Transfer portal and NIL Money, how they have changed college sports".

[Voyageur]

So let's change the focus, because none of us are really calling all student-athletes dumb. Let's just focus on football for now - since this is a football forum. Yes all athletes are able to get NIL money. Yes there are extremely bright athletes. Yes there are very talented young people that get a hard-earned athletic scholarship and also receive a hard-earned degree in many great fields.

However, football is a different animal. Quite a lot of them come from substandard schools and got substandard grades. Big universities are tough places to learn. I remember taking calculus from a professor who spoke zero English. He just wrote math problems on a board and pointed. The dean said that they couldn't afford English-speaking professors and TAs. We all had to teach ourselves calculus out of the textbooks. It was no great struggle for me, but my brother who struggled in school, would have failed. Toss in daily practices and team meetings and it puts a lot of these kids at a great disadvantage. There are tons of resources available and tutors which is great. However, from what I saw and the people that I knew when I was in college, many of those guys were just trying to get by and "keep their grades up" so that they didn't get kicked off the team. Their focus was football.

As older adults, we can sit back and talk about how precious a scholarship education is from the luxury of our hindsight perspective. Not all 17-21 year olds have that perspective until it's too late. Opportunity and scholarships pass them by and then it's too late.

Spot on. If we think in terms of the reality of who gets to move on from college playing football, we need to remember that there are 7 rounds in each draft, and 32 teams. That's 224 picks. Add in the additional picks for guys who jump from one team to another, and we end up with 256 picks in this year's NFL draft. Add in another..... let's say 120 free agents having a shot at making teams, and you have 376 players trying to latch on to one of few jobs that will be available. There are 1,760 players on NFL rosters. There are 320 of them that make practice squads. The rest, if good enough, might make an XFL team, but that's not easy either.

In the NFL, there is roughly a 25% turnover in personnel each year. That means that there are roughly 440 jobs opening up on rosters, and on practice squads, less than half getting call backs for a second year.

So, essentially, there are about 440 jobs opening up on NFL rosters, and maybe as many as 160 on practice squads. That's, at best a 600 player turn over. Every year, roughly 1.6% of those players ending their eligibility will be drafted, or offered a viable chance to make a roster. Many will fail. Of them, it will be less than a dozen that fall below DI football who will get a shot at the brass ring.

With that low of a chance to make it into the NFL, it's understandable why these players will do everything they can to make some money while still in college, so they can at least have a fighting chance to make it in the real world, after they leave school.

The NCAA is bragging how the "graduation rate" has gone up from the low 70% range over 20 years ago, to a little over 90% today. I buy that's great. But I'm also very aware of the fact that the majors being reported, and the minors, are something made out of a storybook of simplification to insure these kids have a shot at playing through their time of eligibility. It's obvious, when you see how so many struggle after college, that their time there did little, if anything, to give them a viable career. Part of this is due to the player not having the mental ability to do better, but then there's the pressure surrounding the game itself. It takes up a lot of time.

I don't begrudge these kids the money they get. I just wish it was shared more with the players who aren't going to be getting that huge contract from the NLF, which is most of them.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I don't begrudge these kids the money they get. I just wish it was shared more with the players who aren't going to be getting that huge contract from the NLF, which is most of them.

Very important point you make here. I will try to just stick to football, for now.

While I don't have actual stats, because I don't know if they actually exist yet, my guess is that a lions share of the NIL money in football, is going to the eventual pro players. Or at least, the REALLY good ones in college, thought to be on a fast track to the NFL. Why is that important? As you allude to and I have to, the so called "dead end college football player" isn't seeing much, if any of this NIL money. So those who argue that NIL is good, because it helps those that don't get a professional football job after college are not really looking at the big picture.

Also this whole argument of "the school makes a ton of money, so the players should be paid part of that" isn't valid. NIL money does not come directly from the University, it comes from donors. Donors that are willing to give a certain athlete a certain amount, if said athlete enrolls in a select school and allows the donor to use their likeness or them directly, in promoting something. Basically, "If you hold up this can of Wisconsin Beer, we will pay you $1000."

