Heres why i will not be a Packer fan once Favre retires

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wils0646

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Two quick things...

1) Why blindly support anything management does?

2) They have been trying to get rid of Hendu for years now, they finally got their wish. Hendu is gone now and we will see how his successor's legacy fairs.


1) Were not blindly supporting him. I believe in what he's doing. Newsflash: He's been doing the same thing for 3 years.

2) Jesus, let him go. The NFL is a business. I loved Hendo, but he got beat out by Miree and Leach because he couldn't block as well as them. The better FBs got the job to make the team better.
 

MIPackFan

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The talk about moving Woodson to S. Why? Collins will come around and have a big year. He started to look alot more comfortable the end of last season. Also add in Rouse and we have a hard hitting S tandem that ol' Chuck Cecil would be proud of.
 

digsthepack

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Byr-Bye...don't let the door hit you in the *** on your way to being a Viking fan!
 
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flapackfan

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although DT may be deep we dont have a great DT we have good ones and thats why we took him plus a good D-line makes average secondarys look good.

yea but we didnt need a 1st round DT. We had greater needs in other areas.


wow you can see the future? can you tell me which lottery card holds the grand prize? anyways the guy fits in our scheme perfect and he sees the hole and hits it. Im pretty sure they run the ZBS so he already has experience in it. Ahman Green was from Nebraska

So because Ahman Green played at Nebraska 10 years ago, this guy is a perfect fit for our team?? Nobody projected this guy to be a 2nd rounder besides the Packers. He was a reach in rd 3 and rd 4 is where he should have been picked. Im telling you, Deshawn Wynn (7th rounder) will beat him out.


guess you werent watching when they drafted Clark Harris TE from Rutgers not to mention we have Tory Humphrey, Zac Alcorn who we have been high on but havent got a chance to play when Martin was here well now he is gone

Are you sick in the head?? You really think a 7th round tight end is going to compete for a starting spot on our team??? Whey i say we didnt get a tight end, i mean we didnt get a good tight end. You know this but you argue with me anyway because you are a *******. Anyone who thinks Clark Harris is going to start next year, i got a nice bridge i have for sale.

Guess you missed these 2 picks two. James Jones, David Clowney. Both were talked very highly by the experts when the packers drafted them funny thing is about Jones they said teams were hoping he would go unoticed so they could have got him same thing they said about Jennings last year. also we have Ruvell Martin and Caryle Holiday who both were starting to look good and Koren if he stays clean will help out alot.

A 3rd and 5th round receiver is going to help our team more than Randy Moss??? Sure there is the occasional Marcus Colston late round receiver that turns out to be a star. But in general, these 3rd & 5th rounders usually turn out to be nothing. And if they do make the team, they are either practice squad guys or they take 3 - 4 years to turn into 3rd string receivers. Dont waste your time trying to sell anyone on these 3rd & 5th round receivers. They will not help our team in any way next year or the year after. They certainly will not beat out Koren, DD, Jennings any time soon. Lol, cant believe we are even discussing this.


#1 who ever said anything about moving Woodson to safety? Him and Harris are one of the best CB duels we have had in a long time and although he covers #2 WR some say he outperformed Harris last year. Did you even watch the draft because we drafted Aaron Rouse, safety, Virginia Tech he is 6' 4" and once again we have a bunch of other guys on our roster already and the way Marviel Underwood was performing before he got hurt he probably would have beat out Manuel for the spot.

I kind of like the pick since we totally dropped the ball and missed out on Sabby Piscatelli in round 2. We had a shot to get Sabby but TT had his thumb up his butt i guess and decided to go for a 3rd string RB instead of a stud Safety in Sabby. Rouse wont be any better this year or next year than Manuel though. He did not make our team better. He might be good, he might not. I know that Deon Grant would have completed our secondary and he was definitely available. TT needs to learn how to "go after" free agents and make them want to play for us instead of having the excuse every time of "he wanted more money" or "he wanted to go to a winner" or "he didnt fit our scheme". All that crap aint gonna mean much when we are 5 - 11 next year.

PackerLegend said:
we drafted Allen Barbre who was also highly talked about by the scouts and our O-Line was very young but improving over the course of the year and expect the same this year.

http://nfl.com/draft/drafttracker/team/GB

Great, so we get another 4th round offensive lineman. Did you really just say what you said. im talking about impact players. Not 4 th & 5th rounders who might or might not be decent players some day in the future.

