Five knee-jerk reactions to Packers first training camp practice

[TJV]

What I don't like about this ongoing Abbrederis and Janis argument is it seems like Packers fans are rooting against players on the Packers roster.

Abbrederis has a high school physique and I don't see how anyone would expect him to have the durability to play long-term in the NFL, especially given his concussion history.

With all the money and time spent by the Packers preparing for the draft their use of a 5th round pick on Abbrederis indicates they expected him to have the durability to play long-term in the NFL. Do you see that? Or do you think Thompson just spent/threw away (what he considers a very valuable) 5th round pick on a whim?

 

[Mondio]

I want them both to succeed and think they both have a nice role they could fill for the Packers. Both have knocks against them, but both have a pretty nice niche they could fill too. I don't think either is our everydown Jordy or Cobb. They're a stretch the field, take the short ball and go a long ways, or the sure handed, know where to be and get there, catch the ball to move the chains when all the big names are paid attention to. We could use a reliable guy to fill either, or both those roles

 

[Joe Nor Cal Packer]

I like Abbrederis, and think he'll be sixth on the depth chart. Nelson, Cobb, Adams, Montgomery, Janis, Abbrederis. I don't think TT will give up on a talented 5th round pick who was redshirted last year. There is a need for some raw speed to stretch the field on 3 and 4 WR sets. And I think Janis and Abbrederis fit that. Any talk of Abbrederis having a high-school physique is irrelevant. I don't think such a person could survive, much less thrive in the Big Ten if that were true.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

What I don't like about this ongoing Abbrederis and Janis argument is it seems like Packers fans are rooting against players on the Packers roster. With all the money and time spent by the Packers preparing for the draft their use of a 5th round pick on Abbrederis indicates they expected him to have the durability to play long-term in the NFL. Do you see that? Or do you think Thompson just spent/threw away (what he considers a very valuable) 5th round pick on a whim?

Realistically, if Abby continues to lack the durability to stay on the field then the Packers DID throw away a fifth round pick (though not because of his physique unless you think additional muscle mass would prevent ACL tears or concussions). One of the major concerns for him coming out of the draft was durability; talent-wise he was much better than the fifth round. Packers gambled that he could stay healthy. So far that hasn't worked out. Hopefully that changes.

 

[AmishMafia]

What I don't like about this ongoing Abbrederis and Janis argument is it seems like Packers fans are rooting against players on the Packers roster. With all the money and time spent by the Packers preparing for the draft their use of a 5th round pick on Abbrederis indicates they expected him to have the durability to play long-term in the NFL. Do you see that? Or do you think Thompson just spent/threw away (what he considers a very valuable) 5th round pick on a whim?

Risk vrs reward. Favre was a huge risk as the Packer Doctors thought he only had 5 years because his hip was thought to be degenerative. Adrianne Peterson was a big risk because of a knee issue in college. Harrell was a risk because of assorted college injuries. You take chances on players based on what they can become vrs risk of injury. Sometimes you hit and sometimes you miss.

 

[I asked LT to delete my acct]

was redshirted last year.

I never understood this. What does red shirting a player do exactly ??

 

[TJV]

I never understood this. What does red shirting a player do exactly ??

It makes the player wear an ugly red shirt that can’t be removed or washed for an entire season.

Seriously, it’s a term applied to college sports: A player saves a year of eligibility by red shirting. For example, a freshman who probably wouldn’t contribute to the football team can sit out for his first year (only practice with the team) and still have four years of eligibility left.

 

[I asked LT to delete my acct]

It makes the player wear an ugly red shirt that can’t be removed or washed for an entire season.

Seriously, it’s a term applied to college sports: A player saves a year of eligibility by red shirting. For example, a freshman who probably wouldn’t contribute to the football team can sit out for his first year (only practice with the team) and still have four years of eligibility left.

Thank you . I always thought it meant the player was off limits for hard hits, e.g. the QB in practise sessions or something like that.

 

[Mondio]

Thank you . I always thought it meant the player was off limits for hard hits, e.g. the QB in practise sessions or something like that.

in the NFL it does, qb's or player coming off injury will wear a red jersey, which means, don't hit them, but in college it has the meaning that Jack wrote about. That's the general meaning when saying someone had "redshirt" year. The guys in the NFL are just wearing red jerseys

 

[I asked LT to delete my acct]

in the NFL it does, qb's or player coming off injury will wear a red jersey, which means, don't hit them, but in college it has the meaning that Jack wrote about. That's the general meaning when saying someone had "redshirt" year. The guys in the NFL are just wearing red jerseys

Once again, thank you

 

[Joe Nor Cal Packer]

Once again, thank you

Now that I think about it the term doesn't really apply in pro ball. As pointed out, in college it means a player is "around" the team but doesn't play and so doesn't lose a year of eligibility.