I don't really have any suggestions for "equal distribution of NIL across all the players on a team", since the reason for the 1 contribution is to entice/pay 1 athlete to endorse something. From a tax standpoint, that 1 athlete must pay ordinary income taxes on that amount. The ramifications of "splitting it up" between 89 other players, who did nothing to earn it, is complicated, if even possible. I can imagine the IRS is having fun trying to keep track of that money.

I still hope that the NCAA gets smart and caps NIL money per player and per team.

 

[Voyageur]

Very important point you make here. I will try to just stick to football, for now.

While I don't have actual stats, because I don't know if they actually exist yet, my guess is that a lions share of the NIL money in football, is going to the eventual pro players. Or at least, the REALLY good ones in college, thought to be on a fast track to the NFL. Why is that important? As you allude to and I have to, the so called "dead end college football player" isn't seeing much, if any of this NIL money. So those who argue that NIL is good, because it helps those that don't get a professional football job after college are not really looking at the big picture.

Also this whole argument of "the school makes a ton of money, so the players should be paid part of that" isn't valid. NIL money does not come directly from the University, it comes from donors. Donors that are willing to give a certain athlete a certain amount, if said athlete enrolls in a select school and allows the donor to use their likeness or them directly, in promoting something. Basically, "If you hold up this can of Wisconsin Beer, we will pay you $1000."

I don't really have any suggestions for "equal distribution of NIL across all the players on a team", since the reason for the 1 contribution is to entice/pay 1 athlete to endorse something. From a tax standpoint, that 1 athlete must pay ordinary income taxes on that amount. The ramifications of "splitting it up" between 89 other players, who did nothing to earn it, is complicated, if even possible. I can imagine the IRS is having fun trying to keep track of that money.

I still hope that the NCAA gets smart and caps NIL money per player and per team.

Excellent analysis. It's a real mess. I saw where Caitlin Clark will be making around $76,000 as a base salary in the WNBA. Her NIL money dwarfs that figure. How much of it she'll keep, when going pro, I don't know. It makes me wonder how much of it is more of a local offer to entice her to have played for Iowa, and how much of it was on a national level, and would have been paid, no matter where she played. I can only guess at this point.

I see the money as a two tier thing. The local NIL money, that's surrounding the school's program, and the national NIL money, which is a separate ball game. That's what makes this entire issue with Storr such a mess. Is he talking to the national NIL people about that $1 mill? Then, are the NIL people at Kansas saying they can come up with $750K locally, and another $250K could come from national ads? It's so messed up....... a real cluster.

I wonder how much Storr got this past year with the Badgers. I don't think it was that much. Anyway, not in those mega-bucks ranges.

In the end, we're going to see this whole thing explode in a few years. It will take some time, but as teams drop out of DI ball, because they can't pay the freight, it's going to have a big effect on what's left. Those remaining will be a pariah to the rest of college sports.

 

[DoURant]

Caitlin Clark will make more money on endorsements. She has already been in the new State Farm commercials.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Excellent analysis. It's a real mess. I saw where Caitlin Clark will be making around $76,000 as a base salary in the WNBA. Her NIL money dwarfs that figure. How much of it she'll keep, when going pro, I don't know. It makes me wonder how much of it is more of a local offer to entice her to have played for Iowa, and how much of it was on a national level, and would have been paid, no matter where she played. I can only guess at this point.

I see the money as a two tier thing. The local NIL money, that's surrounding the school's program, and the national NIL money, which is a separate ball game. That's what makes this entire issue with Storr such a mess. Is he talking to the national NIL people about that $1 mill? Then, are the NIL people at Kansas saying they can come up with $750K locally, and another $250K could come from national ads? It's so messed up....... a real cluster.

I wonder how much Storr got this past year with the Badgers. I don't think it was that much. Anyway, not in those mega-bucks ranges.

In the end, we're going to see this whole thing explode in a few years. It will take some time, but as teams drop out of DI ball, because they can't pay the freight, it's going to have a big effect on what's left. Those remaining will be a pariah to the rest of college sports.

$76,000 for a WNBA player? Wow I knew it would be a lot lower than the NBA, but that's really low. And as DoURant points out, she'll make her big money on endorsements. There aren't a lot of people who haven't heard of her or seen her by now. And maybe this latest craze with women's NCAA BB brings more eyes to the WNBA. It will never be at the level of the NBA, but the college women have shown it can be just as fun to watch.

