The Jordan Love Thread

[Sunshinepacker]

Jordan Love might turn into a great QB. It’s doubtful it will be this year mainly because it’s only his second year abs I’m not real sure how much practice he got last year with he COVID protocols. His college tape showed a good QB when he had a lot of support and a mediocre QB when he didn’t. I tend to think he’s closer to the good QB and he’ll be that in the NFL because he’ll have more practice time and won’t be turning over offensive skill players every year. However, anyone that thinks there isn’t a decent chance that Love isn’t a good NFL quarterback is being unrealistic.

 

[TAYLORBOY]

Plus ... I don't know why but I got a feeling Urban Meyer's system isn't going to end up working too well in the NFL. The man has never coached 1 down of NFL football before, and aside from Pete Caroll, almost zero successful college coaches end up doing anything in the pros.

Pete Carroll was posting losing seasons at Seattle until they drafted Russel Wilson..

 

[PackerfaninCarolina]

Pete Carroll was posting losing seasons at Seattle until they drafted Russel Wilson..

Well to be fair he had only been there 2 years prior to RW being drafted. But yeah point still stands though that very few big shot college coaches are able to hack it in the big leagues.

 

[GleefulGary]

My only point is that Love effectively had one year where people were like, "hey, look at this guy". That was his sophomore year at Utah St. that doesn't play the toughest of competition. After he lost some good teammates he did not elevate the players around him like good QBs do. You're also cherry picking anomalies. One can also play the exception to the rules game. There are busts at all levels and there are anomalies as well. I would agree that HS doesn't mean crap in the NFL. However, how do you think big time athletes get to big time schools? Point is, Love has never had a lot of hype around him and I think it is because he's just not that good. He's a big time flyer and risk. But hey, I'm just a dude typing in a chat room. I have zero knowledge of pro football besides watching it at home on my couch.

Anomolies? Arguably the top 3 QB’s in the league don’t fit into your standards bc of not being blue chip QB’s. We can go further too! Russell Wilson was a 3* QB, best offer an average ACC team, transferred, and drafted in the 3rd round. Dak Prescott, 3* QB, drafted in the mid rounds. Josh Allen, best offer was Wyoming. Lamar Jackson, 3* QB that some schools wanted as a WR. Ben Roethlisberger, Miami of Ohio. I’m not cherry picking. These aren’t anomalies. One could argue the best blue chip QB’s in the league are Matt Stafford and Jared Goff.

Jordan Love had one excellent year. He also had a poor year, with absolutely awful teammates. One could argue he did raise their level of play, but there are limits to the ceiling. Do I think he’ll be great, or even good? I have no idea! I do think he has great physical talent, and can make every pass you would want him to. He just has to figure out the mental side of things. I think it’s easier to teach a QB to be less aggressive than to be more aggressive.

 

[Krabs]

Anomolies? Arguably the top 3 QB’s in the league don’t fit into your standards bc of not being blue chip QB’s. We can go further too! Russell Wilson was a 3* QB, best offer an average ACC team, transferred, and drafted in the 3rd round. Dak Prescott, 3* QB, drafted in the mid rounds. Josh Allen, best offer was Wyoming. Lamar Jackson, 3* QB that some schools wanted as a WR. Ben Roethlisberger, Miami of Ohio. I’m not cherry picking. These aren’t anomalies. One could argue the best blue chip QB’s in the league are Matt Stafford and Jared Goff.

Jordan Love had one excellent year. He also had a poor year, with absolutely awful teammates. One could argue he did raise their level of play, but there are limits to the ceiling. Do I think he’ll be great, or even good? I have no idea! I do think he has great physical talent, and can make every pass you would want him to. He just has to figure out the mental side of things. I think it’s easier to teach a QB to be less aggressive than to be more aggressive.

Peyton Manning, John Elway, Troy Aikman, Andrew Luck, Eli Manning, Matthew Stafford... The list goes on. I would much rather take my chances rolling the dice on proven guys against tough competition. Again, I'm no scout. My only point is that I feel like Love was a reach in the draft and really never had much hype around him. To each their own. I just don't like the pick and think he isn't that good. Here's to hoping I'm wrong! Go Pack Go!

