Still waiting. . . .

[Heatherthepackgirl]

Replacement for Green yet to be found
By TOM SILVERSTEIN
[email protected]
Posted: March 10, 2007

The wheel is done spinning and the bets all have been paid, yet there are the Green Bay Packers, still on the sideline waiting for their number to be called.


Mike McCarthy insists that something will come of the four young backs currently on the roster.

What should the Packers do at running back?




Roughly one quarter of the National Football League will go into next season with someone else's primary runner in its backfield, the result of a frenzied first seven days of free agency in which one team's trash quickly turned into another team's treasure.

Yet despite losing six-time 1,000-yard rusher Ahman Green to the Houston Texans, the Packers were removed from the fray, standing pat with a backfield of Vernand Morency, Noah Herron, P.J. Pope and Arliss Beach. While Houston, Denver, Baltimore, the New York Jets and Oakland Raiders, among others, have paid a pretty price for blemished runners, the Packers have barely lifted a finger to replace Green.

"I'm definitely OK with it," said Packers coach Mike McCarthy, whose boss, general manager Ted Thompson, dictates what direction the team takes in free agency. "One thing is, I'm involved in all the conversations. I have an understanding why things are happening.

"The free-agent market is always going to be expensive. You have to be able to draw lines in this business and trust your vision, stay true to your vision."

For the most part, no one outside of the Packers is quite sure what Thompson's vision is.

It very well could be that he's obsessed with having $20 million or more of salary-cap space every year just in case. It could be he'll prove to be smarter than the others and wind up with a younger, more talented option than was available on the market.

Or it could be he just blew it by failing to meet Green's price.

McCarthy is the one who will have to pay the price if the latter is true, but he certainly didn't sound like someone concerned about next season. As much as he wanted Green back, he swears he's OK with the decision to let him go.

"The focus is not making emotional decisions," McCarthy said. "Those are easy traps to fall into. You overreact and you end up building up value on an individual or a value on a position based on emotion, not on facts. Once again, a player moved on in free agency; that's part of the business."

McCarthy insists that something will come of the four young backs currently on the roster, although he admitted Morency has to prove he can play 16 games and Herron has to be more than just a third-down back.

As for Pope, who was signed off Chicago's practice squad, and Beach, an undrafted free agent who spent last season on injured reserve, he said: "They've both been here. Beach had a terrific training camp, particularly after the second week. Pope is a guy we really liked on film and did a good job with the opponent's stuff. They're just young guys who need a chance."

Perhaps, but if the Packers go into the season with those four backs they'll be the laughingstock of the NFL. According to McCarthy, it's unlikely that will happen, because Thompson and his staff still have their eyes on some backs they think will become available as the off-season goes on.

"We have a board, and our personnel department ranks all the free agents," McCarthy said. "And also you have another board where you're looking at people that you may think may come free for whatever reasons, and as those individual cases pop, we talk about them."

It's possible Thompson has his eye on San Diego restricted free agent Michael Turner, but that would require making a trade, and anyone who knows Thompson knows he doesn't deal draft picks. Some who could find the unemployment line later are Miami's Ricky Williams, Baltimore's Mike Anderson, Oakland's Lamont Jordan and Carolina's DeShaun Foster.

The Packers didn't make a strong play for any of the backs who switched teams and have a mild interest in unsigned former Tennessee back Chris Brown. Other than that, their current free-agent options are limited.

"If there was (someone), we'd be talking about it," McCarthy said. "I just have to trust the pro personnel department. I think they do an outstanding job. Ted and I talk through these lists and talk through the possibilities. We had a meeting the day before when we went through almost every guy. You have to stay the course."

McCarthy truly believes in the players he has on his roster and wants to see how they develop with a full off-season conditioning program. He also knows that the running back position could be addressed in the draft, possibly with the first-round pick.

He's not overly concerned about the loss of tight end David Martin, who was his best player at the position until the injury bug hit him again. McCarthy really liked Martin, but when the Dolphins offered him $1.2 million to sign he understood why Thompson balked.