 

[Voyageur]

Caitlin Clark will make more money on endorsements. She has already been in the new State Farm commercials.

I think the national brand ads will continue for quite a while. State Farm, Nike, etc. Those contracts will stay active as long as she is a focal point in sports. If she ends up not doing well in the WNBA, that's another story. That money will slowly diminish. But, at this point, that's nothing more than conjecture.

I'm really anxious to see how her college game translates into the pros. I've heard comments that it's going to go well for her, and others, where they think she's going to take a hard fall, because of the competition being tougher. I just don't know.

I do know one thing though. If she does at least moderately well in the pros, it's going to help their sport. There's several darned good players going pro this year, so that should help the league as well. Many of them are considered top prospects.

Clark, Cameron Brink, Rickea Jackson, Kamilla Cordoso, Jacy Sheldon, Georgia Amore, Aiiliyah Edwards, Leila Lacan, Pouch, Reese, Leger-Walker, Pili, and Lee. All of whom could make an impact on a team. That said, all of them have that adjustment to the pros that has to be made. The game is so much more physical in the WNBA. It could change a lot of what they can do.

Never been a WNBA fan, but I'm gonna start checking it out next year to see how well they play. There's some good ball handlers in this group coming, and I want to see how well they compete.

 

[DoURant]

Caitlin brought Women's basketball to a higher level in viewership than anyone else ever has. I seems like some of the WNBA star players don't like that she is being crowned this "savior" or best thing to happen to Women's basketball. Just by some comments that have been made, not sure if it's their feeling disrespected of what the did for the game, or a jealousy thing. Caitlin will need to prove herself at the next level, but regardless of how she does, her College success was great for the game, and it got me and my wife to watch, which we never did before.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Caitlin brought Women's basketball to a higher level in viewership than anyone else ever has. I seems like some of the WNBA star players don't like that she is being crowned this "savior" or best thing to happen to Women's basketball. Just by some comments that have been made, not sure if it's their feeling disrespected of what the did for the game, or a jealousy thing. Caitlin will need to prove herself at the next level, but regardless of how she does, her College success was great for the game, and it got me and my wife to watch, which we never did before.

Yeah I never watched women's BB, collegiate or pro, but that changed with Caitlin Clark. She brought a lot of attention to the sport. Whether that carries over to the pros, we'll see.

Interesting that there is some animosity among WNBA players due to her celebrity. I guess if she brings in more attention, meaning more ad dollars, salaries will go up. Seems like everyone wins there.

Hopefully she continues her extraordinary college career at the pro level. I'm sure existing rivalries will extend to the pros and some new ones may be discovered. That's all for the good.

 

[Voyageur]

My opinion is that she will have a great pro career. My Son was telling me her Finacee was hired by the Indiana Pacers so, being drafted by the Indiana Fever would be perfect. It would be a great start for them.

 

[El Guapo]

My Son was telling me her Finacee was hired by the Indiana Pacers so, being drafted by the Indiana Fever would be perfect. It would be a great start for them.

Those things happen A LOT in pro sports. When the Vikings drafted Christian Ponder, I was doing consulting work for a large company that was a named sponsor for the Metrodome. The Vikings asked this company to hire Ponder's girlfriend, who then asked me to take her on as an intern. I quickly realized that she had no financial or computer skills, but liked fashion. I quickly pawned her off to some other department that babysat her until the two broke up. Then the girlfriend left Minnesota for NY to be a model or something.

Anyway, my experience is one among many that I have heard of in pro sports. It's a small cost of doing business for the teams. If anything, it helps keep a franchise player in town when contracts expire because the player has a spouse to consider.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Those things happen A LOT in pro sports. When the Vikings drafted Christian Ponder, I was doing consulting work for a large company that was a named sponsor for the Metrodome. The Vikings asked this company to hire Ponder's girlfriend, who then asked me to take her on as an intern. I quickly realized that she had no financial or computer skills, but liked fashion. I quickly pawned her off to some other department that babysat her until the two broke up. Then the girlfriend left Minnesota for NY to be a model or something.

