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Pokerbrat2000

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Not sure if it is his fear or the team's trepidation that he will get hurt and that the wear will impact his DB performance, which is an area we are sub par already.

I think its a bit of both. From a players perspective, they make more money as a starter on offense or defense, an injury on special teams could jeopardize their ability to make future money playing their position.

From a teams perspective, special teams are low hanging fruit to many coaches and they don't want to risk a starter getting injured playing on ST's.

All that said, how many players get injured returning kicks and punts? Seems like very few, but I could be wrong.

For me, special teams should be a bigger focus. Final scores often come down to a point or 2. Picking-up/Giving-Up a big play on special teams could ultimately be the difference in the outcome of a game.
 
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Remember that well. Beebe was a very underrated cog on that machine with all the injuries we incurred at receiver. Back on subject, it appears that Moore is only a return specialist. I don't see him making much of a mark at WR.
Don Beebe was a physical freak of nature. I’m about positive (going off memory) that he benched 20 reps of 225lb and only weighed like 185lb. He’s the guy who’s block sprung Desmond Howard’s Super Bowl TD
Kickoff return.
There was a claim he ran a 4.21 40 time but it was several years before digital tracking.
 
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All that said, how many players get injured returning kicks and punts? Seems like very few, but I could be wrong.
Tell that to Kylin Hill... Your points are solid though.

I'm pretty sure that the ST coaches don't look at it as the low hanging fruit. They are trying their best to motivate guys that aren't excited to be backups.
 

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Don Beebe was a physical freak of nature. I’m about positive (going off memory) that he benched 20 reps of 225lb and only weighed like 185lb. He’s the guy who’s block sprung Desmond Howard’s Super Bowl TD
Kickoff return.
Beebe also returned a kickoff for a TD that year, 1996, at Soldier Field.
 

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I think its a bit of both. From a players perspective, they make more money as a starter on offense or defense, an injury on special teams could jeopardize their ability to make future money playing their position.

From a teams perspective, special teams are low hanging fruit to many coaches and they don't want to risk a starter getting injured playing on ST's.

All that said, how many players get injured returning kicks and punts? Seems like very few, but I could be wrong.

For me, special teams should be a bigger focus. Final scores often come down to a point or 2. Picking-up/Giving-Up a big play on special teams could ultimately be the difference in the outcome of a game.
A few names that come to mind with return injuries are Jacoby Jones, Mims, and Antonio Gibson. Bears had someone named Johnny ? who wrecked his spine years ago.
 

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Good point EG. Gluten doesn't strike me as the type to play that game. Diggs was cut after one game, I'm certain, because he's just not that good anymore.

The Packers certainly need help at CB, so cutting any CB is a big deal. The hurdle to make the team as a CB isn't very high.
No, I think the price tag is the deciding factor for both players being released...

Maybe their medical situations are dictating. That's up to the doctors and techs to decide. Bit if they're healthy enough to play. Then the concern is reliability ...

So what makes a champion? I believe a lot of it is pure will power and determination. Ego completely sold on their abilities.... Both Alexander and diggs have climbed to the top and got paid. Then the game chewed them up and spit them out.....

So maybe a they aren't a hall of famer. Bit they were at the top of their games not long ago. Age isn't a factor. What it comes down to is they got injured and regressed to the point that the cowboys and Packers couldn't justify their $20+m/ur cap hits...... Not talent, but reliability. And that may injured that ego, leading to Alexander basically retiring, and diggs sitting on free agency, being prioritized lower than a unknown draft pick, by 32 teams currently..... That's gotta hurt.

So what gives? I'm guessing, unless they want to buy a farm and be cow herders, or play basketball games against cops for fund raisers. They will have to "prove" their value.

$6-8mil each on one year prove it deals, for a Superbowl bound GBP team. Throw in come incentives. That could resurrect their careers in one move. Besides get them a ring and a new forever home somewhere.

