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Kill me if you want, but here's a question, with some logic behind it

Discussion in 'Packer Fan Forum' started by profile_removed, Jul 26, 2010.

  1. profile_removed

    profile_removed Cheesehead

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    Here's the question I want alot of people to answer for me, and I'll give you insight and logic into my side of this argument so here goes:

    Why is the Brett Favre situation Brett's fault and NOT Ted's?

    Let's look at what happened: Ted drafted Aaron. That'd be like any of you ladies coming home and having your husbands say 'hey honey meet my knew lady' or you guys having your wives say 'meet my new man'. Now I ask you...how would YOU have handled yourself in that situation? Not as well as Brett I'm guessing.

    THEN Ted goes and says 'Well Brett obviously won't be here forever and we have to plan for that'. Which to me would sound like "My wife/husband is dying, and we'll move you in the day after it happens". Again, how many of you would do well with hearing that?

    Then Aaron comes out in training camp and makes a comment about Brett not being there when Aaron was a rookie and should be keeping his mouth shut and learning...Ted and Mike do nothing. Now I don't know about you, but if it's me and I'm Favre I'm thinking 'The fix is IN'.

    You're then asked/told to basically train your replacement. Think about this...guys would you train your wife's new husband. Ladies, would you train your husband's new wife?

    We then start hearing more and more about Brett not coming to OTA and such...I believe because Ted was trying to turn the media against Favre and boot him out of Green Bay. This is something we've only heard in passing in year's prior, yet now seems to be a major event. Or it could be construed as if we want to stick with the domestic angle 'she had dinner made 5 minutes late last week'.

    Brett loses his Dad prior to Aaron being drafted, Deanna is diagnosed with cancer and loses his brother in law sometime between his father's death and 3/4/07, not sure of the time frame though so can't place things perfectly into alignment so I won't...but through that...one constant for Brett was US! 70,000 KNOWLEDGEABLE lunatics at Lambeau Field, and stadiums all around the country where in most cases half of the stadium was filled with people just like us screaming for him through the good and the bad and why? He was one of us. Small-town aw-shucks personality that played a kids game and LOVED it more than he loved the money he got for playing it. We were in the huddle with him all night in Oakland. We were willing him to stay on his feet and keep going in Chicago in '95. We were with him too in that final drive against Oakland at Lambeau when he broke his thumb. Why? We believed in him.

    Then in the NFC Championship game, a week after Brett had one of THE greatest games in his life...he throws an interception that the majority of you can't get past. Maybe it was a dumb throw, maybe it wasn't. What I know is this, if that pass is completed with that jump the corner had on the route...Green Bay wins the game on that play because we get the TD, and it's a pass Brett usually completed. So maybe you all are hanging Brett for a great defensive play.

    By 3/4/07 I watched a beaten man leaving the team he loves. I wish I had found this forum back then, so I could've posted what I saw that day, but I hadn't, so I'll tell you what I saw that day. I saw a guy who knew that he wasn't done, but that he was being replaced. Seriously, think about this. Have we EVER seen Brett let out with alligator tears? "My father died"...moist eyes. "Deanna has breast cancer" a few tears. "I know I can still play, but I don't know if I want to anymore" and he was almost blubbering like a baby. On one side of the screen I see Brett doing that, on the other I see highlights of the Seattle game, and I'm going 'ok something is up here', and it turns out something WAS up.

    I think in the 6 or so weeks between the NFC Championship and the retirement Brett was told that he was the backup. Not even that there was an open competiton...flat out that Aaron was the starter.

    At that point Favre decided to "retire" and then play the game that eventually led to him forcing Ted to basically trade him to Minnesota. So I ask you again...Why is this Brett's fault and not Ted's?
     
  2. Green_Bay_Packers

    Green_Bay_Packers Cheesehead

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    Ted didnt trade Favre to the Vikings though he traded him to the Jets.

    Maybe it was Ted's fault but I dont know and really dont care as if Favre comes back we go 2-0 vs him anyway :)
     
  3. LAG

    LAG Cheesehead

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    Long ago, like so many Packer fans I got sooooooo tired of Brents annual 'retirement' schpiel. Now it's getting sooooooo passe listening to sob story's from the teary eyed Favre fan. Geez, the guy recently said playing for the queens one year was better than ten years with the Pack. Dressed in Barney purple is better than the beloved green and gold?

    Starr, Hunter, Dickey, Rodgers...these names don't leave a bad taste in my mouth.
     