"He has an injury history," McCarthy said.

The four tight ends he has on the roster - Bubba Franks, Donald Lee, Tory Humphrey and Zac Alcorn - are good enough to go into the season with, he said. He thinks Lee and Humphrey can stretch the field like Martin did, and that Alcorn can be a threat in the passing game.

"Zac is a small-college guy who has exceptional hands catching the football," McCarthy said. "The guy has the best hands on our team."

Still, one can't see the Packers matching the Indianapolis Colts touchdown for touchdown with Morency at halfback, Alcorn at tight end and no additional help at wide receiver. This team needs some firepower fast.

"Right now I can see why I'm answering this line of questioning," McCarthy said. "But people just need an opportunity. I think some of those guys may already be here."

 

[CaliforniaCheez]

I'm glad to see Tom doing a rational story on a subject that has been treated irrationally. Tom lays out a few things that should be considered.

McCarthy and Thompson understand the process and will handle free agency like other aspects of fielding a football team. Some should take a breath and carefully read it again.

Some calm is needed. I like Tom Silverstein's work. He is the best at the Milwaukee Journal Sentinal.

Thanks for bringing up for discussion, Heather.

 

[GakkofNorway]

There are a lot of things about the NFL free-agency period that perplex me, but none more than teams' desire to acquire somebody else's running back, all those carries on the body and all.

Some are even foolish enough to trade draft picks and give out plenty of money, too.

The latest is Baltimore, forced to do so because its own castoff, Jamal Lewis, was signed by the Cleveland Browns. The Ravens traded three draft picks Thursday to acquire Willis McGahee from the Buffalo Bills. They gave up a third and a seventh in this year's draft, plus a third in 2008.

What did they get? They got a running back who has a major ACL injury on his resume, one with a 3.9-yards-per-rush average. The Ravens see it differently.

"We’re getting a dynamic back who has the potential to diversify our running game," coach Brian Billick said in statement. "We've studied him, and he brings the same passion and preparation that is common to Miami players, like our Ray Lewis and Ed Reed. Getting a player as good as Willis is another example of how (general manager) Ozzie (Newsome) and his department size up the market and use our resources well."

In addition to giving up the picks, the Ravens also are in talks to sign McGahee to a long-term deal; he has one year remaining on his contract and is represented by bulldog agent Drew Rosenhaus.

I just don't get the move.

Look at the leading rushers from 2006. The top eight were all drafted or signed by the teams they were with last season. That's players like San Diego's LaDainian Tomlinson, Kansas City's Larry Johnson, San Francisco's Frank Gore and St. Louis' Steven Jackson.

Drafting running backs is the way to go -- the only way.

Yet here we are in the second week of free-agency and teams are gobbling up others' castoffs.

The Jets traded to get Thomas Jones from the Bears, the Broncos signed Travis Henry to a big deal as a free agent, Lewis gets a one-year deal from Cleveland and Ahman Green gets a big deal from the Houston Texans.

Of those five players, all but McGahee rushed for 1,000 yards in 2006, but they all have the wear-and-tear of playing in the league for a few years.

My running back philosophy has always been this: Draft one, beat him up and then move on to the next young guy you draft.

Do not pay top money for somebody else's carries. If you want to keep your own veteran, which the Ravens considered with Lewis and the Jacksonville Jaguars did with Fred Taylor, that's fine.

Picking up somebody else's beaten-up body is not the way to go.

When the Arizona Cardinals signed away Edgerrin James from the Indianapolis Colts last year, it started a frenzy in Indy. General manager Bill Polian was ripped. The Colts, many said, couldn't win without James.

At the time, I laughed at that talk and wrote that way in a column.

My thinking was the Colts would find a younger, faster player in the draft, and James would not be missed.

Well, they drafted Joseph Addai, and the Colts won the Super Bowl. Was he missed?

The Cardinals are stuck with James, who had a 3.4 per-rush average last season.

