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moritz-boehringer

Discussion in '2016 Draft Archive' started by Chris398, Mar 31, 2016.

  1. Sanguine camper

    Sanguine camper Cheesehead

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    True, he isn't an NFL ready prodpect. With his elite athleticism he won't be hid on a practice squad. That is why whoever wants him will have to devote a roster spot to a project. Teams do it with quarterbacks all the time.
     
  2. Sky King

    Sky King 158.3

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    I thought the tape was in a loop. Bubble screen, bubble screen, uh...bubble screen, etc. :confused: The kid does have some wheels, though. Somebody is bound to take a flyer on him. BTW, which NFL teams are playing in Germany next?
     
  3. captainWIMM

    captainWIMM Cheesehead

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    I don't think you have to devote a roster spot to a developmental player most likely years away from having an impact in the NFL while not being sure if that ever happens.
     
  4. GreenBaySlacker

    GreenBaySlacker Cheesehead

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    Very true... But it doesnt mean he is not nfl ready either. I mean, how smart is he?

    Im not too stoked to havea project 7th reciever on the roster. But as a te prospect? Special teams ace, if he is on fact , like janis? He could have value as a pick. And be a lotto as a nelson replacment in a few years...
     
  5. captainWIMM

    captainWIMM Cheesehead

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    Boehringer has only played one season in the German Football League. There´s absolutely no way he is anywhere close to being ready to play in the NFL.
     
  6. jetfixer

    jetfixer Cheesehead

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    I found more video of him
     
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  7. HardRightEdge

    HardRightEdge Cheesehead

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    After seeing the Packers invited this guy for an on-site visit, I thought I'd take a second look. There is no way this guy won't be drafted, and I could see him going as high as the 4th. round. Thompson, or anybody else, is dreaming if he thinks this guy can be picked up as a 7th. rounder or UDFA for the practice squad.

    He's not just a Combine stud. First, note the soft hands and clean catching technique; this guy is no body catcher. Look at the tape again and you see a couple plays where he shows some extension and adjustment. In the workout tapes he shows quickness in his breaks. This guy shows natural pass catching technique that Jeff Janis is only showing occasional flashes of after 2 years in the league, and who may never show it on a consistent basis.

    Now consider Magnus Hunt. Remember him? One of the all-time great Combine freaks. He was a former junior world champion discus thrower. His freshman year at SMU was his first playing football. He played 4 years at SMU doing nothing in his first 3 years. The only thing in his resume to recommend him was his 8 sacks as a senior and a knack for blocking kicks. He would be turning 26 in his rookie year.

    The Bengals, a pretty good draft-and-develop team, took him in the 2nd. round, a decision they surely regret.

    The point being, if the Bengals would risk that pick on a guy with 4 years college experience without much in the resume, imagine what teams might think about this latest freak of nature who actually shows meaningful football skills without having actually played much football. Somebody will grab for the high ceiling.

    He'll have to learn an NFL route tree, an NFL playbook, adapting to the NFL locker room and the professional football environment, and living in a foreign land. That's a lot to clutter the mind, so you would not expect much out of him in year one. One thing I said about Janis, which was not acknowledged or echoed anywhere until it happened, would apply here. You could expect him to serve as a gunner to justify a roster spot in year 1. ;)
     
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  8. Pokerbrat2000

    Pokerbrat2000 Opinions are like A-holes, we all have one.

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    The other "tricky" part with a guy like Boehringer is where do you stash him while he is getting up to speed? Most people think the 6 current WR's on the roster will be there at the start of the season, I personally don't, but that is besides the point. So you draft Boehringer, he looks good in camp, but isn't up to NFL speed, do you risk putting him on the PS and someone snatching him? He ends up being your #6 WR (bumping one of our current WR's) on the 53 man roster, that may not suit up most of the season. Not saying this isn't a bad problem to have, we had the same situation with Hundley last year.

    Now if you draft him and he looks great or has a long way to get up to speed, what to do with him becomes much easier.

    EDIT: I guess you answered that with your last line "You could expect him to serve as a gunner to justify a roster spot in year 1". Janis odd man out? Since we don't need 2 gunners that aren't ready to contribute fully at WR.
     
  9. HardRightEdge

    HardRightEdge Cheesehead

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    I'm not putting him on my list for the Amish contest because I'm fairly certain he'll be gone before Thompson would want to take a stab at him.

    If by some fluke he did land in the Packers lap, I would not cry if this guy was a reboot of the Janis "concept", but there are other alternatives.

    Abbrederis is a nice little receiver, but limited in scope. He also doesn't contribute on special teams which limits his utility for the game day roster unless there's an injury.

    The approach that would make the most sense is to call M-B the 3rd. TE. Whether we call him a slot TE or a slot WR is semantics, but that looks to me like his natural position. Then you'd have the top pair of fast/physical gunners in the league while you wait. Wasn't Goodson the other gunner? In preseason you'd want to give him some snaps in 4-wide paired with Cook in the other slot. See how it works. That should give these teams playing these small new age ILBs and box safeties who are not so swift in coverage some second thoughts. He doesn't have to learn the whole route tree for specific matchups.

