Michael Vick
- Thread starter slowsinistermo
- Start date
I've always thought Vick was a thug and I won't miss him.
BUT...
As some posters have hinted at, other players have gotten off a hell of a lot lighter for beating and ****** women, and for being involved with the killing of human beings.
The guy who shot and killed one of my best friends served less time than Vick will, so this is a wee bit of a touchy issue with me
.
BUT...
As some posters have hinted at, other players have gotten off a hell of a lot lighter for beating and ****** women, and for being involved with the killing of human beings.
The guy who shot and killed one of my best friends served less time than Vick will, so this is a wee bit of a touchy issue with me
.Packnic
Cheesehead
Pit bulls arent dogs. just killing machines.
Raider Pride
Cheesehead
I am not a Vick fan and never have been. I think he is arrogant and carried a gangster like attitude. He is no Brett Favre and I find it interesting that Atlanta as an organization and city gave up on Brett but loved Vick.
I do not know much, but this I do know.
Many people in South Korea eat dogs and cats. Because dog meat is so expensive there though, the people in rural areas raise and kill the dogs themselves; or steal them. In many regions of South Korea they serve dog as a regular part of the menu. Vick in South Korea would not be a criminal, he would be a vendor.
People in India do not believe in eating cows and are horrified at the way cows are treated here. It is a different culture. Almost everyone of us here on this forum are just as sick in the mind of many people in India as Vick is to many of us here.
In England, A lady named Nadine Trewin, in lost her temper after a flea from her cat bit her on the leg. She then put the cat in her microwave oven and cooked it to death. She is facing a maximum of six months in jail. Vick got 23 Months.
Vick however gets almost two years in jail, AND…. At least a 100 Million Dollar Plus Fine.
Think about it. He also loses all of his endorsements, Nike has dumped him, and he loses at least three years of his income he would have earned in the NFL.
That is a big *** fine, when you also combine 23 months in a 6 foot by 10 foot cell. Not to mention that he will loose all dignity when he has to stand in front of prison guards, strip naked, turn around, bend over and spread his *** cheeks so they can make sure he is not hiding any thing.
Vick is not the smartest guy in the world. Hell, he could not mentally grasp a simple playbook in Atlanta even though he was given years to grasp it. I understand that coaches had to simplify things for him. He is no Payton Manning.
However, does he deserve almost two years in jail and a 100 Million dollar plus fine?
I reckon that is decided by where you live. India? South Korea? China? Or… if you live in the good old U.S.A.
I do not know much, but this I do know.
Many people in South Korea eat dogs and cats. Because dog meat is so expensive there though, the people in rural areas raise and kill the dogs themselves; or steal them. In many regions of South Korea they serve dog as a regular part of the menu. Vick in South Korea would not be a criminal, he would be a vendor.
People in India do not believe in eating cows and are horrified at the way cows are treated here. It is a different culture. Almost everyone of us here on this forum are just as sick in the mind of many people in India as Vick is to many of us here.
In England, A lady named Nadine Trewin, in lost her temper after a flea from her cat bit her on the leg. She then put the cat in her microwave oven and cooked it to death. She is facing a maximum of six months in jail. Vick got 23 Months.
Vick however gets almost two years in jail, AND…. At least a 100 Million Dollar Plus Fine.
Think about it. He also loses all of his endorsements, Nike has dumped him, and he loses at least three years of his income he would have earned in the NFL.
That is a big *** fine, when you also combine 23 months in a 6 foot by 10 foot cell. Not to mention that he will loose all dignity when he has to stand in front of prison guards, strip naked, turn around, bend over and spread his *** cheeks so they can make sure he is not hiding any thing.
Vick is not the smartest guy in the world. Hell, he could not mentally grasp a simple playbook in Atlanta even though he was given years to grasp it. I understand that coaches had to simplify things for him. He is no Payton Manning.
However, does he deserve almost two years in jail and a 100 Million dollar plus fine?
I reckon that is decided by where you live. India? South Korea? China? Or… if you live in the good old U.S.A.
I hate dog fighting and think Vick got what he deserved..
I love to deer hunt..
But I completely see KG point on this..
A buck walking or running chasing a doe to get some, and WHAM is shot with a bullet or an arrow..He has no defense at all for himself other then his senses..and even those can be fooled by the human putting on scents, clothes and makeup..
And honestly?? How many hunters NOW need that meat? Back in the day hell yeah they needed it...Now its a SPORT and to control the population..
Dog fighting, 2 animals going at it to win...The one that is stronger faster normally wins...Sort of sounds like boxing..