They have a back who is entering his ninth season and has 3,056 carries. The body eventually starts to wear down. Want to bet it shows even on a workout warrior like James?

McGahee is younger than James, so it makes a little more sense for the Ravens to make the move, but not for the price -- not with the chance to get a young player in the draft.

The Jets made the same type of move with Jones. They traded their second-round pick, the 37th overall, to the Bears for Jones and Chicago's second-round pick, 63rd overall. Then they gave Jones, who is entering his eighth season, a new contract that pays him $20 million for four seasons, $12 million guaranteed.

"I just can't figure out why teams keep paying these older running backs," said one NFC coach. "That's how you get in trouble. The player plays two years and then you have to eat the pro-rated part of his contract."

The 2006 season was the year of the rookie runner. In addition to Addai, you had Reggie Bush in New Orleans, Laurence Maroney in New England, Maurice-Jones Drew in Jacksonville and Leon Washington with the Jets. Carolina's DeAngelo Williams, another first-round pick in 2006, had four good games in his last six and looks ready to take over as the feature back.

You can find backs.

"It's the one position where you do the same thing, aside from protection schemes, that you have done since you were a kid," said one AFC personnel director. "That's why it's so easy to come in and play."

And why it's foolish to pay big money or give up draft picks for somebody else's reject, a guy with carries already eroding the running skills.

It's yet another reason why it's hard for me to understand some of what these teams do in free-agency.

 

[packedhouse01]

I can understand completely that everyone is wondering what the Packers are going to do at running back. I will say this again, it's part of the problem with the previous regime that the cupboard was left so bare. Ted has been trying to rebuild the base through the draft by getting quality people in the draft. They may not be starters, but he's building some depth. We have to give him time to do that. We are 20 mil under the cap, but you want to spend that money wisely. I just couldn't see giving Ahman that kind of money and that length of a contract, that's stuff that the Sherman regime would do and it's what got us in trouble.

I believe the Packers are looking for a specific type of runner, and I think they believe that they have something building in that line and that you can put a good running back in the back field and they will be fine. I don't know that I agree with that, but I think that's what Thompson feels. He will wait until he has what he wants at his price and I think he believes he will find it. I'm not at the point where I put complete blind faith in him, but he's proven to be a pretty good judge of talent and I admire his patience.

 

[Buckeyepackfan]

Yea!!! IT'S STILL ALL MS'S FAULT!!!!!!

I can live with that.

PJ Pope will be the surprise of training camp 2007!!!!!!!

That is why there has been no movement in th RB situtation.
We are good to go!!!

Build depth on the O-line and D-backs in the draft, The Packers will be back on top of The NFC North next year with their young guys being led by a the solid base ov veterans they have.

 

[Arles]

I'm not too worried about running back. My biggest concerns are at TE and safety. Right now, the roster is woeful at those two spots and I'd hate to use our first two picks on need guys with limited upside (a TE like Olsen and a safety in round 2) instead of getting the best players on the board.

FB, TE, and safety are usually manageable deals in FA. Look at the money Griffiths, Reggie Kelly and Grant got and you will see three fair deals for guys that would have freed up our draft to get impact players in the first two rounds. Now, we'll be looking for "reaches" like Bubba Franks, Jamal Reynolds and Ahmad Carroll because of the glaring needs we have.

 

[porky88]

Deshaun Foster would be a great option. When healthy I think he's a very good back. The article mentioned him as someone who could be released soon enough.

RB should be taken in the Draft. Probably with one of our first 2 picks. I think that's what the Packers have their eye on.

Still RB is not the only need on this team right now.

 

[pyledriver80]

I'm not too worried about running back. My biggest concerns are at TE and safety. Right now, the roster is woeful at those two spots and I'd hate to use our first two picks on need guys with limited upside (a TE like Olsen and a safety in round 2) instead of getting the best players on the board.

