Pro Football Focus ranks Packers O-Line #7 overall in final rankings

[adambr2]

https://www.profootballfocus.com/ne...ine-rankings-all-32-teams-units-after-week-17

Also of note is that the tackle duo of Bahktiari and Bulaga was the highest ranked tackle duo in the NFL in pass protection.

 

[Dantés]

45/53 sacks on Aaron Rodgers this season came after 2.5 seconds.

 

[LambeauLombardi]

I figured Bakhtiari was more deserving of 1st Team All Pro in 2016-2017 more so than this year too so maybe I was a little ******* him. I gave Bulaga a lot of **** this year too but he did start 14 games. I thought our o-line was great in 2016. Find a RG like Colts did with Quenton Nelson (not quite as good as him but just solid enough) then I think we can have a real solid unit for 2019. In saying that depth is a huge problem with this group.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Yet, most here are ready to cut Bulaga.

I get the fact that he has been injured more than you want to see, but who replaces him and then who replaces THAT guy and so on.

Been saying it for years, Packers just need better depth on the OL and for 2019 a better RG.

Injuries happen and if you are having to sub in untested UDFA's to cover for starters, something isn't right.

 

[7thFloorRA]

Those clowns ranked HaHa as the best safety in the league when everyone that watched him knows he was one of the worst. Their grading criteria needs to be adjusted.

 

[Arod2gjdd]

Bulaga is generally very good when healthy. Problem is he can't stay on the field.....

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Bulaga is generally very good when healthy. Problem is he can't stay on the field.....

Yes and no.

Snap counts for Packer OL this season:

• Linsley: 1074
  
• Bakhtiari: 1031
• Taylor: 881
• Bulaga: 781
• Bell: 527
• McCray: 480
• Spriggs: 291

So yes, he missed 293 snaps or roughly 4 games, but who takes over his spot and what does that cost? While I wouldn't mind seeing the Packers use a 3rd rounder or later on RT for the future, I think the Packers are going to be hard pressed to find a guy to cover those snaps as well he does, for the $6.75 M they save by cutting him loose.

 

[Poppa San]

45/53 sacks on Aaron Rodgers this season came after 2.5 seconds.

And what is the ratio for the rest of the league. I would think a majority of sacks are after 2.5 seconds.

 

[Dantés]

And what is the ratio for the rest of the league. I would think a majority of sacks are after 2.5 seconds.

Not sure. But the point is that most of the time, there was time for Rodgers to avoid the sack. The OL needs to play better, but he needs to stop holding the ball so long.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Not sure. But the point is that most of the time, there was time for Rodgers to avoid the sack. The OL needs to play better, but he needs to stop holding the ball so long.

There's a element of the girlfriend who thinks she can change her bad boy boyfriend in that assessment. Slip-slide-escape-go playground has been a hallmark of Rodgers magic when the offensive has been magical. You cannot love it when it works and then hate it when it doesn't.

So, why did it not work so well this season? There are couple factors to consider. There's the gimped up knee evident through most of the season. There's the playing with rookies where confidence to throw open is lacking, waiting for the break. There's the TE where the chemistry is not the best. I question whether Graham's route running is up to Rodgers standards. Though there isn't any evidence I can detect, it is possible the shoulder may have caused lack of confidence in accuracy on certain throws passing up some tight fit tosses.

Unless Rodgers has some permanent physical impairment and Rodgers is convinced of such, there isn't any point in trying to enforce 2.5 second throws via scheme. He's going to go playground when he doesn't like what he's seeing. Taking the optimisitc view that Rodgers does not have permanent physical impairments, the answer is to elevate the execution of the players around him or get better players who can. We might get some of that with receiver progress in year 2.

Let's face it. The WR and OG pass backing performance, taken collectively, was the worst in the Rodgers era, and when Bulaga was out the picture got worse. #2 wideout misses nearly all the season, slot receiver misses half of it with health questionable for the rest of it.

 

[gbgary]

Not sure. But the point is that most of the time, there was time for Rodgers to avoid the sack. The OL needs to play better, but he needs to stop holding the ball so long.

yup. foles only got sacked once yesterday because he got the ball out quick.

 

[HardRightEdge]

45/53 sacks on Aaron Rodgers this season came after 2.5 seconds.

