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Hearing a cheer for Carroll over chorus of boos

Discussion in 'Green Bay Packers Fan Forum' started by Zero2Cool, Sep 27, 2006.

  1. Zero2Cool

    Zero2Cool I own a website

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    Well said.
     
  2. Bruce

    Bruce Cheesehead

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    Even a blind zebra could tell that was not pass interference. He made a clean play and it was a key play in the game. If that is interference they may as well make CB's wear dresses and skirts, because that was simply very good defense -- and as far as I know that has not been outlawed completely by the NFL.

    Ryan, that was an opinion piece that was not written by Carrol:

    "Fourth, and not to be taken lightly, is the adjustment for an African-American growing up in Atlanta to moving to and living in Green Bay. It's a culture shock to put it mildly — and it doesn't help when the hometown fans are booing you."

    There is no race card in that paragraph. It is an adjustment and culture shock and it is not easy for a 20 year old to get booed by his team's fans (regardless of race).

    I don't agree with much from the opinion piece, but that paragraph was not Carroll offering excuses, nor was it any kind of stretch from quite obvious facts.
     
  3. kewlbeans

    kewlbeans Cheesehead

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    I assume that was directed toward the author and in general and not implying that Carroll himself is making excuses because of his skin color.

    And with the lousy coverage play from Harris, Woodson , Collins, Manuel, and Poppinga why are people still bitching about Carroll (especially when he made a great play ?)
     
  4. Bruce

    Bruce Cheesehead

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    Good question, Carroll had great coverage throughout and is the last guy you would expect fans to be singling out after the Win in Detroit.
     
  5. Zero2Cool

    Zero2Cool I own a website

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    First I want to say I agree so this doesn't sound like I'm trying to counter. But I don't think Carroll has ever made any excuse. I think he's always taken the responsibility on his own shoulders.
     
  6. CaliforniaCheez

    CaliforniaCheez Cheesehead

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    Once you are 18 you have to deal with the consequences of your decisions. No more special rules and excuses. It isn't that harsh. It is part of freedom.
     
  7. gopackgo

    gopackgo Cheesehead

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    Boo.

    I think after the Packers first win, critics have stretched a bit to say how good the Pack are.
     
  8. pyledriver80

    pyledriver80 Cheesehead

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    This is funny coming from Trom. Don't you question my fanhood all the time?


    Anyways it was clearly not pass interference. Trom just doesn't like Carroll. Carroll has played as well as anyone in our secondary. In fact Carroll has looked better than Woodson and Collins. Carroll will be fine.
     
  9. tromadz

    tromadz Cheesehead

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    you guys are...wrong. Pyle, ur used to that, but come on. read the rules that zero was so kind to provide.

    I know you wouldnt be disagreeing with me for the sake of disagreeing, you would neeeeeeever do that.
     
  10. pyledriver80

    pyledriver80 Cheesehead

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    No I saw what everyone else BUT YOU saw.
     
  11. Zero2Cool

    Zero2Cool I own a website

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    lol
     
  12. yooperfan

    yooperfan Cheesehead

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    Carrol clearly made a good play like him or not.
     
  13. Buckeyepackfan

    Buckeyepackfan Cheesehead

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    A good play by Carroll, which ruins Trom's whole week.

    He can't blame Ahmad on the poor play of the db's and he will never say anything bad about any player TT has brought in.
     
  14. Bruce

    Bruce Cheesehead

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    This has nothing to do with special rules and excuses -- I am in the Ahmad Carroll thread and not the Koren Robinson thread aren't I? :wink:

    This is simply a writer (not a very good one IMO) offering an opinion . Carroll has never complained about Green Bay, but many players (especially African American, but others too) have talked about the culture shock of coming to Green Bay -- this is not a complaint or an excuse for anything, rather a very real experience.


    That is not a slam on the city of Green Bay, it is a great little (relatively) community. But face it for Packer players one of the (many) culture shocks is playing in a fish bowl regardless of color, than multiplied if you are African American and multiplied again if you are an African American from a large urban city that is predominately black.

    FYI: In case it missed you attention the % of African Americans living in Green Bay is 1.38%, whereas the racial makeup of the Atlanta is 61.39% Black.

    Note: these are just facts, not excuses, not judgements, simply facts.
     
  15. Zero2Cool

    Zero2Cool I own a website

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    While I agree with some of this, Ahmad wasn't brought in by Ted. It was Sherman who gets all the credit for that.
     
  16. Bruce

    Bruce Cheesehead

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    LOL trom it became obvious long ago that you never played the game, which is cool and does not have anything to do with your fanhood, but no objective person thought it was pass interference. Not the refs (who were calling the game in Detroit), not the announcers, not the coachs from either team, and no one but you at this forum or any other I have visited.