FB, TE, and safety are usually manageable deals in FA. Look at the money Griffiths, Reggie Kelly and Grant got and you will see three fair deals for guys that would have freed up our draft to get impact players in the first two rounds. Now, we'll be looking for "reaches" like Bubba Franks, Jamal Reynolds and Ahmad Carroll because of the glaring needs we have.

This is my biggest problem with Ted's approach. If he would have filled the other area's of need like TE,FB or Safety through FA, we would have had the benefit of trading picks to get that impact RB or whatever. Now we basically have to get the draft dead on to have much of a chance of competing. The odds are slim. We can't afford to have another Cory Rodgers

 

[Buckeyepackfan]

Maybe this has already been posted, but if not it comes from KFFL.


Packers | Team likely to add another running back
Sun, 11 Mar 2007 05:37:27 -0800

John Murphy, of Yahoo! Sports, reports the Green Bay Packers will likely wait until after the NFL Draft to help bolster the running back position behind RB Vernand Morency and RB Noah Herron. "We're going to bring in some competition for them," said general manager Ted Thompson.

Looks like TT is hoping one of the guys on the roster now will step up and win the starting job. But he says they will have competitiob, whether it be a FA or from the draft I guess we will just have to wait and see.

 

[kmac]

This is my biggest problem with Ted's approach. If he would have filled the other area's of need like TE,FB or Safety through FA, we would have had the benefit of trading picks to get that impact RB or whatever. Now we basically have to get the draft dead on to have much of a chance of competing. The odds are slim. We can't afford to have another Cory Rodgers

Of course we can. In fact, it's inevitable. Almost every team has a Cory Rodgers every year. Find a team for me who's 3rd, 4th, and 5th round picks all made some impact last season. There aren't too many of them, if any. Every team has a Cory Rodgers every year.

 

[porky88]

Maybe this has already been posted, but if not it comes from KFFL.


Packers | Team likely to add another running back
Sun, 11 Mar 2007 05:37:27 -0800

John Murphy, of Yahoo! Sports, reports the Green Bay Packers will likely wait until after the NFL Draft to help bolster the running back position behind RB Vernand Morency and RB Noah Herron. "We're going to bring in some competition for them," said general manager Ted Thompson.

Looks like TT is hoping one of the guys on the roster now will step up and win the starting job. But he says they will have competitiob, whether it be a FA or from the draft I guess we will just have to wait and see.

I think whether it's Noah Herron or would of been Ahman Green back there, Green Bay's success running the ball is going to start with the development of Spitz and Colledge.

 

[Buckeyepackfan]

Maybe this has already been posted, but if not it comes from KFFL.


Packers | Team likely to add another running back
Sun, 11 Mar 2007 05:37:27 -0800

John Murphy, of Yahoo! Sports, reports the Green Bay Packers will likely wait until after the NFL Draft to help bolster the running back position behind RB Vernand Morency and RB Noah Herron. "We're going to bring in some competition for them," said general manager Ted Thompson.

Looks like TT is hoping one of the guys on the roster now will step up and win the starting job. But he says they will have competitiob, whether it be a FA or from the draft I guess we will just have to wait and see.

I think whether it's Noah Herron or would of been Ahman Green back there, Green Bay's success running the ball is going to start with the development of Spitz and Colledge.

You speak the truth!!!!!

It all begins with the O-line on offense and for that matter the D-line on defense.

Don't forget about PJ Pope, IMHO he will become the steal of 2006, when he surprises everyone and wins a roster spot for 2007, maybe even the starting job.

Pope is a solid runner who is was known for his pass catching ability and even more important his blocking ability when he played for BGSU.

I work with BGSU's sports director, he interviewd PJ last December while at the Oneida BB classic, PJ said he is excited about this coming year and that he is comfortable with the expectations The Packers have of him.

 

[pyledriver80]

This is my biggest problem with Ted's approach. If he would have filled the other area's of need like TE,FB or Safety through FA, we would have had the benefit of trading picks to get that impact RB or whatever. Now we basically have to get the draft dead on to have much of a chance of competing. The odds are slim. We can't afford to have another Cory Rodgers

Of course we can. In fact, it's inevitable. Almost every team has a Cory Rodgers every year. Find a team for me who's 3rd, 4th, and 5th round picks all made some impact last season. There aren't too many of them, if any. Every team has a Cory Rodgers every year.

