Wow!!! Colt Lyerla participating in rookie camp

[GoPGo]

I would really appreciate it if you would stop talking about something you obviously have no idea about. There´s a huge difference between a guy occasionally taking drugs because he enjoys being high and a drug addict.

Maybe you should think before you accuse someone of not knowing what they're talking about. I'm a certified psychiatric nurse with going on 8 years of experience in acute care, which includes... you guessed it, drug addiction.

I'm sorry, the idea that drug addiction is a "disease" is nothing more than a metaphor that some take WAY too literally. The biggest problem with the field of psychiatry is the continued legitimization of maladaptive and malevolent behavior with each edition of the DSM. For instance, the DSM-V now identifies "Pedophillic Disorder." I wonder how long it will be until some degenerate child ****** gets off easy thanks to that stroke of brilliance. Now I'm fully aware that there are some circles that inexplicably consider drug addiction to be a "disease" but there are other circles that reject that hypothesis, and a hypothesis is all it is. I will repeat, there is no empirical evidence that supports the disease model.

Drug addiction occurs due to stupid decisions on the part of the addicted, PERIOD. The only exception is babies born addicted to drugs because of their mothers' stupid decisions. People can overcome their addiction by making wise decisions and following through on them. No other "disease" can be overcome by making the decision that you're no longer going to have it anymore. And for the record, lack of will power isn't a disease either.

Again, labeling drug addiction as a disease does NOTHING to help addicts. I couldn't count the number of times I've heard addicts use the disease label to justify their behavior. The worst one that stands out most in my mind was just last fall. We had a 20-something woman who was 7 months pregnant and was in for an overdose on Xanax and methamphetamine. When asked how she feels about what might be happening to her baby, she said, "Hey, what do you expect me to do? I HAVE A F***ING DISEASE! There's nothing I can do about it so get off my ***!" That's not a paraphrase either. It's a verbatim quote.

There is exactly one and only one benefit to labeling drug addiction as a disease... expanding insurance coverage. That's it. And those proponents are where you find the disease model being touted the most.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

He may have been struggling with drugs in that very moment. He may have some sort of mental issue. That's not the sort of idea that comes from a normal person's thought processes, and neither is something to shun him for.

Yeah, it is. There are enough things in this world that people use for excuses...he CHOSE to do drugs, therefore those those things he did while under its influence are his responsibility. I can forgive someone many things do to youthful indiscretion but insulting and belittling that tragedy isn't one of them.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

He obviously watched some articles and things that a lot of other people also believe could be true and got all sucked into it. Just like 9/11 conspiracy or Kennedy assassination, some people always jump to conspiracy theories. Easy thing to do for a guy that's been up several nights high on cocaine let alone for people that are straight sober.

He made a mistake and it sounds like he is aware of it.

You're right,I forgot, people are always mocking the massacre of children when high on cocaine...my bad

 

[Sunshinepacker]

Lots of people do really dumb **** when they are in their high school and college years. If he has gotten his act together and is all in then I am fine with him being part of this organization. The one thing I trust the most about Murphy, TT and MM is their evaluation of character. If he is good with them then he is good with me.

Yup, I can't count the number of college students that told the parents of a murdered child that they were lying. Those wacky kids

 

[Brett Favre 4]

When will we know, if Lyerla made the team or not?

 

[brandon2348]

You're right,I forgot, people are always mocking the massacre of children when high on cocaine...my bad

It's not like he is a child killer. I am not here to go over and discuss what happened at Sandy Hook as obviously it was a huge tragedy but this is a football forum. I can sense that the tragedy still causes you great pain as it does a lot of others including myself.

I am not trying to defend Colt Lyerla but people tweet stupid things all the time that aren't clearly thought out or that are being controlled by something else. Maybe a substance. Maybe some propaganda they hear. It can be many things.

Were talking about a 21 year old kid here that has already taken some steps to handle some of the symptoms that have been causing himself some problems. If anything I think people should be supportive of someone trying to get better rather then nit picking something they did that bothers them.

Everyone deserves a second chance and TT is not a sucker at giving them out. In this scenario it is definitely "In Ted I Trust" for me.