I'd be curious to know how many of the post 2.5 second sacks came when there was pressure under 2.5 seconds. It would also be interesting to know what percentage of Rodgers pass attempts + sacks came with pressure under 2.5 seconds and how that compared with the rest of the league.

 

[HardRightEdge]

yup. foles only got sacked once yesterday because he got the ball out quick.

Oh, yeah, that was an offensive juggernaut. And a quick throw offense didn't stop him from throwing 2 picks.

When put a top drawer defense on the field like Philly's last season you can afford to play ball control passing. When you put a still good but not great defense on the field against a less than threatening offense you can afford to play ball control.

 

[gbgary]

There's a element of the girlfriend who thinks she can change her bad boy boyfriend in that assessment. Slip-slide-escape-go playground has been a hallmark of Rodgers magic when the offensive has been magical. You cannot love it when it works and then hate it when it doesn't.

So, why did it not work so well this season? There are couple factors to consider. There's the gimped up knee evident through most of the season. There's the playing with rookies where confidence to throw open is lacking, waiting for the break. There's the TE where the chemistry is not the best. I question whether Graham's route running is up to Rodgers standards. Though there isn't any evidence I can detect, it is possible the shoulder may have caused lack of confidence in accuracy on certain throws passing up some tight fit tosses.

Unless Rodgers has some permanent physical impairment and Rodgers is convinced of such, there isn't any point in trying to enforce 2.5 second throws via scheme. He's going to go playground when he doesn't like what he's seeing. Taking the optimisitc view that Rodgers does not have permanent physical impairments, the answer is to elevate the execution of the players around him or get better players who can. We might get some of that with receiver progress in year 2.

Let's face it. The WR and OG pass backing performance, taken collectively, was the worst in the Rodgers era, and when Bulaga was out the picture got worse. #2 wideout misses nearly all the season, slot receiver misses half of it with health questionable for the rest of it.

he's not 28 anymore. he's got to realize that, what he's got to work with in the WR group and o-line, and taylor his game to it. the new coach has to realize the same things. guys were getting open but he wasn't throwing to them. 2.5-3 seconds should be a goal to get the ball out. that means playing the short game. if he's got a physical issue it's all the more important to play the short/quick game...and he's got to throw it whether he trusts them or not. taking a sack is a bad thing for a guy who's become an injury issue.

 

[gbgary]

Oh, yeah, that was an offensive juggernaut. And a quick throw offense didn't stop him from throwing 2 picks.

When put a top drawer defense on the field like Philly's last season you can afford to play ball control passing. When you put a still good but not great defense on the field against a less than threatening offense you can afford to play ball control.

i didn't claim they were a juggernaut. i'm pointing out if foles can succeed at it (against a pass-rushing dynamo) Rodgers surely can if he's motivated to do it.

 

[HardRightEdge]

...he's not 28 anymorehe's got to work with in the WR group and o-line, and taylor his game to it...

Yeah, that way he can make lemonade out of lemons and go 8-8.

I find the idea of pidgeon holing Rodgers in a Philly-like offense designed to disguise Foles notable deficiencies a bit absurd.

I'll tell you this much: Go out and stack two drafts like New Orleans or Indy and you'll be amazed how the punditry will proclaim there was nothing wrong with Rodgers after all.

As for age, I would count on Rodgers to trim off a little of this and a little of that on his own if you put the players on the field who allow for it. And frankly, he's been more than willing to do that already if you want to play 2-high safeties with slow linebackers. Conversely, if Mahomes goes playground and throws a couple of picks (his modus operandi more or less), the punditry will point to a lack of maturity and control. And they will be wrong with respect to the control.

The refusal to accept the level of dysfunction at the other 21 positions and special teams, digging holes to get out of, and generally exposing themselves as a not very good football team as having an affect on the QB's performance is a clear case of denial. That can certainly be attributed to some degree to the rash of injuries and inexperience at quite a few positions. But that does not change the fact the guys on the field were not very good.

 

[Dantés]

There's a element of the girlfriend who thinks she can change her bad boy boyfriend in that assessment. Slip-slide-escape-go playground has been a hallmark of Rodgers magic when the offensive has been magical. You cannot love it when it works and then hate it when it doesn't.

