Flores Suing the NFL, Alleging Racism

[Dantés]

This is a crazy story!

Brian Flores Sues NFL, Names Dolphins, Giants, Broncos In Racism Charge

Former Miami Dolphins head coach Brian Flores, still awaiting a head coach interview with the Houston Texans, on Tuesday filed a suit in Manhattan Federal

www.outkick.com

He didn't get the Giants job, the Giants didn't tell him, Belichick found out, and he accidentally text Flores when he meant to text Daboll (I guess??).

Plus Flores is claiming that Ross (Dolphins' owner) mistreated him because he wouldn't break tampering rules and throw games!

And he says that teams (specifically the Broncos) treated his interview as a joke and it was clear that it was just a Rooney Rule deal.

If there's actual ethnic bias and prejudice at work, I hope there are receipts and they get exposed. This stuff needs to get exorcized instead of remaining at the level of "implied" or "suspected." Get it out there and deal with it.

 

[Forget Favre]

Interesting because a few months ago the NFL fired Jon Gruden to show it is not racist.

 

[ARPackFan]

Interesting because a few months ago the NFL fired Jon Gruden to show it is not racist.

A handful of emails out of 650,000 are "leaked" and Jon Gruden is out of the NFL. I think he deserved to be fired but why & how those specific emails got leaked is the big question and should be investigated. If Gruden was targeted by individuals in the league office then more heads need to roll.

If there's actual ethnic bias and prejudice at work, I hope there are receipts and they get exposed. This stuff needs to get exorcized instead of remaining at the level of "implied" or "suspected." Get it out there and deal with it.

If Belichick knew Dabol was being hired by the Giant before Flores was even interviewed then the Roony rule is a joke and be honest I've always felt most teams bring in a minority just to satisfy the rule with no intention of hiring.

 

[Dantés]

A handful of emails out of 650,000 are "leaked" and Jon Gruden is out of the NFL. I think he deserved to be fired but why & how those specific emails got leaked is the big question and should be investigated. If Gruden was targeted by individuals in the league office then more heads need to roll.



If Belichick knew Dabol was being hired by the Giant before Flores was even interviewed then the Roony rule is a joke and be honest I've always felt most teams bring in a minority just to satisfy the rule with no intention of hiring.

Yes, the Rooney Rule is a joke.

Any rule that requires you to interview people based on skin color is a joke. It robs excellent black coaches of dignity, making them wonder if they’re genuinely being considered or just checking a box.

I don’t know what to make of all Flores’ claims, but the one about the Giants being racist does not hold any water at all. They interviewed their own DC and were pursuing Frazier as well. The reality there is almost certainly that Schoen was leaning towards Daboll from the start for obvious reasons.

The idea that the Broncos are racist is a stretch. The coach who preceded Fangio was black.

It’s also hard to see how the Dolphins are racist given that one of the people Flores didn’t see eye to eye with there, Chris Grier, is black. And the Dolphins hired him in the first place.

 

[Mondio]

I know racism exists in some people in varying capacities. I'm not sure what to do about other than try and treat people as people in general. I think the Rooney Rule is a feel good, do nothing hoop that is for theater only. Like so many rules and actions by people these days from their instagram account to political actions with massive social implications, so much theater. But the NFL has it, so whatever. They are in the entertainment biz so maybe the theater is good for them. but really, i couldn't really care less about this part of his allegations.

But the money to toss games or tamper with players under contract etc? If there is some traction behind that, get them.

 

[Forget Favre]

Yes, the Rooney Rule is a joke.

Any rule that requires you to interview people based on skin color is a joke. It robs excellent black coaches of dignity, making them wonder if they’re genuinely being considered or just checking a box.

I don’t know what to make of all Flores’ claims, but the one about the Giants being racist does not hold any water at all. They interviewed their own DC and were pursuing Frazier as well. The reality there is almost certainly that Schoen was leaning towards Daboll from the start for obvious reasons.

The idea that the Broncos are racist is a stretch. The coach who preceded Fangio was black.

It’s also hard to see how the Dolphins are racist given that one of the people Flores didn’t see eye to eye with there, Chris Grier, is black. And the Dolphins hired him in the first place.

So is he crying, "Racism," just because he wasn't hired?

To win his case he has to prove beyond a doubt that those organizations/teams are racist or didn't hire him because of his skin color and he will have to find proof of that.
A joke shared about an ethnic or minority group around the water cooler won't be enough.

Ya know, I swear. The NFL is the most controversial pro sports organization I know of.
Nowhere else in pro sports have I ever heard of so many crimes, domestic abuse, racist allegations, ****** assault, etc that happens at the level it does within those past and present involved with football.

