1. Welcome to Green Bay Packers NFL Football Forum & Community!
    Packer Forum is one of the largest online communities for the Green Bay Packers.

    You are currently viewing our community forums as a guest user.

    Sign Up or

    Having an account grants you additional privileges, such as creating and participating in discussions. Furthermore, we hide most of the ads once you register as a member!
  2. Announcement is LIVE: Read the Forum Post

Bret Retire NOW

Discussion in 'Packer Fan Forum' started by starpass, Jan 21, 2008.

  1. trippster

    trippster Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2005
    Messages:
    1,405
    Ratings:
    +2
    I am the rivisionist??
    Wikipedia - Jeff Garcia
    Following the Grey Cup victory in 1998, Garcia was signed as a backup to Steve Young with the San Francisco 49ers of the National Football League. Over the summer, he had been fighting for a spot on the roster, but early in the 1999 season, Steve Young was sacked by Aeneas Williams and suffered his final professional concussion, knocking him out for the year. Garcia stepped in and finished the season.

    The following season, with Young retired, Garcia kept the starting quarterback position and made his first Pro Bowl appearance. He set a new 49ers' team record with 4,278 passing yards in the 2000 season, although the team finished with a 6-10 record. In both of the next two seasons, the 49ers went to the playoffs.

    Garcia had 31 and 32 passing touchdowns in the 2000 and 2001 season seasons, more than any other quarterback over those two seasons. Garcia went to the Pro Bowl in three consecutive seasons (2000-2002).

    On January 5, 2003, during the 2002-2003 playoffs, Garcia was a large part of the 49ers' comeback win over the New York Giants, the second largest comeback victory in NFL playoff history. In the game's third quarter, the Giants were up 38-14, with about 18 minutes left to play. Once the 49ers regained possession of the ball, they began a comeback that saw 25 unanswered points, with San Francisco taking a 39-38 lead. The Giants lost an opportunity to retake the lead after a controversial call, and the improbable victory became the signature game of Garcia's 49er career. He threw for 331 yards, 3 touchdowns, 1 interception, and also ran for 60 yards and 1 touchdown.

    Following a disappointing 2003 season, in which Garcia performed at a sub-par level, the 3-time Pro Bowler was released by the 49ers due to a decline in performance and salary cap issues. Garcia also had a falling out with wide receiver Terrell Owens.



    Funny thing about the internet, you can use it to find out facts.....

    Teams usually make the change at QB for one or both of two reasons.
    1. Starting QB is declined in production (which Favre hasn't)
    2. the team is going nowhere or has little aspirations for the following year.

    That being said, so Favre threw a bad ball. so he thought Driver was running a different route. Whatever the reason, lets keep in mind the biggest reason the Packers were even in the game to begin with. Brett Lorenzo Favre. How about his play in the KC game? how about the Denver game? Seattle? Detroit? The ONLY reason we were 7-1 in the first half of the season is because of Favre and his ability to pass when we had no running game

    And the biggest thing and the reason I think we excelled on offense this year, his ability to finally call audibles. Favre is one of the smartest QB's to come along in a long time. Wasn't it the Seattle CB who said "it was like Favre knew all our plays. He always called the perfect audible"

    Rodgers will have his time in the spotlight. however, we have the tools to go to the SB next year and the year after. Would you like to give that up so that we can look to the Future?


    My guess is that Favre will retire before his skills decline so that the team does not have to make that decision. then it will be the Rodgers era.

    I just can't believe I have to sit here and defend why the runner up in the MVP voting should keep his job. Sheesh!

    Oh, and I would take a 50 yr old with Favres abilities before any 25 yr old who MIGHT be good. (a bird in a hand is worth more than two in the bush)
     
  2. Cal2GreenBay

    Cal2GreenBay Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2006
    Messages:
    468
    Ratings:
    +1
    EVERY interception that ANY QB has thrown has had SOMETHING go wrong by other people. THat would mean EVERY mistake was a team mistake.

    But there was once a GREEN BAY QB that would make the INCORRECT throw in bad coverage, and have the WR get kiilled, the o-line break down, and STILL be able to make a play.

    That QB is now 38 and in those situations where he used to make miracles.
    He makes the game losing interception.

    But HEY..he still puts up great stats during the regular season!
     
  3. Pack93z

    Pack93z You retired too? .... Not me. I'm in my prime

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2005
    Messages:
    4,855
    Ratings:
    +22
    Okay now I get your logic.. Aaron has the ability to pull off that magic and lead this team to victory. The same QB that has had spot duty in two games following each with a stint on the injury report.

