2023 week 5 MNF in Vegas

[rmontro]

It's gonna be a great draft for QBs. Just sayin......... I'd much rather Love and his young team close out the season on a high note, even if that means 6 or 7 wins. Just wanna see real progress from a bunch of young guys.

I don't follow college football, but I'll take your word on it. That would certainly be interesting if Gute got a chance to draft another quarterback, could have a controversy brewing. But I tend to doubt that they would want to mess with Love's confidence at this point, if they really have faith in him.

 

[Heyjoe4]

I don’t only comment after losses though. Frustrated after the last loss & just pointing out that I don’t think Love is the man. I think I raise some good points & add value to discussions. If that’s not the case, feel free to ban me.

I don't know where the ban talk is coming from Krabs. You're about as level-headed as anyone here (understanding that this is faint praise, at best ).

You did make a point about Love's first pick against the Raiders. That happened early in the game, so Love wasn't desperate to make something happen. In one replay from behind Love, there were four black/silver uniforms in the area of the throw and one GB receiver. I don't know how he could not have seen that, or seen that the LB was sitting and waiting. The only amazing thing is that the Raider LB didn't drop the pick out of shock that it had been thrown.

Yeah it's one play, one game. To me it's a big red flag. Of course, give the guy this season to get better. But the team direction now is backwards. It's concerning for sure, and I agree with you.

 

[Firethorn1001]

They put all their eggs in the Jordan Love basket.

Yes. All the eggs in 2023 were in the Love basket. It's 5 games post-Rodgers. What were you suggesting they do to not put all their eggs in the Jordan Love basket? Draft a QB high so in case Love fizzles out 5 games into the season they start him? Can only imagine the teeth gnashing on social media if that happened.

Bring a veteran QB in? With cap issues, any veteran QB coming in was just filing a backup role and wasn't going to be the future.

They did exactly what Wolf did. Drafted a QB in the later rounds.

 

[Heyjoe4]

I don't follow college football, but I'll take your word on it. That would certainly be interesting if Gute got a chance to draft another quarterback, could have a controversy brewing. But I tend to doubt that they would want to mess with Love's confidence at this point, if they really have faith in him.

Well the college football intelligentsia say 2024 will have a bumper class of QBs. The same guys who said Zach Wilson and Bryce Young were "can't miss". The same guys who had no ideas about Brock Purdy.

I think Love has a full two seasons to prove himself. Gluten won't waste an early pick on a QB. And if he doesn't fix the OL, it won't matter much who is behind center. And Love isn't the only player on O who has to improve.

 

[thequick12]

I don't know how he could not have seen that, or seen that the LB was sitting and waiting. The only amazing thing is that the Raider LB didn't drop the pick out of shock that it had been thrown.

Yeah it's one play, one game. To me it's a big red flag. Of course, give the guy this season to get better. But the team direction now is backwards. It's concerning for sure, and I agree with you.

So that was the same play he threw his first pick against the Lions on. Yes Love should have seen the Lb, especially the 2nd time. However, I do think its more a sign that opposing defenses dont respect the Packers running game at all right now. If they did those are easy completions. Hopefully once Jones gets back, the running gane will be respected more, the play action game will work better

Just watched that last int against the Raiders on the all 22. First of all Love nerds to throw that sooner and lofted to the back of the end zone. But second, Watson should of caught that ball anyways. Im not sure what he was doing drifting away when the ball was clearly short. He needed to plant his feet and attack that ball. Instead of just hoping it fell into his hands

 

[Heyjoe4]

So that was the same play he threw his first pick against the Lions on. Yes Love should have seen the Lb, especially the 2nd time. However, I do think its more a sign that opposing defenses dont respect the Packers running game at all right now. If they did those are easy completions. Hopefully once Jones gets back, the running gane will be respected more, the play action game will work better

Just watched that last int against the Raiders on the all 22. First of all Love nerds to throw that sooner and lofted to the back of the end zone. But second, Watson should of caught that ball anyways. Im not sure what he was doing drifting away when the ball was clearly short. He needed to plant his feet and attack that ball. Instead of just hoping it fell into his hands

Excellent point on the R8DRS not respecting the run, or the Lions. There's nothing to respect. Doesn't excuse Love from throwing the ball, but it can't be pinned on Love by himself.

