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Why is this happening?

Discussion in 'All Other Team Discussions' started by packedhouse01, Jul 17, 2008.

  1. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    I am just going to say this once..

    He felt disrespected by Ted for being LIED to..

    He asked Ted for a favor Ted said to him OK..To Brett that meant Yes I will TRY..

    How many times have YOU asked YOUR boss for a favor?
    Take off hour early, let me have this day off, etc.........

    Did he have the right to ask for those favors, or do what he did...Maybe or maybe not..That truly is not the issue from what I can gather...


    Ted would come out in PUBLIC and say something totally different, then what he had told Brett in private, so it was a slap in the face to Brett..

    He was going to just let it ride, but things that Ted and Mike said had half truths to them...

    He LET it ALL out...

    Right now I can fully understand his thinking and his frustration..

    I still wish he would be here and the starting q/b..

    BUT HE WONT BE
     
  2. boiga

    boiga Cheesehead

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    More like he doesn't want people to notice the brown stains on his hands.

    You have to imagine that it was bus who convinced favre to ask for release and try to get a new deal with a new team. Also, whether brett was in on it or not, Bus has been shopping Brett around for months.
     
  3. Pack93z

    Pack93z You retired too? .... Not me. I'm in my prime

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    I assure you.. once this issue has passed and Brett finally does retire for good.. that the Packers will seek tampering charges against Cook himself.. right now wouldn't be right... but I am sure the Packers have that in mind.
     
  4. Zombieslayer

    Zombieslayer Cheesehead

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    As I said on another thread, I will always like Brett Favre.

    Those of us that are old enough to remember, I was a Packers fan since '76. We were bad, really bad. It was soooo nice when the Bucs came into the NFL because we actually would win some games. They went 0-14 that first year, and we swept them, for 2 of our 4 victories that year. Great feeling.

    You young ones don't know what it's like to root for a perpetually losing team. Imagine a Detroit Lions fan who all of a sudden gets a Hall of Fame QB that leads them to a SB victory. Now, do you see my point?

    We were bad, really, really, really bad before Favre came on board. Sure, we had one Playoff year with Lynn Dickey, but he was always injured and our D was always bad. I think one year with Dickey, we had the #1 O, but the worst D in the NFL. Then there was '89 with Majik. But he too was always injured.

    Then Favre came along and every year, we had a shot. It was so much different, so much better.

    I'll always cherish the 16 years Favre gave us. Always.
     
  5. Packnic

    Packnic Cheesehead

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    even if he throws the Packers under the bus to join the Vikings?
    using his fans to get his way?
     
  6. Truman

    Truman Cheesehead

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    There is a misperception about what Favre said during his Fox interview. People on this and other forums are claiming that Favre was playing GM, trying to tell Thompson who to sign, etc., and lambasting Favre for thinking he should have input on management decisions. The actual interview and the full transcript make it clear that is not what happened, and that is not Favre's complaint.

    Favre did not demand that the Packers resign Wahle and Rivera. According to the quotes, Thompson was lobbying Favre to come back. Favre told Thompson it would help if he would resign his linemen. Pretty predictable request coming from a quarterback. Favre said Thompson told him he would sign at least one of them. Thompson did not do it. Favre thinks Thompson was not honest with him.

    Favre did not demand that Thompson hire Mariucci to be the coach. According to the quotes, Favre simply asked Thompson to interview Mariucci. Thompson responded that he heard Mooch no longer wanted to coach. Favre told him Mooch would be interested. Thompson told Favre he would interview him. Favre hears McCarthy has been hired, and asks Mooch what went wrong in the interview. Mooch told Favre there never was an interview. Again, Favre thinks Thompson was not honest with him.

    Favre did not demand that Thompson acquire Randy Moss. The Packers were interested in Moss, and Favre either was asked or volunteered to help lobby the wide receiver. Favre did that. He talked to Randy. He offered to make concessions with his own salary. He thought he had worked it out so that the deal was there to be made. Thompson did not complete the deal. He then denied that Favre had been lobbying Moss at the same time that Tom Brady was getting a lot of the credit for Moss going to the Patriots, due to one phone call Brady put in. Again, Favre thought Thompson was not being honest.

    This is not about Thompson not doing what Favre wants. It is about Thompson telling Favre one thing, doing another, and not keeping Favre in the loop.

    As GM, Thompson owes no obligation to Favre to take his input, or to listen to what Favre has to say about personnel/management decisions. But once Thompson told Favre he was going to do something, the dynamics changed. At that point, Thompson has a duty to carry through, or at least try to carry through, on his promise and to communicate with Favre if something goes wrong.