 

[brandon2348]

When will we know, if Lyerla made the team or not?

I would think very soon.

 

[GoPGo]

When will we know, if Lyerla made the team or not?

Some time between tomorrow and August 31, when final cuts are due.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Maybe you should think before you accuse someone of not knowing what they're talking about. I'm a certified psychiatric nurse with going on 8 years of experience in acute care, which includes... you guessed it, drug addiction.

I'm sorry, the idea that drug addiction is a "disease" is nothing more than a metaphor that some take WAY too literally. The biggest problem with the field of psychiatry is the continued legitimization of maladaptive and malevolent behavior with each edition of the DSM. For instance, the DSM-V now identifies "Pedophillic Disorder." I wonder how long it will be until some degenerate child ****** gets off easy thanks to that stroke of brilliance. Now I'm fully aware that there are some circles that inexplicably consider drug addiction to be a "disease" but there are other circles that reject that hypothesis, and a hypothesis is all it is. I will repeat, there is no empirical evidence that supports the disease model.

Drug addiction occurs due to stupid decisions on the part of the addicted, PERIOD. The only exception is babies born addicted to drugs because of their mothers' stupid decisions. People can overcome their addiction by making wise decisions and following through on them. No other "disease" can be overcome by making the decision that you're no longer going to have it anymore. And for the record, lack of will power isn't a disease either.

Again, labeling drug addiction as a disease does NOTHING to help addicts. I couldn't count the number of times I've heard addicts use the disease label to justify their behavior. The worst one that stands out most in my mind was just last fall. We had a 20-something woman who was 7 months pregnant and was in for an overdose on Xanax and methamphetamine. When asked how she feels about what might be happening to her baby, she said, "Hey, what do you expect me to do? I HAVE A F***ING DISEASE! There's nothing I can do about it so get off my ***!" That's not a paraphrase either. It's a verbatim quote.

There is exactly one and only one benefit to labeling drug addiction as a disease... expanding insurance coverage. That's it. And those proponents are where you find the disease model being touted the most.

I won´t comment on this topic anymore as this is a Packers forum and I´m here to talk about football.

But, geez, I was shocked reading a comment like that coming from a certified nurse who´s actually there to help people.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

When will we know, if Lyerla made the team or not?

The Packers will announce the tryout players they have signed to the 90-man roster sometime this week.

 

[Oshkoshpackfan]

Sounds to me like this kid needs guidance and structure that the party world of college could not give him. I say we give this kid a chance. I would, if I was MM, have him drug tested during camp every 3-4 days. If he shows clean and has the correct attitiude and work ethic, then give the kid a shot. The AZ cardinals gave tyrann mathieu a chance and he went beast mode until he got hurt, and he was a **** storm of trouble before he went pro. Without 2nd chances, a lot of us would not be where we are today, maybe not for the same reasons, but he deserves a 2nd chance. Now, if he pops on a drug test with us, make it public news and kick his butt out and he will never play again.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Sounds to me like this kid needs guidance and structure that the party world of college could not give him. I say we give this kid a chance. I would, if I was MM, have him drug tested during camp every 3-4 days. If he shows clean and has the correct attitiude and work ethic, then give the kid a shot. The AZ cardinals gave tyrann mathieu a chance and he went beast mode until he got hurt, and he was a **** storm of trouble before he went pro. Without 2nd chances, a lot of us would not be where we are today, maybe not for the same reasons, but he deserves a 2nd chance. Now, if he pops on a drug test with us, make it public news and kick his butt out and he will never play again.

He´s in a court-ordered drug treatment program, so he has to take drugs tests regularly.

 

[FrankRizzo]

A) I won´t comment on this topic anymore as this is a Packers forum and I´m here to talk about football.

B) But, geez, I was shocked reading a comment like that coming from a certified nurse who´s actually there to help people.

A) You won't comment because you just had your lunch handed to you. You found out that your arm-chair, backseat comments, ideas, opinions lacked credibility compared to this trained professional.

B) Why shocked? It really does HELP when the person who has the addiction OWNS UP and TAKES RESPONSIBILTY for their OWN actions. Cancer, Diabetes are diseases. Getting addicted to a drug, yes cigarettes too, are NOT diseases.

