Packers release TE Justin Perillo, promote ILB Carl Bradford to active roster

[PackerDNA]

so, if it looked good to all these people then, then should any of us have an opinion now, on what is wrong? Either you agree it was a good roster and things have happened, or you thought it was a good roster, now realize it wasn't, but then your evaluation skills aren't all that great either so why do you know what's wrong now?

Not you in particular, just a general you for purposes of making a point I for one think we had a pretty solid roster. Not perfect, but you can't get one because even if you are perfect at picking the best players, there are 10,000 other factors that won't be. As much as the bottom of the roster isn't holding up, the top isn't doing much better. Rodgers is doing better, but didn't start so great. Still worth it. Clay hasn't been this year. Shields isn't. Peppers isn't. Cobb is rebounding some. Jordy is rebounding after injury and worth it I think. But there's a lot of money in difference makers, that at this point aren't making a lot either. You can blame it on Ted, but I don't think that would be fair either.

He gets a big chunk of it. It's his roster, and his methods that have put together and left this roster in the condition it's in.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

so, if it looked good to all these people then, then should any of us have an opinion now, on what is wrong?

Should we only be allowed to have a second opinion if our first opinion 3 months ago was right? That is how I interpret your question. If that is the correct interpretation, then read no further.

Pretty simple really, the 53 man roster and 10 man PS that we saw in September, has not been as good as what many of us thought and apparently what the people who make the decisions thought either. The evidence of that is what we have seen on the field over the course of 10 games. If you want to keep score, my opinion of the WR's and ILB's in August was much lower than most. But that doesn't make me smart/dumb, just a fan with an opinion.

Not sure why my opinion, right or wrong, of the 53+ players can't change over time, especially after seeing some of them actually play in a real game. Remember, I don't attend every practice, watch film, talk to players, etc. These are the things TT and the coaching staff get paid to do. So their level of knowledge is always way ahead of an average Joe such as myself.

Opinions are what make this Forum fun. We all have them, many of us agree and disagree, but just because our initial opinion was wrong, that should not preclude us from formulating another one. I actually laugh when I type or read "IMO", its like we all have to quantify that it's our opinion, of course it is, we are the ones typing it.

 

[Mondio]

No, you can have an opinion. What I was getting at was I see a lot of absolute statements from people. About players, about coaches, about front office guys. If people are going to be so absolute now, then they have to be honest about a few things.

Were they wrong in their assessment? If yes, then what qualifies them to then make such absolute statements now?

Or are there a lot of things going on?

I don't dislike how Ted builds a roster all things considered. I can see it's limitations, but I also realize there's no perfect way. For every way we may fix something by running another philosophy, there's as likely a list of problems that can easily happen with a different approach.

Not that I think those ways are "wrong" either, it's just when somebody is good at something, I don't expect them to be someone else.

On a broader picture, I think Don Capers is an excellent coach. Nobody is going to convince me the man doesn't know how to play defensive football. But I don't know that his scheme is kind to young guys or constant turnover. Or maybe it's because the coaches aren't quick to abandon plans, which can be good, and can be bad. I would like to see a more flexible defensive scheme. I can't debate the results right now, because the results are freaking horrible.

But he was also the coach last year and our defense was pretty good. He was also the coach earlier this year and we were pretty good on defense then too. Just lucky? Too slow to change? Too much going on? I don't know. Therefore I'm not absolute in my statements that he must stay or go. I have my opinion. Too much inexperience all on the field at once. Makes it appear worse than it should. Where just a couple positions changed and these guys are getting worked in as they're meant to be and everyone is better for it. But it's not the situation we find ourselves in.

 

[PikeBadger]

He gets a big chunk of it. It's his roster, and his methods that have put together and left this roster in the condition it's in.

Well most outsiders were saying prior to the season tha we had one of the most talented rosters in the league.

 

[Mavster]

Well most outsiders were saying prior to the season tha we had one of the most talented rosters in the league.

These outsiders must have missed the 2015 season.

 

[Mondio]

These outsiders must have missed the 2015 season.

And yet they were 1 of the final 8 standing when the year ended

 

[PikeBadger]

These outsiders must have missed the 2015 season.