Maybe both are cooked and that $16-20 mil is wasted. But when you're talking about all-pro talents and especially all pro egos. They don't die easy. It's always a bad bet going against a former all -pro. More times than not, they show you the former all-pro. The problems lie in wear and tear. They can't make it through a 22 week season anymore........so? Use them sparingly until week 15 or so, and work them in full time for the playoff run.
 

Pokerbrat2000

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I'm pretty sure that the ST coaches don't look at it as the low hanging fruit. They are trying their best to motivate guys that aren't excited to be backups.

I hope we just hired a ST coach that does this, it has been a long time in GB since I felt the Special Teams were....Special.
 

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Not sure if it is his fear or the team's trepidation that he will get hurt and that the wear will impact his DB performance, which is an area we are sub par already.
I agree that it's not a good idea to put the #1 WR on kick returns.

It's stomach churning though to think Nixon is the best CB on the team. He probably is, so Gluten covered that base and took Skyy Moore as a return specialist.

But if Nixon ranks as the #1 WR when the season opens....... Well that's not good, and will require the team to win with offense. That's fine, but an elite D is needed to get far in the playoffs.

I have a feeling Gluten will trade for a veteran CB. That guy will have to be better than Nixon or the trade is pointless.
 

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But if Nixon ranks as the #1 WR when the season opens....... Well that's not good, and will require the team to win with offense. That's fine, but an elite D is needed to get far in the playoffs.

I have a feeling Gluten will trade for a veteran CB. That guy will have to be better than Nixon or the trade is pointless.
Since the main free agency period is done, who out there is better than Nixon? The list is probably smaller than the leaflet on famous Jewish sports legends on TWA Flight 307.

Gutekunst could strike gold in the draft, but that is highly unlikely. The only other way to get somebody better than Nixon at this point is in some kind of trade similar to the Micah Parsons deal just prior to the season. I don't think that we have the capital or stomach for that again. Therefore, Gutekunst will likely pick up a veteran with questionable gas left in the tank and then swing for an extra base hit in the draft.


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I agree that it's not a good idea to put the #1 WR on kick returns.

It's stomach churning though to think Nixon is the best CB on the team. He probably is, so Gluten covered that base and took Skyy Moore as a return specialist.

But if Nixon ranks as the #1 WR when the season opens....... Well that's not good, and will require the team to win with offense. That's fine, but an elite D is needed to get far in the playoffs.

I have a feeling Gluten will trade for a veteran CB. That guy will have to be better than Nixon or the trade is pointless.
I’m assuming you meant #1 CB. I keep going back to the fact BOTH CB’s are pretty average and both CB’s are in contract years. I put Nixon ahead of Valentine because he’s more disruptive and better in the Run game.

Even an average.. call it CB2? is going to get paid handsomely. The most frequent pathway is keep 1 on a moderate Veteran deal $4mil-$8mil annual area. That = drafting at least 1 CB imo. Unless the Packers sign a veteran CB to a multi year deal? Theres a Top 3 need at CB in this draft. Someone they think can start Year 2.

I’m fine with trading for a veteran. If we sent a Day 3 draft pick for a good CB who’s got maybe 1 or 2 years left on his Rookie contract? Thats 1 or 2 years we don’t have to wait for contribution. I’d really like to see someone knock Valentine to our #3. He’s terrible in the Run game and pretty average in pass protect. Wonderful for RD7 though I’m not completely down on him. Valentine is what I’d label a good #3 Boundary option, one that can fill that CB2 in a pinch, until you reinvest or remodel the CB room.
 
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milani

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I’m assuming you meant #1 CB. I keep going back to the fact BOTH CB’s are pretty average and both CB’s are in contract years. I put Nixon ahead of Valentine because he’s more disruptive and better in the Run game.

Even an average.. call it CB2? is going to get paid handsomely. The most frequent pathway is keep 1 on a moderate Veteran deal $4mil-$8mil annual area. That = drafting at least 1 CB imo. Unless the Packers sign a veteran CB to a multi year deal? Theres a Top 3 need at CB in this draft. Someone they think can start Year 2.

