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I have asked this question before

Discussion in 'Packer Fan Forum' started by DePack, Sep 12, 2006.

  1. DePack

    DePack Cheesehead

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    ...the past couple seasons. Why can't our receivers get seperation? How often are our receivers truly open compared to the other team? Seems to me that on third and 7 Favre is always forced to try to force the ball to get a first down. Other teams have guys wide open on third and 7!

    Everyone knows that I was a Sherman fan for years but I truly had hope that maybe Green Bay's patterns hadn't changed for years so the other team knew what was coming. I thought maybe a new regime would help this one area, but after Sunday's game it is the same thing. Our receivers DO NOT get the seperation that most receivers do. Either that or MM is running the same patterns.

    I love DD but I believe this is the problem you have with not having a STUD #1 receiver. Those guys get open even when drawing double coverage and also free up the secondary for other receivers.
     
  2. pyledriver80

    pyledriver80 Cheesehead

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    Well DePack, I think its a combo thing. It's hard to get seperation when you only have 3 seconds to throw. Another area is that outside of DD our recievers aren't real good. It's not just skill but alot of it has to do with craftiness.


    There are parts to route running that take time to develop. Footwork, head movement, hard digs, etc. These will come in time.

    It's a combination of no time,bad routes, pedictability,etc. Also usually the D can get pressure on Brett with a 3-4 man front so they are dropping alot of guys back
     
  3. GakkofNorway

    GakkofNorway Cheesehead

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    None of our receivers have the abillity to get good separation, DD doesn't and he wouldn't be the #1 on many teams other than the Packers.
     
  4. PackFanInSC

    PackFanInSC Cheesehead

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    I think it may also be the type of routes that the West Coast offense lives on -- little dink and dunk passes underneath the defenders. For that to work, we really need to be hitting them on the run -- like we almost did with Donald Lee. The same way Jerry Rice always did on the slants. You throw to them as they cross from one zone to another and take advantage of the next defender not being able to pick them up in time. We do not do that very well. In fact, a lot of the catches seem to be after the receiver has almost stopped to wait for the ball. I think the receivers realize that as well. Watch Driver after he catches. You can almost see him cringe and duck his head as soon as he catches because he knows they are going to unload on him,. That is understandable considering Fergy getting hurt 2 years ago and Murphy last year. It is just a matter of time before he gets hurt as well if he is standing still and the defender gets a free shot.
     
  5. TOPackerFan

    TOPackerFan Cheesehead

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    No protection and no running game to speak of would be the two most obvious reasons IMO.
     
  6. DePack

    DePack Cheesehead

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    I've noticed it for years now
     
  7. all about da packers

    all about da packers Cheesehead

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    Great post pyle, very valid facts IMO.
     
  8. majikman

    majikman Cheesehead

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    This is what I've been thinking too DePack, and in light of this fact, it's really hypocritical to come down on Favre when he's had so little talent to work with. Look at how Tom Brady did yesterday without Branch? Not very impressive.

    Think of how good Favre would be with 2-3 really good WR's. Kurt Warner looked like an all pro yesterday. Look at their receiving talent. It doesn't take a genius to figure this out. The people who want to blame Favre for 29 interceptions should also point the finger at TT. He hasn't given him much to work with, and even less this year.
     
  9. umair

    umair Cheesehead

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    great post!!

    if a team wants to win games it has to be a team effort. each player depends on another. if they cant do that they cant win games.

    just my 2 cents


    thats kind of what pyle was trying to say...i think.
     
  10. calicheesehead

    calicheesehead Cheesehead

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    I've mirrored these thoughts as well. I think it comes down to DB's jamming our receivers right from the line. With our DB's do we ever see them jam the opposing WR's? Very little. They get seperation from the word go. Guess who our WR's practice against? Our own DB's. Seems like once Butler left the intensity in the backfield dropped.
     
  11. kmac

    kmac Cheesehead

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    What about the Packers teams that went to the SB? We had 1 good reciever like Driver in Brooks, and quite a few other average ones. We also only had an average HB.

    (Just playing Devil's advocate. Couldn't let this turn into a Pyle lovefest :lol:)
     
  12. calicheesehead

    calicheesehead Cheesehead

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    Antonio Freeman, Andre Rison, Mark Chumaura....pretty good weapons, plus we had a solid D and ST player in Desmond Howard. Hardly average players IMHO.
     
  13. pyledriver80

    pyledriver80 Cheesehead

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    Right on.
     
  14. cheesey

    cheesey Cheesehead

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    It's bothered me too. Look at how wide open the Bears WE's and TE's were. Is our D just that bad? Our TE's were almost non existant. SOMEONE should be able to get open. Where was Bubba Franks???
    Green ran great, so it SHOULD have opened up some passes.
    HOPEFULLY Robinson will help the O get on a roll.
     
  15. steveGB

    steveGB Cheesehead

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    if we want seperation we shoulda just kept leo bookman :p
     
  16. vixtalkn

    vixtalkn Cheesehead

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    Very good question.

    In man coverage, separation is all about fakes and cuts. If you can get the defender moving backwards, for example, and then cut away from him you get good separation.

    In zone coverage, separation is all about finding the holes in the zone.

    Trouble is, if you're a fan like me watching games on FOX, the network never gives you enough info to determine why a particular receiver was not open. Oh, occasionally, you'll see a replay and get some insight when, perhaps, a receiver scores a touchdown, but otherwise you get no replay and no analysis at all.

    If any of you get the opportunity to see Driver or Jennings or Fergie (and now Robinson) run routes in zone and man coverage, whether they get a catch or not, post your analysis here. Tell us if the receiver overran the seam or if the receiver was completely manhandled by the defender or, alternatively, whether any of our guys are consistently running crisp routes but Brett's just not getting them the ball. We'd all like to know.
     
  17. packerfanfourever

    packerfanfourever Cheesehead

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    On TV its hard to see what wide receivers area open, I have been to many packer games and its like watching a different game you do see the wide receivers get seperation, but Favre need just a little bit more time to check his other recievers, Its just a matter of seconds. Hopefully the O-line will improve to give him those extra seconds.
     
  18. cheesey

    cheesey Cheesehead

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    I think this may be alot of it. Give Favre enough time to FIND the open guy. Right now, he looks like a scared rabbit. He's trying to find someone before he gets his block knocked off.
     
  19. packerfanfourever

    packerfanfourever Cheesehead

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    Thats the thing, you give almost any QB in the NFL time they will find a open reciever, but if you give Favre that time he will pick the defense apart all day. Right now Manning or Brady with our offensive line would be in the same boat as Brett.
     
  20. cheesey

    cheesey Cheesehead

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    (Well......anyone but Joey Harrington!)LOLOLOL!!! :lol:
    Your right though.....no QB can do much with no protection. Vick can run, but he's not the caliber of QB that Favre is.
     

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