Middleton declines player option

[longtimefan]

Bucks GM Horst confirms Middleton declined player option for 2023-24 season​

 

[Voyageur]

I'm going to watch what happens next, with great interest. It could go a lot of ways, including sideways.

 

[Sanguine camper]

Middleton is too old and misses too many games. The quicker the Bucks move on from him the better. Time to rebuild the gray hair franchise.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Middleton is too old and misses too many games. The quicker the Bucks move on from him the better. Time to rebuild the gray hair franchise.

The Bucks are quickly aging around their superstar Giannis. It's gonna be tough to get younger and stay near the top of the standings though. I do hope Lopez returns because, what are the options? As much as I like Middleton, as a person and a player, his best days are behind him, or on the bench through his frequent injuries. The Bucks can't afford to keep him.

Unfortunately they have very little draft capital to acquire younger players or make deals. In hindsight, giving up 5 second round picks for an aging Jae Crowder was a terrible move.

If the Bucks are gonna win another championship with Giannis, it has to be this season or next. In the meantime, Horst has to thread a needle to replace aging veterans with younger and ideally better players. Good luck......

 

[Voyageur]

Okay. We need to get younger. But, that means stripping this roster down. When people say that Middleton is too old, start to think about what you're actually saying.

Holiday, Lopez, and Matthews, are all older than Khris, who is 31. Matthews 36, Lopez 35, and Holiday, 33. Better get rid of them too, if Middleton is toast.

As far as the rest of the major part of this roster, there are no young 23 year old studs on the roster. Even Giannis is 28. Might as well start thinking about dumping him.

What's frustrating is how much they gave up to get guys like Crowder, and several others over the years.

My opinion? Try to keep as much of this roster as possible, and get some pieces from free agency. Try to hang onto guys like Ingels, despite being 35. And quit trading away the future for marginal players who are older. Instead, find young guys who don't require giving up draft picks. We're not going to have much as it is, for way too long.

In all honesty, I believe this team has at most, 2-3 years to win it all again, and it's going to be a total rebuild, including replacing Giannis.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Okay. We need to get younger. But, that means stripping this roster down. When people say that Middleton is too old, start to think about what you're actually saying.

Holiday, Lopez, and Matthews, are all older than Khris, who is 31. Matthews 36, Lopez 35, and Holiday, 33. Better get rid of them too, if Middleton is toast.

As far as the rest of the major part of this roster, there are no young 23 year old studs on the roster. Even Giannis is 28. Might as well start thinking about dumping him.

What's frustrating is how much they gave up to get guys like Crowder, and several others over the years.

My opinion? Try to keep as much of this roster as possible, and get some pieces from free agency. Try to hang onto guys like Ingels, despite being 35. And quit trading away the future for marginal players who are older. Instead, find young guys who don't require giving up draft picks. We're not going to have much as it is, for way too long.

In all honesty, I believe this team has at most, 2-3 years to win it all again, and it's going to be a total rebuild, including replacing Giannis.

All good points. And yeah the championship window is tight. And once they drop from contention, Giannis will look elsewhere, and I wouldn't blame him. They call him freak for a reason. He won't play for any team that can't contend.

 

[Sanguine camper]

The tean is just too old. If you think they hit the wall last season, just wait until next year. The team needs to be rebuilt. Will Giannis wait 4-5 seasons to contend again and give up the remaining best years of his career with a mediocre squad. Doubtful. The window with the current old dudes has closed shut.

 

[Voyageur]

The tean is just too old. If you think they hit the wall last season, just wait until next year. The team needs to be rebuilt. Will Giannis wait 4-5 seasons to contend again and give up the remaining best years of his career with a mediocre squad. Doubtful. The window with the current old dudes has closed shut.

I don't see your logic. You're throwing in the towel. They won more games during the regular season than anyone else. The Heat didn't just dump the Bucks, they dumped everyone in the East to make the finals. Even though they were whipped in the finals, they beat everyone thrown at them until then. They got just plain hot at the right time.

We have no draft picks. Getting rid of players without getting solid compensation would just destroy the team. What makes you so certain the problem wasn't the coaching itself?

I'll stick with putting the team in a position to make a run at it I want to see what the new coach has in mind.

 

[Heyjoe4]

I don't see your logic. You're throwing in the towel. They won more games during the regular season than anyone else. The Heat didn't just dump the Bucks, they dumped everyone in the East to make the finals. Even though they were whipped in the finals, they beat everyone thrown at them until then. They got just plain hot at the right time.