I’m fine with trading for a veteran. If we sent a Day 3 draft pick for a good CB who’s got maybe 1 or 2 years left on his Rookie contract? Thats 1 or 2 years we don’t have to wait for contribution. I’d really like to see someone knock Valentine to our #3. He’s terrible in the Run game and pretty average in pass protect. Wonderful for RD7 though I’m not completely down on him. Valentine is what I’d label a good #3 Boundary option, one that can fill that CB2 in a pinch, until you reinvest or remodel the CB room.
With the size of the rosters today a team should not have use a DB. Lombardi used Adderley in his first 5 seasons for kick returns and Willie Wood for punt returns. Both are in the HOF. But the rosters were smaller.
 

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I’m assuming you meant #1 CB. I keep going back to the fact BOTH CB’s are pretty average and both CB’s are in contract years. I put Nixon ahead of Valentine because he’s more disruptive and better in the Run game.

Even an average.. call it CB2? is going to get paid handsomely. The most frequent pathway is keep 1 on a moderate Veteran deal $4mil-$8mil annual area. That = drafting at least 1 CB imo. Unless the Packers sign a veteran CB to a multi year deal? Theres a Top 3 need at CB in this draft. Someone they think can start Year 2.

I’m fine with trading for a veteran. If we sent a Day 3 draft pick for a good CB who’s got maybe 1 or 2 years left on his Rookie contract? Thats 1 or 2 years we don’t have to wait for contribution. I’d really like to see someone knock Valentine to our #3. He’s terrible in the Run game and pretty average in pass protect. Wonderful for RD7 though I’m not completely down on him. Valentine is what I’d label a good #3 Boundary option, one that can fill that CB2 in a pinch, until you reinvest or remodel the CB room.
Diggs is a free agent..... I think he would be an excellent candidate. Jaire Alexanders rights could probably be traded for cheap. Considering they were scorned by him already. And if he decides to "come back". I doubt they'd want him anyways..... He showed some interest in coming back to GB.... I'm guessing if we traded for his rights before he came back. He would come out of retirement for us...
 

Pokerbrat2000

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Diggs is a free agent..... I think he would be an excellent candidate. Jaire Alexanders rights could probably be traded for cheap. Considering they were scorned by him already. And if he decides to "come back". I doubt they'd want him anyways..... He showed some interest in coming back to GB.... I'm guessing if we traded for his rights before he came back. He would come out of retirement for us...

I think the ship has sailed on both Diggs and Jaire as far as Green Bay goes. Both were 2 guys that made a boat load of money and then couldn't seem to play the game anymore. I'd rather have young and hungry guys that want to show up and work hard at every practice and put it all out on the field come Sunday.
 

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I think the ship has sailed on both Diggs and Jaire as far as Green Bay goes. Both were 2 guys that made a boat load of money and then couldn't seem to play the game anymore. I'd rather have young and hungry guys that want to show up and work hard at every practice and put it all out on the field come Sunday.

Diggs in a sub-$4M deal with zone defense being his fortay I'm not opposed to, BUT only if the draft doesn't provide Gute with THE right corner or the right duo of corners.
 
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Diggs is a free agent..... I think he would be an excellent candidate. Jaire Alexanders rights could probably be traded for cheap. Considering they were scorned by him already. And if he decides to "come back". I doubt they'd want him anyways..... He showed some interest in coming back to GB.... I'm guessing if we traded for his rights before he came back. He would come out of retirement for us...
Im convinced that Brian has at least 1 FA offer ready for each position group, but won’t use it if the draft falls the right way. Meaning he’ll wait to see what he’s able to address in the Draft first. I’ll be straightforward though, I doubt it’s Alexander or Diggs.
I think we draft a pair for next year.