Back to Abbrederis for a minute. I don't necessarily agree he's a "fragile" player. I can't think of the name of the top 5 pick from this year, a DL with the Jags, who blew out an ACL in day one OTAs or rookie minicamp. He could hardly be called fragile. ACLs are usually freak plays that are very, very hard to see coming much less avoid. I think Abby makes the team this year. That said, it will be hard for him to get snaps other than STs. But if rehabbed aggressively and retains his natural speed, could make a great ST gunner, and stretch Ds in 4 WR sets.

 

[sschind]

I want them both to succeed and think they both have a nice role they could fill for the Packers. Both have knocks against them, but both have a pretty nice niche they could fill too. I don't think either is our everydown Jordy or Cobb. They're a stretch the field, take the short ball and go a long ways, or the sure handed, know where to be and get there, catch the ball to move the chains when all the big names are paid attention to. We could use a reliable guy to fill either, or both those roles

I guess I don't really care if whether either one in particular succeeds. I mean yeah, I would like for them to but only in the sense that I want all Packers to succeed. If they don't someone else will take their spots and I want the best guys on the final roster I don't really care if it is Janis or Abby or White or the new kid. I'm not particularly pulling for either one of them because I don't particularly think either one of them will be anything special.

I live in Wisconsin but I didn't go to UW so I don't really have any affinity towards the school. I don't think I have ever watched a game. Maybe one of the Rose Bowls 20 years ago or something like that. If you like the school, or any school for that matter and you are particularly pulling for players from that school that's fine. If you are a Badger fan and would rather see Abby than Janis I have no problem with that, as long as Abby beats him on the field. I'd really hate to see some UCLA fan being all pissed off that Rodgers is starting again instead of Hundley.

 

[sschind]

Now that I think about it the term doesn't really apply in pro ball. As pointed out, in college it means a player is "around" the team but doesn't play and so doesn't lose a year of eligibility.

Back to Abbrederis for a minute. I don't necessarily agree he's a "fragile" player. I can't think of the name of the top 5 pick from this year, a DL with the Jags, who blew out an ACL in day one OTAs or rookie minicamp. He could hardly be called fragile. ACLs are usually freak plays that are very, very hard to see coming much less avoid. I think Abby makes the team this year. That said, it will be hard for him to get snaps other than STs. But if rehabbed aggressively and retains his natural speed, could make a great ST gunner, and stretch Ds in 4 WR sets.

I think in a rough sense it could apply. Certainly not in an "eligibility" way since that does not apply in the NFL but sometimes players are placed on IR with "minor" injuries simply because they need some seasoning. I'm not saying Abby's injury was minor and it may not really apply to him specifically but teams do take players with no intentions of having them play their rookie years. In a sense they are using IR to redshirt them.

 

[Joe Nor Cal Packer]

I think in a rough sense it could apply. Certainly not in an "eligibility" way since that does not apply in the NFL but sometimes players are placed on IR with "minor" injuries simply because they need some seasoning. I'm not saying Abby's injury was minor and it may not really apply to him specifically but teams do take players with no intentions of having them play their rookie years. In a sense they are using IR to redshirt them.

That's a good way to look at it. Basically they're "stashing" a guy they have no intention of playing. Now an ACL is a season-ender anyway, but at least the player gets to be around the team. This gives him some time to learn the playbook, but that only goes so far. One really learns the playbook and schemes by playing! The teams with the best playbooks don't win, it's the teams with the best players executing the playbook - and coaches of course.

I don't care if other WRs emerge to challenge Abbrederis or Janis for the 5th and 6th spots. I've got no emotional attachment to a guy because he was a /badger. Probably the most pressure is on Montgomery - a high draft choice will get a spot and has to perform. But from what we've seen so far in camp, he could turn out to be the most valuable player from this draft class. As another posted noted, I just want the best players on the team. It's amazing to me the number of gems who are UDFAs.

In my usual "stream of consciousness" mode, does anyone know how Rollins is doing? I don't know I just like the guy and round 2 is where TT seems to shine. I heard about the hamstring and cringed. Anyway would appreciate any updates. Thanks all!

 

[brandon2348]

I don't know why everyone talks about a guy that isn't gonna do anything. Until he does what's with all the endless hoopla?

 

[Joe Nor Cal Packer]

What I don't like about this ongoing Abbrederis and Janis argument is it seems like Packers fans are rooting against players on the Packers roster. With all the money and time spent by the Packers preparing for the draft their use of a 5th round pick on Abbrederis indicates they expected him to have the durability to play long-term in the NFL. Do you see that? Or do you think Thompson just spent/threw away (what he considers a very valuable) 5th round pick on a whim?