Anyway, my experience is one among many that I have heard of in pro sports. It's a small cost of doing business for the teams. If anything, it helps keep a franchise player in town when contracts expire because the player has a spouse to consider.

Nothing new to businesses, politics, education, etc. When your main target is married/in a relationship/has a family, you want to do everything in your power to make ALL of them happy. This gets them behind the new job and location.

Heck, they even do it in the Armed Forces. Set up bases where the entire family gets housed.

 

[Voyageur]

Nothing new to businesses, politics, education, etc. When your main target is married/in a relationship/has a family, you want to do everything in your power to make ALL of them happy. This gets them behind the new job and location.

Heck, they even do it in the Armed Forces. Set up bases where the entire family gets housed.

I saw it first hand in my own family. My cousin was a phenomenal athlete. He actually made all-state in football 3 years, all-state in baseball 2 years, and all-state in basketball his senior year. By the time he graduated from HS, his bedroom was a shrine to athletics.

His HS girlfriend was offered a scholarship to a university for music, so despite all the schools that were offering him scholarships, he followed her. The funny part is that they broke up before the end of the first semester.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

The funny part is that they broke up before the end of the first semester.

Double whammy, he lost 2 portals!

 

[Voyageur]

Double whammy, he lost 2 portals!

My Cousin died back in 1986. His wife died less than 2 months ago. They were close to my wife and I. She was a great catch for him. They met, during the summer between his junior and senior year, at a party that the college head coach held at his home. She didn't even like football.

When he asked her to dance, and they were on the floor, she asked him; "Who are you?" He told her. She hesitated for a moment then asked; "How do you know the coach and his family?" She obviously was not a football fan. When he told her, she wasn't the slightest bit impressed. They ended up getting married shortly after graduation, and the entire group of guys who were part of the wedding party were members of the football team, many of whom were on their way to the NFL. It was a huge event in the city, and there were reporters everywhere, asking questions, and taking pics.

Since we were part of the family, one reporter latched on to me, and my wife and he asked me who I was. I looked at him dead seriously and said; "His parole officer. I'm here to make sure he doesn't drink anything at the reception." He just looked at me, stunned. "Can I print that he?," he asked. "Hell no!" I said. "Don't you know a joke when you hear one!" Then we walked away. I'm afraid I've never been one who could pass on an opportunity to do something offbeat. Life wouldn't be any fun unless you enjoyed it.

By the way, Susan never remarried. They meant that much to each other. After she passed, their Son said to me; "They're together again. It's how they always wanted it to be." I just agreed with him, and said I understood. My wife and I not too long ago celebrated our 59th anniversary together, and I wouldn't trade it for anything. Sometimes the vow about forever means something special. It did for them, and for us. We miss them both so much.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Those things happen A LOT in pro sports. When the Vikings drafted Christian Ponder, I was doing consulting work for a large company that was a named sponsor for the Metrodome. The Vikings asked this company to hire Ponder's girlfriend, who then asked me to take her on as an intern. I quickly realized that she had no financial or computer skills, but liked fashion. I quickly pawned her off to some other department that babysat her until the two broke up. Then the girlfriend left Minnesota for NY to be a model or something.

Anyway, my experience is one among many that I have heard of in pro sports. It's a small cost of doing business for the teams. If anything, it helps keep a franchise player in town when contracts expire because the player has a spouse to consider.

Christian Ponder??? QB, right? What year was that? Thanks!

 

[El Guapo]

I'll look it up because I don't remember....2011 according to the internet. I do remember that his first pass was a bomb against the Packers in the season opener. I was driving somewhere listening to Wayne Larrivee announce it in disbelief.

 

[Heyjoe4]

I'll look it up because I don't remember....2011 according to the internet. I do remember that his first pass was a bomb against the Packers in the season opener. I was driving somewhere listening to Wayne Larrivee announce it in disbelief.

Thanks. All I remember is that Ponder was unremarkable.

 

[El Guapo]

Like so many Vikings QBs....

 

[Voyageur]

The Vikings haven't had a lot of luck in drafting QBs. I think three QBs that stand out most to me are Tarkenton, Moon, and Kapp. The latter two were fugitives from the Canadian Football League, so not really a pick. Tarkenton was a 3rd rounder, and Tommy Kramer was the 27th pick in the first round. Culpepper was the 11th pick in round 1, Ponder was the 12th (ouch!) in the first round, and Bridgewater at #32, the bottom of the 1st round.