So, why did it not work so well this season? There are couple factors to consider. There's the gimped up knee evident through most of the season. There's the playing with rookies where confidence to throw open is lacking, waiting for the break. There's the TE where the chemistry is not the best. I question whether Graham's route running is up to Rodgers standards. Though there isn't any evidence I can detect, it is possible the shoulder may have caused lack of confidence in accuracy on certain throws passing up some tight fit tosses.

Unless Rodgers has some permanent physical impairment and Rodgers is convinced of such, there isn't any point in trying to enforce 2.5 second throws via scheme. He's going to go playground when he doesn't like what he's seeing. Taking the optimisitc view that Rodgers does not have permanent physical impairments, the answer is to elevate the execution of the players around him or get better players who can. We might get some of that with receiver progress in year 2.

Let's face it. The WR and OG pass backing performance, taken collectively, was the worst in the Rodgers era, and when Bulaga was out the picture got worse. #2 wideout misses nearly all the season, slot receiver misses half of it with health questionable for the rest of it.

I agree with a lot of this, but you do see players change their style when necessary. Ben Roethlisberger and Andrew Luck come to mind.

 

[OldSchool101]

lets Face it. It takes time for any QB to get in sync with receivers. When Geronimo went down we then had just 2 Wideouts who had played more than a few hours of live regular game experience with this team
Cobb’s snap count was a fraction of Adams. He essentially missed half the season.

I would like to see where GB compares with other teams in continuity.

1. Id like to see the breakdown by % of passing plays directed at a particular position group. RB, TE, WR (heck throw in a category for misc eligible players) A pie chart if you will.

2. Then how many total snaps did each QB have with WR veterans of at least 1 full season accrued in each Offensive system.

3. Then I’d like to see how many total snaps did each QB have with TE veterans of at least 1 accrued season with said team.

4. Then I’d like to see how many total snaps did each QB have with RB veterans of at least 1 accrued season with said team.

This is truly just a hunch, but from a generality of looking around the league I don’t see a bulk of teams
having the inexperience in a system. I have a feeling from a weighted % of snaps per position grouping into that total pie that the GB Offense is either at or near the bottom of the league in experience playing together. The main ingredient of continuity

I say 1 year accrued AND veteran because it’s rare that receivers are high impact players their first year in a system or their first year in the league. While there are exceptions,, they are generally prominent athletes who are at the top of their game or top of the draft board.

I think we should eliminate the newness factor before we make accusations about our O line or QB. They are the least likely to be the most weighted factor when considering Bulaga, Taylor, Linsley, Bak, McCray all played significant snaps this year. If we’re questioning sack count, throw away count etc.. it makes sense to go about it the logical way.

You don’t investigate a crime scene spending all your resources on the outside perimeter of available persons of interest. You go to the high probability candidate when times a tickin’
Aaron Rodgers isn’t a 2nd year player and this O line isn’t a rookie grouping. They have an automatic alibi with character witnessss galore and a rock solid resume.
Assuming the thread information is valid and accurate. The #7 OL ranking helps us take focus off them because it’s essentially similar to an alibi. It’s now either the QB or the Receivers. The next logical question is...


Who’s the new guy(s)??

P.S. I take back everything bad I’ve been saying about Bulaga behind his back

 

[HardRightEdge]

I agree with a lot of this, but you do see players change their style when necessary. Ben Roethlisberger and Andrew Luck come to mind.

I'm not seeing your point here. R. and L. have always been pocket passers not know for dynamic passing on the run. R. never ran that much. Luck used to ran a fair amount. We can say Luck threw more balls this season than any other and ran less than in any other full season. But he also took fewer sacks than any other full season. I think the O-Line is as big a factor as any accomodation in his play. Indy has had some not-so-great lines in his time there.

When you get down to individual plays, with the QB taking what he sees as the optimal opportunity, if you want Rodgers to hang in and throw under those 2.5 seconds more often, then improve the O-Line and improve the route running and/or upgrade receiving talent and I'm sure he'd be happy to accomodate.

 

[HardRightEdge]

https://www.profootballfocus.com/ne...ine-rankings-all-32-teams-units-after-week-17

Also of note is that the tackle duo of Bahktiari and Bulaga was the highest ranked tackle duo in the NFL in pass protection.