William Henderson was on our team and Bradon Miree beat him out and outperformed him which shows although he may not be a top FB he has skills

yea, Miree isnt bad and he is definitely better than Hendo. Im not so upset about not getting a starting fullback but we eventually need to get depth. Another Miree type fullback because fullbacks get hurt all the time.

Poppinga did fine last year for basically his rookie season because he saw the field the whole year starting. He is improving and that DT you are complaining about should help put pressure and take out o-line blocks so our fast LB's can get to the QB.

As a linebacker, you can either defend the pass or you can not. Popinga can not. We need a guy who can. He and safety were our weak links in the passing game once Ahmad Caroll were gone. Dont tell me hes gonna get better. He isnt mobile enough to cover tight ends & running backs.

Randy wanted to go to New England because he felt like he had a better chance there to get something he doesnt have yet, a ring. Also he was unwilling to redo his deal with the pack because he wanted to go to New England.

This is why we should have wrapped the deal up 2 or 3 months ago. Sure, it might have cost more than a 4th rounder. Maybe we have to fork up a 3rd rounder but who cares. Randy was willing to work with us back then. He is not willing to do it now because he sees the opportunity to go to the Patriots. This is why we need a GM who knows how to pull the freaking trigger instead of sit back and hope things work out. Fire his *** now.

although he was very dissapointing last season he is still a good blocker and can catch the ball sometimes. And who will be starting will be determined throughout the numerous minicamps and preseason because jobs are earned.

Catch the ball sometimes??? Are you kidding?? West Coast offense DEMANDS a prolific tight end. We have a guy who can "catch the ball sometimes"???? And you are happy with that? Honestly if our 7th round draft pick is starting or if Bubba is starting, we are screwed either way, bottom line. Bubba is a waste of space. All he was ever good for is standing there in the endzone like a tree while Favre delivered perfect strikes to him for touchdowns. He is not a quality player, just a guy who has made millions off Favre. Bubba should just retire instead of embarrass himself even further.

that is what it looks like Morency did good last year and was alot quicker then Green and what is so bad about that guy from Nebraska? he already has experience in the ZBS and maurice jones-drew was a 2nd round pick last year and he did very good

I have nothing against him except we could have gotten him later or equal value later in the draft. Damn, Deshawn Wynn will be just as good if not better. Ive seen both play and i'd rather have Wynn, lol. Why compare a guy with a completely different frame & running style to Jones-Drew. Like comparing Randy Moss to Wes Welker. get real.


the team wont be worse. We lost an ageing RB who got paid to much and was very fumble prone, a backup tight end who couldnt stay healthy and a old FB who was beat out by Bradon Miree. WOW big losses there!

I was glad we dumped Green. But i thought we would at least get McGahee, Lewis or someone else who was available.
 

Arles

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PackerLegend said:
although DT may be deep we dont have a great DT we have good ones and thats why we took him plus a good D-line makes average secondarys look good.

yea but we didnt need a 1st round DT. We had greater needs in other areas.
That's the logic we used on Jamal Reynolds, Ahmad Carroll and Antwan Edwards. Oh, CRAP, we need a WR/TE/RB - better take the best guy! No matter that he isn't a good value here - we need to help Brett!!

Come on, there was no value at the offense spots and TT tried to trade down (to no avail). So, we had to choose at 16 and Harrell was the best prospect that could help the team. Run-stuffing DT was a need on this team (check the Seattle and Jets games from 06) and this draft was pretty deep at WR.


So because Ahman Green played at Nebraska 10 years ago, this guy is a perfect fit for our team?? Nobody projected this guy to be a 2nd rounder besides the Packers. He was a reach in rd 3 and rd 4 is where he should have been picked. Im telling you, Deshawn Wynn (7th rounder) will beat him out.
Scouts.com had him as a late 2nd or early 3rd. Given we traded down to one of the final second round picks, he wasn't a reach. He would have been gone by the James Jones pick (if you look at value). He was also tabbed as a sleeper back by many people. Will he be good? Who knows, but I don't see any back we could have grabbed from 16 to 63 that would have been better. Kenny Irons? Chris Henry? Leonard? These guys had just as many questions and played in completely different systems.


