Let’s have a serious conversation…aka ditch Anders

[BrokenArrow]

I don't think we want a project this year where it looks like we could be very good. If he makes a bunch of mistakes in preseason or early in the season; I say go with someone else. Would not mind spending a late round pick on a kicker.

What guarantee do you have that "someone else" would be better? Who do you have in mind?

 

[gopkrs]

What guarantee do you have that "someone else" would be better? Who do you have in mind?

No guarantees. Just think there must be a kicker out there in the college ranks that would be worth a look see and a late draft pick. The kicker from Missouri was impressive. We have scouts. Some of them should be given the task of looking for a kicker. Not exclusively. Just don't want to be stuck with inconsistency come the regular season. I hope he turns it around for us. Don't want to be holding my breath on every kick.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

No guarantees. Just think there must be a kicker out there in the college ranks that would be worth a look see and a late draft pick. The kicker from Missouri was impressive. We have scouts. Some of them should be given the task of looking for a kicker. Not exclusively. Just don't want to be stuck with inconsistency come the regular season. I hope he turns it around for us. Don't want to be holding my breath on every kick.

I am guessing those are the same scouts that the Packers used last year to evaluate Carlson? Maybe bad scouting or perhaps just another situation showing that relying on a rookie kicker, isn't the best thing to do.

While I think Carlson deserves and will be given a chance to prove himself to be better than he was last year, I think that window closes at the end of August. If he doesn't, I would prefer the Packers have a proven Vet. ready to step in.

This goes back to what Captain and I debated every year. He wanted Crosby out and the Packers to replace him with an any UDFA that could kick in college, because it save the team a few million. For my money, when you have a team that could be in it until February, make sure you have a kicker you don't have to worry about.

 

[gopkrs]

I am guessing those are the same scouts that the Packers used last year to evaluate Carlson? Maybe bad scouting or perhaps just another situation showing that relying on a rookie kicker, isn't the best thing to do.

While I think Carlson deserves and will be given a chance to prove himself to be better than he was last year, I think that window closes at the end of August. If he doesn't, I would prefer the Packers have a proven Vet. ready to step in.

This goes back to what Captain and I debated every year. He wanted Crosby out and the Packers to replace him with an any UDFA that could kick in college, because it save the team a few million. For my money, when you have a team that could be in it until February, make sure you have a kicker you don't have to worry about.

I wonder if a directive given to a couple of scouts to specifically look for a kicker might not get them giving more of a concentrated effort. I don't know what their instructions have been or are. Just go out and look for good players? Anyway, I am not against checking out our top rated rookie. But sure, also bring in a vet. There seem to always be very good vets that stay with a second team for a good number of years. Just not anyone, but someone with a very good track record. It's another one of those positions where you can't be penny pinching and think you are going to get away with it imho.

 

[Schultz]

No guarantees. Just think there must be a kicker out there in the college ranks that would be worth a look see and a late draft pick. The kicker from Missouri was impressive. We have scouts. Some of them should be given the task of looking for a kicker. Not exclusively. Just don't want to be stuck with inconsistency come the regular season. I hope he turns it around for us. Don't want to be holding my breath on every kick.

IMO replacing a young kicker with another young kicker is not the best approach. Bring in a vet for competition.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Well....Gute went and did it.

Former Viking, Greg Joseph will join the Packers as a placekicker who will compete with 2023 rookie draft pick Anders Carlson in training camp. Joseph has prior experience in the NFL, as he’s been a member of six franchises

Packers ink kicker Joseph to challenge Carlson

The Packers signed veteran kicker Greg Joseph to compete with Anders Carlson.

www.espn.com

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Not really all that impressed with Joseph's Stats

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[Firethorn1001]

No guarantees. Just think there must be a kicker out there in the college ranks that would be worth a look see and a late draft pick. We have scouts. Some of them should be given the task of looking for a kicker.

I'm sure they expend energy reviewing kickers, but.. lets be honest.. I very much doubt the pool for potential kickers is that big and probably can be measured in the high single digits or low teens and that is being generous so putting a massive amount of energy into kicker research I doubt is happening. If you don't have the range to kick 50+ FGs in the NFL then they are immediately removed from the pool. Given that, I'm not an NFL scout and I could probably whittle the pool down significantly just by looking at a stat sheet and come up with 10 guys and go.. look closer at these 10.

 

[Poppa San]

Not really all that impressed with Joseph's Stats

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2019 -- 2 games and 9/9 XP? I'd like that type of scoring this season.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

2019 -- 2 games and 9/9 XP? I'd like that type of scoring this season.

That was 4 seasons ago. On XP's Joseph is a career 90%'er on XP's (146/162).

Now that's better than Anders 87% 34/39, but not much.

Let's put it this way, there's no clear cut favorite between them.

 

[lambeaulambo]

I do not think this bodes well for either. Anders needs more swedish whirlpools and dare I say it - darkness retreat.

 

[OldSchool101]

So what I’m seeing just off the cuff? Joseph in near automatic at
XPM%. 95%
Compare to Carlson was in the 87% area at XPM

Also Carlson had a surprisingly lower TB% 40%. I thought he was supposed to have a huge leg?!
Compared to Joseph more normal 71.3% TB%.