And that end zone INT was frustrating on every level. It was a lousy, very short throw by Love. You're right, he lofts that to the back corner and that should be an easy jump ball for Watson. It's also true that Watson should have, at a minimum, played D and tried to break up the INT. He clearly didn't read the pass and kept fading back. Result - a 5'9" corner gets an easy pic in front of a 6'4' WR and the game is over.

So it's hard to get a correct read on Love. He's been getting rushed relentlessly due to no run game. He did play lousy against the R8DRS, but it's probably a miracle he hasn't been injured.

 

[milani]

Excellent point on the R8DRS not respecting the run, or the Lions. There's nothing to respect. Doesn't excuse Love from throwing the ball, but it can't be pinned on Love by himself.

And that end zone INT was frustrating on every level. It was a lousy, very short throw by Love. You're right, he lofts that to the back corner and that should be an easy jump ball for Watson. It's also true that Watson should have, at a minimum, played D and tried to break up the INT. He clearly didn't read the pass and kept fading back. Result - a 5'9" corner gets an easy pic in front of a 6'4' WR and the game is over.

So it's hard to get a correct read on Love. He's been getting rushed relentlessly due to no run game. He did play lousy against the R8DRS, but it's probably a miracle he hasn't been injured.

Good points. The two drops precipitated the INT. However, I would not have gone long anyway. So 2 in row that should have been 1st downs. Just tee it up again and go for 10 yards and a first down. There was still time to get to the end zone. MLF must learn to know what he has and does not have. With this team you never bite off more than you can chew.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Good points. The two drops precipitated the INT. However, I would not have gone long anyway. So 2 in row that should have been 1st downs. Just tee it up again and go for 10 yards and a first down. There was still time to get to the end zone. MLF must learn to know what he has and does not have. With this team you never bite off more than you can chew.

Yeah and calling the wrong plays that close to the end zone with time running out is becoming a signature MLF move. I think they were playing the Bucs in the NFCCG and had first and goal at the four late in the game, down by 7. MLF called three straight passes, all incomplete, and then kicked a FG rather than go for it. If I recall there was time to run the ball. But if it was the Bucs, that was a very good D. Even so.......

 

[Krabs]

Could beat the Bears again, we'll be at home. A lot depends on if Aaron Jones is going to be healthy or if that hamstring is going to be a nagging problem all season. Without him, there's considerably more reason for pessimism. Or maybe optimism, if you're looking for better draft picks.

Yes, they could beat the bears a second time.

 

[Outsider99]

Don Majkowski had a great starting year, so the comparisons don't mean much. I think they were 10-6 in '89.

The coaching and play calling are not good. I don't need a SuperBowl every season, but I would like to enjoy the game and watch a competitive team. Favre had some tough seasons, but the games were exciting and the losses weren't embarrassing. Same with Rodgers, even when the team was crap, you always felt like you had a chance to win.
Hopefully Jones starts this weekend.

 

[longtimefan]

The problem is Goody and Lafleur. Lack of preparation for the future. They put all their eggs in the Jordan Love basket.

Ron Wolf had a back up plan if Favre got injured or wasn't the guy. How many starting QBs did Wolf draft? I remember as a little boy that my friend said Mark Brunnel was better than Favre.

Ty Detmer (1992 ninth round), Mark Brunell (’93 fifth round), Matt Hasselbeck (’98 sixth round) and Aaron Brooks (’99 fourth round), all of whom became starters for other teams.

Brett almost benched for Burnell

Think Andy Reid stopped Holmgren from doing it

Maybe Steve "Mooch" did?

 

[longtimefan]

I don't know where the ban talk is coming from Krabs. You're about as level-headed as anyone here (understanding that this is faint praise, at best ).

You did make a point about Love's first pick against the Raiders. That happened early in the game, so Love wasn't desperate to make something happen. In one replay from behind Love, there were four black/silver uniforms in the area of the throw and one GB receiver. I don't know how he could not have seen that, or seen that the LB was sitting and waiting. The only amazing thing is that the Raider LB didn't drop the pick out of shock that it had been thrown.

Yeah it's one play, one game. To me it's a big red flag. Of course, give the guy this season to get better. But the team direction now is backwards. It's concerning for sure, and I agree with you.

Was a joke about banning

Lord people wound tight

 

[milani]

Don Majkowski had a great starting year, so the comparisons don't mean much. I think they were 10-6 in '89.