We have no draft picks. Getting rid of players without getting solid compensation would just destroy the team. What makes you so certain the problem wasn't the coaching itself?

I'll stick with putting the team in a position to make a run at it I want to see what the new coach has in mind.

I see your point. Let's see what a new HC and staff can do first. And trading Middleton will get very little in return now that I think about it. Better to run it out for the next two years with this team because there's not much choice, and as you note, they won a lot of games. They'll make changes on the margins of course, but nothing drastic. They did pick up a pretty good player in the draft, Jackson.

 

[Sanguine camper]

The Bucks can go with the old guys but they're fooling themselves if they think they have enough gas in the tank to compete for a championship. Delaying a rebuild just makes it harder to get over the hump and get competitive again in the future. Don't see how any new coach is going to solve their old roster problems. If they do go with the gray beards, they should rest as many players as possible and try to squeeze in as the 8th seed.

 

[Heyjoe4]

The Bucks can go with the old guys but they're fooling themselves if they think they have enough gas in the tank to compete for a championship. Delaying a rebuild just makes it harder to get over the hump and get competitive again in the future. Don't see how any new coach is going to solve their old roster problems. If they do go with the gray beards, they should rest as many players as possible and try to squeeze in as the 8th seed.

“….squeeze in as the 8th seed”? Hey no one was happy with last season, but that comment makes no sense. Well unless you’re taking bets the Bucks finish no better than 8th in the East. Be honest, would take that bet?

 

[Voyageur]

“….squeeze in as the 8th seed”? Hey no one was happy with last season, but that comment makes no sense. Well unless you’re taking bets the Bucks finish no better than 8th in the East. Be honest, would take that bet?

No. I wouldn't take that bet. In fact, I think they could end up being a better team before the season is over. I think coaching makes more of a difference than a lot of people believe. It's subtle, when it comes to the NBA, but it's knowing how to react to what's opposite a team on the floor, and exploiting it. I don't think Bud was good at that part of the game, and spent too much time running isolation plays for Giannis. They have to show more of a complete game, and I think we'll see it this coming season.

I think they're in the hunt for a championship.

 

[Sanguine camper]

Where the Bucks finish isn't all that important as long as they make the playoffs. With their old roster, its more important to rest players than to finish with a high seed. The No 1 seed did nothing for them this year. An 8th seed is as good as a No. 1 seed if they are rested and healthy. They were gassed the past two playoffs and it showed. I agree Giannis is used in too many isolations but maybe he has to do it because the team is tired and slow.

 

[Voyageur]

Where the Bucks finish isn't all that important as long as they make the playoffs. With their old roster, its more important to rest players than to finish with a high seed. The No 1 seed did nothing for them this year. An 8th seed is as good as a No. 1 seed if they are rested and healthy. They were gassed the past two playoffs and it showed. I agree Giannis is used in too many isolations but maybe he has to do it because the team is tired and slow.

If not having home court advantage, and end up in a one game play in, that would be a little hairy. If that was the case, I'd say start tearing the roster down, and rebuild. I'd even suggest trading Giannis for a treasure trove of first round picks, and a couple of decent players to make them at least competitive from the start.

 

[Heyjoe4]

No. I wouldn't take that bet. In fact, I think they could end up being a better team before the season is over. I think coaching makes more of a difference than a lot of people believe. It's subtle, when it comes to the NBA, but it's knowing how to react to what's opposite a team on the floor, and exploiting it. I don't think Bud was good at that part of the game, and spent too much time running isolation plays for Giannis. They have to show more of a complete game, and I think we'll see it this coming season.

I think they're in the hunt for a championship.

I agree. And coaching makes a big difference. Miami is a great example. Spoelstra was like a conductor, ever changing depending on the opponent and game situation. Denver finally beat them with brute force.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Where the Bucks finish isn't all that important as long as they make the playoffs. With their old roster, its more important to rest players than to finish with a high seed. The No 1 seed did nothing for them this year. An 8th seed is as good as a No. 1 seed if they are rested and healthy. They were gassed the past two playoffs and it showed. I agree Giannis is used in too many isolations but maybe he has to do it because the team is tired and slow.

This all makes sense, thanks for the clarification. And I agree, playoff seeding isn't as important as playoff readiness (and that means rest for older guys). It's an entirely new season. Miami more or less proved that this year.