  4. bozo

    bozo Cheesehead

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    There's plenty of blame to go around, so I don't think it was totally Ted's fault or Favre's fault, but I do know that after Holmgren left, Favre became UN-manageable, Sherman let him run things, & when McCarthy came, there was conflict, as McCarthy tried to get a hold of the strings, Favre revolted. Had Favre, NOT played the "I'm retiring...I'm coming back" game in previous years, perhaps TT would have done things differently.

    I had a lot of respect for Favre when he was traded to the Jets, but when he insisted on going to the Vikes, that was purely a "get back" at the Packers move...when he stated that, "this is the best team I've ever played on", dissing the Packers 96 Super Bowl team...that was the end of my respect for him.
     
  5. Wolvi

    Wolvi Cheesehead

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    Hmm where to start? How can you even attempt to make the analogy of a marriage?

    "Let's look at what happened: Ted drafted Aaron. That'd be like any of you ladies coming home and having your husbands say 'hey honey meet my knew lady' or you guys having your wives say 'meet my new man'. Now I ask you...how would YOU have handled yourself in that situation? Not as well as Brett I'm guessing."

    This is a BUSINESS, not a marriage. Of course you would draft a great young QB when yours is getting older and about to have grandchildren. You would hope that the older guy would mentor your new guy and get him ready to step into your shoes...To be honest you lost me right from there. You need a better analogy to try to sway my vote...
     
  6. FrankRizzo

    FrankRizzo Cheesehead

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    #1- There aren't any ladies here reading. Maybe one???
    #2- This is the NFL. It's not real life and it's not a marriage. You can't compare.
    #3- Yes, TT does deserve some blame. But:
    #4- Farve even today can't fuqing come out and admit he's coming back in a few weeks. Back in 2004, 2005, it was still the case. In 2005, when God slid Aaron Rodgers to the #25 pick, TT had to take him knowing that he was really the #1 player in that draft. My 2005 Sporting News Draft Preview had Arod ranked #1, as did I.
    #5- TT was and is aware that Farve always chokes in the playoff clutch. Always has, always will. OK, so he didn't throw away the 1996 season because the defense was ranked #1 with Reggie & co. and Desmond Howard made sure of it.

    I don't blame Farve for wanting to keep playing. The game is fun. He makes a lot of money. And he loves, loves, loves the attention, media, and spotlight. That's the part I hate. He bullshitted everyone all these years to pretend that he was just a country boy, a regular guy who wanted privacy. That's hogshit. He has his wiki leak system in place down there between is little Biloxi reporter, his agent Bus Cook, and his brother. It's always been amazing to see what info gets passed on to the media..... sources say Brett Farve has just taken a dump and rolled out a 14-incher, but doesn't know if he can do it much longer........ so unless he's had a bug planted in his house, he always leaked these things. He's a media whore. I want to see him sacked early and hard into the Lambeau turf, with Raji smothering his throwing shoulder.
     
  7. SpartaChris

    SpartaChris Cheesehead

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    Oh boy, where to start...
    Brett is gonna be what, 41 this year? He was 35 when we picked Rodgers. Rodgers was to us at the time what Matt Flynn is to Rodgers today- A backup holding a clipboard and learning the game. At 35 years old, we had no idea how much longer Brett wanted to keep playing. He'd already played the retirement game a couple times by this point, so we needed that added insurance policy. We drafted a guy to learn who could eventually come in and replace him. That's sound business, especially when you consider the kind of uncertainty Brett was leaving us with.

    Well yeah. What indication did Brett give anyone that he was going to keep playing for sure? Every single season for his last three or four years with us it was "I'm not sure if I'm coming back." And I'd argue this isn't anything like a loved one dying. This is a business first, and we had to be prepared for his eventual departure.

    "It's not my job to teach, it's his job to learn." - Brett Favre

    Sounds like an awful lot of insecurity. It's called being a team player and a "leader". Again, this isn't a marriage, it's a business. A team is only as good as it's weakest player, and it was to Brett's best interest to make sure his backup was strong enough should something happen to him.

    Was it Ted going to the media and telling them Fraud didn't report for OTA's, or was it more likely that someone in the media, showing some initiative and knowing of Brett's wishy-washiness in past years, was floating the idea of Brett skipping camp and possibly heading towards retirement?

    Occam's razor says the simplest solution is often the correct one, so even money tells me the latter is more likely than the former.

    Or, you know, calling it what it is- an Interception. Facts are facts, and the fact is he threw a pick on that final play. He had a couple guys wide open, and made a bad pass. You live by the Favre, you die by the Favre.

    Bullshit. He wasn't being forced out. He wasn't even approached about returning by the time he held that now embarrassing press conference. What was up was Fraud was tired of being forced to be a TEAM player. He was tired of not being the guy in charge and of being held accountable. In fact, Ted visited Brett a couple times after Brett retired, and never bothered to get an answer from him about a possible return. Hell, in June Fraud was still using the word "might," as in , "I think I might want to come back." That tells me he still wasn't committed to returning to the team, so we more or less had no choice but to move on.

