Demarious Randall

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HardRightEdge

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And then Vince Lombardi proclaimed to the huddled and angry masses gathered outside Ted Thompson's house, "Thou shalt not judge a draft pick the second he's selected don't you Wisconsinites remember the Nick Collins novel?":whistling:
I would upgrade that pick from a D to a B-/C+ given Randall was the #30 pick. I don't grade on a curve, so for me a C grade would be exactly what you'd expect from a rookie #30, no more and no less. I've bumped the pick now to B-/C+ instead of a flat C because his decent (not great) play has been valuable in Shields' absence. My chief concern with this pick was Randall's lack of physicality.

You might note that subsequent to my D grade, issued right after the draft, I posted a few clicks above that, "According to one report, Randall gained 14 lbs. between the end of the season and the Combine. That would indicate his [college] game tape is showing a guy weighing 182 lbs. He looks it. So, I'll reserve further judgment as to his tackling skills for the preseason." No one else in these pages seemed to think this relevant. He's proven to be an adequate tackler after bulking up, nothing more. However, we've not seen him to be trusted much with press coverage.

Calling Randall a "shut down" corner at this juncture is overshooting the mark by some measure. Here are a few thoughts on his season and perhaps his future place in the scheme.

1) He got off to a strong start in the first 4 games or so chiefly because teams did not throw at him very much. This was more a function of having no NFL tape on the guy, and not much college tape of Randall at perimeter corner, than fear of what he could do. As the season wore on with accumulated tape, that changed.

2) His high water mark was the game-saver against San Diego which, on an unrelated matter, coincided with my last post on these boards, but since I got an email flagging this thread and it's a snow day I figured I'd respond. As teams threw his way more as the season wore on, vulnerabilities were exposed.

3) Randall, like Shields, gives away inside releases. On the one hand, I can't help but question whether this is being coached with Job #1 being defending the deep sidelines in Capers soft-coverage/bend-don't-break/clamp-down-in-the-red-zone approach. On the other hand, (1) with neither Dix nor Burnett being instinctual ball hawks, both in the strong safety mold and (2) not having an adequate coverage ILB dropping in the middle as the team has transitioned from the clueless Palmer to the semi-clueless Thomas in dime (which persists) to the improving and promising Ryan who is still working to master this coverage defense, it's difficult to understand the willingness to channel receivers to the short-to-intermediate inside. Give the instances where Randall has not just given up the inside, but has gotten turned around on those routes, I can't help but think this is not entirely what Capers/Whitt have in mind.

The weakness in this defense has been the soft underbelly of the pass defense. It gets exposed when playing the better QBs, the Washington game not withstanding against an overrated QB having played a weak schedule, the wind killing throws for half the game, and the pass rush having played their best game of the season.

4) In consideration of the ILB position, and the progress (and increasing snap counts) we've seen from Kendricks throughout this season (a guy some of us wanted at #30), it begs the question:

Would this be a better defense at this juncture with Kendricks/Ryan in the middle in base/nickel, Kendricks in dime, Matthews back on the perimeter where he belongs, and a CB crew of Shields-Rollins (a pick I did think was good value)-Hayward-Gunter on the perimeter and Hyde-Hayward at nickel/dime? Something for the forum denizens to ponder. Think about how good Rollins has looked in limited play and, shock of shocks, a perimeter corner defending a crossing pattern with Gunters nice play against Washington.

5) Anybody who thinks Randall will make the all-rookie team should consider the play of Darby (the #50 pick) and Peters, among others.

6) So, what does the future hold for Randall and how we will we view him a few years down the road? If he stays at cover corner I think we'll be happy to think of him as a solid, reliable player who doesn't give up the big plays in bunches. He'll not be a Pro Bowl-caliber perimeter corner. Maybe he'll be an "alternate-caliber" player in a year where he happens to snag 5 or 6 INTs.

There's another scenario. Think about how often you've seen Dix close on a deep ball in support? Hardly ever, or more correctly, nearly never. In single-high safety, which he plays a fair amount of the time, you would not call him instinctual or smart as he hedges bets and is rarely at the ball. Think about Randall's TD-saving tackle on Gurley, coming all the way across the field like he was shot out of a cannon. Based on that play, I would submit he's one of the faster players in the league when chasing either a player or the ball. Consider his very good ball skills. Consider his outstanding play as a college safety. Consider his physically, while improved, not what you'd want for press coverage.

I would submit that the best free safety on this team is Damarious Randall. Both Burnett's and Dix's contracts run through 2017. The defense does not benefit from having two strong safeties.

