer in long yardage, which is precisely the situation where dime is used. There's one problem with that. You'd now have 7 DBs on the field (would we call that "the quarter?"). which means you're going way deep into the bench.

So, while using Hyde in that way might patch up one problem in the short middle zone, another is exposed downfield going so deep into the bench.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

It would make a lot of sense to have a guy like Hyde at dime backer in long yardage, which is precisely the situation where dime is used. There's one problem with that. You'd now have 7 DBs on the field (would we call that "the quarter?"). which means you're going way deep into the bench.

So, while using Hyde in that way might patch up one problem in the short middle zone, another is exposed downfield going so deep into the bench.

Well, that depends on if the coaching staff feels confident about Gunter being capable of covering one of the outside receivers. I expect Shields, Randall, Rollins, Burnett and Clinton-Dix to be on the field in the nickel package so adding Hyde as the dime linebacker is dependent on Gunter´s performance.

As soon as there´s one injury in the secondary I wouldn´t feel comfortable lining up with seven defensive backs though.

 

[GreenBaySlacker]

Hyde at ILB at 6', 200 lbs.? What a bad idea. It's one thing to see a guy come up from the back end or out of the slot and make a slicing tackle from time to time. It's a whole different thing to stick him in the middle of the field and expect him to take on O-Linemen at the second level. If teams always threw the ball in nickel and dime, they'd have thrown it 80% of the time last season. There are far too many tweener run/pass downs for him to be playing the position.

I can agree. Especially with capers 2 dlinemen up front all the time... But say we get a dline that is getting penetration for a change... That makes a huge difference. Also the theme of the packers defense is smaller, quicker, able to get to the play easier. Rather than big and coming up a half step short of the tackle. Calling datone jones a every down de coming in to the league, is a perfect example of what capers wants to do... But he is now leaning towards a bigger better dline, and its working better. Along with this theme, people are willing to drop a 1st rounder on ilb Lee... Who at 6'1" 230 would be a smear on the turf against the run as well... So the benefit of speed , ability to cover, and strong tackling for a 200 pounder. The strengths vs the weaknesses. I think its an option. Not as a starter, but a contributor...
If it makes more sense, burnett is 210. Hyde could play safety...

Ragland would be sweet, but i think he will be long gone by #27.

 

[thisisnate]

League and fans have gone safety/ilb tweener crazy. I get the appeal, but we don't need to force people out of position just to cover the latest defensive fad. If we were going to do that, Richardson was our guy, but our insanely improbable run of seasons with career-ending neck injuries claimed that poor soul.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Along with this theme, people are willing to drop a 1st rounder on ilb Lee... Who at 6'1" 230 would be a smear on the turf against the run as well... So the benefit of speed , ability to cover, and strong tackling for a 200 pounder.

I just hope it's not the Packers spending their first-rounder on Darron Lee.

 

[GreenBaySlacker]

League and fans have gone safety/ilb tweener crazy. I get the appeal, but we don't need to force people out of position just to cover the latest defensive fad. If we were going to do that, Richardson was our guy, but our insanely improbable run of seasons with career-ending neck injuries claimed that poor soul.

Im quite out spoken about having a big dominant dline. And playing 3 dlinemen , most the time, even on obvious passing downs. So on those obvious passing downs. There should be ilbs who can cover well, since the secondary doesnt have that extra player that capers likes in his nickel/dime. All lbs should jave the ability to cover well imho...

Having the peppers type olbs who rush nearly all the time, seems a lot like a 4-3 dime. Only you call him a olb instead of de.... Why not just play a 4-3 if you are going to build a weakness into the olb position???
If you want a 3-4 then put 3 dlinemen in and a olb that isnt a liability in coverage. Imo.

 

[HardRightEdge]

4b. Kolby Listenbee wr TCU: a one-trick pony, but it is a pretty good trick. He is blazing fast and can really stretch the field. A little bird told me that the Packers think he can develop better route running and can be an all-around receiver. He has a lot of work to do, and if he stops track, hopefully he can focus more time on learning football nuances.

Beside the blazing speed, the thing that jumps out at me is how well he tracks and adjusts to deep balls. He also shows good competitiveness on contested balls for a smaller WR. Compared to a mere dash-and-grab speedster, I'd call him a 2-trick pony for the ball skills. Seems to show good hands, but the highlight tapes won't show any drops. I can see what your little birdie might see in him; there's a lot to work with. The #6 spot could easily be contested.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Beside the blazing speed, the thing that jumps out at me is how well he tracks and adjusts to deep balls. He also shows good competitiveness on contested balls for a smaller WR. Compared to a mere dash-and-grab speedster, I'd call him a 2-trick pony for the ball skills. Seems to show good hands, but the highlight tapes won't show any drops. I can see what your little birdie might see in him; there's a lot to work with. The #6 spot could easily be contested.

Listenbee had two drops on a total of 32 catchable balls last season for a drop rate of 6.25%. He´s mostly a deep threat though and as we´ve seen with Janis last season the coaching staff doesn´t feel comfortable playing receivers like that.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Listenbee had two drops on a total of 32 catchable balls last season for a drop rate of 6.25%. He´s mostly a deep threat though and as we´ve seen with Janis last season the coaching staff doesn´t feel comfortable playing receivers like that.