Back to football.
I hope this jerk makes the team, and turns his life around.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

A) You won't comment because you just had your lunch handed to you. You found out that your arm-chair, backseat comments, ideas, opinions lacked credibility compared to this trained professional.

B) Why shocked? It really does HELP when the person who has the addiction OWNS UP and TAKES RESPONSIBILTY for their OWN actions. Cancer, Diabetes are diseases. Getting addicted to a drug, yes cigarettes too, are NOT diseases.

That is for sure not the reason I don´t want to talk about the topic here anymore. If you´re interested in continuing the discussion I´m more than happy to do it in a private conversation and explain it to do why I was shocked to read a statement like that from someone actually working with addicts.

 

[Jordyruns]

A) You won't comment because you just had your lunch handed to you. You found out that your arm-chair, backseat comments, ideas, opinions lacked credibility compared to this trained professional.

B) Why shocked? It really does HELP when the person who has the addiction OWNS UP and TAKES RESPONSIBILTY for their OWN actions. Cancer, Diabetes are diseases. Getting addicted to a drug, yes cigarettes too, are NOT diseases.

Back to football.
I hope this jerk makes the team, and turns his life around.

I see addiction somewhat as a disease, a disease you 100% can control if you get it or not. I see how it can make your life hard when you try to turn it around but at the same time it is no excuse as you caused it.

Well anyway I find it funny you said diabetes, while type 1 is undoubtedly a disease by any sense of the word, type 2 seems to me to fall 100% under the addiction definition of disease. Maybe you were only talking about type 1, but you did not specify and I found your logic a little flawed.

 

[ThePerfectBeard]

Man we sure do love to argue on this forum.

 

[Dan115]

My dad can beat up yours

 

[TJV]

Rodney at Packer Update votes "no" on whether or not Lyerla is worth the trouble: http://packerupdate.net/?p=33846

 

[AmishMafia]

Man we sure do love to argue on this forum.

No we don't

 

[Dylan Hoppe]

No we don't

Yes we do


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[PFanCan]

You guys are like a bunch of little old ladies who bicker over everything.

Using Google, from Websters.com:

dis·ease
1. a disordered or incorrectly functioning organ, part, structure, or system of the body resulting from the effect of genetic or developmental errors, infection, poisons, nutritional deficiency or imbalance, toxicity, or unfavorable environmental factors; illness; sickness; ailment.
2. any abnormal condition in a plant that interferes with its vital physiological processes, caused by pathogenic microorganisms, parasites, unfavorable environmental, genetic, or nutritional factors, etc.
3. any harmful, depraved, or morbid condition, as of the mind or society​

Definitions #1-2 seem to align with GoPGo's definition in that a "disease" is something you cannot "will" away. It is a physical abnormality or disordered organ or system. Something that one can see/touch/monitor. Not a behavior.

However, definition #3 seems to align with what WIMM seems to be advocating- that is, any harmful or depraved condition of the mind is a disease.

Also, Wiki (less authoritative, IMO) shows the following text. Note the 3rd-4th sentences which reveals that how this word is commonly used in relation to humans (the change to red color was done by me):

A disease is an abnormal condition that affects the body of an organism. It is often construed as a medical condition associated with specific symptoms and signs.[1] It may be caused by factors originally from an external source, such as infectious disease, or it may be caused by internal dysfunctions, such as autoimmune diseases. In humans, "disease" is often used more broadly to refer to any condition that causes pain, dysfunction, distress, social problems, or death to the person afflicted, or similar problems for those in contact with the person. In this broader sense, it sometimes includes injuries, disabilities, disorders, syndromes, infections, isolated symptoms, deviant behaviors, and atypical variations of structure and function, while in other contexts and for other purposes these may be considered distinguishable categories. Diseases usually affect people not only physically, but also emotionally, as contracting and living with many diseases can alter one's perspective on life, and one's personality.​

So, as my mom used to say, "You are both right and you are both wrong. Now, go to your rooms!"