Joseph and Carlson at FG% were splitting hairs. 80%-81% in 2023. However Joseph is back on top for career FG% 82.6%. So yes, they are about the same at FG in general, but Joseph wins the overall career %competition by a slight margin. Joseph wins the TB%.

PS. One last thing. Joseph inside 40 for his career? 62/63!!! (98.41%) That I had to double check because it looked wrong!


He’s “Elite inside 40” and even including his XPA he's 92.44% career on any attempt inside 40 yards. That’s pretty darn good.
-Above average distance (61 career long)
-Exactly Average TB% 71.3% which is #17 (20+ minimum tries)
Pedestrian FG% (82.6% career)

The one thing I don’t know is how does Joseph do in cold weather. It’s one thing to Kick in US bank Stadium and another at Lambeau

 

[gopkrs]

I think it's just a face saving thing for Gute. Joseph has been with what...6 teams. And Minihaha doesn't want him anymore.

 

[Thirteen Below]

Joseph will earn up to $1.295M on this one-year contract, Ian Rapoport of NFL Network reports. As Tessler notes, the 29-year-old drew interest from other teams, but he preferred to join Green Bay. Joseph will serve as veteran competition with Anders Carlson this offseason.

Sounds like a big part of his decision is that he thinks he's got an excellent chance here of outkicking the current kicker and securing the starting job. If I were an aging kicker looking for a little bit of security with one last team, Green Bay would be awfuly attarctive.

 

[Poppa San]

That was 4 seasons ago.

I was referring more to the 9 TDs in 2 games than the kicker.

Also Carlson had a surprisingly lower TB% 40%. I thought he was supposed to have a huge leg?!
Compared to Joseph more normal 71.3% TB%.

With the new kickoff rules, TBs will become a thing of the past.

 

[El Guapo]

Most fans on here wanted legitimate competition at kicker. Now we got it. May the best man win.

 

[Voyageur]

Good competition in camp for the role of kicker. I think Joseph will win, and we can all breath a sigh of relief. Then again, Carlson might come out of the chute a different kicker, even though I don't believe that's gonna happen. I think it's Joseph, because he's automatic on everything from 45 yards in, and EPs.

If anything goes wrong, with him kicking, it's gotta be on the other two guys in the chain.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

So what I’m seeing just off the cuff? Joseph in near automatic at
XPM%. 95%

Actually, for his career, he is only 90% . I think you are looking at last season only.

That is the thing with Kickers, 1 or 2 missed/made kicks in a season, can drastically change the %.

Again, you also need to look at the "kicking unit". Were they all performing well? While I am glad that Gute has brought in veteran competition, I would expect the kicking unit (K, H, LS) to improve with time.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Also Carlson had a surprisingly lower TB% 40%. I thought he was supposed to have a huge leg?!
Compared to Joseph more normal 71.3% TB%.

This is another area that would need clarification. We all need to remember, that a TB is not ALWAYS the desired outcome. If you have a good coverage team and a kicker that can pop their kicks a bit higher, the ST coach may decide to tempt the opponent each time with a returnable ball.

Then you have all the other variables, wind, temps, game situations, etc.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I was referring more to the 9 TDs in 2 games than the kicker.

Missed that. Well, the Packers offense ranked 8th in TD's scored last season (44 TD's), that isn't too bad, but room for improvement.

While I think the offense will most likely get better in 2024, due to development of young players, I see the Packers needing to get better on Defense and Special Teams.

It would be nice to see the Packers do better in the Turnover ratio as well. How do they do that? While they ended up having a Net Turnover Ratio of 0 (18th ranked), the Packer offense only gave the ball up 18 times, which ranked them tied for 6th in the NFL. Meanwhile, the defense's 18 takeaways was 23rd in the NFL and the Packers defense only intercepted the ball 7 times, 31st in the NFL.

 

[PikeBadger]

That was 4 seasons ago. On XP's Joseph is a career 90%'er on XP's (146/162).

Now that's better than Anders 87% 34/39, but not much.

Let's put it this way, there's no clear cut favorite between them.

Gasp, he missed 6 XP in 2022.
Fire Joseph now!

 

[El Guapo]

No matter who is kicking, we will not improve without a better option at long-snapper. That was a consistent problem last season that many people are conveniently overlooking when assessing Carlson. I don't care if it's Joseph, Carlson, or the ghost of Vince Lombardi out there. We will still have problems if snaps are not coming in perfect every time.

 

[DoURant]

It seems like kickers across the league are more accurate at FG's inside 40 yds than they are at PAT'S. Could it be because FG's are on the hashes and PAT'S are in the middle of the field? Joseph 62/63 inside 40, yet has missed 16 PAT's... Carlson was 20/20 on FG's inside 40, yet missed 5 PAT'S.

 

[SudsMcBucky]

It seems like kickers across the league are more accurate at FG's inside 40 yds than they are at PAT'S. Could it be because FG's are on the hashes and PAT'S are in the middle of the field? Joseph 62/63 inside 40, yet has missed 16 PAT's... Carlson was 20/20 on FG's inside 40, yet missed 5 PAT'S.

A kicker can spot the PAT where he wants.

 

[DoURant]

A kicker can spot the PAT where he wants.

Maybe some of these kickers should choose that option moving forward. I very seldom have seen a kicker attempt a PAT from the hash marks.