 

[Forget Favre]

A handful of emails out of 650,000 are "leaked" and Jon Gruden is out of the NFL. I think he deserved to be fired but why & how those specific emails got leaked is the big question and should be investigated. If Gruden was targeted by individuals in the league office then more heads need to roll.

Those emails should have been or were supposed to be private exchanges and they were done when he was in between coaching jobs.
I also believe in warnings and if he was not warned then I would find that unfair.
And this was over harmless words when actions, such as murdering someone because they are black, are far, far worse.
I disagree about the firing while I agree with your other points though.

 

[AKCheese]

Actually he doesnt have to prove his case beyond a doubt. He has to prove it by the preponderance of the evidence, which is 50.0000000000001%. Personally I think there have been enough black HCs in the NFL that that arguement on an institutional basis is getting a little stale. No doubt some owners and GMs still have issues.

 

[Dantés]

So is he crying, "Racism," just because he wasn't hired?

To win his case he has to prove beyond a doubt that those organizations/teams are racist or didn't hire him because of his skin color and he will have to find proof of that.
A joke shared about an ethnic or minority group around the water cooler won't be enough.

Ya know, I swear. The NFL is the most controversial pro sports organization I know of.
Nowhere else in pro sports have I ever heard of so many crimes, domestic abuse, racist allegations, ****** assault, etc that happens at the level it does within those past and present involved with football.

The NFL is controversial because it's highly public and the media covers it with a microscope.

The rates of criminality in the NFL are actually a lot lower than their peers in the general public.

I would not assume that Flores is lying about his allegations, just as I would not assume that the organizations are guilty. I'm just saying, his claims aren't holding water with me at first glance. If there is more evidence, I'm all for it going public.

 

[sschind]

So is he crying, "Racism," just because he wasn't hired?

To win his case he has to prove beyond a doubt that those organizations/teams are racist or didn't hire him because of his skin color and he will have to find proof of that.
A joke shared about an ethnic or minority group around the water cooler won't be enough.

Ya know, I swear. The NFL is the most controversial pro sports organization I know of.
Nowhere else in pro sports have I ever heard of so many crimes, domestic abuse, racist allegations, ****** assault, etc that happens at the level it does within those past and present involved with football.

How many people are involved in the NFL as opposed to the other sports organizations. I mean just player wise you are looking at almost twice as many players and that's just active. Then I think you have far more coaching and staff positions in the NFL as well. I think that the NFL is a cross section of humanity just like everything else. You have your saints and your devils and everywhere in between and by sheer numbers you are going to hear about more bad apples. Also, are you as big a fan of the other sports leagues or maybe you just hear more about the NFL because you are a bigger fan?

 

[Packerbacker1996]

A handful of emails out of 650,000 are "leaked" and Jon Gruden is out of the NFL. I think he deserved to be fired but why & how those specific emails got leaked is the big question and should be investigated. If Gruden was targeted by individuals in the league office then more heads need to roll.



If Belichick knew Dabol was being hired by the Giant before Flores was even interviewed then the Roony rule is a joke and be honest I've always felt most teams bring in a minority just to satisfy the rule with no intention of hiring.

Or Dabol killed on the interview and they knew they have there man and only ware going to interview Flores out of fear of people accusing them of racism.

Hey aren't there like 67% or something like that black players in the NFL? wtf racism more white players should get z chance to play and *** about east Indians and Asians. Racism.

Or wait. Maybe there are more black players because more black people like to play ball.
Or maybe black man have better genetics and are on average bigger, stronger, faster etc.. ? Maybe they make better players and that's why there are dominating NFL?.

Listen if there is racism involved it defenitly needs to be addressed. There is no room for that and should not be tolerated.

However we have to be very carefully here because you can easily turn nearly everything In to a racism issue.

 

[Forget Favre]

How many people are involved in the NFL as opposed to the other sports organizations. I mean just player wise you are looking at almost twice as many players and that's just active. Then I think you have far more coaching and staff positions in the NFL as well. I think that the NFL is a cross section of humanity just like everything else. You have your saints and your devils and everywhere in between and by sheer numbers you are going to hear about more bad apples. Also, are you as big a fan of the other sports leagues or maybe you just hear more about the NFL because you are a bigger fan?

