Zone blocking

[ChrisC]

I realise I know very little about this, but just what exactly is the vaunted zone blocking scheme giving us right now?

Is it that we fall behind too quickly to "stay" with the run?

Is it just that the current OL can't block whatever the scheme?

Or what ...?

All we seem to have got thus far is a huge turnover ( :!: ) at RB and some bad press for cut blocking. If it's a scheme (Dr) Samkon Gado couldn't grasp, and a scheme the OL can't block, then maybe it's just a mistake?

Help me out here, fellow Packer backers!

Chris

 

[porky88]

I think it's the inexperience of the interior lineman and I think Clifton is an awful fit and it has showed at times.

Most around the NFL say that the zone blocking is something that takes a while to get down and once you get it down it's very effective.

Now I'm not sure the truth to that or what but in time I think it can work and to be fair it didn't look to bad last night. Morency looked pretty good outside of the fumble. The fact that we were playing from behind the entire 2nd half really stopped any chance of GB sticking to the run.

I actually think the worse thing Green Bay can do now is give up on it. That would be a horrible move in my opinion. This team drafted 3 offensive lineman just for this scheme. They let go of Davenport in place of Herron just for this scheme. They traded Gado for Morency just for the scheme. If Green Bay gives up on the scheme it'll be one of the worse mistakes they make all year long. Keep in mind that even with a man to man blocking scheme I highly doubt this team does much better than it has. Stick with it and it should improve. It’s already shown improvement week to week. I see no reason why they should give up after week 4 on some thing you’ve pretty much based your entire offense around.

 

[Greg C.]

Well said, Porky. This is not the time to bail out on the zone blocking scheme.

 

[pack_in_black]

Good post, Porky. I agree, I think that the O-line looks much improved over the mess that we saw in preseason. 0 sacks in 2 games. I'd say that's not bad, considering everyone expected this sack-happy Philly pass rush to eat Brett alive. No matter what the excuse, they've given up O SACKS! Now, I'm not breaking down game film, and just watched the game as it happened, so I'm no expert, but it seems like Morency was finding holes, making moves, and generating 1st downs. Everything didn't click last night, but it's coming.

I'm staying patient.

 

[all about da packers]

I think it's the inexperience of the interior lineman and I think Clifton is an awful fit and it has showed at times.

I've noted teh same thing, but I can't figure out whether it is the scheme that is giving him problems or his injuries have caught up with him.

That is why I think our G's should be Moll and Spitz, with Colledge being the LT. It looks like Cliffy is getting close to being done. Real shame, he was amazing and still has a considerable amount of years left on his contract I believe.

 

[warhawk]

Absolutely good post. Everyone here was concerned with the offensive line at the start of the season. While the running game still needs work I thought it looked pretty decent last night.

We got stuffed a few plays but many times Mo popped thru there for decent gains. I remember a few 2nd and 3's that's always a nice position to be in.

Both lines did well last night. Some on another thread said the whole defense was bad last night. I didn't think that. At worst our two lines fought to a draw overall. Stat wise we beat them hands down. Four sacks and allowed none.

Unfortunately, the key stat was a very average Wr with 2 receptions for 75 yards and 2 TD's. These plays not only killed us we looked bad doing it. A battle turned into a blood bath in about five minutes there.

After that the run became an afterthought. We cannot get down by two td's with this offense. It's design allows it to be efficient in close games.

Any DB's listening back there?

 

[ChrisC]

Thanks for those, guys - interesting and informative.

I agree that Morency had a good game - tho he fumbled and fluffed a catch that was intercepted. Also agree that the D Line is doing well.

I think many of the 2nd and short plays were as a result of slant passes, rather than a consistent running game, but as it's the first Packer game I've seen in the UK this year, I can't say how much overall improvement there may have been in the O Line.

I worry about a running scheme which asks a lot of rookies who were Tackles in College and so are playing out of position, and a scheme which, from some of your comments, doesn't fit a veteran LT who was previously a mainstay of the line. But I take the point that, having appointed MM and crew and installed the zone scheme, it would be difficult and unwise at this stage to throw it all overboard. Maybe some adjustments ...?

Warhawk makes the excellent point that we cannot get too far behind running MM's version of West Coast. However since we are unable at present to keep games close, I think we need

1) some competent DBs and
2) a Plan B for when 6 yd slants are no longer enough!

Thanks again for the responses

Chris

 

[ChrisC]

Forgot to mention that the running game didn't cover itself in glory at the end of the Eagles game, when we couldn't run it in with 4 goes from very close :-? Doesn't inspire much confidence.

Chris

 

[Buckeyepackfan]

An observation I have made, maybe someone else has.
When I watch The Falcons or Broncos their O-lines seem to be engaging the defense on The defenses side of the line of scrimmage where if you watch The Packs O-line, they mostly engage on their side of the line of scrimmage.
I don't know if that causes a problem, or exactly how and when a blocker is supposed to engage, but it seems to me that running the ball would be easier if you are hitting your man on their side of the line of scrimmage.

 

[wpr]

It looks like Cliffy is getting close to being done. Real shame, he was amazing and still has a considerable amount of years left on his contract I believe.