    The same QB that worked that magic to lead us to victory in Dallas, because you know he is a 24 year old QB that has earned the right to lead this team because he is a first round draft pick, that isn't hitting his escalators on his contract because he can't beat out a 38 year old washed up 3 time MVP QB that only puts up nice stats.

    Perfect logic to me.
     
  4. Cal2GreenBay

    Cal2GreenBay Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2006
    Messages:
    468
    Ratings:
    +1
    That year of 6-10 is what I'm referring to.

    Do you know what the Packer fans would do to Aaron Rodgers if the team went 6-10 next year after this season and if he were the starting QB?

    They were calling for Garcia's head in San Francisco, but they kept him and let him blossom the following years.

    You think Green Bay fans who feel compelled to DEFEND Brett on every comment and are so hypersensitive and reactive to any criticism are going
    to let Aaron follow a 6-10 season?

    Brett is a great stat QB and he bailed the team out of many flawed campaigns this year. I've stated that in many posts in this very thread.

    But saying he is not longer the magician he once was is not a knock. It's an observation and it' showed in the game.

    The TEAM LOST THE GAME.

    Did Brett help that team loss? YES.
    Does he have that magic anymore? Not as much.

    That shouldn't be so hard to accept.

    If you guys read the details of my posts and not skip through them..it'll show there's not much to need to defend on Brett
    and I'm not as biased towards Rodgers either.
     
  5. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2005
    Messages:
    16,743
    Ratings:
    +2,983
    We will see this coming training camp if Brett has lost it..So far Rodgers hasnt been able to beat Brett..

    And until the coaches say Rodgers is the "MAN" I will have faith in Brett
     
  6. Cal2GreenBay

    Cal2GreenBay Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2006
    Messages:
    468
    Ratings:
    +1
    See this is a point of you putting words in my mouth that I didn't say.

    My point on Favre doesn't mean I'm following it w/Rodgers as the solution.

    I DON'T KNOW IF RODGERS is the SOLUTION.

    That's as unbiased it gets.

    But what I DO KNOW is that our Magical QB Favre is not as magical as before and we need to prepare for it...Whether it be Rodgers or someone else.

    It just means that change is coming and it's better to get ready for it.

    And let's be real here. Even if Aaron were to "beat out" Brett in training camp and in the preaseaon. He won't be able to really BEAT HIM OUT
    of the starting job.

    There's politics and marketing here and oversensitive fans to deal with.

    It's the "Barry Bonds" rule. YOu can't really beat out an icon. It's not that cut and dry. You can only wait for that icon to leave.

    Let's be real about that.

    It's nice for you guys to think it's so logical that Aaron can "beat out" Brett.
    But it's not going to happen that way.
     
  7. Cal2GreenBay

    Cal2GreenBay Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2006
    Messages:
    468
    Ratings:
    +1
    THIS is COMPLETELY FAIR. Great post
     
  8. trippster

    trippster Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2005
    Messages:
    1,405
    Ratings:
    +2
    Alright Cal, I just can't see your logic. You claim he has lost his magic yet you stated he bailed the team out of many flawed campaigns this year. So, does he have to bail us out of EVERY one? Can he too not be successful once in a while?

    Yes, he made a bad pass at the end. Big deal. My thought is had Driver not slipped, that pass is broken up and falls incomplete.

    Had Rodgers played the whole season my guess is that we are not even in the playoffs much less hosting the Championship game. We have the ability to win it all....NOW.

    no one gives up NOW for what might never happen in the future.

    Would you agree that Favre is CURRENTLY a better all around QB and leader than Rodgers?
     
  9. Pack93z

    Pack93z You retired too? .... Not me. I'm in my prime

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2005
    Messages:
    4,855
    Ratings:
    +22
    Okay what about the San Diego game? Or the Denver OT thriller? Those weren't spun by the "old man" that has lost it?

    To be honest, I am looking forward to seeing what Rodgers can do at the helm, but I am not ready to appoint him to said helm without him winning the job. I have said this before and I will say it again.. when Rodgers is "clearly" the better choice at QB then I say roll with him.

    But apparently the only way that Rodgers will beat out Favre is if he retires.. even Rodgers biggest fan is begging for him to retire so Aaron gets his shot. Even if it takes an injury as you posted previous.

    To me, wouldn't it be more noble to beat him out such as Young did with Montana? He earned the position with his performance on the field, in training camp and the Niners out of respect gave Joe the option of backup or being traded.