 

[GleefulGary]

Peyton Manning, John Elway, Troy Aikman, Andrew Luck, Eli Manning, Matthew Stafford... The list goes on. I would much rather take my chances rolling the dice on proven guys against tough competition. Again, I'm no scout. My only point is that I feel like Love was a reach in the draft and really never had much hype around him. To each their own. I just don't like the pick and think he isn't that good. Here's to hoping I'm wrong! Go Pack Go!

When you have to bring up a bunch of QB’s who aren’t in the league anymore to defend your anomalies statement, it should tell you how good your argument is.

 

[longtimefan]

My only point is that Love effectively had one year where people were like, "hey, look at this guy". That was his sophomore year at Utah St. that doesn't play the toughest of competition. After he lost some good teammates he did not elevate the players around him like good QBs do. You're also cherry picking anomalies. One can also play the exception to the rules game. There are busts at all levels and there are anomalies as well. I would agree that HS doesn't mean crap in the NFL. However, how do you think big time athletes get to big time schools? Point is, Love has never had a lot of hype around him and I think it is because he's just not that good. He's a big time flyer and risk. But hey, I'm just a dude typing in a chat room. I have zero knowledge of pro football besides watching it at home on my couch.

Love had diff system that year.

 

[Krabs]

When you have to bring up a bunch of QB’s who aren’t in the league anymore to defend your anomalies statement, it should tell you how good your argument is.

The Mannings and Luck just recently retired and Stafford is still rolling. I'm taking into account the history of the NFL. I also think it is okay to disagree on things. I haven't changed my mind about Love regardless of feedback. I think the Packers took a major flyer on a guy who had one solid year of football at a low level college against bad competition.

Love had diff system that year.

Sounds like an excuse to why he couldn't rise to the level of the Mountain West and raise the level of his teammates up.

I hope I'm wrong on this. It's just my opinion as it stands right now. I'm looking forward to seeing him play in the preseason to see what he has.

 

[AmishMafia]

The Mannings and Luck just recently retired and Stafford is still rolling. I'm taking into account the history of the NFL. I also think it is okay to disagree on things. I haven't changed my mind about Love regardless of feedback. I think the Packers took a major flyer on a guy who had one solid year of football at a low level college against bad competition.

Sounds like an excuse to why he couldn't rise to the level of the Mountain West and raise the level of his teammates up.

I hope I'm wrong on this. It's just my opinion as it stands right now. I'm looking forward to seeing him play in the preseason to see what he has.

Yup. I agree. The Packers took a major gamble. Do you think it was worth it?

At that point in time, I believe it was. I would not have taken him in the top 20. But where the Packers took him was value. He has a ceiling that is very high. Either playing in a new system with all rookies around him caused his poor play or the previous year of sensational play was a fluke. One or the other. There are other players who had 1 amazing college season and then flaked out in the NFL. Had he repeated his performance, he would have gone top 10 and we would have had no shot to draft him.

So a late 1st round pick on a player who has demonstrated the skills to play at an elite level when our fHOF QB has been on the decline for the last few season? It was a good pick. Doesn't mean he will work out, but you have to take shots like that to be a SB contending team.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Yup. I agree. The Packers took a major gamble. Do you think it was worth it?

At that point in time, I believe it was. I would not have taken him in the top 20. But where the Packers took him was value. He has a ceiling that is very high. Either playing in a new system with all rookies around him caused his poor play or the previous year of sensational play was a fluke. One or the other. There are other players who had 1 amazing college season and then flaked out in the NFL. Had he repeated his performance, he would have gone top 10 and we would have had no shot to draft him.

So a late 1st round pick on a player who has demonstrated the skills to play at an elite level when our fHOF QB has been on the decline for the last few season? It was a good pick. Doesn't mean he will work out, but you have to take shots like that to be a SB contending team.