Are you sick in the head?? You really think a 7th round tight end is going to compete for a starting spot on our team??? Whey i say we didnt get a tight end, i mean we didnt get a good tight end. You know this but you argue with me anyway because you are a *******. Anyone who thinks Clark Harris is going to start next year, i got a nice bridge i have for sale.
Scouts had him as a mid-5th round value and a sleeper to contribute. I don't think it's a stretch to think we can have a decent set of TEs with Franks, Harris, Lee and Acorn. No worse than last season and we still have an FA period to look at other guys if need be.

A 3rd and 5th round receiver is going to help our team more than Randy Moss???
No one is saying that, Mr. Strawman. But, I think there's a decent chance that we will be solid at receiver with DD, Jennings, James Jones, K-Rob, Clowney, Ferguson and others. And, again, if GB isn't sold still, there will be a handful of capable No. 3 receivers released. 17 WRs were taken on day 1 (ave is 12), so I don't think it's a stretch to say some solid receivers will be let go because of these additions. If we don't add any more receivers before camp, I will agree that GB has an issue with No. 3. But that's almost 3 months away.

I kind of like the pick since we totally dropped the ball and missed out on Sabby Piscatelli in round 2. We had a shot to get Sabby but TT had his thumb up his butt i guess and decided to go for a 3rd string RB instead of a stud Safety in Sabby.
I am as big a Sabby fan as you can get - but Rouse is not that far off what Sabby would have given us. In fact, some had him rated higher. Plus, Jackson was rated by most as a much better prospect than Sabby (Scouts gave him a 77 and Sabby a 70, 30 spots below in the overall rankings). So, saying Jackson was a reach and Sabby would not have been is simply not true. I personally think both would have been solid picks but am glad we grabbed Jackson.

I also find it interesting that you knock GB for drafting the best value defensive prospect in round 1 over offense, but also knock GB for drafting a good value RB in round 2 instead of a lower valued defensive player.

Rouse wont be any better this year or next year than Manuel though.
But Sabby would? Scouts had Sabby one spot above Rouse (both 3rd rounders). I guess that one spot is the difference from an impact starter and bench fodder, right? Sabby would have been just as much a question mark as Rouse. Plus, Rouse is a much better ST guy.

Great, so we get another 4th round offensive lineman. Did you really just say what you said. im talking about impact players. Not 4 th & 5th rounders who might or might not be decent players some day in the future.
We're talking about backups here. What did you want to do? Go out and pay $60 million to Leonard Davis to be our backup OT? It's either going to be a retred vet (ie, Klemm) or draft pick with potential. 4th round is a good spot to get value at tackle and we got a fairly high rated one. My guess is that he and Moll will do just as well backing up our tackles as some retred would - plus Barbre has the potential to be a starter.

As a linebacker, you can either defend the pass or you can not. Popinga can not. We need a guy who can. He and safety were our weak links in the passing game once Ahmad Caroll were gone. Dont tell me hes gonna get better. He isnt mobile enough to cover tight ends & running backs.
I'm thinking we will be playing more nickel with Rouse at SS (is almost like a OLB in size, but has speed of a S) and the addition of Walker. That said, I wouldn't mind seeing another OLB body to compete with Popinga. One guy to keep an eye on is Rory Johnson (undrafted OLB we signed). He was rated by Scouts as a 3rd round value and was a coverage-style LB at Miss. Here's a snippet from his bio:

"Gets adequate depth in drops and can cover a lot of ground in zone coverage. Changes directions quickly, explodes out of cuts and flashes above-average man-to-man cover skills."

He could be a sleeper in camp.

This is why we should have wrapped the deal up 2 or 3 months ago. Sure, it might have cost more than a 4th rounder. Maybe we have to fork up a 3rd rounder but who cares. Randy was willing to work with us back then. He is not willing to do it now because he sees the opportunity to go to the Patriots. This is why we need a GM who knows how to pull the freaking trigger instead of sit back and hope things work out. Fire his *** now.
This has been talked about ad nausium, but here's what we would have had to do to get Moss before the draft (if you believe ESPN, NFL.com, Scouts, PFW and Fox - all are consistent):

1. Pay Al a 2nd round pick for Moss. He wanted a 1st or 2nd to move him prior to the draft.
2. Keep Moss at $9 mil for 07 and $9 mil for 08.