The criticism of Abbrederis is strange and the durability questions aren't logical.... He made it through the Big Ten. ACLs are freak injuries and I don't think they have anything to do with durability. Abbrederis deserves a chance. Anybody suggesting TT bite the bullet and put him out to pasture without seeing more snaps isn't thinking straight.

That said, TT will not hesitate to dump a player who is not performing - like Thornton, a 3rd round pick last year who likely won't be around for the kickoff at Soldier Field. Hanging on to a guy who is either 1) not contributing or 2) not showing progress is a sunk cost, no matter where he was drafted.

Of course that doesn't explain why AJ Hawk lasted as long as he did. He must have pictures or something. That really did seem like a situation where TT let emotion cloud a hard decision (for Ted, not most fans). That really surprised me coming from TT and will likely remain a mystery. I know AJ made a ton of tackles - but when they're five or ten yards down from the line of scrimmage, that stat doesn't mean so much. I'm not trying to offend AJ fans. He was and is a decent human, a loyal GB Packer, and a hard worker, just not championship caliber.

 

[Joe Nor Cal Packer]

This thing with Abbrederis has been going on since he was drafted. I'm a Wisconsin fan and I like the Badgers but from day 1 I thought the guy didn't have an NFL body. Everyone has been arguing ever since he was drafted and until he can actually get on the field he really can't even be evaluated. I really hope he can get and stay healthy so we can all see what he can do. However; i'm losing confidence that will happen on a consistent basis. Well see. He appears to be somewhat fragile which was a concern going in.

Despite others, I loved the Montgomery pick and it appears TT had some concerns about depth at receiver as well. I really got tired of people saying Montgomery had "bad hands." It's still early but I think he is off to a great start.

Right now you cant really even count on Abbrederis stay healthy.

I like the Montgomery pick as well. We may finally have a kick returner and a dangerous option out of the slot or backfield. A "mini-Cobb" except he's bigger.

As far as the back and forth on Abbrederis, like every one else drafted or signed, he has to prove himself. I'll give him a Mulligan on the ACL, those are nasty and happen to the best conditioned athletes as well. If he retains his speed, I see him as a ST gunner and used in 4 wideout sets to stretch a secondary. That would be plenty from a 6th WR. The real question is who else could do that and possibly more? And while I like Janis and don't care much about the fact he came from Division II, he has a lot of proving to do.

Safe to say Nelson, Cobb, Adams and Montgomery round out the top 4. As for 5 and 6, don't be surprised if it's not Janis and/or Abbrederis. But I think they're hungry and will do well.

 

[brandon2348]

I like the Montgomery pick as well. We may finally have a kick returner and a dangerous option out of the slot or backfield. A "mini-Cobb" except he's bigger.

As far as the back and forth on Abbrederis, like every one else drafted or signed, he has to prove himself. I'll give him a Mulligan on the ACL, those are nasty and happen to the best conditioned athletes as well. If he retains his speed, I see him as a ST gunner and used in 4 wideout sets to stretch a secondary. That would be plenty from a 6th WR. The real question is who else could do that and possibly more? And while I like Janis and don't care much about the fact he came from Division II, he has a lot of proving to do.

Safe to say Nelson, Cobb, Adams and Montgomery round out the top 4. As for 5 and 6, don't be surprised if it's not Janis and/or Abbrederis. But I think they're hungry and will do well.

I see Montgomery closer to a "Bigger Harvin" as he has some serious straight line explosion. It is beyond noticeable. Not that Cobb isn't explosive but more so in a different way. I compared Montgomery that way after they drafted him and now Sam Shields has thrown that comparison around. Regardless of how he is compared I agree and is a threat to "take it to the house" from anywhere on the field.

Maybe they only keep 5 receivers, IDK. I think Ladarius Gunter could be a gunner. I'm not rooting against Abbrederis at all but I have concerns about durability. There is nothing to really evaluate at this point. Let's hope he can get and stay healthy so everyone can see what he can do.

 

[Mondio]

I am excited by Montgomery too, he appears to have the build and skills to be a game changer.

As for the other wr spots, I hope whoever gets it, earns it. I want to see one or two receivers step up and say ,it's mine, and take it.

 

[PikeBadger]

I guess I don't really care if whether either one in particular succeeds. I mean yeah, I would like for them to but only in the sense that I want all Packers to succeed. If they don't someone else will take their spots and I want the best guys on the final roster I don't really care if it is Janis or Abby or White or the new kid. I'm not particularly pulling for either one of them because I don't particularly think either one of them will be anything special.

I live in Wisconsin but I didn't go to UW so I don't really have any affinity towards the school. I don't think I have ever watched a game. Maybe one of the Rose Bowls 20 years ago or something like that. If you like the school, or any school for that matter and you are particularly pulling for players from that school that's fine. If you are a Badger fan and would rather see Abby than Janis I have no problem with that, as long as Abby beats him on the field. I'd really hate to see some UCLA fan being all pissed off that Rodgers is starting again instead of Hundley.