You are right but the problem lies in the fact that these other teams can AFFORD to have a Cory Rodgers because they are active in FA and don't have 6-7 spots that need serious help in. They lock up players or sign FA'S.

You can replace anyone but you better do it with someone who is an upgrade over what you had before or you will never improve. It's classic Cleveland Brown syndrome. You want to let guys go and not pay them then you better have someone waiting in the balance to replace them.

Look at J-Walk. Sure we replaced him with Jennings but is Jennings of J-walk's calibur? Sure he was a rookie and he might develop but what if once he does he wants more like Walker did? Do you let him walk and go after more potential? It's that classic rebuilding, wait til next year, you are replacable, syndrome that drives teams into 30 year droughts.

 

[Heatherthepackgirl]

I'm glad to see Tom doing a rational story on a subject that has been treated irrationally. Tom lays out a few things that should be considered.

McCarthy and Thompson understand the process and will handle free agency like other aspects of fielding a football team. Some should take a breath and carefully read it again.

Some calm is needed. I like Tom Silverstein's work. He is the best at the Milwaukee Journal Sentinal.

Thanks for bringing up for discussion, Heather.

Your very welcome!!!

 

[GakkofNorway]

This is my biggest problem with Ted's approach. If he would have filled the other area's of need like TE,FB or Safety through FA, we would have had the benefit of trading picks to get that impact RB or whatever. Now we basically have to get the draft dead on to have much of a chance of competing. The odds are slim. We can't afford to have another Cory Rodgers

Of course we can. In fact, it's inevitable. Almost every team has a Cory Rodgers every year. Find a team for me who's 3rd, 4th, and 5th round picks all made some impact last season. There aren't too many of them, if any. Every team has a Cory Rodgers every year.

You are right but the problem lies in the fact that these other teams can AFFORD to have a Cory Rodgers because they are active in FA and don't have 6-7 spots that need serious help in. They lock up players or sign FA'S.

You can replace anyone but you better do it with someone who is an upgrade over what you had before or you will never improve. It's classic Cleveland Brown syndrome. You want to let guys go and not pay them then you better have someone waiting in the balance to replace them.

Look at J-Walk. Sure we replaced him with Jennings but is Jennings of J-walk's calibur? Sure he was a rookie and he might develop but what if once he does he wants more like Walker did? Do you let him walk and go after more potential? It's that classic rebuilding, wait til next year, you are replacable, syndrome that drives teams into 30 year droughts.

all teams aren't active in the FA as well.

 

[net]

I can understand completely that everyone is wondering what the Packers are going to do at running back. I will say this again, it's part of the problem with the previous regime that the cupboard was left so bare. Ted has been trying to rebuild the base through the draft by getting quality people in the draft. They may not be starters, but he's building some depth. We have to give him time to do that. We are 20 mil under the cap, but you want to spend that money wisely. I just couldn't see giving Ahman that kind of money and that length of a contract, that's stuff that the Sherman regime would do and it's what got us in trouble.

I believe the Packers are looking for a specific type of runner, and I think they believe that they have something building in that line and that you can put a good running back in the back field and they will be fine. I don't know that I agree with that, but I think that's what Thompson feels. He will wait until he has what he wants at his price and I think he believes he will find it. I'm not at the point where I put complete blind faith in him, but he's proven to be a pretty good judge of talent and I admire his patience.

I've refrained from re-dredging the Mike Sherman stuff, but the above post cannot go unchallenged.

What was regurgitated above is simply the once-chewed mindfood of our pal, ol' Ted...at least what he will say in public, which is next to nothing.