    Like I wrote earlier, if refs start calling that interference, the next very small step will be forcing DBs to wear dresses.

    Carrol played an outstanding game -- not just on that play but the whole game.

    I know it is hard for you to give props where props are due, but you are so obviously blinded by your bias here.
     
  17. Bruce

    Bruce Cheesehead

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    Zero: You obviously missed Buck's point... which was if Ted had brought Ahmad in Trom would be calling him the 2nd coming and defending him left and right. He would be calling everyone who questioned the play an idiot and worse...
    That was what Buckeye was writing -- if you reread his post I think it will become obvious to you.
     
  18. Buckeyepackfan

    Buckeyepackfan Cheesehead

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    Just bad wording on my part. I am referring to the 52 million dollar man and the 10 million dollar man that have yet to play up to their potential but don't get hammered the way Carroll does.
     
  19. DePack

    DePack Cheesehead

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    Exactly Bruce. Anytime some of these guys reads anything about race it is perceived as "playing the race card". The reporter is just stating facts. How many people on this board that are white would be comfortable taking a job and performing in a 98% black community while constantly being booed and bitched about?
     
  20. Ryan

    Ryan Cheesehead

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    I don't know how that portion of the statement has nothing to do with race. Would an Ivy league "Caucasin" from Atlanta have the same "adjustment problems"? By this thinking:
    Yes they would. Would they write in the article, well the rich white boy isn't adjusting well, it must be because he grew up in Atlanta, had everything given to him, earned his degree at Yale etc etc.

    It doesn't matter where you are from, you can either play or not. I have never played in front of 70K people, I will give him that much, but I have been booed by a good 9K before at D1 College Soccer games... You're out there to do a job, regardless of what everything else thinks. You can either do your job well, or not. It doesn't matter what color you are... plain and simple.
     
  21. digsthepack

    digsthepack Cheesehead

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    Um, DePack.....inner city kid? The kid grew up solid middle class....not exactly going from the projects to that "De-luxe apartment in the sky"!!

    Bottom line, the writer was way off base. The knock on Carroll coming out was that he did not take coaching well, somewhat beligerent/stubborn, and way to brash for his accomplishments.

    Seems a whole lot more to do with attitude than ethnicity or social demographics.
     
  22. Bruce

    Bruce Cheesehead

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    There is a huge difference between making an obvious statement regarding race, and saying someone is playing the race card. The man simply stated a very real fact -- it is not an excuse or a race card. Further, it is an opinion piece -- not an indictment of Racism in America.

    DePack asks an interesting and provocative question above. If you were in a community where there were only 1.38% Caucasions and you came from a place that was very different and where you were used to being in the majority and you were greeted with boos and people calling you names like PUNK, PUKE, THUG and worse you might just find it a bit of a culture shock -- plain and simple.

    Yes, an Ivy league Euro-American from Atlanta would suffer culture shock moving to Green Bay, but in very different ways, but come on he could certainly pass unnoticed through the streets of Green Bay without everyone identifying him as being either a Packer or part of a very small ethnic community

    Wait a minute are we talking about Bush or Carrol here? Because aside from the Atlanta piece it does sound an awful lot like W :wink:

    Finally, we totally agree :D


    Unless you were really bad I doubt it was it was by your home crowd that were supposed to be your fans. Further, of course as White man you can be quite assured that those mostly 9k white folks in the stands were not influenced by the fact that you were white.

    Ryan you are a great guy, but it is you who is turning this poorly written opinion piece into some huge Racial issue. The author made mention of culture shock in the 4th point in his opinion piece -- that hardly qualifies as playing a race card.

    You are making a mountain over a molehill, my friend.
     
  23. DePack

    DePack Cheesehead

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    You didn't answer my question? Put yourself in his racial situation. How would you handle it?
     
  24. Packnic

    Packnic Cheesehead

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    The fact is carroll had a decent game and that play was borderline, but i wouldnt have called it.... then again im a packer fan.

    However there is more than one African American on this team. To even bring it up is ridiculous. Before that game Carroll was disappointing to say the least. He was booed because he played poorly and continously set us back with pentalties. If any player white black purple yellow whatever did what carroll did for 2 straight years.... they would get booed too. I dont feel one bit bad for him and if he straightens up listens to coaches and plays at the level he established sunday He wont be booed... period. Hes a talented speedy kid and i just hope sunday was the turning point for him .
     
  25. DePack

    DePack Cheesehead

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    This is all true....the reporter (not Ahmad) was just stating that it must be difficult to be in his situation coming out of college at a young age.

    I'm not so sure why we are all afraid to discuss the race issue without getting heated. Nobody is accusing Green Bay of being a racial town, just a mostly white town, which I'm sure nobody here would disagree with.
     

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