I care about one guy I hope succeeds and that is Janis because I don't think we have anyone else on the roster that has his long speed. It remains to be seen how well and how quickly he can master the skills to play WR and I hope he does and quickly because he adds a dimension that no one else on the roster possesses.

 

[sschind]

The criticism of Abbrederis is strange and the durability questions aren't logical.... He made it through the Big Ten. ACLs are freak injuries and I don't think they have anything to do with durability. Abbrederis deserves a chance. Anybody suggesting TT bite the bullet and put him out to pasture without seeing more snaps isn't thinking straight.

That said, TT will not hesitate to dump a player who is not performing - like Thornton, a 3rd round pick last year who likely won't be around for the kickoff at Soldier Field. Hanging on to a guy who is either 1) not contributing or 2) not showing progress is a sunk cost, no matter where he was drafted.

Of course that doesn't explain why AJ Hawk lasted as long as he did. He must have pictures or something. That really did seem like a situation where TT let emotion cloud a hard decision (for Ted, not most fans). That really surprised me coming from TT and will likely remain a mystery. I know AJ made a ton of tackles - but when they're five or ten yards down from the line of scrimmage, that stat doesn't mean so much. I'm not trying to offend AJ fans. He was and is a decent human, a loyal GB Packer, and a hard worker, just not championship caliber.

I recently read a stat that said the Packers have the lowest cap space taken up by dead money, something like 4%. That may have something to do with Ted holding on to guys like Hawk for so long. When a GM gives out a big contract he usually does so to guys he thinks can contribute at a high level for a long time. That doesn't always work out but that's the thinking when the deal goes down. Almost always it seems most fans will disagree. So a down year means those fans are willing to cut bait and put up with the dead money. The GM, who obviously disagrees with the fans anyway, isn't willing to do so but it has nothing to do with the dead money it has everything to do with the fact he probably still thinks the guys has something left. By giving him the extra year to prove it the team gets the added advantage of less dead money. Obviously there comes a time when a player has to go, dead money or not but again, the GM is likely to think that point is later than most fans do. The key is it is the GM who determines when the guy is not contributing or not showing progress and not the fans. I think Ted held on to Hawk for as long as he did because he simply thought he might still have something left.

 

[Carl]

The criticism of Abbrederis is strange and the durability questions aren't logical.... He made it through the Big Ten. ACLs are freak injuries and I don't think they have anything to do with durability. Abbrederis deserves a chance. Anybody suggesting TT bite the bullet and put him out to pasture without seeing more snaps isn't thinking straight.

That said, TT will not hesitate to dump a player who is not performing - like Thornton, a 3rd round pick last year who likely won't be around for the kickoff at Soldier Field. Hanging on to a guy who is either 1) not contributing or 2) not showing progress is a sunk cost, no matter where he was drafted.

Of course that doesn't explain why AJ Hawk lasted as long as he did. He must have pictures or something. That really did seem like a situation where TT let emotion cloud a hard decision (for Ted, not most fans). That really surprised me coming from TT and will likely remain a mystery. I know AJ made a ton of tackles - but when they're five or ten yards down from the line of scrimmage, that stat doesn't mean so much. I'm not trying to offend AJ fans. He was and is a decent human, a loyal GB Packer, and a hard worker, just not championship caliber.

Hawk was an average or solid for many years. No reason to cut an average player when there isn't a better guy around to take the spot.

His last season he was awful, and then promptly cut.

 

[GoPGo]

I'm not trying to offend AJ fans. He was and is a decent human, a loyal GB Packer, and a hard worker, just not championship caliber.

Superbowl XLV? He started and played the entire game, you know.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

In my usual "stream of consciousness" mode, does anyone know how Rollins is doing? I don't know I just like the guy and round 2 is where TT seems to shine. I heard about the hamstring and cringed. Anyway would appreciate any updates. Thanks all!

Rollins broke up a deep ball by Rodgers to Montgomery and gave up a 26-yard reception to White during yesterday's practice. He mostly rotated with Gunter as the dime corner.

I think Ladarius Gunter could be a gunner.

Gunter isn't fast enough to be a gunner.

I recently read a stat that said the Packers have the lowest cap space taken up by dead money, something like 4%.

Currently there are four teams having less dead money counting against the cap than the Packers (2.23% of the cap). I agree with the rest of the post.

 

[Half Empty]

Superbowl XLV? He started and played the entire game, you know.

As did Frank Zombo and a surprisingly large number of players nobody would call championship caliber. Playing on a championship team doesn't make you a championship player.