Let's look at OJ Simpson for example who may have done the worst of the worst crime of any current or former football player.
We have yet to hear, as far as I know, of any baseball, hockey, golf, basketball or even boxing and MMA players to have been charged with committing such a horrific crime or who do as many crimes as football players do.
To me I see and hear of more really bad troubles done by football players.
I think it comes with the mentality of the violent vibe that goes with the game.
The psychology of how that spills over into some players personal lives who take that home with them, I have no idea and that would be something only an expert can answer who has studied that.

 

[JK64]

The Rooney rule is to blame for all of this. There are so many dumb policies that are supposed to help minorities but end up hurting them in the long run.

 

[ARPackFan]

Or Dabol killed on the interview and they knew they have there man and only ware going to interview Flores out of fear of people accusing them of racism.

Hey aren't there like 67% or something like that black players in the NFL? wtf racism more white players should get z chance to play and *** about east Indians and Asians. Racism.

Or wait. Maybe there are more black players because more black people like to play ball.
Or maybe black man have better genetics and are on average bigger, stronger, faster etc.. ? Maybe they make better players and that's why there are dominating NFL?.

Listen if there is racism involved it defenitly needs to be addressed. There is no room for that and should not be tolerated.

However we have to be very carefully here because you can easily turn nearly everything In to a racism issue.

Most teams probably know who they want to hire before the previous coach is fired. The Giants have every right to hire who they want but the league via the Roony Rule has mandated two external minority candidates shall be interviewed in person before a new coach is hired. I don't see what the Giants did as racist but if the Bill Belichick email indicates the Giants had made their decision before the process of interviewing was complete (timeline below) then they are in violation of league rules and should penalized accordingly. I will bet the Giants lose at least one draft pick because the league will want to send a message that covers up the fact that the Rooney rule is completely worthless.

https://larrybrownsports.com/footba...ach-interviews-rooney-rule-requirement/591390

Jan. 11 (Tue) – Giants fire Joe Judge as head coach
Jan. 21 (Fri) – Bills assistant GM Joe Schoen hired as GM
Jan. 21 (Fri) – Bills OC Brian Daboll interviews with Schoen and Giants’ co-owners via teleconference
Jan. 22 (Sat) – Bills DC Leslie Frazier interviews via teleconference
Jan. 23 (Sun) – Bengals DC Lou Anarumo interviews via teleconference
Jan. 23 (Sun) – Daboll and Frazier’s Buffalo Bills eliminated from playoffs
Jan. 24 (Mon) – Cowboys DC Dan Quinn interviews in-person. Giants’ first in-person interview for the job.
***Bill Belichick Email congratulating Brian Dabol inadvertently sent to Brian Flores***
Jan. 25 (Tue) – Brian Daboll receives second interview. Interview occurs in-person
Jan. 26 (Wed) – Giants DC Patrick Graham interviews. Does not satisfy Rooney Rule since in-house candidate
Jan. 26 (Wed) – Ex-Dolphins HC Brian Flores has dinner with Schoen
Jan. 27 (Thu) – Brian Flores interviews (satisfies Rooney Rule because it is in-person with someone outside organization)
Jan. 27 (Thu) – Dan Quinn announces he is remaining as Cowboys DC
Jan. 28 (Fri) – Leslie Frazier gets second interview, this time in-person, also satisfying Rooney Rule
Jan. 28 (Fri) – Daboll hired as head coach

 

[BrokenArrow]

Ya know, I swear. The NFL is the most controversial pro sports organization I know of.
Nowhere else in pro sports have I ever heard of so many crimes, domestic abuse, racist allegations, ****** assault, etc that happens at the level it does within those past and present involved with football.

Well, the NFL has almost twice as many players as MLB, about 6 times as many as the NBA and 4.5 times as many as the NHL which is mostly comprised of Canadians.

 

[Dantés]

I’ve been thinking a lot about this suit and the issues around it.

On the one hand, I reject the current cultural tendency to just assume everything is racially motivated.

But on the other, I also reject the common knee jerk response of assuming everyone like Flores is a grifter.

The absence of more black head coaches is strange.

Here is my theory:

NFL head coaches lean towards the offensive side of the ball. Most years there are roughly 2 head coaches with offensive backgrounds to every 1 with a defensive background. Most black head coaches have been defensive minded guys (Todd Bowles, Brian Flores, Marvin Lewis, Tony Dungy, Lovie Smith, Mike Tomlin, Vance Joseph, Leslie Frazier, Raheem Morris, Herm Edwards, Mike Singletary, Romeo Crennel). So the majority of attractive HC candidates who happen to be black are concentrated on the side of the ball that gets about half as many chances. That isn't prejudice against their skin color, but rather a bias towards offense.

