Cornerbacks

[HardRightEdge]

There's going to be a huge scramble to vet the situation over the next 48 hours.

The timing is interesting. Is it a legit complaint? The woman was evidently not a scorned ex taking revenge on his paycheck. Could be a faker looking for some cash. Who knows?

The problem is that you're not likely to get to the bottom of it in 48 hours. The incident happened on April 9, it's under investigation, no charges have been filed as of yet. I think you're gonna see "err on the side of caution" reflected in his draft position.

 

[AmishMafia]

Gareon Conley was recently accused of ****. No charges. If he's innocent, the timing could not be worse.

WTF. If true this guy is the biggest ******* ever.

 

[MiamiBeachPacker]

If this hadn't happened they would still be talking about Caleb Brantley, who knocked a woman unconscious after punching her in the face with less than a week to go before the draft

 

[Passepartout]

Well that could drop him down in the draft over that.

 

[thisisnate]

Pretty nuts the high-end cornerback chaos these last few weeks...
Sidney Jones was a top 15 guy. His injury puts him out of the 1st round.
Fabian Moreau was a first rounder. His injury puts him out of the 1st round.
Gareon Conley was a top 20 guy. No clue how these allegations will impact his draft stock, but he may very well slide.

 

[HardRightEdge]

WTF. If true this guy is the biggest ******* ever.

Biggest act of violent *******-edness, yes, if true.

But for pure, unadulterated *******-edness I have to with the Miami players (including Coley) who were suspended for renting exotic cars to be paid for out of future NFL paychecks. Can't show up on South Beach in a used Corola, doncha know. Of course nobody would notice these vehicles or ask any questions.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Pretty nuts the high-end cornerback chaos these last few weeks...
Sidney Jones was a top 15 guy. His injury puts him out of the 1st round.
Fabian Moreau was a first rounder. His injury puts him out of the 1st round.
Gareon Conley was a top 20 guy. No clue how these allegations will impact his draft stock, but he may very well slide.

Makes getting a good perimeter CB in the first round that much tougher.

 

[brandon2348]

Funny how all these Pac 12 hype guys can't even stay healthy for the draft.

The list includes Tak McKinley, Fabian Moreau, Sidney Jones, John Ross.

All are on the DL even before the draft. Maybe this will finally keep TT out of that conference this year.

 

[Dantés]

Pretty nuts the high-end cornerback chaos these last few weeks...
Sidney Jones was a top 15 guy. His injury puts him out of the 1st round.
Fabian Moreau was a first rounder. His injury puts him out of the 1st round.
Gareon Conley was a top 20 guy. No clue how these allegations will impact his draft stock, but he may very well slide.

Makes the "wait on corner because it's deep" argument a little less compelling. They definitely shouldn't reach, but if a guy is there that they love at #29 then they had better take him.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Funny how all these Pac 12 hype guys can't even stay healthy for the draft.

The list includes Tak McKinley, Fabian Moreau, Sidney Jones, John Ross.

All are on the DL even before the draft. Maybe this will finally keep TT out of that conference this year.

Thompson must be in a panic.

I get the California guys...too much sun and surfing, not enough yoga. Not sure about the Washington guys. Maybe all that rain and chill.

 

[jetfixer]

This could become an undrafted FA situation, just like the Collins deal a few years back(LSU lineman to the Cowboys)

 

[HardRightEdge]

Makes the "wait on corner because it's deep" argument a little less compelling.

The case for Awuzi gets a bit stronger. He checks a lot of boxes, first as a nickel/safety swing man in the Hyde mold with better athleticism (Hyde's speed deficiency often showed up) who would come in handy dropping to safety when Burnett plays in the box. The there's the possibility he steals a perimeter job. At a minimum he'd be an upgrade over Goodson and maybe Rollins who looks more like a nickel corner.

They definitely shouldn't reach, but if a guy is there that they love at #29 then they had better take him.

Isn't that a kind of tautology that applies to every pick? If they "really love" a guy at a particular pick by definition he's not a reach.

 

[Dantés]

The case for Awuzi gets a bit stronger. He checks a lot of boxes, first as a nickel/safety swing man in the Hyde mold with better athleticism (Hyde's speed deficiency often showed up) who would come in handy dropping to safety when Burnett plays in the box. The there's the possibility he steals a perimeter job. At a minimum he'd be an upgrade over Goodson and maybe Rollins who looks more like a nickel corner.

Isn't that a kind of tautology that applies to every pick? If they "really love" a guy at a particular pick by definition he's not a reach.

Sure, it's a bit redundant. But the point is that they shouldn't count on the depth of this corner class to provide a great option at #61 and therefore pass on a cornerback they love at #29. However, that doesn't mean they should just take a corner at #29 to say they did it. Some have suggested that unless they land a corner in the 1st, it's a failure.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Sure, it's a bit redundant. But the point is that they shouldn't count on the depth of this corner class to provide a great option at #61 and therefore pass on a cornerback they love at #29. However, that doesn't mean they should just take a corner at #29 to say they did it. Some have suggested that unless they land a corner in the 1st, it's a failure.

I think that as long as there's not a player a tier above everyone else available at #29 the Packers have to select a cornerback in the first round.

 

[Dantés]

I think that as long as there's not a player a tier above everyone else available at #29 the Packers have to select a cornerback in the first round.