    Many people on this forum have asked why the two of them don't sit down and talk face to face. The answer, apparently from Favre's side, is that it would not matter because he does not trust Thompson to follow through on what he says.

    Also keep in mind Thompson's strange behavior regarding the retirement. He does not communicate with Favre, whereas he did in years past. Once Favre gives his retirement speech, the Packers quickly announce that the retirement ceremony will be the first game of the following season. That struck me, and everyone else, as being weird. Reporters throughout the country commented on the story, saying it is as if the Packers wanted to make sure Favre stayed retired. (Remember, they did not retire Reggie White's number until, sadly, he had passed away.) It is always better to wait a few years to do something like that. Then Thompson tells Favre he wants to cut his locker out and give it to Favre. Not put it in the Packers Hall of Fame. Or donate it to the Pro Football Hall of Fame. Just send it to Favre. On the one hand, seems like a classy gesture. On the other hand, could be perceived as a further move to "move on."

    Favre apparently believes Thompson has not been honest with him. Favre told Greta that that is why he is hesitant to report to training camp for the Packers, or to even ask Thompson to trade him, because he cannot trust Thompson. He has asked for his release so that he is no longer under Thompson's control.

    I am not writing this to take a side. But merely to point out how things look from Favre's perspective. This helps explain "why this is happening."
     
  7. DGB454

    DGB454 Cheesehead

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    I remember those years too. I became a Packer fan mostly due to Bart Star. (Yea way back then). If the charges about the Vikings turn out to be true and Brett is just trying to weasel his way into their orginazition then I still believe there will be a mass exodus of Packer nation fans from the Favre camp. Are we grateful for the 16 seasons? Should we cherish the good times we had with him as our QB? Of course. But if it's true then he left us long before we turned our collective backs on him.
     
  8. DGB454

    DGB454 Cheesehead

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    Truman. Interisting take. Makes me go Hmmmm.....
     
  9. dd80forever

    dd80forever Cheesehead

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    You are dead on. Brett never tried to run the team, but he made suggestions. There is nothing wrong with that. Ted told Brett one thing, then didn't do it, or told the media another.

    It's a great misperecption but the truth is people read what they want to form a stance on one side or the other and they cling to it.
     
  10. tromadz

    tromadz Cheesehead

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    What's with this "reading it a certain way" crap? I, and others, WATCHED it. We watched the words leave his lips. We seen the look in his eyes(not that it matters. See: retirement speech).

    He says something, he means it...right? Isn't that what people say, he's a straight shooter? Only when it works for you, eh?

    And yes, there's nothing wrong with a player making suggestions, if he's asked. And ok, even if he's not asked and makes suggestions, he has no right to be pissy and bitter if they don't happen. You're not the GM, Brett. You're a player. Play.
     
  11. Bertram

    Bertram Cheesehead

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    He's been seen as a straight shooter in the past, but was he really one? How many times have we been deceived by Brett in the past? The biggest deception is probably the notion that he is a straight shooter, because he has been caught lying several times in this soap opera, read: when he said it was all rumor, when he said he didn't feel pressured to retire, and many more instances.

    We can definitely conclude: HE IS NO STRAIGHT SHOOTER
     
  12. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    I think I said something similar?

     
  13. boiga

    boiga Cheesehead

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    Truman, I think you are certainly right that that is how Favre feels about this situation.

    However, from a fan's perspective, Ted was probably right in the way he acted in all three of those situations. After 2005, we NEEDED brett to come back, but we could not afford to keep Wahle and Rivera. I am completely fine with Ted lying to Brett to get him back on board, but still doing his job by releasing two guys we couldn't afford to pay. In the long run, Ted was right: Pass protection improved after we lost Wahle and Rivera.

    The odd thing from the Mooch event is that Favre never states that Ted directly agreed to interview the guy. Here's his quote from the transcript: "And he[mooch] said, ‘That’s always been a dream job, sure I would.’ So, I tell Ted that. And he says, ‘OK.’"

    So favre tells Ted that Mooch would love to coach the packers, Ted say OK, and then hires M3. If all Ted say was 'OK' then he never agreed to interview the guy. Did Favre misspeak, or did he just misread Ted? In either case he never shows that Ted lied to him in that incident, instead there was just a communication gap.

    The Moss incident has been gone over a million times, so I won't reference it. But in regards to this season, why WOULD Ted keep in close contact with Brett this summer? Brett had retired and become a former player. How often does he call Koren?

    Favre's expectation of coddling after his retirement speech was unfounded. He's a grown man, he shouldn't need to be asked.
     