The Packers were a Super Bowl contending team at the time of the 2020 draft. There was no reason to draft a quarterback in the first round who might make them one several years down the road.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

Yup. I agree. The Packers took a major gamble. Do you think it was worth it?

At that point in time, I believe it was. I would not have taken him in the top 20. But where the Packers took him was value. He has a ceiling that is very high. Either playing in a new system with all rookies around him caused his poor play or the previous year of sensational play was a fluke. One or the other. There are other players who had 1 amazing college season and then flaked out in the NFL. Had he repeated his performance, he would have gone top 10 and we would have had no shot to draft him.

So a late 1st round pick on a player who has demonstrated the skills to play at an elite level when our fHOF QB has been on the decline for the last few season? It was a good pick. Doesn't mean he will work out, but you have to take shots like that to be a SB contending team.

I agree with this but context DOES matter. Pretty much every other important position on an NFL team has multiple players at that position on the field at the same time OR a player that comes in fairly often to give the starter a break. That's not the case with QB. Taking a first round flyer on a guy that won't help the team unless the starter is injured isn't really helping the team because it's still going to be a downgrade at the QB position if Love is forced to play.

Love might be a very good QB but drafting him when you already have a very good QB (who isn't threatening to retire every year) is not a move designed to help the team win a Super Bowl in the near term (or really medium term). I guess I could have understood more had they traded BACK into the second round and drafted Jalen Hurts because then the Packers would have added additional assets with the trade back rather than giving up assets to draft a guy who doesn't make the current team better.

 

[Krabs]

Yup. I agree. The Packers took a major gamble. Do you think it was worth it?

At that point in time, I believe it was. I would not have taken him in the top 20. But where the Packers took him was value. He has a ceiling that is very high. Either playing in a new system with all rookies around him caused his poor play or the previous year of sensational play was a fluke. One or the other. There are other players who had 1 amazing college season and then flaked out in the NFL. Had he repeated his performance, he would have gone top 10 and we would have had no shot to draft him.

So a late 1st round pick on a player who has demonstrated the skills to play at an elite level when our fHOF QB has been on the decline for the last few season? It was a good pick. Doesn't mean he will work out, but you have to take shots like that to be a SB contending team.

The only thing, and I know a lot of other fans feel this way, is they could have drafted a player that would have helped immediately. I really thought they traded up to take Queen because of the constant need at ILB. I will give Love a tip of the cap for his sophomore year with 3,400 yards passing and 32 td passes. Again, it is just at a lower level against the Mountain West. He also couldn't repeat that performance. Regardless, I'm looking forward to seeing what he has. Hopefully, @GleefulGary can throw it in my face later and I will gladly eat a plate of crow if it all works out.

 

[AmishMafia]

I agree with this but context DOES matter. Pretty much every other important position on an NFL team has multiple players at that position on the field at the same time OR a player that comes in fairly often to give the starter a break. That's not the case with QB. Taking a first round flyer on a guy that won't help the team unless the starter is injured isn't really helping the team because it's still going to be a downgrade at the QB position if Love is forced to play.

Love might be a very good QB but drafting him when you already have a very good QB (who isn't threatening to retire every year) is not a move designed to help the team win a Super Bowl in the near term (or really medium term). I guess I could have understood more had they traded BACK into the second round and drafted Jalen Hurts because then the Packers would have added additional assets with the trade back rather than giving up assets to draft a guy who doesn't make the current team better.

You have to remember, although Rodgers was not threatening to retire, his play was decreasing significantly the last few years. I actually believe that it was the drafting of Love that woke him up and got him focused.

I heard when the Packers drafted Rodgers, they were expecting Favre to play for 2-3 more years. They wanted insurance, and the value was too good to pass up.


the QB is so important, you cant wait till you don't have one, to start looking for one.