1. GM’s love that position
2. New DB’s Coach support
3. It’s a reasonable good Class all the way through RD7
4. CB Position group carries 6 plus PS.

Harder I look? I really only see Depth as a fundamental concern. Not suggesting we don’t WANT an upgrade a Starter that’s the goal. Yet let’s look around and be real? His many starters get beat out? OL, QB, RB, TE, WR, Safety, LB? I doubt that. About the only position I can see being a first year starter or #1’s pick is at DT or CB. Even CB won’t be easy for a Rookie to beat out Valentine and St Juste, who I believe will fight for boundary CB2

This Draft is about finding a good NT and good depth.
 
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I think the ship has sailed on both Diggs and Jaire as far as Green Bay goes. Both were 2 guys that made a boat load of money and then couldn't seem to play the game anymore. I'd rather have young and hungry guys that want to show up and work hard at every practice and put it all out on the field come Sunday.
See that's where I disagree. I'm looking for a recipe here. And both diggs and zaire fit the recipe....

I'm looking at the grind of 4 years of HS football. Probably other sports. 3 years of college. And a number of years on the big boy, break your body league.... At some point the brain takes over and goes into self conservation mode.... I'm not going to hold that against either of them.

But don't forget that entire career where these guys were the best of the best... That is a mistake to lump these two guys in with random young guys trying to prove themselves..... They're built different.

Diggs and Zaire both have bounced around the league and been let go by each. Guaranteed that's the first time in their lives they haven't been picked to play kickball.

Zaire says "I didn't want to play anyways", lol. And diggs at home sweating , holding hope he still has value in this league.... But BOTH have been dropping tweets and tiktoks etc, hinting to a GB comeback ... Zaire said he wouldn't mind coming back to GB, where he has had success in the past. His ego admittedly injured in philly and Baltimore... And after GB didn't call, a week later he is on the beach talking about how he has really evolved by taking time away from football, and healing his body and mind alike...... Diggs is working out with parsons wearing GBP workout gear....

But what I'm talking about, is a 50% off sale for 2026, on two all pro caliber CBs .. rested. Humbled. Hungry to regain some status, eager to come to GB. Diggs running with his bff... Zaire coming home..... That's a recipe to have a shut down secondary imo.... For one year at least.

Randy Moss played for $1mil the year he went to the pats, and broke the TD in a season record. Along with getting a ring and coming back to being #1:in the league..... There's a avenue of getting that one bargain year with these guys who have already made their money. It's not all bad. It's really not about money anymore. It's the ego. The natural drive to be the best that these men inherently have. They want to run with the lions and be the one to make that kill for the pride. They are lions. Let them be lions.... Offer $8mil each, and see if either bites. I think they both would for one year. They want this as bad as we need it.
 

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Diggs in a sub-$4M deal with zone defense being his fortay I'm not opposed to, BUT only if the draft doesn't provide Gute with THE right corner or the right duo of corners.
You think he will come back to GB to have his ego kick? $4 mil and a dime position for depth?

Don't bother.

These guys are former all pros. Diggs is 27. They're not coming back to be the dog you kick when you need a scapegoat for a loss.

I think $8mil each is insulting to their former selves. But both being down and out, are probably likely to come to a championship caliber team, who could use a shut down #1 CB..... There's real opportunity here if they do in fact return to their old selves. They will be motivated IMO. But not for the $8mil. They'll be motivated because that's who they are. That's how they became the best and became NFL all pros....

The sales pitch is. This is what we can afford. This is your opportunities. All politics aside. I think they take it. And I think they come back ready to play.

The risk/reward is in our favor.

Worst case, as you say. We have a rotational player at market rate for one year.
 
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See that's where I disagree. I'm looking for a recipe here. And both diggs and zaire fit the recipe....

I'm looking at the grind of 4 years of HS football. Probably other sports. 3 years of college. And a number of years on the big boy, break your body league.... At some point the brain takes over and goes into self conservation mode.... I'm not going to hold that against either of them.