The coaching and play calling are not good. I don't need a SuperBowl every season, but I would like to enjoy the game and watch a competitive team. Favre had some tough seasons, but the games were exciting and the losses weren't embarrassing. Same with Rodgers, even when the team was crap, you always felt like you had a chance to win.
Hopefully Jones starts this weekend.

That 1989 team won a lot of late last minute squeekers. That is why they were the Cardiac Pack. They had a somewhat soft schedule. But they did beat the Bears on the replay and they went into SF and actually beat Montana and the 9ers. They needed help to get in on the last weekend and did not get it.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Was a joke about banning

Lord people wound tight

Agreed. I don't know where all the comments started about banning krabs. Pretty silly.

 

[Krabs]

Agreed. I don't know where all the comments started about banning krabs. Pretty silly.

All good by me. Sometimes it's hard to sense sarcasm or jokes via messages. Obviously, you can't see the nonverbal cues while reading. I've moved on awhile ago. I just don't think some liked me voicing my displeasure with Love and his horrible interception vs the Raiders. More specifically, I don't think it was appreciated saying we should move on after 5 games . I do stand by the fact that if one of the top QBs coming out of college are available we need to take him.

 

[rmontro]

I just don't think some liked me voicing my displeasure with Love and his horrible interception vs the Raiders

I don't necessarily agree or disagree with you about Love (I'm trying to stay neutral), but don't you think that INT could be a key learning experience for him?

Honestly, I'm not expecting Love to be anywhere near as good as Favre or Rodgers. I'm just hoping that once we get the cap cleared up, we can put together a solid team with a more inexpensive quarterback, with Love acting as a game manager (in the best sense of the word). And not have to depend so much solely on the quarterback.

 

[Krabs]

I don't necessarily agree or disagree with you about Love (I'm trying to stay neutral), but don't you think that INT could be a key learning experience for him?

Honestly, I'm not expecting Love to be anywhere near as good as Favre or Rodgers. I'm just hoping that once we get the cap cleared up, we can put together a solid team with a more inexpensive quarterback, with Love acting as a game manager (in the best sense of the word). And not have to depend so much solely on the quarterback.

Yes, but that first interception was brutally bad. One that he should have already learned from in the past. Into triple coverage and right to the linebacker. Anyway, I don't want to relive it.

I agree on the cap. It's a season they basically have to punt on due to previous contracts. Next year will be better and 2025 even better. This is as long as they don't doll out more horrible contracts.

 

[rmontro]

Yes, but that first interception was brutally bad. One that he should have already learned from in the past. Into triple coverage and right to the linebacker. Anyway, I don't want to relive it.

Okay, I thought you were talking about the third interception, the one into the endzone.

 

[Heyjoe4]

All good by me. Sometimes it's hard to sense sarcasm or jokes via messages. Obviously, you can't see the nonverbal cues while reading. I've moved on awhile ago. I just don't think some liked me voicing my displeasure with Love and his horrible interception vs the Raiders. More specifically, I don't think it was appreciated saying we should move on after 5 games . I do stand by the fact that if one of the top QBs coming out of college are available we need to take him.

You're right about that first INT. In the view from the end zone, you couldn't see the receiver for all the silver/black jerseys around him. The end zone pass to Watson was almost as bad, but Watson could have done more.

I'm not ready to say Love is or is not the guy. Certainly if the team ends the season with 4 or 5 wins, and Love hasn't shown progress, they'd have to look hard at taking a QB in round 1. The 2024 draft looks to be rich in QB talent. Well, don't tell that to Carolina and Bryce Young.......

I'm fine seeing where this season goes. Expectations were pretty low to begin with. Love doesn't have to be Favre or Rodgers 2.0 - he does have to consistently show improvement.

 

[OldSchool101]

I do believe as the season progresses the Offense will improve some. Of course it’s hard not to improve from such a low level of production.

These guys need playing time. Until they get most of a season they’ll struggle with ups or downs. I do think having Jenkins back regular at LG and Aaron Jones helps some. Losing key veteran players is crucial to a young team.
Our Defense has been ok ish. If we can get a few scores earlier on Offense it would give them a moral boost. Also our Offense has not been very helpful on Field position.

 

[Krabs]

You're right about that first INT. In the view from the end zone, you couldn't see the receiver for all the silver/black jerseys around him. The end zone pass to Watson was almost as bad, but Watson could have done more.

I'm not ready to say Love is or is not the guy.