Hammer
Cheesehead
Are we forgetting about racketeering, gambling, and other federal charges beyond the dogfighting? If he was trafficking drugs as the illegal activity, wouldn't it be similar?
For the record, I think he's a reprehensible scumbag for this dogfighting crap.
For the record, I think he's a reprehensible scumbag for this dogfighting crap.
Packnic
Cheesehead
People just dont like Vick period. He could have jaywalked and they would put him jail for 23 months.
He's in jail for the money aspect of the whole thing. People are acting like the 23 months is for act of murdering dogs. It's not. It's for conspiracy of funding, not murder or animal cruelty. The fact that he helped kill the dogs should have no weight on his sentencing, because that's not what he was charged with. Funding a dog fighting ring is illegal, regardless of the fate of the dogs. Yes, his funding lead to the dog's death, but that has nothing to do with what he was charged with.
I'm not defending the guy. I think dog fighting is terrible. I'm just clarifying exactly what it is he is in jail for.
I personally (not that it will make a diffrence) will NEVER watch a game that has Vick playing in it.
Not that I think it would ever happen, but I'd even go as far as no longer watching the packers if by some chance they picked him up.
Due to Tromadz stance on this topic he has definatly won my vote for mod! :thumbsup:
Not that I think it would ever happen, but I'd even go as far as no longer watching the packers if by some chance they picked him up.
Due to Tromadz stance on this topic he has definatly won my vote for mod! :thumbsup:
Hammer
Cheesehead
Nathaniel, dogfighting is also illegal, it was one of the charges...funding an illegal dogfighting operation. So that weighed on the sentence.
Packnic
Cheesehead
Why? Why? How could you have so much contempt for someone because of pit bulls. They are pit bulls, by name, bred for fighting in pits. The very nature of the animal is to kill or hurt other things. If you put two pitbulls on the street and let them roam... they will fight other dogs, its what they do. If a pit bull bites or kills a child, you would have the pit bull killed. But when it bites another dog in a ring, you wanna kill the owner.
I'm not questioning Vick in jail. The law states that you cant organize pit bull fighting, you cant commit perjury, and you can't run illegal gambling rings. He should be in jail because he did those things. Thats fine (even though i think 23 months is excessive for something that isnt human)
But for someone to say they would quit cheering for and or watching their favorite football team because they picked Mike Vick up is ridiculous. The guy organized the fighting of things that kill and fight by nature, and you wouldnt let him play football and win ball games for you. It really is all just because people have never liked the kid for some reason or another.
pack_in_black
Cheesehead
You make a great point, but I just felt the whole time that with all of the media attention it got, the dehumanization of Mike by the media and Fido-firsters was sickening. It just feels like he became an instant scapegoat, political platform-builder, and man to be made an example of.
I absolutely LOATHE dogfighting, and think it should be stopped. And I agree with packnic that pitbulls are good for one thing: killing.
But Michael Vick got completely screwed by our corrupt judicial system and useless politicians.
I know we aint s'posed to get political on this site, but the whole thing is just a farce IMHO.
Hammer
Cheesehead
Point taken. Chicken, egg.
jnells
Cheesehead
Here’s a list of things to consider before applauding how harsh Vick's punishments have been. I know my last post about this hasn’t been too well received, but I don’t care. How much Vick has had to lose here is wrong, not because he’s Mike Vick, but because he's a person, and people have seemed to forget that.
Also, this is not a defense of Vick or dog fighting, but my stating that the punishments here are too much, not just for Vick but for anybody. This is also not supposed to bash the Justice Department, they did their job is prosecuting Vick, which they should have done because he was operating a criminal enterprise across state lines. I never said he should have gotten off without a scratch, but he should have been given a lighter penalty.
1) Forget Mike Vick for a second. Had an ordinary average Joe been convicted of dog fighting they would lose as much as he did. But that person would now be a convicted felon, which they would have to report to every prospective employer. Being a convicted felon also disqualifies a person from any form of government job. There’s a term for this its called FELON DISENFRANCHISEMENT. Some feel its leads to something called RECIDIVISM, which is where a person re-engages in criminal activity after their release from incarceration. I don’t feel dog fighting, actually animal cruelty is so serious that it warrants such repercussions.
2) Vick has no prior felony convictions. Forget the water bottle thing and Ron Mexico because they never ended up in court. This is kind of steep for a first time offender. He plead guilty and turned himself in. Yes he could have actually gotten up to 60 months, but 23 is still very high.
3) When all is said and done Vick will have missed 4 seasons. His comeback is very unlikely. Though its unlikely he'll end up back in a Newport News housing project, his quality of life will be significantly diminished. This is too much for a person to have to endure because of dog fighting.