As far as the drops go, the data sample is too small to judge one way or the other.

The Packers have made a conscious effort to add a stretch-the field complement, starting last season with White and Janis, which have not worked out so well. Janis has made some slow progress.

Here's a Listenbee reel:

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There is no comparison to Janis; these are entirely different players.

0:54 & 2:10: track and adjust
2:22: double move

You'll also see several catches where he looks very natural with the ball thrown over his head, a catch some 3rd. round picks struggle with, and you know to whom I'm referring. There are several plays where you see him contest for the ball and win. I think that's where his 18 lifts show up. It also indicates strength to work off press coverage.

He shows clever hand work to get separation.

nfl.com commented, "Gangly with a frame that is too thin at this time. Takes an excessive amount of time to gear down into his breaks and is slow to turn and find the ball." I don't see the need for body changes and the gearing down into the breaks looks to me like he setting up DBs, which needs work in that it needs to be selective. Slow to turn and find the ball? I'm not seeing that.

Clearly there's not much route tree on display, which will need to be learned. But there is a lot here that cannot be taught which goes beyond raw speed.

 

[4zone]

Without harping on specific players here, I'm not seeing this at all.

DL will be our target in Rd1 but what's trending is a deep run early which will leave good talent at OL available which would be my #2 prediction for Rd. 1.
If we go OT in Rd1, Rd will be DL for certain unless an option at LB TT likes is available there.
We start hitting the LB's in Rd 3 and 4 with a possible RB as well, not before Rd4 though. Probably not until Rd 5.
I don't see us taking a TE until Rd 5 with Cook now signed.

If we get DL in Rd.1 I see LB's in Rd 2 and 3 unless a top shelf OT falls to Rd 2. Then we push LB's down one more round to start in 3. If not, I see an OT/G in Rd 4 along with a Rb. Again, TE not until Rd5.

Lastly, I see a Punter in Rd 6. An intended replacement, not just camp competition.

Last word: it's all about the 26 teams in front of us that will drive this draft. There are a lot of targets that can come in right away and some that can be long term solutions at highly sought after positions. The game is afoot....

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Without harping on specific players here, I'm not seeing this at all.

DL will be our target in Rd1 but what's trending is a deep run early which will leave good talent at OL available which would be my #2 prediction for Rd. 1.

With the Packers having far more pressing needs there´s absolutely no reason to draft an offensive lineman in the first round.

 

[4zone]

With the Packers having far more pressing needs there´s absolutely no reason to draft an offensive lineman in the first round.

Arizona Cardinals proved otherwise.

 

[AmishMafia]

With the Packers having far more pressing needs there´s absolutely no reason to draft an offensive lineman in the first round.

With 3 starters (Sitton, Bahk, and Lang) and a primary backup, Tretter all FAs next year, I would put OL as high on the needs list. In fact, if Conklin is there, mark my words, he would be the pick. Even over my favorite, Reed, much to my dismay.

 

[4zone]

With 3 starters (Sitton, Bahk, and Lang) and a primary backup, Tretter all FAs next year, I would put OL as high on the needs list. In fact, if Conklin is there, mark my words, he would be the pick. Even over my favorite, Reed, much to my dismay.

We will not get all 4 back in 2017-18. A replacement with a year to get up to speed and fill in for injuries the first year is real smart. Who knows, maybe even supplant a current starter.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I can see either Conklin or Decker potentially being on the board at #27, but would be disappointed if Ragland was there and TT chose to fill a possible 2017 need instead of one that has been glaring for many seasons. While I don't think choosing either OT would necessarily be a wasted pick, especially if the needs at ILB and DL could be taken care of with the next 2-3 picks, TT will have a year + to fill whatever needs me may or may not have on the OL. Also, with both Sitton and Lang on the bubble for 2017, I would prefer TT go after a quality guard to replace one of them before he uses a pick on an OT.

 

[AmishMafia]

I can see either Conklin or Decker potentially being on the board at #27, but would be disappointed if Ragland was there and TT chose to fill a possible 2017 need instead of one that has been glaring for many seasons. While I don't think choosing either OT would necessarily be a wasted pick, especially if the needs at ILB and DL could be taken care of with the next 2-3 picks, TT will have a year + to fill whatever needs me may or may not have on the OL. Also, with both Sitton and Lang on the bubble for 2017, I would prefer TT go after a quality guard to replace one of them before he uses a pick on an OT.

We have 2 ILBs who have experience and are servicable. They are both young and still on the upswing. OL is not typically plug and play. I would rather have an ILB issue than a OL issue. And we need an OL to sit on the bench and prep for next season so next year OL is not a dire need that cannot be met.

To me, I would take Reed before Ragland and Conklin. But I think for TT it would be Conklin, Reed And then Ragland.

I wonder if Spriggs is on the radar at 1? Sure seems like a TT guy. And he has been climbing the charts as of late to early first. When I did this mock he was listed as mid 2 to late 3.