But don't forget that entire career where these guys were the best of the best... That is a mistake to lump these two guys in with random young guys trying to prove themselves..... They're built different.

Diggs and Zaire both have bounced around the league and been let go by each. Guaranteed that's the first time in their lives they haven't been picked to play kickball.

Zaire says "I didn't want to play anyways", lol. And diggs at home sweating , holding hope he still has value in this league.... But BOTH have been dropping tweets and tiktoks etc, hinting to a GB comeback ... Zaire said he wouldn't mind coming back to GB, where he has had success in the past. His ego admittedly injured in philly and Baltimore... And after GB didn't call, a week later he is on the beach talking about how he has really evolved by taking time away from football, and healing his body and mind alike...... Diggs is working out with parsons wearing GBP workout gear....

But what I'm talking about, is a 50% off sale for 2026, on two all pro caliber CBs .. rested. Humbled. Hungry to regain some status, eager to come to GB. Diggs running with his bff... Zaire coming home..... That's a recipe to have a shut down secondary imo.... For one year at least.

Randy Moss played for $1mil the year he went to the pats, and broke the TD in a season record. Along with getting a ring and coming back to being #1:in the league..... There's an avenue of getting that one bargain year with these guys who have already made their money. It's not all bad. It's really not about money anymore. It's the ego. The natural drive to be the best that these men inherently have. They want to run with the lions and be the one to make that kill for the pride. They are lions. Let them be lions.... Offer $8mil each, and see if either bites. I think they both would for one year. They want this as bad as we need it.
Listen I appreciate the loyalty to J’aire that’s commendable as he was a great player fur a couple of years and some good examples also.
I’d be very worried about J’aire. First of all he hasn’t strung a complete season in 4 years. We’re not dinging a guy for missing a game or two. I’m talking his longest string is 7 contests in 4 NFL seasons and he has a significant injury(s)

Now Diggs has a similar situation but not as long lasting or far reaching as Alexander’s concerns. Yet to me Trevon is more a last resort and only on a low risk prove it 1yr.
 
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Listen I appreciate the loyalty to J’aire that’s commendable as he was a great player fur a couple of years. I’d be very worried about J’aire. First of all he hasn’t strung a complete season in 4 years. We’re not dinging a guy for missing a game or two. I’m talking his longest string is 7 contests in 4 BFL seasons and he has a significant injury(s)

Now Diggs has a similar situation but not as long lasting or far reaching as Alexander’s concerns. Yet to me Trevon is
That was a problem when he was making $24 mil a year. Doesn't seem like such a detriment when he is making $8 mil.

I don't have loyalty to Jiare. He fits the blueprint of former all pros with something left in the tank. Humbled. On a come back. Last push for a championship.... Jiare is all of those things.

Also I looked at the free agency list of starting caliber CBs and it's weak. Diggs and his injury concerns being one. And Jiare not even listed, currently retired under contract with philly.

We need some help at CB. A rookie isn't going to help much of chit in 2026.
 
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That was a problem when he was making $24 mil a year. Doesn't seem like such a detriment when he is making $8 mil.

I don't have loyalty to Jiare. He fits the blueprint of former all pros with something left in the tank. Humbled. On a come back. Last push for a championship.... Jiare is all of those things.

Also I looked at the free agency list of starting caliber CBs and it's weak. Diggs and his injury concerns being one. And Jiare not even listed, currently retired under contract with philly.

We need some help at CB. A rookie isn't going to help much of chit in 2026.
There you go. Go work a trade with a team that has depth. Similar to our Wicks trade but reverse it.

I still think Brian will draft a pair of CB’s and this is reasonably good class. I’m about 60% sure there will even be guys we have on our board in that Top 150-175 area all the way well into RD6-7. Call them a pair of Top 25 College players at CB

My guess is we”ll go at CB something like this.
RD4
RD5

Or
RD3
RD7
 
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