There's no way I give this O-Line that rating over the course of the season.

How might PFF have gotten to that rating?

• Take the 2 tackles' and the center's grades without regard for missed snaps
• Wow, that's a very high grade for those 3 positions
• Take the 2 best OGs pass pro grades without regard for missed snaps
• OK, that's not very good but not the worst
• Avergage out those 5 best grades, not accounting for missed snaps
• Voila, 7th ranked

I'm quite convinced that if one graded the O-Line group on the field for every snap you won't get close to that 7th. ranked grade. There were many snaps this season with a weak link or two that proved costly.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

There's no way I give this O-Line that rating over the course of the season.

How might PFF have gotten to that rating?

• Take the 2 tackles' and the center's grades without regard for missed snaps
• Wow, that's a very high grade for those 3 positions
• Take the 2 best OGs pass pro grades without regard for missed snaps
• OK, that's not very good but not the worst
• Avergage out those 5 best grades, not accounting for missed snaps
• Voila, 7th ranked

I'm quite convinced that if one graded the O-Line group on the field for every snap you won't get close to that 7th. ranked grade. There were many snaps this season with a weak link or two that proved costly.

Proves that you can mix, match and cook up stats to make them look like they mean something. not saying that these stats are inaccurate, but like you, I don't think they tell the full story.

 

[OldSchool101]

It sure didn’t seem like we were top 7. But who am I to say? I still think we need to hire Bulagas successor sooner than later. He’s not getting any younger and those injuries not only take their toll they take longer to heal with each passing year

 

[OldSchool101]

Spriggs was one of the quicker/stronger OL coming out of the combine. At just 301 pounds, he posted 31 reps and a 115” broad jump. Not to mention he ran a 4.95 X 40yard dash which combined, you obviously don’t do by being weak
I know he’s an OT by nature (has impressive quickness and length) but I saw recently that the average NFL OG recently was 311lb and 6’5”. The height surprised me because I thought Spriggs being 6’6” was too tall to play interior.

I ask this because Spriggs seems to have an average at best ceiling at Tackle and we’re 2 years in.

What are your guys thoughts on him playing Guard? Do you think he could pull a Bakhtiari and add
15-20pounds of muscle to give him more core strength and transition??

 

[Dantés]

I'm not seeing your point here. R. and L. have always been pocket passers not know for dynamic passing on the run. R. never ran that much. Luck used to ran a fair amount. We can say Luck threw more balls this season than any other and ran less than in any other full season. But he also took fewer sacks than any other full season. I think the O-Line is as big a factor as any accomodation in his play. Indy has had some not-so-great lines in his time there.

When you get down to individual plays, with the QB taking what he sees as the optimal opportunity, if you want Rodgers to hang in and throw under those 2.5 seconds more often, then improve the O-Line and improve the route running and/or upgrade receiving talent and I'm sure he'd be happy to accomodate.

We have dramatically different memories of earlier versions of Roethlisberger and Luck.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Spriggs was one of the quicker/stronger OL coming out of the combine. At just 301 pounds, he posted 31 reps and a 115” broad jump. Not to mention he ran a 4.95 X 40yard dash which combined, you obviously don’t do by being weak
I know he’s an OT by nature (has impressive quickness and length) but I saw recently that the average NFL OG recently was 311lb and 6’5”. The height surprised me because I thought Spriggs being 6’6” was too tall to play interior.

I ask this because Spriggs seems to have an average at best ceiling at Tackle and we’re 2 years in.

What are your guys thoughts on him playing Guard? Do you think he could pull a Bakhtiari and add
15-20pounds of muscle to give him more core strength and transition??

I know when Lang left in free agency, McCarthy said Spriggs would not be moved to Guard. Not sure if that was because they still had hopes he would be a successful tackle, they didn't think he could play the position well or just better options. But at this point, whomever the line coach moving forward is, they have one year to figure out if Spriggs is worth another contract and if he can kick the ball....well put him there!

He may end up just being that guy that is good enough to keep around as a backup, but for a guy who cost what he cost (not mentioning the picks), I would say he has been a disappointment thus far.