    Yeah, I call bullshit again. Fraud had a great season in 2007, so why wouldn't we have wanted him back? If he would have said, straight out, that he was returning, none of this would have happened. As it was he decided he didn't want to have to be accountable. He didn't want to do training camp any more. He didn't want to be reigned in, like McCarthy was doing. He wanted to act like a spoiled child and get his way, which is why he's now a Viking.

    No conspiracy here man. Fraud wanted to go to a team that would roll over to his demands and kiss his ***. Ted and Mike weren't doing that any more.
     
  8. morningwood

    morningwood Cheesehead

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    I don't know how you could blame the Packers for drafting Rodgers:

    1. Favre was what, 35 at the time? Any prudent team would be looking for the QB of the future with a QB that age.

    2. Rodgers was a steal at #24 in the draft.
     
  9. SpartaChris

    SpartaChris Cheesehead

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    Good point. You don't often go wrong taking the best player available.
     
  10. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Good gawd man...

    As others stated you can not compare this to a marriage...

    Packers wanted him to just commit, he couldnt so they said see ya..As I posted in your other rant, the time line shows he wanted Ted to be honest but Brett wasnt honest with Ted..

    Both are at fault, both sides made mistakes....It is 3 years since it happened


    LET IT GO

    If this thread gets out of hand it will be locked
     
  11. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    and WE cant get past the int?

    Shall I dig up every post of yours about Rodgers int or fumble in the Zona game? Once again Rodgers does it your blaming him, Brett does EXACT same thing and your making excuses
     
  12. Pugger

    Pugger Cheesehead

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    BINGO! Before his teary PC Favre was slated to be our starting QB, not Rodgers. Favre wanted out of Green Bay because he didn't like people telling him what to do. We all saw how far Chilly got trying to rein in His Highness last season. BTW, I'm beginning to believe it was more MCCARTHY that got sick and tired of Favre's act and is the reason why #4 is gone rather than TT. If you remember it was MM that had those marathon talks with Favre that August and whom #4 could not convince he was 100% committed to playing for the Packers. And if he wasn't 100% committed to playing for GB I had no problem with MM and TT shipping him off to NY. But seriously, this is all ancient history. Favre is where he wanted to be all along so and we have Rodgers so everyone should be happy - except queen fans when #4 throws another game killing INT... ;-)
     
  13. PackersRS

    PackersRS Cheesehead

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    Oh my freaking God. You just compared Favre and GB to a marriage, which is, in theory, eternal. You really are making your argument to be that the Packers should've done whatever Favre wanted, and only get a proper replacement once Favre retired, missing every opportunity to get a quality future franchise QB, who, on the WCO, needs usually 3 years to fully grasp the playbook?

    This has to be the most delusional, to say the least, comparison I've ever seen.
     
  14. 3irty1

    3irty1 Fear the Dreads!

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    Actually it would be more like you going to work one day and have your manager say, "Hey Bob, this is Aaron he's the new hire."

    Really? Cause to me it would sound like, "Hey Bob, I know your planning to retire soon, so we hired this new guy to take over when you do. Why don't you show him the ropes?"

    Really, cause in any other job you train those that are hired under you. Not sure where you work, but I'm assuming the older guys helped you out when you were starting?

    Actually, I trained many people that ended up taking over my position when I left. Its quite common in the business world. Trained about 25 employees before I left for college at my Highschool Job, Trained about 5 more while in college, and still train people today even though im not going anywhere. All different jobs.

    Or it could be looked at as "an employee showed up 5 minutes late last week" in which case happened mulitiple times, and ends up being an issue. Do you work sir?

    I work at Enterprise Rent-a-Car. I work hard my entire career, and all my management team and underlings love me. I have great time management skills and make an effort to look good to everyone. One day I leave the keys to a rental in a car and don't lock it. The next morning the car is gone. Maybe that was a dumb mistake, and if that thug didn't happen to look into that car I'd still have a job, but guess what? In the real world mistakes are what your supervisors (management AND fans in this case) judge you on. is that fair? Hell no, life isn't fair.

    If you happen to reply yes to my "Do you work?" question, try this. Go to work and tell your boss, "I know I can still work, but not sure if I want to" see what happens. Now do it three days in a row before actually putting in your two weeks notice. Now, when those two weeks are up, go sit on your couch all day, put your resume out and look for another job. In one month come back and tell your manager you didn't actually quite and tell him you want all your hours, all your benefits, and hell, why not a pay raise?