As I recall, Mike Sherman, the man who left the cupboard bare, was the one who had a guy by the name of Ahman Green here, the same Ahman Green who Ted Tightwad allegedly tried, and failed, to resign.
Mike Sherman also had left the cupboard bare with two guards who were...ah, Pro Bowlers, and highly sought free agents. Oh,ya, and his center, who is now playing elsewhere. And, let me add Mike also had the left tackle and the right tackle that ol' Ted now enjoys.

Mike Sherman also had a guy named Aaron Kampman, and a guy named Cullen Jenkins who ol' Ted just thought enough of to give him a whopper of a contract. And just today, ol' Ted is discussing a contract extension with a guy named Barnett, drafted by, ah....Mike Sherman. Mike also brought in a guy named Grady Jackson who was playing for someone else last year. He also brought in a good portion of the DT's who were rotated around last year. KGB? Misused, but still one of the best pass rushers around, a Sherman re-sign.

Al Harris: who brought him to town? Oh, ya, and I guess he just got a new contract. Mike McKenzie and Javon Walker were brought here by....oh, ya.
And Mike Sherman also got the best years out of Bubba Franks and David Martin just signed a free agent contract with someone because he was so terrible when Mike Sherman brought him in.

Donald Driver...who resigned him?

I could go on, but I think you get the point.

The cupboard was not bare here. What happened was one GM wanted to pay veterans and didn't do a very good job drafting. But the current GM will only repay veterans if he has to, and his drafting, to date, is so-so.

4-12 had more to do with key injuries than lack of talent.
8-8 had more to do with beating only one team with a winning record( the Bears who already locked up the title) and having more people healthy.

Ted better pull a rabbit out of his hat regarding running back(Turner?) or if I was Brett Favre I would officially retire.

 

[cheesey]

This is my biggest problem with Ted's approach. If he would have filled the other area's of need like TE,FB or Safety through FA, we would have had the benefit of trading picks to get that impact RB or whatever. Now we basically have to get the draft dead on to have much of a chance of competing. The odds are slim. We can't afford to have another Cory Rodgers

Of course we can. In fact, it's inevitable. Almost every team has a Cory Rodgers every year. Find a team for me who's 3rd, 4th, and 5th round picks all made some impact last season. There aren't too many of them, if any. Every team has a Cory Rodgers every year.

The good thing i saw in this was........TT didn't hang onto him just to try to save face. When it was clear that Rodgers stunk, he got rid of him. Some GM's will keep a guy they drafted, cause they don't want to admit it was a wasted pick.

 

[porky88]

As I recall, Mike Sherman, the man who left the cupboard bare, was the one who had a guy by the name of Ahman Green here, the same Ahman Green who Ted Tightwad allegedly tried, and failed, to resign.

Ron Wolf made the trade to get Ahman Green. I believe the deal involved Fred Vinson too. It was one of his last great moves as the GM.

Mike Sherman also had left the cupboard bare with two guards who were...ah, Pro Bowlers, and highly sought free agents. Oh,ya, and his center, who is now playing elsewhere. And, let me add Mike also had the left tackle and the right tackle that ol' Ted now enjoys.

All those guys were drafted by Ron Wolf.

Mike Sherman also had a guy named Aaron Kampman, and a guy named Cullen Jenkins who ol' Ted just thought enough of to give him a whopper of a contract. And just today, ol' Ted is discussing a contract extension with a guy named Barnett, drafted by, ah....Mike Sherman. Mike also brought in a guy named Grady Jackson who was playing for someone else last year. He also brought in a good portion of the DT's who were rotated around last year. KGB? Misused, but still one of the best pass rushers around, a Sherman re-sign.

KGB is far from the best pass rusher in this league but let's leave that alone. He did give us a lot of good years though. He was drafted by none other than.... Ron Wolf. Jenkins was brought in by Sherman and Kampman is one of of the 33% of Sherman's Draft picks who are still actually in the NFL today.

Al Harris: who brought him to town? Oh, ya, and I guess he just got a new contract. Mike McKenzie and Javon Walker were brought here by....oh, ya.
And Mike Sherman also got the best years out of Bubba Franks and David Martin just signed a free agent contract with someone because he was so terrible when Mike Sherman brought him in.