It looks like Chad is signed thru 2009 and has almost $5 mil of his pro rated signing bonus left.
Per The Cap Guy

 

[majikman]

What, now we get rid of Clifton and Tauscher because of the "scheme"?

Funny, these guys were never a problem until this new "scheme" came into town.

 

[Blackjackking]

By the time the Packers get it down McCarthy and his staff will be long gone.

 

[wpr]

What, now we get rid of Clifton and Tauscher because of the "scheme"?

Funny, these guys were never a problem until this new "scheme" came into town.

I didn't say let's get rid of Clifton, nor Tauscher for that matter I jsut answered "Da" Man's question.

 

[porky88]

What, now we get rid of Clifton and Tauscher because of the "scheme"?

Funny, these guys were never a problem until this new "scheme" came into town.

Nobody is saying get rid of them. Tauscher I think can fit in the system perfactly. Clifton apparently cannot. He probably needs to drop some weight and get quicker for the scheme to work. That'll be something they work on in the off season but as of now Chad Clifton isn't playing well.

With that said Monday he didn't look bad. Seemed like he was his old self again. This thing takes a while to get so maybe he's slowly starting to catch on. Let's give him a chance to prove he can do it in this scheme like the last one before we try and cut or trade him.

 

[majikman]

What, now we get rid of Clifton and Tauscher because of the "scheme"?

Funny, these guys were never a problem until this new "scheme" came into town.

Nobody is saying get rid of them. Tauscher I think can fit in the system perfactly. Clifton apparently cannot. He probably needs to drop some weight and get quicker for the scheme to work. That'll be something they work on in the off season but as of now Chad Clifton isn't playing well.

With that said Monday he didn't look bad. Seemed like he was his old self again. This thing takes a while to get so maybe he's slowly starting to catch on. Let's give him a chance to prove he can do it in this scheme like the last one before we try and cut or trade him.

Didn't he have some injury problem with his knees?

Maybe that's been slowing him down a little.

 

[porky88]

What, now we get rid of Clifton and Tauscher because of the "scheme"?

Funny, these guys were never a problem until this new "scheme" came into town.

Nobody is saying get rid of them. Tauscher I think can fit in the system perfactly. Clifton apparently cannot. He probably needs to drop some weight and get quicker for the scheme to work. That'll be something they work on in the off season but as of now Chad Clifton isn't playing well.

With that said Monday he didn't look bad. Seemed like he was his old self again. This thing takes a while to get so maybe he's slowly starting to catch on. Let's give him a chance to prove he can do it in this scheme like the last one before we try and cut or trade him.

Didn't he have some injury problem with his knees?

Maybe that's been slowing him down a little.

Yeah he did have knee problems. Could be what's wrong.

Some players are a product of the system. You here it more with QB's but RB's and offensive lineman as well. Personally I think he'll be fine. Maybe getting quicker is all he has to do and that can be done if he drops some weight.

 

[ChrisC]

Here's an interesting article from JS Online, which indicates just how much of a "work in progress" the new offense is ...

http://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=510024

S'pose this is what "rebuilding" looks like. :roll:

Chris

 

[HatestheEagles084]

this new scheme is asinine...and WHEN this coaching staff gets torched, we're either gonna have to shop hard for a coach who runs this scheme, or get rid of all of our linemen, which, in my opinion showed improvement pass blcoking on monday, and morency was able to find some holes as well...i just hate how the zone blcok scheme has special requirements, and 'franchise' tackles such as Pace, Walter Jones, Ogden, etc...wouldnt even fit on our team because of excessive bulk, but their teams do just fine with oversized linemen

 

[calicheesehead]

I'm glad I saw this thread. I have been harping on the OL for sometime, and after watching the Eag's game you can see progressing. Besides the pass they were starting to get those gaps opened. If we can get the running end of the scheme down it will surely open up the passing game. Until they can't stop our run with the Tampa 2 types of D's we'll be rolling better.

 

[spardo62]

I think it's the inexperience of the interior lineman and I think Clifton is an awful fit and it has showed at times.

Most around the NFL say that the zone blocking is something that takes a while to get down and once you get it down it's very effective.

Now I'm not sure the truth to that or what but in time I think it can work and to be fair it didn't look to bad last night. Morency looked pretty good outside of the fumble. The fact that we were playing from behind the entire 2nd half really stopped any chance of GB sticking to the run.

I actually think the worse thing Green Bay can do now is give up on it. That would be a horrible move in my opinion. This team drafted 3 offensive lineman just for this scheme. They let go of Davenport in place of Herron just for this scheme. They traded Gado for Morency just for the scheme. If Green Bay gives up on the scheme it'll be one of the worse mistakes they make all year long. Keep in mind that even with a man to man blocking scheme I highly doubt this team does much better than it has. Stick with it and it should improve. It’s already shown improvement week to week. I see no reason why they should give up after week 4 on some thing you’ve pretty much based your entire offense around.

Let us not forget also that Green seems to have lost a step and some of his power coming back from the injury and his advanced age that also has contributed to the lack of success running the ball.