Discuss amongst yourselves.
 
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tynimiller

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There's another scenario. Think about how often you've seen Dix close on a deep ball in support? Hardly ever, or more correctly, nearly never. In single-high safety, which he plays a fair amount of the time, you would not call him instinctual or smart as he hedges bets and is rarely at the ball. Think about Randall's TD-saving tackle on Gurley, coming all the way across the field like he was shot out of a cannon. Based on that play, I would submit he's one of the faster players in the league when chasing either a player or the ball. Consider his very good ball skills. Consider his outstanding play as a college safety. Consider his physically, while improved, not what you'd want for press coverage.

I would submit that the best free safety on this team is Damarious Randall. Both Burnett's and Dix's contracts run through 2017. The defense does not benefit from having two strong safeties.

Discuss amongst yourselves.

You made the case and saw the play that started it for me as well! If Gunter improves and Rollins as well (or we draft another) I think that is precisely what we see unfold. We let Burnett walk, resign HaHa and bam, you have a double headed true free and strong safety duo.
 

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IMO Randall has a chance to be a very good cover CB - and so does Rollins. They're part of the reason I'm very optimistic about the Packers secondary going forward. They're young (the oldest player is Shields at 28, followed by Burnett at 27) and I think there's a lot of talent. They have three good cover CBs - and I am intrigued by Gunter and I think they're solid at safety with HHCD having a chance to become a difference maker.
I'm neither excited nor disappointed about the pick at the moment as I have to see him play the position.
You haven't seen him play the position?
 

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He may have been talking about the scenario where we for some reason let Burnett go and move Ha Ha and then Randall becomes a safety? I'm not advocating that, but I know it was brought up.
 

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As of the end of this season I would grade the drafting of Demarius Randall as an "A". He has added a playmaking ability at the corner for a Rookie that is second to none. I don't know of another rookie CB that has had as good of a year.
 

thisisnate

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As of the end of this season I would grade the drafting of Demarius Randall as an "A". He has added a playmaking ability at the corner for a Rookie that is second to none. I don't know of another rookie CB that has had as good of a year.

Marcus Peters, Ronald Darby, Delvin Breaux

Just sayin.
 

Curly Calhoun

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It's fun to look back on the comments on Randall a season after the pick. In hindsight, I think most will agree he was a solid addition, and a pretty decent value at #30. I didn't know too much about him before the draft, and I wondered if he would end up as a "project" moving from college safety to NFL corner. After losing both Tramon Williams and Davon House, I thought Ted might be reaching to fill a need. If he was, I'm glad he did.

Stephone Anthony would have been a good selection too, he went to the Saints with the next selection. However, good cover corners are coveted in today's NFL, so it's hard to argue Ted got this one wrong. I'm sure someone will manage to nonetheless.........:p
 

thisisnate

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He had a good year, and I'm happy with his rookie season and the pick, but as always, I'll reserve judgement for a few seasons. I'm not even that old and I've seen too many guys have good first years and then regress or fail to improve further.
 

tynimiller

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Also don't go nuts.....this pick reminds me a #21 we lost a few years back from the secondary. #21 was just plan athletic and versatile....I don't see that kind of career out of him, but dangit if this dude isn't capable of playing both Safety spots....nickle and dime CB and some say has the hips and speed to become an outside CB....weapon plain and simple.

Hmmm....looks like I nailed it kinda...far too early to tell if he truly turns into the weapon #21 was, which I even said is dreaming...but "weapon plain and simple" I think would fit this early in his career. Hope it keeps ascending that way.
 

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It's fun to look back on the comments on Randall a season after the pick. In hindsight, I think most will agree he was a solid addition, and a pretty decent value at #30. I didn't know too much about him before the draft, and I wondered if he would end up as a "project" moving from college safety to NFL corner. After losing both Tramon Williams and Davon House, I thought Ted might be reaching to fill a need. If he was, I'm glad he did.

Stephone Anthony would have been a good selection too, he went to the Saints with the next selection. However, good cover corners are coveted in today's NFL, so it's hard to argue Ted got this one wrong. I'm sure someone will manage to nonetheless.........:p

I'm a huge fan of both the young corners, and personally think Rollins has the higher upside. Although Randall appears as though he's going to be a fine player also. The secondary is in great shape for the first time in a while. Pretty deep and talented IMO.
 

Ace

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He had a good year, and I'm happy with his rookie season and the pick, but as always, I'll reserve judgement for a few seasons. I'm not even that old and I've seen too many guys have good first years and then regress or fail to improve further.