I disagree that they have to. Their success at corner in 2017 has much more to do with the health/development of Randall and Rollins and whether the addition of House pans out than how a rookie will perform in year one. However, I do agree that all else being equal a good corner would make the most sense and could contribute. But if they wanted to go with a pass rusher instead, I'd be good with that. And then of course we agree that if a much better player happens to drop at a different position, that changes the equation.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I disagree that they have to. Their success at corner in 2017 has much more to do with the health/development of Randall and Rollins and whether the addition of House pans out than how a rookie will perform in year one. However, I do agree that all else being equal a good corner would make the most sense and could contribute.

While it's extremely difficult for a cornerback selected at the end of the first round to make an immediate impact there's a small possibility a rookie could elevate the performance of the entire unit. Especially with the Packers possibly not even having a single legit starter currently on the roster.

While the team needs to add quality depth at outside linebacker the starters are set with Matthews and Perry.

 

[Dantés]

While it's extremely difficult for a cornerback selected at the end of the first round to make an immediate impact there's a small possibility a rookie could elevate the performance of the entire unit. Especially with the Packers possibly not even having a single legit starter currently on the roster.

While the team needs to add quality depth at outside linebacker the starters are set with Matthews and Perry.

A 3rd pass rusher could make as much or more impact on opposing passing games as a 3rd/4th corner.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

A 3rd pass rusher could make as much or more impact on opposing passing games as a 3rd/4th corner.

I'm not sure about that as the nickel cornerback receives significant more playing time than the third outside linebacker on the depth chart. In addition the Packers should aim to draft a CB capable of taking over the #1 spot rather sooner than later.

 

[brandon2348]

Also consider that the chance of both Perry and Matthews both staying healthy for 16 games is "zero".

 

[brandon2348]

I think as has been posted that in Thompson's Mind he has spent a first and a second on corner two years ago and a first on safety three years ago so he already "has the guys" in the secondary.

I really wouldn't be surprised to see corner adressed as late as 3-4th round.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Sure, it's a bit redundant. But the point is that they shouldn't count on the depth of this corner class to provide a great option at #61 and therefore pass on a cornerback they love at #29. However, that doesn't mean they should just take a corner at #29 to say they did it. Some have suggested that unless they land a corner in the 1st, it's a failure.

I don't think anybody games the board for their #61 pick from the point in time when #28 comes off the board.

There's some game planning for the first round where there's better clarity on what other teams are going to do, but by the time you get to the second round it's less predictable. If you're getting ready to pick at 29 while at the same time there's 3 other corners on the board you'd like at 61, you could easily be left holding your d*ck if you pass on the guy you love who is not a reach. The second round is know for runs on positions of depth.

Thompson claims they study other teams sufficiently that historically the guy they targeted at their low first round pick has in fact been on the board, and they pick him. From that standpoint, the kind of gaming you fear is not in play. On those occasions where the guy is not there, you should expect they'll take the best player among positions of need and importance while factoring in such things as position cap allocation and what they project for the next season's FA class.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I think as has been posted that in Thompson's Mind he has spent a first and a second on corner two years ago and a first on safety three years ago so he already "has the guys" in the secondary.

I really wouldn't be surprised to see corner adressed as late as 3-4th round.

While that might be Thompson's mindset I believe it would be a terrible mistake solely relying on Randall and Rollins to significantly improve. Therefore cornerback should be addressed early.

 

[Dantés]

I'm not sure about that as the nickel cornerback receives significant more playing time than the third outside linebacker on the depth chart. In addition the Packers should aim to draft a CB capable of taking over the #1 spot rather sooner than later.

If that type of CB prospect is there, then you take him. But you're more likely talking about your Jacksons and Awuzies. If they take one of these premier athlete pass rushers over one of those guys, I won't blink.

 

[Dantés]

I don't think anybody games the board for their #61 pick from the point in time when #28 comes off the board.

There's some game planning for the first round where there's better clarity on what other teams are going to do, but by the time you get to the second round it's less predictable. If you're getting ready to pick at 29 while at the same time there's 3 other corners on the board you'd like at 61, you could easily be left holding your d*ck if you pass on the guy you love who is not a reach. The second round is know for runs on positions of depth.

Thompson claims they study other teams sufficiently that historically the guy they targeted at their low first round pick has in fact been on the board, and they pick him. From that standpoint, the kind of gaming you fear is not in play. On those occasions where the guy is not there, you should expect they'll take the best player among positions of need and importance while factoring in such things as position cap allocation and what they project for the next season's FA class.

I agree with this. Which is why I take issue with the posts that suggests we wait on corner because of depth. You might wait on corner because of value, but like you say you should never pass on a great prospect just because you think there might be a good one later.

 

[HardRightEdge]

I think as has been posted that in Thompson's Mind he has spent a first and a second on corner two years ago and a first on safety three years ago so he already "has the guys" in the secondary.

I really wouldn't be surprised to see corner adressed as late as 3-4th round.

I agree that's a strong possibility. However, even if he's projecting Randall and Rollins on the perimeter, he still doesn't have a nickel corner. Nickel corner is no longer an afterthought. He's a "starter" in terms of snap count, and defending slots and TEs is no minor consideration. More teams are emphasizing the slot receiver, and many do what the Packers do in having Nelson and Adams run from the slot to exploit a matchup. There's also the matter of having a potential backup plan if Randall or Rollins does not show improvement. Third, you have both safeties entering FA next year, so a nickel/safety type accounts for that vulnerability.

As I've been saying for quite some time, the odds of it being a corner are fairly high but it might not be the kind of corner most people think. Then I looked at Awuzi's tape, and lo and behold, there's that guy who fits squarely in the 25-50 group where there isn't a lot to separate them other than need, scheme fit and subjective projection.

In conclusion, I don't expect Thompson to select Awuzi.