If you are willing to do both there's a chance we could have gotten him before the draft. Of course, there's also a chance he would pull a TO with Baltimore and complain his way to NE anyway.

Catch the ball sometimes??? Are you kidding?? West Coast offense DEMANDS a prolific tight end. We have a guy who can "catch the ball sometimes"???? And you are happy with that? Honestly if our 7th round draft pick is starting or if Bubba is starting, we are screwed either way, bottom line. Bubba is a waste of space.
I would like to see one more TE brought in. We'll see if it happens.

I have nothing against him except we could have gotten him later or equal value later in the draft. Damn, Deshawn Wynn will be just as good if not better. Ive seen both play and i'd rather have Wynn, lol. Why compare a guy with a completely different frame & running style to Jones-Drew. Like comparing Randy Moss to Wes Welker. get real.
Drew - 5'7, 205, 4.43 speed and a scouts ranking of 79/100.
Jackson - 5'9. 210, 4.48 speed and a scouts ranking of 77/100.

Drew also had a history of durability issues at UCLA (like Jackson at Nebraska) and he was looked on as a back that would struggle to carry the full load (jackson too). In his senior season, Drew finished with 914 yards on 186 carries (4.9 ypc) and 453 yards on 31 receptions. In his senior season, Jackson had 989 yards on 188 attempts (5.3 ypc) and 313 yards on 33 receptions. You couldn't find a more spot-on comparision for Jackson from the 2006 class than Drew when looking at prospect profiles.
 

pyledriver80

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I agree with you bud. I would never not be a Packers fan however and think you are overreacting. Just count down the days til Ted goes.

Harrell was a terrible pick. The whole draft was terrible. No Moss, No Turner, No LJ.

These people live in the world of potential and not reality. They live in the world where Brandon Jackson is a starting back, where a 7th round TE is good enough, where having cap space is the same thing as a super bowl.

It's only a matter of time before Ted is shown the door.
 

OregonPackFan

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Jackson is very much like Drew in all aspects.

However I think Jackson is more polished and stronger than Drew and might be a better back as a rookie than Drew was.
 

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So Flapackfan, you lost me at "we didn't draft a safety" And your logic that only guys drafted in the first two rounds can be contributors? You better call Donald Driver and tell him to start sucking year after year because he's been doing it wrong.

Go break some teams down by the rounds they were drafted. Hits and misses occur at the same percentages in each round.

Packerlegend shredded your rant and I thoroughly enjoyed it.
 

pyledriver80

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So Flapackfan, you lost me at "we didn't draft a safety" And your logic that only guys drafted in the first two rounds can be contributors? You better call Donald Driver and tell him to start sucking year after year because he's been doing it wrong.

Go break some teams down by the rounds they were drafted. Hits and misses occur at the same percentages in each round.

Packerlegend shredded your rant and I thoroughly enjoyed it.


Why do we depend on "hits & misses" every year?
 

Arles

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Why do we depend on "hits & misses" every year?
There are no "hits & misses" in FA? I'd be interested in hearing of a manner to add players that never misses. I'd be all in favor of GB taking that route from now on. :thumbsup:
 

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You can get good players in the whole draft, most teams get good players in the whole draft, the difference is that early rounders usually make a larger impact early on in their careers while late rounders gradually catch on.
 

pyledriver80

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pyledriver80 said:
Why do we depend on "hits & misses" every year?
There are no "hits & misses" in FA? I'd be interested in hearing of a manner to add players that never misses. I'd be all in favor of GB taking that route from now on. :thumbsup:

Uhhh

Randy Moss Vs. James Jones - Who's the biggest question mark?

Justin Griffith vs. DeSawn Wynn - ditto?

You know what you get with FA's most of the time. With rookies its a crapshoot and if they don't pan out you have to have somewhere to turn
 

Arles

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I'll give you Griffith. I think we should have signed him. As to Moss, I think it's well-documented that GB made a pretty good effort after Moss but he wanted to go elsewhere. GB benefited from a similar situation in the late 90s with Keith Jackson so I think you just have to play the "**** happens" card with the Moss situation.
 

digsthepack

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Moss is chasing a championship. I beleive we can ALL agree that NE is a little closer to that goal than the Packers.
 

pyledriver80

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Moss is chasing a championship. I beleive we can ALL agree that NE is a little closer to that goal than the Packers.