They look at the entire league. They don't look at the Packers with a different bias than they do the other 31 teams. People on this forum are ALL biased.

It's all dialectic, man. One to nine. You either love someone or you hate them. There ain't no fractions in space, man.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

No, you can have an opinion. What I was getting at was I see a lot of absolute statements from people. About players, about coaches, about front office guys. If people are going to be so absolute now, then they have to be honest about a few things.

Were they wrong in their assessment? If yes, then what qualifies them to then make such absolute statements now?

Or are there a lot of things going on?

I don't dislike how Ted builds a roster all things considered. I can see it's limitations, but I also realize there's no perfect way. For every way we may fix something by running another philosophy, there's as likely a list of problems that can easily happen with a different approach.

Not that I think those ways are "wrong" either, it's just when somebody is good at something, I don't expect them to be someone else.

On a broader picture, I think Don Capers is an excellent coach. Nobody is going to convince me the man doesn't know how to play defensive football. But I don't know that his scheme is kind to young guys or constant turnover. Or maybe it's because the coaches aren't quick to abandon plans, which can be good, and can be bad. I would like to see a more flexible defensive scheme. I can't debate the results right now, because the results are freaking horrible.

But he was also the coach last year and our defense was pretty good. He was also the coach earlier this year and we were pretty good on defense then too. Just lucky? Too slow to change? Too much going on? I don't know. Therefore I'm not absolute in my statements that he must stay or go. I have my opinion. Too much inexperience all on the field at once. Makes it appear worse than it should. Where just a couple positions changed and these guys are getting worked in as they're meant to be and everyone is better for it. But it's not the situation we find ourselves in.

I'm still a bit confused on your "having an opinion thing", so I am going to drop that

I think most people's opinions of TT, MM and DC has ebbed and flowed during their tenures. Sure there are a few rock solid lovers and haters of any of the 3, but for the most part, the results of their work at any specific point in time was a good indicator of general public opinion of the job people felt they were doing, at the time. All 3 guys have had their successes and that can't be denied. The problem is, the current team has been flailing for various and multiple reasons for a very long stretch and it's almost impossible to point at just one guy (spoiler alert, I do in a moment) and say "there is the problem", that is if 1, 2 or 3 of them are actually the problem. As much as I would like to blame things on injuries, I just don't think that is the root source of the biggest problem. We have an offense that lives and dies with AR and if he is off or doesn't have enough playmakers, the offense stinks. We have a defense that has proven to not have enough talent with its starters or its depth. Our special teams is so inconsistent, I pray for no long returns or fumbles. Pathetically, I don't even have to say which team I am worried about doing either of those things. I'm starting to think the play of your special teams, may be a good indicator of the quality of your depth and our special teams has been far from being special for too many years.

So just taking a shortcut method of adding those things up, my "blame meter" is squarely on TT for failing to assemble a complete enough roster that can compete all season long. A roster that gives AR enough playmakers to do what he does best. A roster that includes some veterans and experience for back ups, instead of plugging in guys who just aren't ready quite yet. A roster that has guys at the bottom of it with enough talent to be good on special teams while also being able to contribute at their position when needed.

Hopefully, things get turned around, but if they don't anytime soon, then someone needs to sit down and write a book entitled "The Downward Spiral of the Packer Empire". Maybe they will be able to untangle all the events and make some sense as to how things unraveled and intertwined to take us from where we once were to where we are now. Just my opinion, but might be a best seller (amongst Packer fans).

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Well most outsiders were saying prior to the season tha we had one of the most talented rosters in the league.

Unfortunately it's pretty obvious they were completely wrong about it.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Well most outsiders were saying prior to the season tha we had one of the most talented rosters in the league.

Guessing most of the same people were predicting Carolina and Arizona to be pretty good too.

 

[PikeBadger]

Unfortunately it's pretty obvious they were completely wrong about it.

How do we know? Much ofthe best talent on the team has been injured for most of the year.

I don't want to go down this road again with you. You and I don't agree on what constitutes "talent". Our veteran talent has been horribly inconsistent this year. It's very possible that we have a situation where the GM and entire coaching staff is replaced after the end of the season. That would absolutely thrill about half of the people on this forum.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

How do we know? Much ofthe best talent on the team has been injured for most of the year.