I've seen enough. I don't need to give this guy another year to find out he's not the guy.

Certainly if the team ends the season with 4 or 5 wins, and Love hasn't shown progress, they'd have to look hard at taking a QB in round 1. The 2024 draft looks to be rich in QB talent. Well, don't tell that to Carolina and Bryce Young.......

It's looking good that the Packers will be picking in the top 5. They had better consider one of the big QBs coming out of college.

I'm fine seeing where this season goes. Expectations were pretty low to begin with. Love doesn't have to be Favre or Rodgers 2.0 - he does have to consistently show improvement.

All we can do is wait it out. Somehow, even with extremely low expectations, they are still falling short.

 

[Heyjoe4]

I've seen enough. I don't need to give this guy another year to find out he's not the guy.

It's looking good that the Packers will be picking in the top 5. They had better consider one of the big QBs coming out of college.

All we can do is wait it out. Somehow, even with extremely low expectations, they are still falling short.

I think all of your comments were made before that disaster in Denver yesterday Krabs. After that debacle, I'm getting closer and closer to jumping on the train with you and saying Love is not the guy, in GB or with any other NFL team.

We've all heard the excuses "but this is a young team", and it is. But then, and if the talent is there, I'd expect improvement by now. It's going the other direction. And Love is hardly new to the NFL. He's been here four years. We were constantly reassured by Gluten and MLF that Love was real to take over. Yeah, take over a clown car.

In fairness, MLF's play calling has been awful. He dialed up that ill-advised bomb to Toure in double coverage to end the game in Denver. Even at that, Love had plenty of time to decide that was a low % play, and hit an untouched Dillon in the left flat with nothing but green in front of him.

We can know for sure it's really bad when no one is blaming Joe Barry.

Maybe all those second year and rookie receivers will grow to be something special. I don't think it will happen with Love throwing the ball.

And this has been the easy part of the schedule. So a top 5 pick may be something to hope for. Sad to say.

 

[Krabs]

I think all of your comments were made before that disaster in Denver yesterday Krabs. After that debacle, I'm getting closer and closer to jumping on the train with you and saying Love is not the guy, in GB or with any other NFL team.

We've all heard the excuses "but this is a young team", and it is. But then, and if the talent is there, I'd expect improvement by now. It's going the other direction. And Love is hardly new to the NFL. He's been here four years. We were constantly reassured by Gluten and MLF that Love was real to take over. Yeah, take over a clown car.

In fairness, MLF's play calling has been awful. He dialed up that ill-advised bomb to Toure in double coverage to end the game in Denver. Even at that, Love had plenty of time to decide that was a low % play, and hit an untouched Dillon in the left flat with nothing but green in front of him.

We can know for sure it's really bad when no one is blaming Joe Barry.

Maybe all those second year and rookie receivers will grow to be something special. I don't think it will happen with Love throwing the ball.

And this has been the easy part of the schedule. So a top 5 pick may be something to hope for. Sad to say.

Yeah, I don't see a win in the next 7 games. His first TD against Denver could have easily ended as an interception if not for Doubs fighting for it. The 2nd TD pass was luck. Doubs probably should have came down with it, but the placement was off and Reed was in the right place at the right time. The game ending interception was merely a punt tossed into double coverage. I too noticed Dillon was open in the flat and would have gotten them into FG range. That's lack of experience from a guy who got the opportunity to sit for three years learning game situations.

 

[milani]

Yeah, I don't see a win in the next 7 games. His first TD against Denver could have easily ended as an interception if not for Doubs fighting for it. The 2nd TD pass was luck. Doubs probably should have came down with it, but the placement was off and Reed was in the right place at the right time. The game ending interception was merely a punt tossed into double coverage. I too noticed Dillon was open in the flat and would have gotten them into FG range. That's lack of experience from a guy who got the opportunity to sit for three years learning game situations.

And even if it was just outside the cusp of FG range you live for one more down with a chance to move the chains.

 

[Heyjoe4]

And even if it was just outside the cusp of FG range you live for one more down with a chance to move the chains.

Correct. The right call on 3rd and 20 is to get 10 or more yards back. That puts them in FG range or at least closer on 4th down.

Well we all know this. And the long throws are the weakest part of Love's game, and that's saying a lot. So why does MLF dial that up in that situation?

I don't know. Opponents are just harder from here. The team started out with a bang in Chicago. And I guess a lot of us forgot it was Chicago.