I agree but why? Why is NE a little closer. Why are they highly regarded as the team to beat this year?
 

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flapackfan is PMSing.... its all hate from him... lol... Dude look at seattle and see what he did with them through the draft.... Shaun Alexander, Marcus Tubbs, Steve Hutchinson... Tatupu I mean the guy knows what he is doing...
 

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You're a complete *******. The Packers D-line was good but not as good as you might like to think. Just look at all the other D-lines in the NFC North, specifically at the DT position. Chicago has Kelly and Tank Johnson. Minnesota has the Williams'. Hell, even Detroit has Rogers and Redding. Pickett was good for the Pack last year. But no one else really was consistent. Jenkins was moved outside. Williams and Cole were up and down all year.

You have got to be able to stop the run in this division especially. We weren't able to do so consistently. Harrell will help up front and give the LB's, room to make plays.

The offensive line progressed all season long. I thought, as a whole, it was much improved from the year before. It should be very good this year with everyone back, healthy and stronger. You can't just sign guys to play O-line in
the zone-blocking scheme. It takes a lot of time to learn and fully understand.

People said the same thing last year about Jennings. Look at what he was able to do. Let TT do his job.

Do us all a favor and just leave. Beleive me, we won't miss you.

You beat me to it here slick.

If you look just at our division alone it is obvious how invested in the "D" line they are. The stud defensive lines in this league use HIGH draft picks to get there.
Our "D" line performance was very inconsistant in that ONE spot. Pickett did a great job. The other guy was always a mystery. Cole got like all his sacks in one game and then nothing.
They would hold up great and then get destroyed like Seattle.

We're in the North Division where you HAVE GOT to stop the run in that second half of the season when it's cold as hell. It is no coincidence that our Lambeau domination headed south right along with a weak "D" line.

Chicago is GOING to run the ball. Minny just picked up Peterson. What do you think they're going to do with him?

Many have graded the Packers on what help was given Favre but not much thought was put into the idea a top 10 defense would be nice. If a couple more players puts us CONSISTANTLY in the top ten I would think it would tickle BF pink.

It's only been about five years since he's seen a decent one. After how we finished last year and adding a couple of key components we can very much expect a stout performance over there this year.

This move puts Jenkins on the outside more often as well. I'm all for that.
 
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I agree but why? Why is NE a little closer. Why are they highly regarded as the team to beat this year?

To be honest, I think the answer is Tom Brady.

He is a franchise QB, one that can carry a team on his back and say 'I'll take you to glory".

In that regard, he is somewhat like Favre during the Sherman era. I think we'll agree that Favre wasn't surrounded by the greatest talent then, yet he still had the ability to elevate others play around him.

Brady's supporting cast was dreadful last year, yet he took them within a half of getting to the Superbowl. Favre is no longer the QB that can do that at his age.
 

digsthepack

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Um...NE is in the position of favorite for the very same reason the Packers were for several years back to back in the 1990s....because they are good!!

Newsflash, huh?

How was that team built for sustainable excellence? Through the draft and, as a result, having replacements on the roster when aging warriors fall short or injury strikes. It also puts them in the position of SELECTIVELY acquire FAs to put them over the top.

Funny, now that we are building our team in a fashion similar to argueably the best organization of the last 7 - 8 years, TT's methods suck.

A little perspective, people.
 

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digsthepack said:
Moss is chasing a championship. I beleive we can ALL agree that NE is a little closer to that goal than the Packers.

I agree but why? Why is NE a little closer. Why are they highly regarded as the team to beat this year?


are you serious pyle.

this is what we have been arguing about for 2 years. NE is where they are, a highly regarded football team with the ability to win the championship everyyear.... because they had a GM come in and change the game.

They fixed contracts and made smart aquisitions of players no one had heard of but were football players. They drafted well, stuck to their plan, inserted key FA's that may not have cost much, but got the job done.

exactly what most of us with sense believe TT is doing. Gettin things straight in the offseason instead of frantically trying to buy everything some forum monkey thinks will help.

Building with key cogs and not destroying a teams ability to grow and develop by spending money just to get a "name player".

now NE has cap room and rings, and now they have a reputation as a winner, which helps a GM when trying to get a player like Moss.

Ted Thompson is no where near the door...
 
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