The only thing, and I know a lot of other fans feel this way, is they could have drafted a player that would have helped immediately. I really thought they traded up to take Queen because of the constant need at ILB. I will give Love a tip of the cap for his sophomore year with 3,400 yards passing and 32 td passes. Again, it is just at a lower level against the Mountain West. He also couldn't repeat that performance. Regardless, I'm looking forward to seeing what he has. Hopefully, @GleefulGary can throw it in my face later and I will gladly eat a plate of crow if it all works out.

I was so sure they had traded up for Queen. I was very nervous Queen wouldn't last till our pick. When the trade up happened I announced confidently it was for Queen. I was absolutely stunned when it wasn't the case.

Fans want immediate results and only look to the next season. A GM has to look at the next 5 years. A GM who doesn't, isn't going to have his job for long.

 

[AmishMafia]

The Packers were a Super Bowl contending team at the time of the 2020 draft. There was no reason to draft a quarterback in the first round who might make them one several years down the road.

Rodgers was coming off 3 straight seasons of declining play. Errant throws, not throwing to open receivers, arguing with coaches, and some body language getting 'Cutler-esque.' You had no reason to think Rodgers was going to reverse that trend and play great once again.

Again, it may very well have been the perceived slight of drafting Love that got him to play better.

I contend if we drafted Queen, Rodgers would have continued playing poorly and we would have still not gotten a SB.

 

[OldSchool101]

I would much rather take my chances rolling the dice on proven guys against tough competition

You don’t Roll the Dice on proven QBs in the best Conferences. Those type “Highly Rated QBs from the strongest Conferences don’t traditionally get picked after Day 1 draft or beyond unless there are character or serious injury concerns, with few exceptions. At least I wouldn’t consider a Day 1 selection at QB “rolling the dice”. If anything? those are well thought out and calculated, long standing strategies by an entire group of well-seasoned scouts. Those aren’t picks they wildly throw darts at.

My only point is that I feel like Love was a reach in the draft and really never had much hype around him.

Interesting take, because there actually was hype around him. I’m no expert, but I watched 2 experts pre-draft debating if Love would go before Herbert. Also I clearly remember Love actually had a few experts matching him to the GBP on and off there late Day 1 (our original #29?) Also, it’s very apparent on the Draft Consensus Board that Love was at #23-#24 overall just before Day 1 started. So saying he is a reach at #26 overall is actually more the anomaly in the NFL world than the norm.
With that in mind.. I would however offer a question that uses a combination of both sides of the Love argument.
Let’s use this common “draft reach” argument as Gospel and we’ll 100% agree with you for argument sake.

Why do you think a QB that had only 1 year of stellar production in an arguably weaker Conference get the accolades of being a #24 overall consensus selection? What did those experts see in Jordan Love that would propel a diverse group of draft experts to label him well into the Day 1 draft talk?

This is not an indictment on your position. I’m just curious what your thoughts or feelings are on that question?

 

[Krabs]

Fans want immediate results and only look to the next season. A GM has to look at the next 5 years. A GM who doesn't, isn't going to have his job for long.

I do not disagree with this statement. However, I still remain in the drafting for right now camp. This is especially true when you looked at the Packers. Coming off of an NFC Championship game a new QB was not a need or something that would be an immediate impact. Love didn't even suit up for the entire year.

 

[Krabs]

Why do you think, would a QB that had only 1 year of stellar production in a arguably weaker Conference get the accolades of being a #24 overall consensus selection? What did those experts see in him that would propel a we a diverse group of draft experts to label him well into the Day 1 draft talk?
Why did they label him day 1?

Potential. That's it. At a position that was not of need.

 

[Krabs]

So saying he is a reach at #26 overall is more the anomaly than the norm, across those that follow draft closely.

Also, you are correct. I do watch the draft every year and he was one of the top rated QB's suggested to go in the first round. That is a misspeak on my account. When I say reach, I'm talking more of reaching up in the draft to go get him. You are correct though. The pundits and talking heads had him at a late first round selection.

 

[OldSchool101]

Potential. That's it. At a position that was not of need.