    Proof?

    "At this point Favre DECIDED to RETIRE" thats why.
     
  15. Pugger

    Pugger Cheesehead

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    Yup, had Favre not retired he would have been the Packers' starting QB in 2008, not Rodgers.
     
  16. PackersRS

    PackersRS Cheesehead

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    That is a fact and there's no way to contradict it.

    Fact is, if Favre wanted, he would've been the starter in 08.
     
  17. Quientus

    Quientus Oenophile

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    First; Hello All !!! Been absent for quite a while, but been very busy with work and helping starting up a new restaurant ... (Home - Restaurant Fusion) for those of you who are interested ! LOL

    Second; ... - I can NOT believe people are STILL having this discussion ... - more than 2 years and "we" are still at this ??? ... - isn't it time to move on ? and focus on the new season ?

    Anyways, this new lay out of the web page really threw me off ... at first ... - ok ok ... I admit, the first 3 times I actually thought I had stumbled into a totally different web ... But very good too see all those familar faces !!!

    I'm looking forward to be having alot of great discussion (again) with you all, and I hope you all had a nice summer ...


    Now it's time to "buck up" and get ready for the new season !!!

    Happy Football'ing to every one !

    Regards
     
  18. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Welcome back Quin!
     
  19. PackersRS

    PackersRS Cheesehead

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    Welcome back. And I agree. Won't coment about this again. Well, not until we face the Vikings...
     
  20. G0PackG0

    G0PackG0 Cheesehead

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    I was a Favre sympathizer at the start. Very angry with TT. But you know what? The ball was always in Favre's court. Look at right now, the Viking are held hostage by him. Because it's Tavaris Jackson if he doesnt play. And we had Aaron Rodger's waiting. A little difference there. Favre i'm afraid will never quit until he's hurt badly. He cant let go of the game. And I worry about that. Maybe some day he will apologize and be welcomed home but not in the near future I'm afraid.
     
  21. Clay's Jock Strap

    Clay's Jock Strap TRK's Hero

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    And maybe some day the arabs will apologize to the jews - or vice versa... In other words, maybe some day monkees will fly out of my butt. The longer I spend on this planet the more I realize that there are not many certainties in life - but along with death, taxes and the Vikings sucking elephant balls, one apparent certainty is that BrINT favrah will be a "me first" diva who thinks that he is entitled to anything his heart desires. I simply cannot see BrINT favrah ever apologizing for ANYTHING... ****, he couldn't even find it in him to apologize for that PATHETIC interception that basically kept the queenies out of the superbowl... How hard would it to be for such a great leader and accomplished veteran to simply say "I f'd up and made the worst possible decision?" Instead it was Rice who just wasn't in the spot favrah expected him to be in... Eie yie yie - favruh is one of a kind.
     
  22. turbo69

    turbo69 Cheesehead

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    You are comparing a wife......or girlfriend.....to a business? What Ted did was business. Why don't you compare Favre to a set of tires. Ya don't wait until they are totally worn out before you get new ones.
     
  23. vegasdan

    vegasdan Cheesehead

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    I scanned through the comments, hate spending valuable reading time on a non-Packer, but I need to defend the Packers GM.

    I tried your analogy, maybe if AR was a new child whom BF refused to raise. Maybe if BF moved out; asked out the neighbor; called your business competitors and told them your weaknesses; etc. but really BF was not a lifetime commitment by the Packers and the analogy just doesn't work.

    TT has been nearly blameless in this whole matter. If anything, he could have been more communicative with the public at key moments, but hardly the blame that is on the shoulders of BF in this matter.

    I too loved BF, thought he was a good ole boy, aw shucks type who just loved the game. Turns out he was a drama queen who stabbed the Packers in the back the first chance he got. I don't care if he can still play, I am glad the spoiled bitch is gone.
     
  24. Clay's Jock Strap

    Clay's Jock Strap TRK's Hero

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    Great answer! Buy this man a beer!!!! :viksux:
     
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  25. turbo69

    turbo69 Cheesehead

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    I'd like to see that in maybe the NFC Championship game...........against the Packers. "Brett Favre from the shotgun.......he's back to pass......Favre looking downfield.........he's going for Rice at the 30..............Interception by Charles Woodson.......he's at the 35.......the 45......50 .....(ohh my god did you see Favre get layed out by BJ Raji).......he's at the 40....the 30......he could go all the wayyyyyy......! Touchdown Greenbay. Well Joe.........Favre is still down on the field. Thank god he is moving but what a way to end a career. I know what ya mean Al. Look at the way his leg is facing. The Packers give........the Packers taketh away.
     

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