Also, this is not a defense of Vick or dog fighting, but my stating that the punishments here are too much, not just for Vick but for anybody. This is also not supposed to bash the Justice Department, they did their job is prosecuting Vick, which they should have done because he was operating a criminal enterprise across state lines. I never said he should have gotten off without a scratch, but he should have been given a lighter penalty.
1) Forget Mike Vick for a second. Had an ordinary average Joe been convicted of dog fighting they would lose as much as he did. But that person would now be a convicted felon, which they would have to report to every prospective employer. Being a convicted felon also disqualifies a person from any form of government job. There’s a term for this its called FELON DISENFRANCHISEMENT. Some feel its leads to something called RECIDIVISM, which is where a person re-engages in criminal activity after their release from incarceration. I don’t feel dog fighting, actually animal cruelty is so serious that it warrants such repercussions.
2) Vick has no prior felony convictions. Forget the water bottle thing and Ron Mexico because they never ended up in court. This is kind of steep for a first time offender. He plead guilty and turned himself in. Yes he could have actually gotten up to 60 months, but 23 is still very high.
3) When all is said and done Vick will have missed 4 seasons. His comeback is very unlikely. Though its unlikely he'll end up back in a Newport News housing project, his quality of life will be significantly diminished. This is too much for a person to have to endure because of dog fighting.
WinnipegPackFan
Cheesehead
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For those who really think Vick's sentence was too harsh; you may want to consider why his lawyers wanted to deal with this out of court. Jury opinion (as could be the general opinion of this or any other forum) would change very quickly after getting the visual graphic details as to what had actually been done.
It is one thing to debate a topic that no one has ever witnessed, another thing all together to see the graphic details before debating. Vick's lucky he changed his plea to guilty and avoided that Jury because every graphic detail was going to come out and I guarantee you that hearing the details day after day on the news would guarantee that no body ever would consider touching him again in the NFL and what little is left of his fan base would have to wake up.
So thank the system for allowing him to keep all the gory details to himself because"Ignorance is bliss"
It is one thing to debate a topic that no one has ever witnessed, another thing all together to see the graphic details before debating. Vick's lucky he changed his plea to guilty and avoided that Jury because every graphic detail was going to come out and I guarantee you that hearing the details day after day on the news would guarantee that no body ever would consider touching him again in the NFL and what little is left of his fan base would have to wake up.
So thank the system for allowing him to keep all the gory details to himself because"Ignorance is bliss"
Packnic
Cheesehead
exactly. The amount of money he is losing is so huge that its almost unfair really. all because ESPN wants something to talk about.
Packnic
Cheesehead
All his defense would have to do is this. In every detail possible... describe the killing skinning, gutting and tanning of a deer. and then show how many billions of people worldwide hunt and kill deer. just as gory if not even more so. Ive seen dogs fight, and ive seen a dog killed. neither was a gory as the after kill process of a deer hunt bro.
and by the way... putting on display the gory details of a crime isnt justice... its emotionalism with an agenda.
look i understand people have a soft spot for ol' fido and i do too. But theres a big difference from a 15 pound schnauzer to a 60 lb pit bull.
IronMan
Cheesehead
Yeah packnic, espn is the reason Vick is in jail. NOT because he committed a FELONY. Its all espns fault. Boo hoo for Mike Vick.
pack_in_black
Cheesehead
One could also argue that displaying pictures is playing on a jury's immediate emotional response, and creating a "mob mentality" by just showing pictures.
Pack93z
You retired too? .... Not me. I'm in my prime
I don't think most are saying Vick shouldn't have been punished for the crimes he commited.. but in comparison with some of the things others have done, served less or no sentence for, and returned to the game after a suspension or whatnot... it does seem unjust to Vick.
Personally, I don't think Vick's sentence is out of line, but rather that others got away way to light... whether it be Ray Lewis, James Lofton, Micheal Irvin, Little... it seems that their crimes were just as if not more offensible.. but they got a slap on the wrist and allows to play again without the loss of everything. Hell in Ray Lewis's deal, the other person never got to breathe again.. and he just went right back to the game.
Uniformity is what people are looking for and not getting at this point an time.
Personally, I don't think Vick's sentence is out of line, but rather that others got away way to light... whether it be Ray Lewis, James Lofton, Micheal Irvin, Little... it seems that their crimes were just as if not more offensible.. but they got a slap on the wrist and allows to play again without the loss of everything. Hell in Ray Lewis's deal, the other person never got to breathe again.. and he just went right back to the game.
Uniformity is what people are looking for and not getting at this point an time.