The majority head coaches with an offensive background followed the path of QB coach to OC. In other words, I think that being a QB Coach is the surest bet to ending up as a HC down the road.

Most QB Coaches are and have been white. The reason? The eras in which this generation of coaches played football (mostly 80's and 90's) featured way more white QB's than black QB's. Thus the disparity in players of 2-3 decades ago is now manifesting in a disparity among coaches today.

Now why weren't there more black QB's? Was there an ethnic prejudice against having black players at a position where leadership comes with the territory? I don't know for certain, but I think that's pretty likely to at least have been one factor.

So what do we do about it? I think the most important thing that can be done is already happening: the QB position is not the near exclusive domain of white guys. I think there were 11 starting QB's this last season who were not white. And I think and believe that's just because the best guys are playing, and what color their skin is just happens to be incidental. In time, the influx of black QB's should change the trend, if my theory is correct.

In the meantime, they should abolish the Rooney Rule, examine all candidates strongly and fairly, and expose any real evidence of ethnic prejudice at work. I don't see what else they could do. Forcing teams to hire coaches they don't really want for reasons other than skin color wouldn't help anyone, in my opinion.

 

[Forget Favre]

Well, the NFL has almost twice as many players as MLB, about 6 times as many as the NBA and 4.5 times as many as the NHL which is mostly comprised of Canadians.

I don't think that's the reason.
Somehow football attracts future bad guys for some reason who take their violent work home with them.

 

[Mondio]

I’ve been thinking a lot about this suit and the issues around it.

On the one hand, I reject the current cultural tendency to just assume everything is racially motivated.

But on the other, I also reject the common knee jerk response of assuming everyone like Flores is a grifter.

The absence of more black head coaches is strange.

Here is my theory:

NFL head coaches lean towards the offensive side of the ball. Most years there are roughly 2 head coaches with offensive backgrounds to every 1 with a defensive background. Most black head coaches have been defensive minded guys (Todd Bowles, Brian Flores, Marvin Lewis, Tony Dungy, Lovie Smith, Mike Tomlin, Vance Joseph, Leslie Frazier, Raheem Morris, Herm Edwards, Mike Singletary, Romeo Crennel). So the majority of attractive HC candidates who happen to be black are concentrated on the side of the ball that gets about half as many chances. That isn't prejudice against their skin color, but rather a bias towards offense.

The majority head coaches with an offensive background followed the path of QB coach to OC. In other words, I think that being a QB Coach is the surest bet to ending up as a HC down the road.

Most QB Coaches are and have been white. The reason? The eras in which this generation of coaches played football (mostly 80's and 90's) featured way more white QB's than black QB's. Thus the disparity in players of 2-3 decades ago is now manifesting in a disparity among coaches today.

Now why weren't there more black QB's? Was there an ethnic prejudice against having black players at a position where leadership comes with the territory? I don't know for certain, but I think that's pretty likely to at least have been one factor.

So what do we do about it? I think the most important thing that can be done is already happening: the QB position is not the near exclusive domain of white guys. I think there were 11 starting QB's this last season who were not white. And I think and believe that's just because the best guys are playing, and what color their skin is just happens to be incidental. In time, the influx of black QB's should change the trend, if my theory is correct.

In the meantime, they should abolish the Rooney Rule, examine all candidates strongly and fairly, and expose any real evidence of ethnic prejudice at work. I don't see what else they could do. Forcing teams to hire coaches they don't really want for reasons other than skin color wouldn't help anyone, in my opinion.

I can't argue with your thought process

 

[Dantés]

I don't think that's the reason.
Somehow football attracts future bad guys for some reason who take their violent work home with them.

Again, the rates of criminality in the general population of people in the age range of the NFL is higher.

 

[Mondio]

Again, the rates of criminality in the general population of people in the age range of the NFL is higher.

i seem to have to point this out to people all the time. They never believe it, even when you show them the crime rates, violent or other vs the same aged males in the general population. They like it when they compare 20 something males in the NFL with 75 year old females and act like they're all satan themselves.

 

[Dantés]

i seem to have to point this out to people all the time. They never believe it, even when you show them the crime rates, violent or other vs the same aged males in the general population. They like it when they compare 20 something males in the NFL with 75 year old females and act like they're all satan themselves.

It’s amazing how much you can change people’s opinions just by what you choose to pay attention to.

The narrative that criminality is super higher among NFL players is simply a result of the media paying way more attention to their crimes.

 

[rmontro]

People have overused the race card to so much excess that when I hear the word "racist" I just roll my eyes. That word has ceased to have any meaning, because they've now decided that anything and everything is racist. Whether it is or not.