Bubba Franks and Mike McKenzie were not brought in by Mike Sherman. Wolf drafted them. Harris was a great pickup by Sherman. One of his few.

Donald Driver...who resigned him?

If your going to give credit to Sherman for resigning Driver then by that logic Ted Thompson deserves credit for doing the same to Aaron Kampman, Al Harris, and Cullen Jenkins. Yet you bash Thompson and praise Sherman? Ron Wolf also drafted Donald Driver.

What happened was one GM wanted to pay veterans and didn't do a very good job drafting.

I would agree with this statement right here though but that's about it. Though one could argue both Mike Sherman and even Ted Thompson’s little success so far has been because of the players Ron Wolf brought in at the pinnacle of his tenure at GM of the Packers.

 

[all about da packers]

To add to porky's Donald Driver point, give TT credit for keeping Driver happy when he wanted more money last year.

 

[digsthepack]

Hey, net...put the "hits" and "misses" of MS's drafts and FA forays into a scale and see which way it tilts. Yep...you know the answer!

"Give a chimp a typewriter and he will eventually write Shakespeare" best surmises MS's performance as GM. Yes, some of those players were brought in by MS, but those are only a few starting players on a 53 man roster. He left the team threadbare in depth across the board and without a serviceable LB to speak of except Barnett. And let us not even get int BJ Sander...or keeping Torrance "If I only had a brain" Marshall at the expense of Hunter Hillenmeyer.

You can justify his tenure all you want, but he was Nero playing the fiddle as Rome burned around him.

 

[pyledriver80]

Hey, net...put the "hits" and "misses" of MS's drafts and FA forays into a scale and see which way it tilts. Yep...you know the answer!

"Give a chimp a typewriter and he will eventually write Shakespeare" best surmises MS's performance as GM. Yes, some of those players were brought in by MS, but those are only a few starting players on a 53 man roster. He left the team threadbare in depth across the board and without a serviceable LB to speak of except Barnett. And let us not even get int BJ Sander...or keeping Torrance "If I only had a brain" Marshall at the expense of Hunter Hillenmeyer.

You can justify his tenure all you want, but he was Nero playing the fiddle as Rome burned around him.

And then put what really matters against each other.....Thier respective records.

I don't like TT granted but right now no matter how you spin it, look at it or twist it MS was a FAR SUPERIOR GM judging by thier records.

I am sorry but thats what counts. Not how much cap room you clear or how many draft picks make the team.

 

[bozz_2006]

it is believed that the fire began and at once Nero ran from his palace at Antium to the streets of Rome, doing everything in his power to fight the fire. He opened his palace to those who had become homeless during the blaze. In spite of this, rumors quickly arose alleging that Nero was culpable for the fire, and that he ordered sections of the city be burned so they could be rebuilt (did they have home-owners insurance back then?).

It was actually at this time that people began rumors of Nero sitting on top of his palace tower, dressed as an actor, playing a lyre (not a fiddle!), and ************, all the while watching the city burn. To quelch these rumors Nero had to find someone to blame. Who better than the Christians, considering the only parts of town that weren't destroyed were the prosperous Christian sub-sects?

Upon confession of their beliefs, Christians were arrested and punished. Some dressed in rags and fed to dogs, lions, and tigers. Others set on fire early in the evening so they would burn all night. Still others were crucified, impaled (10 foot long pole shoved in the **** and then raised like a flag pole). Anywho, for years later, the people continued to suspect Nero was nuttier than a fruitcake. In AD 68, he was deposed by a civilian supposedly backed by the Roman senate and soon after he killed himself.

Still think Sherman was like Nero???

 

[NDPackerFan]

Hey, net...put the "hits" and "misses" of MS's drafts and FA forays into a scale and see which way it tilts. Yep...you know the answer!