Each and every thread has the exact same posters bickering over nothing. This forum is becoming less about the Packers and more about your petty little hatred for each other. Really? Why a mod haven't sent you all into time-out is beyond me...

 

[Dan115]

Mom always liked you best.

You guys are like a bunch of little old ladies who bicker over everything.

Using Google, from Websters.com:

dis·ease
1. a disordered or incorrectly functioning organ, part, structure, or system of the body resulting from the effect of genetic or developmental errors, infection, poisons, nutritional deficiency or imbalance, toxicity, or unfavorable environmental factors; illness; sickness; ailment.
2. any abnormal condition in a plant that interferes with its vital physiological processes, caused by pathogenic microorganisms, parasites, unfavorable environmental, genetic, or nutritional factors, etc.
3. any harmful, depraved, or morbid condition, as of the mind or society​

Definitions #1-2 seem to align with GoPGo's definition in that a "disease" is something you cannot "will" away. It is a physical abnormality or disordered organ or system. Something that one can see/touch/monitor. Not a behavior.

However, definition #3 seems to align with what WIMM seems to be advocating- that is, any harmful or depraved condition of the mind is a disease.

Also, Wiki (less authoritative, IMO) shows the following text. Note the second sentence which reveals that how this word is commonly used in relation to humans (the change to red color was done by me):

A disease is an abnormal condition that affects the body of an organism. It is often construed as a medical condition associated with specific symptoms and signs.[1] It may be caused by factors originally from an external source, such as infectious disease, or it may be caused by internal dysfunctions, such as autoimmune diseases. In humans, "disease" is often used more broadly to refer to any condition that causes pain, dysfunction, distress, social problems, or death to the person afflicted, or similar problems for those in contact with the person. In this broader sense, it sometimes includes injuries, disabilities, disorders, syndromes, infections, isolated symptoms, deviant behaviors, and atypical variations of structure and function, while in other contexts and for other purposes these may be considered distinguishable categories. Diseases usually affect people not only physically, but also emotionally, as contracting and living with many diseases can alter one's perspective on life, and one's personality.​

So, as my mom used to say, "You are both right and you are both wrong. Now, go to your rooms!"

Each and every thread has the exact same posters bickering over nothing. This forum is becoming less about the Packers and more about your petty little hatred for each other. Really? Why a mod haven't sent you all into time-out is beyond me...

 

[El Guapo]

I'm with Brandon and Oshkosh here. The kid has made a lot of bad mistakes and is about to cross the rubicon. Either he's going to steer his ship into clear waters or crash into a pile of rocks. Chances are he's still got a faulty rutter aimed towards the rock pile, but some new peers and mentors can make every bit of difference. TT gave a chance to Koren Robinson after his second or third DWI, and in return got a decent WR that finally put his life in order. He's gone way out on the limb for Jolly several times, and was once again reward last season.

...and I don't care about court-ordered drug tests. If I'm TT and sticking my neck out for Lyerla, I'm going to stand one foot away and personally watch the guy pull it out, go in the cup, and hand it to the technician. I'm then paying the technician a crisp $500 bill each time to ensure that the tests are done right. If Lyerla takes the wrong cold medicine and isn't 100% straight with the doctors, he's out on the streets. Zero tolerance and a short leash until well-past any success and/or a veteran contract.

 

[BMatt]

Personally, I really hope the Packers take a chance on Lyerla. The guy is an absolute beast.

There is no doubt that the Packers roster improves with Lyerla. With Finley presumably gone the Packers are lacking a play-maker from the TE position, Lyerla fills that void. He brings a physical presence, has good hands, is incredibly versatile, and plays with a real mean streak.

Not every player coming out of college is going to be an absolute choir-boy, college kids make stupid mistakes. All of you jumping the gun and comparing him already to Aaron Hernandez are absolute idiots.

 

[El Guapo]

All of you jumping the gun and comparing him already to Aaron Hernandez are absolute idiots.

I hadn't been one of the people your calling names, but your statement is questionable. Hernandez had not killed anybody in college yet had a troubled life off of the field prior to entering the NFL. It's fair game to question someone that has an equally checkered past up to this point. Even the Packers have history in this area with the '74 drafting of Randy Woodfield.