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Ted Thompson:year 2

Discussion in 'Packer Fan Forum' started by net, Nov 20, 2006.

  1. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    I believe that is what sherman had tried to do...

    Get Brett some more playmakers via F.a and it did not really work out to good IMO
     
  2. mikegrubiak

    mikegrubiak Cheesehead

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    dxbfan wrote:
    This is the best quote I've seen on this forum.

    I'd say TT is about 70/30.

    70% bad or questionable moves and
    30% decent moves that may or will work out.
     
  3. tromadz

    tromadz Cheesehead

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    ill call him and let him know your thoughts, cuz im sure he cares.
     
  4. Cdnfavrefan

    Cdnfavrefan Cheesehead

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    I'd also say TT is 70/30
    70% of his moves we don't know if they passed or failed
    30% of his moves we can judge
    Conclusion for me is I can't judge him yet cause I only got 30% of his results in yet
    Only in Florida do they end an election after 30% of the results. LOL
     
  5. net

    net Cheesehead

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    Thanks!

    I opened this discussion to get a sense of the "State of The Packers".

    I will do this again in a few weeks.

    net
     
  6. GakkofNorway

    GakkofNorway Cheesehead

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    wtf is it with people like chamuko that only post when we lose, lol wonder what happens when we get back to winning most of our games, will they disappear totally from the forum?
     
  7. Zero2Cool

    Zero2Cool I own a website

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    It's another reason to root for the Packers!!
     
  8. dxbfan

    dxbfan Cheesehead

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    I agree that it didnt work out too good. But just because Sherman couldn't get it right doesnt necessarily mean someone else wouldn't. The point is with Favre still around, I dont think the approach should've been abandoned.
     
  9. mikegrubiak

    mikegrubiak Cheesehead

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    I completely agree with your post, and your fast becoming my favorite poster!

    I always felt Sherman should have gotten some veteran receivers instead of Favre having to develop Ferguson and Walker around the same time.

    FA is a time to pick up players who can contribute now, and Sherman, and now it seems TT, just don't understand this.
     
  10. dxbfan

    dxbfan Cheesehead

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    Darn Mike! You tell me that now when the applaud/smite feature's been removed. Nevertheless nice to know.

    The sheer talent of a Polamalu type or the experience of a John Lynch in the secondary, a couple of real weapons for Favre on offense and a line that still featured Wahle and this team would be a contender.
     
  11. mikegrubiak

    mikegrubiak Cheesehead

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    Couldn't agree more. So I'll give you a :cheerleader: since the applaud feature is no more!
     
  12. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    This is something I think Sherman had and it DIDNT work..

    My whole thing is they didnt get back to the superbowl, and they had the talent in 2003 to do it..Walker, Driver, Green, the of line that was so great, Fisher, Antonio Freeman, Sharper, Harris, KGB, Mckenzie and many more..

    who recalls in 2004 the 4 game skid? that was with basicly the same group and they got their A__SS haned to them by the Vikings AT HOME in the playoffs...

    Something WAS NOT WORKING..So when Ted comes in MAYBE he figures Shermans talented team was not working so I am going to get a solid foundation and build it back up..
     
  13. mikegrubiak

    mikegrubiak Cheesehead

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    I see your point longtime, but imo, what wasn't working was the play calling.

    Simply horrible by Sherman and Rossley.

    Also, if Favre just had a few better, seasoned, veteran receivers that year, it would have been a different story!
     
  14. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    How many more did he need? Driver, Walker, Franks, FREEMAN..

    Brett had at least 30 tds both of those years..
     
  15. dxbfan

    dxbfan Cheesehead

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    LT, I could be wrong but the way I see it is that a team's regular season record is a greater indication of the talent they have while a team's post-season record is a greater indication of the calibre of the coaching.

    As Mike says, the play calling was an issue as well as Sherman's inability to rein Favre in when he got carried away.

    You need both talent and coaching. While Wolf and Holmgren were providing that respectively, we won a superbowl.
     
  16. mikegrubiak

    mikegrubiak Cheesehead

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    Freeman was fat, slow, and useless. Franks wasn't much better. Walker hadn't busted out from his rookie numbers yet. And Driver wasn't a factor at all, neither was Ferguson. Is he still on the team, by the way? Plus, the Defense was horrible back then!

    2003 receiving

    Javon Walker 41 716 17.5 66 9
    Donald Driver 52 621 11.9 41 2
    Robert Ferguson 38 520 13.7 47 4
    Ahman Green 50 367 7.3 27 5
    Bubba Franks 30 241 8.0 24 4
    Wesley Walls 20 222 11.1 36 1
    William Henderson 24 214 8.9 22 3
    Tony Fisher 21 206 9.8 32 2
    Antonio Freeman 14 141 10.1 15 0
    David Martin 13 79 6.1 14 2
    Najeh Davenport 6 38 6.3 12 0
    Nicolas Luchey 1 12 12.0 12 0


    Finally some good numbers for the Packers #1 and #2 WR's..but where's the #3 receiver? Non-existent. This year can definitely be pinned on bad and predictable play calling, and on the Packer's coaches being out-coached almost every game!