Ok that’s fair. Let’s take this a step further Don’t lots of QB’s (or draft prospects in general) have potential? If all of the other QB’s drafted day 1 had significant stats AND came from better Conferences.. Wouldn’t there be more than 1 QB named Jordan Love in the draft with potential? I mean, there’s 126 other Division I teams in College, is Jordan Love the only QB with great potential in 126 choices?
I mean. As you just stated, we didn’t even need to draft at QB, so it’s not like we drafted out of need. I’d agree with that last comment that piggybacked your answer.
Why would GreenBay, who was on the brink of a Superbowl appearance and had needs at other positions LB, DT, CB, WR etc.. go and spend a Day 1 selection at a backup QB as a project? That doesn’t even make sense if we think about it.

To me, the only logical reason is that he checked many boxes. Scheme fit, injury history, Mental Aptitude, Coaching tree, natural Competitive nature, Arm Strength, Scramble ability, character concerns, ability to overcome life obstacles etc.. ..to name a few. He would’ve had to score high in every category, not just a few. GB certainly would put effort in studying and doing background work, aside from interviewing him.

Why would GB do well with drafting Gary (although ironically, now that I think about it, a large # of Packer fans said the exact same thing about Rashan Gary). J’aire, Savage and then just swing wildly with Love. The “Rashan Gary” argument that he’s a “poor quality player” and all projection just doesn’t fit imo

 

[rmontro]

Again, it may very well have been the perceived slight of drafting Love that got him to play better.

Could have been because it was his second season in MLF's system. But I'd be willing to bet he doesn't play at that level without the Love pick. I'm curious to see how he follows it up, if he plays this year.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

You have to remember, although Rodgers was not threatening to retire, his play was decreasing significantly the last few years. I actually believe that it was the drafting of Love that woke him up and got him focused.

Fans want immediate results and only look to the next season. A GM has to look at the next 5 years. A GM who doesn't, isn't going to have his job for long.

While Rodgers' performance might have decreased a bit from 2017-19 by his standards he still threw for 67 touchdowns and only 12 interceptions over that period. Jordan Love threw more interceptions than that in his last season playing in the MWC.

While I agree a general manager needs to think about the future as well the present should still be the main focus.

 

[thequick12]

Could have been because it was his second season in MLF's system. But I'd be willing to bet he doesn't play at that level without the Love pick. I'm curious to see how he follows it up, if he plays this year.

Rodgers was also helped immensely by the lack of crowd noise in 2020...but I do agree he's the type of dude that puts it into an extra gear when someone gives him something to put another chip on his shoulder.

However I also agree with Rodgers when he said my down years are other guys career years...the narrative that he was a declining player is simply not true and nobody who was watching the all 22 would say that ie scouts/gms

Rodgers will follow up his 3rd mvp with a season worthy of a 4th...

 

[Mondio]

I don't even care anymore. I know what Rodgers has meant to this team, but I'm also getting sick of it. Our defense was not great last year and the King debacle at the end of the half was pretty bad, but you know what? They came back and played some great football and made some great plays to get this team in a position to win that game. and while I don't think our QB played poorly at all by any stretch of the imagination you know what else he didn't do? Play great. he had multiple opportunities to make a great play and didn't. he played a good game, can't fault him, but this narrative that this team is nothing without him needs to end.

That team last year could have been in the Super Bowl, so thinking the FO doesn't care about winning or isn't focused on it is bunk. Sure it helps to have an all pro at every position, but it also helps when your generationally great players elevate their game in the big games to get it done and not just play "well". and yes, all those teams that are considered great had their players step up and get it done when it needed to be.

 

[tynimiller]

so thinking the FO doesn't care about winning or isn't focused on it is bunk.

His only issue is that they are NOT going about trying to win in his way. He isn't getting his wishes granted - and is throwing a grown man fit essentially.

I remember being so frustrated with Favre waffling and such - but I always understood it, be a tough thing to know when you're done or when you're not. This Rodgers thing is just purely annoying for me at this point.

 

[gopkrs]

While I agree a general manager needs to think about the future as well the present should still be the main focus.

This is an example of talking out of both sides of the mouth.