    One of the things that concerns me about this approach, which I've mentioned before, would be the absence of a blocking TE for short yardage. That does not seem to have much of a priority in the recent past, which has contributed to such poor 3rd. and short performance in the run game.

    One solution I propose in my list is securing Jason Spriggs in the second round if he lasts that long, an idea I borrowed (stole?) from Amish. He might since he tips the scales at only 300 lbs. He might serve as that blocking TE. Depth at OT is needed to start with; there isn't a #3 on the roster you can project, and it's not been pretty when the front line guys have gone down. It's also worth noting that the current salary for an average LT is about $8 mil/yr. with Bakhtiari entering FA after the season, while a few of his valued compadres are doing the same.

    Back to the point, it's interesting to note, and a possible kicker with this pick, is that nfldraftscout.com lists TE as Spriggs' secondary position. I checked his background to see where this comes from, but I see no indication he played TE at the high school or college level, and I don't see where Indiana ever threw him the ball. It may just be a projection on athleticism. In any event, if there's any merit to this credential, an OT at TE who presents enough of a threat to catch the ball will keep the defense from just teeing off against the run from that side. It cannot be just any old OT for this job. If he catches it once, teams will have to pay attention.
     
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2016
  10. HardRightEdge

    HardRightEdge Cheesehead

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    Additional notes on Spriggs:

    His Indiana bio says nothing about him having played high school TE...it notes O-Line, D-Line and, of course, basketball:

    http://iuhoosiers.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=3719

    Note that he started as an O-Lineman as a true freshman at Indiana, and college-football-reference shows no indication of him ever catching a pass in college.

    Yet cbssports.com calls him a "former TE", again taken from nfldraftscout.com

    http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/2001860/jason-sprigs

    ESPN says he played TE as a high school senior, which sounds particularly specific:

    http://espn.go.com/blog/bigten/post...iggs-growing-into-one-of-b1gs-top-left-tackle

    I'm guessing the Indiana bio was written by some intern.
     
  11. jetfixer

    jetfixer Cheesehead

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    HRE, your video of the BYU kid is impressive too....I noticed that on most plays he had to come back to the ball or at least wait on it. Boehringer is certainly stronger and faster, but Mathews? is a tall (looks pretty fast) could be a endzone threat.
     
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  12. Pokerbrat2000

    Pokerbrat2000 Opinions are like A-holes, we all have one.

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    Spriggs never caught a pass in HS, but was recruited by Indiana as "an athlete" with his position to be determined later. He played all 4 years at LT. So not sure why he is being listed as a TE candidate? Obviously, if someone can catch a ball, an offensive coordinator can figure out a wrinkle to use him as such. IMO, Spriggs would not only be a reach at #27, but a luxury pick ahead of other bigger needs. Can't see him still being on the board at #57. With the addition of Cook, I see the Packers carrying Cook, Rodgers and whoever wins the #3 due to their blocking skills. I don't see using Boehringer, someone with very limited football knowledge in that capacity.

    I think you are right though, if all the hype on Boehringer is true, someone will take a shot at him well before TT does. I would take McEvoy over Boehringer if it comes down to one or the other.

    "Hometown Paper" source on Spriggs:

    http://www.elkharttruth.com/sports/2011/07/29/Concord-s-Spriggs-commits-to-Indiana-for-football.html
     
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  13. HardRightEdge

    HardRightEdge Cheesehead

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    Of course neither do I, as I indicated. Just because you put a name at #3 TE in the depth chart doesn't require he fill a traditional role. Ergo, the concept of using Spriggs at TE in the 7-man line, presenting some sort of receiving threat, if that's what he can be. Like I said, it would take an uncharacteristic and quite unlikely sequence of events for M-B to land with the Packers, let alone in combination with Spriggs.

    Nonetheless, the exercise is not pointless. The idea is to apply some imagination to stretch the range of possibilities. If one would like to see some breakout from the somewhat stale and predictable Packer offense, you cannot expect that by bringing in the same kinds of talent year after year.
     
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2016
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  14. HardRightEdge

    HardRightEdge Cheesehead

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    Mathews, M-B, Listenbee....

    Mathews and M-B provide a high a size-to-speed quotient. Listenbee is a smaller player with blazing speed, and it's long speed...a bonafide stretch the field threat. They all have soft hands. Listenbee and Mathews show good ball skills, Listenbee in a particular. M-B might qualify on that count from what I've seen. M-B looks more a slot TE to me; Matthews more a big body wideout who runs 4.5. Listenbee is a wideout all the way. If you think Matthews was underthrown, check out Listenbee's tape; those conservative deep balls Rodgers overthrows might be landing in this guys hands, and looking at how he tracks the ball Rodgers can choose inside or outside.

    Size with speed or top drawer long speed, hands, ball skills...stuff you can't teach. And each of these guys presents a profile currently absent from the roster.

    Mathews is the one guy of the 3 you might be able to sneak onto the practice squad; he might be a tad stiff.
     
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2016
  15. Vrill

    Vrill Cheesehead

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    The hype train is getting real with this guy. Seeing it in my news feed on Facebook now.....
     