    But apparently you don't feel confident that Rodgers can prove he is the better option to lead this team. Not real reassuring if you ask me.
     
  10. Cal2GreenBay

    Cal2GreenBay Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2006
    Messages:
    468
    Ratings:
    +1
    I dunno what information you guys are getting but Young did NOT beat out Montana. While Montana was injured, Young showed "flashes"
    as did Rodgers and that spurred the debate.

    But Montana during his 2nd injury stint, Young took over and didn't let go.

    If Favre were down for 4 games.(which I know will never happen).
    I am confident that Rodgers would show the fans as much to give them confidence in him.

    But again..this is more BarryBonds in principle than Young/MOntana.

    The GB Franchise is tied inexplicably to Favre as Bonds was to to the SF Giants.

    I'm not showing lack of faith in Rodgers. I'm showing lack of faith in the politics that goes w/having an Iconic sports figure in a big town and seeking a fair process for who outplays who.

    To think that's gonna happen is really not being honest w/ourselves about how sports FRANCHISES(i.e. businesses out to make money)..work.
     
  11. Cal2GreenBay

    Cal2GreenBay Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2006
    Messages:
    468
    Ratings:
    +1


    Yes..Brett is the better QB...and he bailed us out of REGULAR SEASON games..but it's the playoffs that matter and he couldn't do it.
    Just like Romo couldn't do it this year (and he's going to have to live with until he does).

    Brett is the better option, but when does it start hurting the long term growth of the team? Like Garcia in San Francisco, there was a 6-10 year after he replaced Young.. but soon after they were up in contention again. We have to afford the next GB QB that year..but when?

    And like my previous post. Not sure if Aaron will be allowed to "BEAT OUT" Brett for many reasons..
     
  12. Pack93z

    Pack93z You retired too? .... Not me. I'm in my prime

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2005
    Messages:
    4,855
    Ratings:
    +22
    Correct, Young took... I repeat took the job away from Montana.. he proved to be more effective than Montana. Correct?

    Rodgers proved himself in a half of football in Dallas, but struggled mightly in the New England game last year. Albeit that is not a fair game to judge upon, the whole team was crushed.

    But here lies the biggest rub I have.. he can't stay healthy. Bad Luck? Maybe.. but do you honestly think that a franchise should pin its hopes to a kid that hasn't shown he can stay healthy?

    Don't get me wrong, I am not a Favre firster or saying that he shouldn't move aside when the time is right. But the proof is in the pudding.. he performed at a very high level this year, so why has he lost it?

    You point to one pass, one game out of a great season and claim he has lost it. Biased? Hard not to claim that.
     
  13. Bertram

    Bertram Cheesehead

    Joined:
    May 7, 2007
    Messages:
    532
    Ratings:
    +1
    Is Cal2GreenBay a Rodgers and Cal fan that became a Green Bay fan when they drafted Rodgers? Seems that way anyway.
     
  14. Pack93z

    Pack93z You retired too? .... Not me. I'm in my prime

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2005
    Messages:
    4,855
    Ratings:
    +22
    Brady threw for 50 TD passes this year, but threw for 3 pick Sunday. His team carried him to the Superbowl.

    Don't think Brett will replay that game or pass in his head a couple thousand times this offseason? He will live with that as well.. as he has with the other bad games in his career.

    Thing is, all QB's struggle at times in the game at this level.. every stinking one of them. Unitas to Montana to Young to Aikman, list them all.. hell Peyton threw 6 picks in a game this year and cost his team the win.

    The day Aaron proves to the coaching staff and the GM, is the day that he will be the starter for the Green Bay Packers. Does he have to beat the mystic of Brett Favre, yes he does, but if he is "clearly" the better choice, I don't see him sitting on the bench.

    You point to marketing and money, I say if Aaron takes the ball and wins for the Packers, he will be embraced with the same respect from Packer fans as Brett has been.
     
  15. Pack93z

    Pack93z You retired too? .... Not me. I'm in my prime

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2005
    Messages:
    4,855
    Ratings:
    +22
    He posted it one time, he is a Cal Bears fan that became a Packer fan with the drafting of Rodgers.. or something close to that effect.

    I swear it much be a sibling of some sort.. A "Rodgers-firster" to coin a phrase.
     
  16. trippster

    trippster Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2005
    Messages:
    1,405
    Ratings:
    +2
    The niners went to Garcia because they HAD to. Young was knocked silly for the umteenth (wondered how that was spelled...) time.
    Young then retired. That is why they moved on with Garcia and lived with his growing pains. It was not like they said, alright Young, you're old so move over...