"Give a chimp a typewriter and he will eventually write Shakespeare" best surmises MS's performance as GM. Yes, some of those players were brought in by MS, but those are only a few starting players on a 53 man roster. He left the team threadbare in depth across the board and without a serviceable LB to speak of except Barnett. And let us not even get int BJ Sander...or keeping Torrance "If I only had a brain" Marshall at the expense of Hunter Hillenmeyer.

You can justify his tenure all you want, but he was Nero playing the fiddle as Rome burned around him.

And then put what really matters against each other.....Thier respective records.

I don't like TT granted but right now no matter how you spin it, look at it or twist it MS was a FAR SUPERIOR GM judging by thier records.

I am sorry but thats what counts. Not how much cap room you clear or how many draft picks make the team.

This isn't a shot at you pyle but....don't you think Ron Wolf was the GM that made Sherman look a lot more superior than TT? I mean, Wolf had the cupboard full when he left and Sherman came in....I think we need to wait at least a couple of seasons to really compare the 2 - Thompson and Sherman.

 

[JbShell]

Hey, net...put the "hits" and "misses" of MS's drafts and FA forays into a scale and see which way it tilts. Yep...you know the answer!

"Give a chimp a typewriter and he will eventually write Shakespeare" best surmises MS's performance as GM. Yes, some of those players were brought in by MS, but those are only a few starting players on a 53 man roster. He left the team threadbare in depth across the board and without a serviceable LB to speak of except Barnett. And let us not even get int BJ Sander...or keeping Torrance "If I only had a brain" Marshall at the expense of Hunter Hillenmeyer.

You can justify his tenure all you want, but he was Nero playing the fiddle as Rome burned around him.

Ahhh Pyle if it were only that easy as a GM I am sure many of us here would be in that seat. MS was not a great GM. He was an emotional spender and tended to give contracts that reflected his personal relationship with a player.
Sherman readched on many of his drafts and refused to look beyond a few set standards of speed and atheliticism and chose players both in F/A and draft that were uncoachable Carrol, or childish, Walker. Sherman did have a couple of good picks to. He was not a horrible GM but was not the best. TT from what I have seen uses F/A properly. F/A should be used with the draft to build base and depth. Occasionaly when you are real close to a SB or a run at least is when you make a move.

When GB was building in the 90's many think that Favre and White were what got GB over the top. I disagree they were the base and depth and other players came in through draft and F/A. Kieth Jackson and others sprang GB over the top.

I take a wait and look approach with TT while frustrating as a fan TT methodical approach has its application and its reasoning. We are not privy to all that goes on in the front offices.


And then put what really matters against each other.....Thier respective records.

I don't like TT granted but right now no matter how you spin it, look at it or twist it MS was a FAR SUPERIOR GM judging by thier records.

I am sorry but thats what counts. Not how much cap room you clear or how many draft picks make the team.

 

[bozz_2006]

it is believed that the fire began and at once Nero ran from his palace at Antium to the streets of Rome, doing everything in his power to fight the fire. He opened his palace to those who had become homeless during the blaze. In spite of this, rumors quickly arose alleging that Nero was culpable for the fire, and that he ordered sections of the city be burned so they could be rebuilt (did they have home-owners insurance back then?).
It was actually at this time that people began rumors of Nero sitting on top of his palace tower, dressed as an actor, playing a lyre (not a fiddle!), and ************, all the while watching the city burn. To quelch these rumors Nero had to find someone to blame. Who better than the Christians, considering the only parts of town that weren't destroyed were the prosperous Christian sub-sects? U
pon confession of their beliefs, Christians were arrested and punished. Some dressed in rags and fed to dogs, lions, and tigers. Others set on fire early in the evening so they would burn all night. Still others were crucified, impaled (10 foot long pole shoved in the **** and then raised like a flag pole). Anywho, for years later, the people continued to suspect Nero was nuttier than a fruitcake. In AD 68, he was deposed by a civilian supposedly backed by the Roman senate and soon after he killed himself.

Still think Sherman was like Nero???