    2004 receiving

    Javon Walker 89 1382 15.5 79 12
    Donald Driver 84 1208 14.4 50 9
    Robert Ferguson 24 367 15.3 48 1
    Bubba Franks 34 361 10.6 29 7
    Tony Fisher 38 277 7.3 25 2
    Ahman Green 40 275 6.9 48 1
    Antonio Chatman 22 246 11.2 21 1
    William Henderson 34 239 7.0 38 3
    David Martin 5 88 17.6 35 0
    Ben Steele 4 42 10.5 27 0
    Najeh Davenport 4 33 8.3 12 0
    Nicolas Luchey 2 20 10.0 11 0
    Andrae Thurman 2 12 6.0 9 0
     
  17. dxbfan

    dxbfan Cheesehead

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    Tony Dungy is a great case in point. Jon Gruden takes over from him in TB and with pretty much the same talent wins the superbowl. Dungy then has even more talent at his disposal in Indianapolis. And while they reel off fantastic season after season they cant get it done in the playoffs. What if the same thing happens this year? Are they going to say, this isnt working let's overall the roster and re-build or are they going to fire Dungy and get someone who can coach in the playoffs?
     
  18. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    They were able to win the division on some luck and the ability to beat the Bears, Viks and Lions who at the time were not really good....

    So we BOTH agree coaching was an issue..So how do you fix that?? Ted hired a new coach..

    Like MM or not, Ted did something about it..
     
  19. dxbfan

    dxbfan Cheesehead

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    Sure but what we were discussing originally was TT's approach to talent - rebuild, build around Favre or re-build with Favre around.
     
  20. Chamuko

    Chamuko Cheesehead

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    No way Gaff, maybe it is that I disliked a lot of the things that TT has done with the team, specially when it comes to coaching staff and FA, BUT if you ask me about the reason why I got lost for 3 weeks it is because I got a new kid delivered and kind of got lost for about a month, but I also post when we win.

    Anyway I got the message from a lot of you and from reality also, weather I like it or not we will have the same coaching staff for at least one more year, so there is no point in being so bitter..
     
  21. mikegrubiak

    mikegrubiak Cheesehead

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    That is kind of how it has shaken out.

    I think TT wanted to re-build without Favre. But when he knew Favre was coming back, he should have tried to build around him a bit with some veteran talent at the skilled position--WR.

    And the O-Line.

    The defense was supposed to be his specialty, so I won't comment there.
     
  22. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    EXCELLENT example..

    That really makes me think... damn you, it hurts now

    But is their cap situation the same? At the start of this seaosn I think that had like 9 million...

    This is very interesting...and it is about the Colts and salary cap issues..
    Its a VERY good read

    jax ask vic web site

    Debbie from Indianapolis, IN: The Colts have been a good football team for seven straight years now. I do not understand why you think they sacrifice the future with all of their signings. They have obviously been good for a long time and I do not see a decline any time soon. Please let me know when exactly you see the big decline coming.

    Vic: The Colts have been a good team for five straight years, counting this year. They were 6-10 in 2001. I understand your point, however, because the Colts have been a good team for a long time. Let's start by acknowledging how they achieved that long run of success.

    They did it by building for the future. They didn't do it by signing old, worn-out and expensive defensive tackles. They did it by drafting future stars, such as Peyton Manning, Edgerrin James and Marvin Harrison. That's what made the Colts a good team.

    Now they've reached the point that those players are so good that they have enormous contracts that are pinching not only the Colts' salary cap but the Colts' purse strings. The salary cap may be about monopoly money, but the check Jim Irsay gives his players is the real thing and the Colts are not a high-revenue franchise.

    Look at the players they've had to let go: James, Marcus Washington, David Thornton, Mike Vanderjagt. These aren't guys you wanna lose. They had to let 'em go because the cap is beginning to close on the Colts and it's going to close even tighter on them in the future. It's inevitable.

    Manning's cap hit next year is $16.5 million. That means they'll probably re-structure him and push more of his money into the future. Harrison will be $8.4 million, Tarik Glenn will be $8.2 million and Robert Mathis and Corey Simon will each be $7.1 million.

    Dwight Freeney would be a free agent so they'll probably have to “franchise” him and that's going to mean a real big bite that will require re-structuring roster-wide to make room for Freeney. Where is all of this money going? Onto future caps.

    The Colts are going to be able to keep it together and complete this run, but when the cards fall, the house is going to collapse. That's exactly what happened to the Jaguars and Titans.
     
  23. dxbfan

    dxbfan Cheesehead

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    It is a good read. It also underlines the key point that the way the NFL is structured there are absolutely no prizes for coming second. In fact it actually hurts the team. Its a double whammy because your existing players expect to be paid more for their performances therein pushing you beyond the salary cap and forcing you to cut some of them while you're drafting at the bottom of every round and replacing your roster with talent that isnt yet as good as what you've lost.

    The Colts today are facing the same situation that we were in in 2004.

    Its no surprise then that some Owners/GMs choose to start over rather than continue in this vein. And as I said in my original post we as fans shouldnt have an issue with TT wanting to rebuild for a more successful and longer future. But then he should have called it for what it is and traded Favre.

    Or he should have managed the cap (as he's done) in order to free up space to get players who can make an immediate difference and take one last shot with Favre at the helm.
     
  24. mikegrubiak

    mikegrubiak Cheesehead

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    I knew that the Pats and Steelers would fall off their perch this year, even thought they were being held up as the model teams for building through the draft. The Patriots will not go deep in the playoffs this year. The Jets shellac'ed them. They will lose. They are not the team that they once were.

    So why not try to build around your HOF QB while you have him?

    There is no sure-fire plan that works in the NFL.
     
  25. Greg C.

    Greg C. Cheesehead

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    That's an interesting theory about a team's regular season record being a product of the talent and the post season record a product of the coaching. I think there is some truth to it, but it's not nearly so simple. A good coach can sometimes coax a good season out of less-than-stellar talent and get them into the playoffs, only to have the weaknesses on their roster exposed by a more talented team.
     

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