They haven't done well at all with drafting them. Making matters worse for them, I don't think they've had a legitimately good head coach since Bud Grant.

 

[Heyjoe4]

The Vikings haven't had a lot of luck in drafting QBs. I think three QBs that stand out most to me are Tarkenton, Moon, and Kapp. The latter two were fugitives from the Canadian Football League, so not really a pick. Tarkenton was a 3rd rounder, and Tommy Kramer was the 27th pick in the first round. Culpepper was the 11th pick in round 1, Ponder was the 12th (ouch!) in the first round, and Bridgewater at #32, the bottom of the 1st round.

They haven't done well at all with drafting them. Making matters worse for them, I don't think they've had a legitimately good head coach since Bud Grant.

Bud Grant! I miss that guy. "No hand warmers! These guys should be thinking of football, not staying warm. This is Minnesota ******* it!"

As for the QBs, I did not know Culpepper was an 11th overall pick. He did have some great years, but even when they had Moss, the Vikings just never got past the choke stage. (I think they've been to 4 SBs, all losses of course). (Side note - Moss went to the Pats who went undefeated right up to the SB against the Giants. They lost that game, a victim of the Vikings' curse - and I think the helmet catch.)

Another guy who put up big numbers for them was Randall Cunningham. I thought they were 15-1 or some outrageous number of wins one season. Not sure if that was the year the kicker choked on a chip shot in the NFCCG (I think that was late 90s, maybe 2000......). I think Cunningham predated that game.

I can handle the Bears occasional SB win (1 and counting), even the Lions (0 and counting). But the Queens? Banish the thought. GB has 4 SBs and who knows how many championships before the SB era. We're lucky fans.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

The Vikings haven't had a lot of luck in drafting QBs. I think three QBs that stand out most to me are Tarkenton, Moon, and Kapp.

Fortunately, Da Bears have done even worse at finding a quality QB through the draft, which has made the NFC North a prime spot for the Packers in the last 30 years. I was just thinking this morning, had Love's future not looked so bright, which of the 4-6 QB's would the Packers be looking at in this years draft? Of all the positions, QB seems to be THE biggest crapshoot in the draft. Having a quality one on your team allows you to use that first round pick on a different position and hopefully a player that has a better shot at being an impact starter quickly.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Fortunately, Da Bears have done even worse at finding a quality QB through the draft, which has made the NFC North a prime spot for the Packers in the last 30 years. I was just thinking this morning, had Love's future not looked so bright, which of the 4-6 QB's would the Packers be looking at in this years draft? Of all the positions, QB seems to be THE biggest crapshoot in the draft. Having a quality one on your team allows you to use that first round pick on a different position and hopefully a player that has a better shot at being an impact starter quickly.

Yeah considering where these guys get picked, it's pretty frustrating that so many of them do so poorly. Trubisky and Lance we're both #3 picks I think. And then there are guys like Hurst, second round, and Mr. Irrelevant, Purdy.

If Fields had played better the Bears could have traded that pick for a TON of draft capital. Glad we've got Love (never thought I'd say that.....) and can afford to fill other needs.

 

[El Guapo]

The Vikings haven't had a lot of luck in drafting QBs.

Culpepper and Bridgewater were good picks IMO. Both suffered horrific knee injuries that effectively ended their careers. When Culpepper suffered that horrific knee injury, I was building an icehouse at a buddy's house while listening to the game. I remember the announcer saying that he "shredded" his knee. He tore three of the four ligaments and never was the same.

Bridgewater was just starting to figure it out. The one aspect of his game that was lacking, was the middle-deep passes. I watched him intensely in the pre-season and noticed that he was airing the ball out accurately. Coming off of his first playoff game and Pro Bowl birth, the kid was about to hit his stride....and then his leg near fell off just prior to the start of the season.

The Vikings make a lot of their own problems, but they've been snake bit more than a few times.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Yeah considering where these guys get picked, it's pretty frustrating that so many of them do so poorly.

Isn't frustrating as a Packer fan.

 

[DoURant]

Isn't frustrating as a Packer fan.

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