    Even without his "magic" Favre is still a top five QB. Who benches that???

    (am I STILL defending a MVP runner-up??) AAAAGGGGHHHHH!!!!
     
  17. Pack93z

    Pack93z You retired too? .... Not me. I'm in my prime

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2005
    Messages:
    4,855
    Ratings:
    +22
    Tripp I am right with ya.. I stayed out of this thread for a long time.. but the ripping of girls because they live in WI drew me in.. still breathing fire after an hour..

    Haven't been pissed like that in a while.. and not because of defending Favre either.. his work speaks for itself.
     
  18. Defense92

    Defense92 Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2007
    Messages:
    175
    Ratings:
    +74
    I won't be rude and ask if you looked in the mirror lately, but you completely reflect the reason why so many women today have eating disorders. Our society wants women to look like they came out of a concentration camp. If you don't have bones sticking out of your collar, you're fat. Years ago, the likes of Monroe and more recently Winslet, although in acting and modeling would be considered fat by today's standards, simply because they have curves.
     
  19. MplsPacker

    MplsPacker Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2007
    Messages:
    39
    Ratings:
    +0
    Regular season stats don't mean crap. It's how you perform in the playoffs that matters.

    This game vs. the NYG was too much of an emotional roller coaster towards the end. You went from Favre throwing a fumbled-INT, to 2 missed NYG FG's, 1 missed w/time expiring to the OT coin flip that GB won to Favre's INT on the 40 yd line. Why didn't Tynes just make the 1st dang FG and kill us quickly instead of slowly stabbing us to an emotional let down?
     
  20. trippster

    trippster Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2005
    Messages:
    1,405
    Ratings:
    +2
    yeah I goota tell ya though, I lived in the Bay area too (live in WI now) and the women out there are AMAZING!!!!

    That said, the WI women have more substance....


    Cal, come on out of the closet will ya? Are you Rodgers' little bro?
     
  21. Pack93z

    Pack93z You retired too? .... Not me. I'm in my prime

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2005
    Messages:
    4,855
    Ratings:
    +22
    LOL.. I spent some time in San Diego, Dallas, Georgia and the Carolina's.. no doubt there are pretty girls across the land. But they do live around he as well.. trust me.. I have seen them. ;)
     
  22. trippster

    trippster Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2005
    Messages:
    1,405
    Ratings:
    +2
    <<<<can't see the pretty girls through the constant snow storms and consistantly grey, overcast, gloomy days...>>>>>
     
  23. TheKanataThrilla

    TheKanataThrilla Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2007
    Messages:
    320
    Ratings:
    +0
    I like women who look healthy. I find it disturbing that men find women who have the bodies of little boys attractive. Whatever floats your boat I guess. Being a boob man, unless you are a genetic freak you have to have a little bit of cushion as this man likes 'em real.
     
  24. Pack93z

    Pack93z You retired too? .... Not me. I'm in my prime

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2005
    Messages:
    4,855
    Ratings:
    +22
    Classic.. got a laugh out of me.. thanks.. I better get to work and get something accomplished today.
     
  25. Cal2GreenBay

    Cal2GreenBay Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2006
    Messages:
    468
    Ratings:
    +1
    It's so funny to me.
    To be supportive of someone other than Favre..I would have to be related to him.

    W/the mirror turned the other way...a lot of you are SO into Favre that it begs the question as if YOU want to be related to him. I will refrain from the "come out of the closet" comment and let all about da packers deal w/that one.

    And about the girls in bikini's comment.

    IT WAS A JOKE...I even stated that it was all in good fun.
    Those girls are attractive. OF course they are.

    I just set a joke out there because everyone else was drooling over them.
    (please spare me the "it's guys like you who give women problems" angle...there's no where socially and CULTURALLY more progressive than out on the west. Let's not even start that about progressiveness about living areas..and it's tangential to say the least. It was a side joke about bikinis...let it go..take a chill pill).

    As I said, OVERREACTIVE...

    You mention any criticism about Favre...you get BASHED.
    You mention any support of someone other than Favore...you get labeled a family member.
    You make a joke about bikinis...you get taken out of context.

    And who are the biased ones here??

    BACK TO TOPIC?

    Regular season is regular season. It's your postseason that
    makes you great. It's Brett's prior postseaons that made him great.


    p.s. If you're sitting there ANGRY about my post about bikinis..it's clearly not my post that keeps you angry. Just looking for an excuse...
     

Share This Page