Looking at you Casey Hayward.
 

tynimiller

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Looking at you Casey Hayward.

Casey is not a bad player, but definitely grabbed hold of other teams trying to pick on the new guy and excelled at making them pay. He will never be a #1 on any team, but he is still an above average CB that can be a #1 slot corner for A LOT of teams.
 

Ace

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Casey is not a bad player, but definitely grabbed hold of other teams trying to pick on the new guy and excelled at making them pay. He will never be a #1 on any team, but he is still an above average CB that can be a #1 slot corner for A LOT of teams.

Correct, I should have elaborated as I agree he isn't a bad player, just regressed quite a bit from his rookie year. Now, injuries derailed that a bit but he hasn't been able to return to form.
 
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It's fun to look back on the comments on Randall a season after the pick. In hindsight, I think most will agree he was a solid addition, and a pretty decent value at #30. I didn't know too much about him before the draft, and I wondered if he would end up as a "project" moving from college safety to NFL corner. After losing both Tramon Williams and Davon House, I thought Ted might be reaching to fill a need. If he was, I'm glad he did.

Stephone Anthony would have been a good selection too, he went to the Saints with the next selection. However, good cover corners are coveted in today's NFL, so it's hard to argue Ted got this one wrong. I'm sure someone will manage to nonetheless.........:p

I was surprised by the pick but Randall had a nice rookie season on which he can hopefully improve even further. I was even more impressed with Rollins during last season though. The Packers seem to be set in the secondary for quite some time.

Anthony, on the other hand, had a mostly disappointing rookie season with the Saints.
 

Pokerbrat2000

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Randall might have been the only guy in the NFL to intercept both Super Bowl starting QB's? I love the state of our secondary. Now its time to put some effort into improving the state of the Linebackers.
 

Ace

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Hayward is an above average slot corner but a team will overpay to line him up on the outside.

Just posted an article in another thread from PFF that pretty much sums this up, and they view him as our #1 priority. I don't know if I agree but they feel the market will be softer for him than expected.
 

Pokerbrat2000

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If bringing Hayward back somehow prevents the Packers from spending money on a FA TE or ILB I am not in favor of it, since our secondary is plenty deep without him. I just don't see any scenario that has Hayward in Green and Gold in 2016, unless no other team has any substantial interest in him.
 
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HardRightEdge

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It's fun to look back on the comments on Randall a season after the pick. In hindsight, I think most will agree he was a solid addition, and a pretty decent value at #30. I didn't know too much about him before the draft, and I wondered if he would end up as a "project" moving from college safety to NFL corner. After losing both Tramon Williams and Davon House, I thought Ted might be reaching to fill a need. If he was, I'm glad he did.

Stephone Anthony would have been a good selection too, he went to the Saints with the next selection. However, good cover corners are coveted in today's NFL, so it's hard to argue Ted got this one wrong. I'm sure someone will manage to nonetheless.........:p
At the time the picks were made there was no way to know that Rollins would be out for a good portion of the year. On that basis, Kendricks would have been the better pick.

Going forward, from what I've seen of Rollins, he may be the better perimeter corner, in which case Kendricks still would have been the better pick in my mind.

That's not to say Randall wasn't a decent pick; I was pleasantly surprised to see he quickly developed past the ankle biting tackler he was in college even if he's not exactly a "good tackler"...adequate I'd say. That's also not to say free safety isn't his natural position.

As it stands, the DB group goes 6 across with quality even without Hayward, which is a good thing. But is it the best thing given past alternatives?
 

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If bringing Hayward back somehow prevents the Packers from spending money on a FA TE or ILB I am not in favor of it, since our secondary is plenty deep without him. I just don't see any scenario that has Hayward in Green and Gold in 2016, unless no other team has any substantial interest in him.

I agree. We'll be fine with or without Hayward. Our DB situation is top shelf.
 
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Just posted an article in another thread from PFF that pretty much sums this up, and they view him as our #1 priority. I don't know if I agree but they feel the market will be softer for him than expected.

I read the article as well and completely disagree that the Packers top priority is to re-sign Hayward. I would like them to either bring back Neal or Perry but other than that I don't consider any of the team's free agent a must to keep.
 
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At the time the picks were made there was no way to know that Rollins would be out for a good portion of the year. On that basis, Kendricks would have been the better pick.

Going forward, from what I've seen of Rollins, he may be the better perimeter corner, in which case Kendricks still would have been the better pick in my mind.

While you know that I was advocating for the Packers to select Kendricks there was no way for Thompson to know that Rollins would still be around in the second round at the time he selected Randall.
 

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