  16. HardRightEdge

    HardRightEdge Cheesehead

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    The national media covering the NFL draft is on the "sprectrum". Like Rain Man, they're stuck in a loop. The endless, repetitious and painfully tedious dissection of 1st. round candidates and secondary QBs begins to sound like, "Boxer shorts at Kmart, boxer shorts at Kmart".

    It takes some exogenous stimulus to flip them into another loop. M-B is one of those stimuli. Before they're done, it will all just sound like "10 minutes to Wapner, 10 minutes to Wapner".

    The timing is perfect for the story to get up a head of steam...14 days to the draft fits the ideal news cycle in which bludgeon a story to death.

    The thing is, he just might become a football player, in case that actually matters.
     
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2016
  17. Pokerbrat2000

    Pokerbrat2000 Opinions are like A-holes, we all have one.

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    I think after Jaylon Smith and Myles Jack have their medical rechecks this week, you will be hearing endless talk about them. I just watched the footage of when Smith was injured, never knew it was Taylor Decker that hit him causing the injury and somewhat of a cheap shot at that.
     
  18. captainWIMM

    captainWIMM Cheesehead

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    With Goodson being suspended the first four games, possibly ending his career with the Packers, the team is in need of another gunner.

    While that might work as a gadget play once I don't understand the reasoning behind using a 300 pounder as a receiver. NFL defenses will figure out a way to defend it immediately.
     
  19. Pokerbrat2000

    Pokerbrat2000 Opinions are like A-holes, we all have one.

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    Good point, forgot about Goodson.

    I was looking more at the idea of carrying both Gunners at the same position and how thin that could leave us at WR, unless you are counting on either Boehringer or Janis to contribute on offense in the event of injury. I'm still not convinced Janis is an NFL wide receiver, but he has bought some more time to learn the position and prove himself with stellar play as a gunner. Would be an interesting final cut to 53 if both Janis and Boehringer looked good enough to keep for special teams, but iffy at WR.
     
  20. captainWIMM

    captainWIMM Cheesehead

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    Goodson made the team solely as a soecial teams player so I don't consider the position of the player replacing him that important. With that being said the Packers should keep five receivers aside of Janis and Boehringer on the roster in that case.
     
  21. HardRightEdge

    HardRightEdge Cheesehead

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    To repeat, the idea is to use that 300 lb. TE in the short yardage 7-man line in place of a blocking TE., with a better execution profile as illustrated below

    The question might be, "why bother?" Why not just carry a 3rd. TE with blocking credentials? It's simple...to open up an additional spot on the 53-man roster and, perhaps more importantly, the 45-man game day roster. In the previously presented scenario, those roster spots were allocated to a guy like M-B.

    I am indifferent as to what spot a guy like M-B would occupy on the depth chart. If one is more comfortable showing him as the #3 TE on the depth chart with 6 others filling out the WR spots and a guy like Spriggs show simply as "OT", instead of showing 2 TEs, a guy like Spriggs as "OT/TE", along with 7 WRs, go ahead.

    In the process, you get better run blocking from an OT than a TE when the short yardage play is a run, something the Packers could certainly use with that lousy 3rd. and short run performance the last couple of years. If that OT-as-TE can execute a simple pass play...chip, release into the flat, turn, catch the ball...when the defense gives it to you, net-net you get more than you'd get from a short yardage blocking TE and add an extra roster spot in the bargain.

    So, you don't want just any OT in that role; you want somebody who presents at least a threat to catch the ball in short yardage so the opponent does not sell out on the run from that side, and if they don't respect the pass catching threat, then the OT-at-TE needs to be able to execute the route and catch.

    As I said, the way to present that pass threat is to get at least one catch on tape. If an opponent respects that threat, then the OT-as-TE presents an improvement in the run game. If an opponent shows no tendency to respect that threat early in a game, selling out on the run, you would want to have a play and a player to execute a route and catch later in the game.

    I think we've established that Spriggs never caught a ball in college, and perhaps never in high school. However, when he came to Indiana at 265 lbs., making him a TE was evidently a consideration, so you'd think he has sufficient athleticism to execute a short route and catch.
     
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2016
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  22. captainWIMM

    captainWIMM Cheesehead

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    I'm fine with adding another tackle who is capable of being a decent backup at both spots later in the draft but him catching a ball in short yardage situations is a complete afterthought for me.
     
  23. Poppa San

    Poppa San Levelheaded Staff Member Super Moderator Moderator

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    You know, I've a novel thought. How about using someone that has already played as a TE and is already on the roster. Like an existing TE or if you want to mix it up, our do everything backup OL who "played tight end in his first two seasons at Cornell, but moved to tackle" or maybe the starting RT who in high school "played offensive tackle and tight end."
     
  24. HardRightEdge

    HardRightEdge Cheesehead

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    The existing TEs (with the possible exception of Cook...we'll see) are lousy blockers, otherwise I would not have raised the alternative. The starting RTs knees are so bad I don't think he could manage it. Tretter? That is a possibility. Whether it's a matter of capability or lack of imagination I could not say.
     
  25. Robert Mason

    Robert Mason Cheesehead

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