  14. DGB454

    DGB454 Cheesehead

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    But he said it last. I only ever read the last post in the thread.
     
  15. Mr_Bumpy

    Mr_Bumpy Cheesehead

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    Maybe Ted originally intended to do as Favre requested, but then after he spent more time with the logistics of it, realized that it just wouldn't work out. There wasn't necessarily an intent to deceive.

    Sometimes my wife will ask me to do something, and I say I'll do it, but then for one reason or another, I realize it's not the best thing to do. Sometimes she agrees with me, sometimes she doesn't. Did I lie to her by telling her I would do it? Well, at that moment, I intended to do it, so it wasn't a lie. Does that make it an "untruth"? Maybe that's what Brett was getting at when he didn't want to say that TT lied.

    The difference is that in my case, I should be accountable to my wife when I change my mind. TT shouldn't be accountable to Brett if he changes his.
     
  16. trippster

    trippster Cheesehead

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    I am not ok with ted lying to anyone, especially his prized employee. Deceit is the biggest cause of loss of trust. You deceive me into action once, and I will never trust you again. You have purposely abused my trust.

    I think Favre is a straight shooter. I think he is too honest and open with his feelings and that is being construed as lying. His comment about "rumors" was in regard to texting. In his interview he said he called TT, not texted.

    He was never pressured into retiring and he said that. He said he felt pressured to make a decision. He chose the retirement path.

    As with any member of a team, you want to be considered an integral part of the team. Favre did not feel that management felt that way about him any longer. That was conveyed by the apathetic attitude he sensed from TT and MM. Was it accurate? Who knows?

    Currently, favre has control of to be activated or not. That is all. Everyone knows that to return and be a backup would be embarrasing and I know of no one that would do that. Especially after his year last year. Not only that, but the descention that would occur on the team. Every mental or physical mistake Rodgers made would be examined by team members as "Would Brett have done that? He's sitting over there on the sidelines, why doesn't MM put him in?" So his only chance to play is to go to another team. however, I firmly believe that if TT could have his way, he would (and I think is trying to) continue to force Favre to stay retired.

    I think that if Favre's only option is to be a backup then he will not play. GB can force him to do that.

    We don't know where the real truth is. I am not sure anyone does because it involves intentions.

    However, over the years I have learned one absolute;

    You always know the truth by the result.

    there is also another constant: past results, while not guaranteed, are the best indicators of future performance.

    Past results indicate Favre would be the Packers best chance at a SB the next couple of years.

    TT has said he does what is best for the Packers.

    The results of his actions do not support that he is acting in the best interest of winning. Favre is the better QB.
     
  17. PackinSteel

    PackinSteel Cheesehead

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    :agree:

    Well stated Tripp!
     
  18. PackinSteel

    PackinSteel Cheesehead

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    The difference MrBumpy is that we don't want you or your wife to QB the Packers :)
     
  19. Pack93z

    Pack93z You retired too? .... Not me. I'm in my prime

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    Just flippin the script a little, sense we are reading deeply into Brett's comments and clearing them up, which I happen to agree with.

    But Ted has said he is trying to do what is best for the Packers, in what context? Short Term or Long Term?

    While I agree that Favre offers us better odds of winning it all this year, what about the long term impact of never finding out what you have in a kid that has worked his tail off this offseason?

    Now don't read past that.. I want to win now as much as anyone, but couldn't one interpet Ted message in the long terms approach?

    It is all in the preception of one view in this tale of poor communication.
     
  20. boiga

    boiga Cheesehead

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    But half of a GM's job is lying. He generally can't tell a play how much he needs them because then they would hold out for more money. He can't let anyone know who he's favoring in free trade, because that would let other teams undercut him. He can't let a player dictate personnel decisions because that would bankrupt the team. GM's are like politicians. If they're not lying, they're not doing their job.

    That said, TT has never been caught in a lie to the public.
    But Favre has been caught lying several times to the media throughout this process. Check Florio's article here :http://www.sportingnews.com/yourturn/viewtopic.php?t=434609

    When asked on july 2nd by the media whether he was trying to play football again, he responded "It's all rumor," and "There's no reason for it." That was a lie.

    In April, he told Peter King that trying to play for a different team "was he last thing he was thinking about" despite Bus shopping him around at the same time.

    I used to think he was a straight shooter too, but Favre has lost all his credibility in this fiasco.
     
  21. starr15

    starr15 Cheesehead

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    its a ted thompson situation its all him he let favre come back and he made the deal with the jets and he took away the packer pride all within four years thats even more amazing than what vince lombardi did with the packers
     

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