Are you talking about talent as a team or individual talent? What individuals on the Packers have had a Pro Bowl season? How can our team on a whole now be called talented? While I get people saying at the beginning of the season that the Packers potentially are a talented team, why wouldn't they think that, look at the Packers record over the last several years. However, potential doesn't win games. If the Packers continue to play as they have, how talented would the current team be viewed going into next season?

 

[Deleted member 6794]

How do we know? Much ofthe best talent on the team has been injured for most of the year.

That's only true on the defensive side of the ball. The offense aside of the running back position has been mostly healthy.

As I've said repeatedly I don't want to use injuries as an excuse. FWIW the Packers only have the 18th highest injury impact to team weighted approximate value in the league according to a site tracking injuries.

It's pretty obvious the overall talent on this year's roster isn't as talented as many believed before the start of the season.

 

[Sky King]

For what it's worth, how many 2016 Packer players do posters predict will be selected as All-Pro or as a representative to the Pro-Bowl?

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

For what it's worth, how many 2016 Packer players do posters predict will be selected as All-Pro or as a representative to the Pro-Bowl?

I asked the same question. My answer would be.....0

 

[Sky King]

I asked the same question. My answer would be.....0

At this point I would have to agree with you.

 

[childerm]

For what it's worth, how many 2016 Packer players do posters predict will be selected as All-Pro or as a representative to the Pro-Bowl?

I'd imagine there would be at least one guy that will squeeze in there due to either injury or a player going to the super bowl. My best guess would be Jordy. He will probably end the season with around 15 TDs and that would be enough to get voted in.

 

[swhitset]

They look at the entire league. They don't look at the Packers with a different bias than they do the other 31 teams. People on this forum are ALL biased.

It's all dialectic, man. One to nine. You either love someone or you hate them. There ain't no fractions in space, man.

They also tend to be more "starstruck" by teams with big name QBs and will tend to not look too deeply at a teams potential issues if it fits their talking points.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I'd imagine there would be at least one guy that will squeeze in there due to either injury or a player going to the super bowl. My best guess would be Jordy. He will probably end the season with around 15 TDs and that would be enough to get voted in.

I don't think any Packer deserves to be named to the Pro Bowl. All-Pro is completely out of the question.

 

[PackerDNA]

And yet they were 1 of the final 8 standing when the year ended

Whoopee.

 

[Mondio]

Whoopee?

No thanks

 

[PikeBadger]

I don't think any Packer deserves to be named to the Pro Bowl. All-Pro is completely out of the question.

People were saying here the same thing last year.

 

[Sanguine camper]

I think Gruden pointed out a major reason for the Packers 5-6 season and the reason they have lost 13 out of the last 23 games. Production from TT'S first round draft picks hasn't been good enough on defense. While all of the first rounders have flashed potential they are woefully inconsistent and not making big plays.

 

[adambr2]

I can see Rodgers probably making it based on reputation and the last few weeks if he rides it all the way to the end. That doesn't mean he'll go, though.

 

[El Guapo]

Looking back at the drafts, I don't see many Pro Bowlers or standouts on defense that were drafted below the Packers pick to a round lower, mostly meaning second round picks that TT could have reached for had he felt they were worth the gamble.

2012 - the Vikes took Harrison Smith right after GB selected Perry. The Seahawks got Bobby Wagner in the middle of the 2nd, and the Bucs got Lavonte David towards the end of the 2nd.
2013 - the Packers selected Datone Jones. Carolina took Kawann Short in the middle of the 2nd and New England took Jamie Collins a little later.
2014 - Jason Verrett was selected a few picks after Ha Ha Clinton Dix, but I'm happy with Dix and think that he still has more potential.

I'm not sure how much better TT could have done unless he took guys projected in the third or fourth rounds and took them as our first round pick. I'm sure that somebody will find another name or two but it doesn't appear that there have been stars available for us to select in the first round. If there were 20 players from those drafts that he missed, that might say something but not five.

One could argue that TT isn't getting the bang for his buck from defenders selected later in the draft.