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Why didn't we trade for Marshawn Lynch again?

Discussion in 'Packer Fan Forum' started by Rodgers2Finley4TDs, Jan 8, 2011.

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  1. Mr Pickle

    Mr Pickle Guest

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    Because Cedric Benson is sooooooo much better (less of a criminal record). Why wait until desperation time to adderess a concern that has been there for years? Ryan Grant was not the answer nor Starks. Let's just pretend that they will have a break out seasons 'some day' and overlook the fact that we need a 'descent' running game to compliment an excellent passing game. Would we even be having this conversation if we 'sincerely' looked to improve in this area? House getting hurt is a real bummer (he showed inpressive effort). I don't believe any injuries that occured in the O backfield will have much of an impact due to the fact they didn't contribute much to begin with to the offensive attack. Another keep your fingers crossed with Benson........
     
  2. ivo610

    ivo610 Cheesehead

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    Look at the money between benson and lynch. Then look at the Lombardi. Those are the two reasons why Ted was right.
     
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  3. Mr Pickle

    Mr Pickle Guest

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    Understood. But it is a what have you done for me lately business. Time will tell about the recent choices. We have neglected the need for a run game is all I'm saying and now it's deseperation time. Dude, honestly, did you think Starks, Saine were ever really a honest effort to help the running game. You will see more pressure on Rodgers than ever now. One demensional does not make a champion. The defenses in the league are smart and catch on quick when you're throwing for 3rd and 2 all the time... We all thought Favre could do it by himself towards the end, how did that turn out? I don't want to see Rodgers desperately throwing to save the day... and he will if we have no running game and a defense as bad as last year
     
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  4. TJV

    TJV Lifelong Packers Fanatic

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    As I've posted before I think all the Packers need on offense is the threat of a running game and a sufficient number of attempts each game to keep the defense honest. Look at the stats of McCarthy's offenses since he's arrived and IMO he has achieved a good balance in that regard as he runs the ball about 40% of the time. I certainly understand some fans disagree with that point of view and I'm always interested in opposing points of view expressed well and backed by logic and facts. But what continues to amaze and amuse me are fans bringing up an example in which they have been proven wrong to make their point. There is no more decisive answer to criticism in the NFL than winning the Super Bowl. So here's my humble suggestion to any such fan finding himself in a pickle: Find an old thread on the importance of the running game which doesn't mention the possible acquisition of a RB who was completely unnecessary to achieve the ultimate goal of every NFL team.
    Four points:
    1. "What have you done for me lately" is the essence of short-sightedness and that phrase is often used derisively describing short-sighted fans.

    2. Ted Thompson led the Packers to a Super Bowl victory TWO seasons ago. Only foolish fans expecting a title every season would view that as anything other than "lately".

    3. Dude, honestly do you not realize that Starks was such a help to the running game that he helped the team win a Super Bowl? It's one thing to tout the potential of a player who has never performed in the NFL, quite another to believe a young player can repeat a former performance. Also, as of today, Brandon Saine has been a Green Bay Packer one year and 16 days. Is it possible at this early point in his career we don't know how good - or bad he can be?

    4. IMO the acquisitions of players like Sitton, Bulaga and Lang are just as important to the running game as RBs. Since you apparently disagree consider these acquisitions regarding "neglecting the need for a run game": Since arriving in Green Bay Thompson has traded for Ryan Grant, drafted Brandon Jackson in the second round, took a flier on James Starks in the sixth round (making the acquisition of a vet RB unnecessary that season), and drafted Alex Green in the third round. You can argue none of those moves worked if you'd like but that's hardly "neglect". Particularly for a GM who values draft choices as much as Thompson.
     
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  5. ivo610

    ivo610 Cheesehead

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    I get that its tough for fans to believe that the running game is more or less irrelevant in todays game. Its been engrained in your head as a fan from espn and announcers that you need a running game, you see the flashy highlights and get a little envious of teams like Jacksonville and Minnesota. The idea of "running the ball to set the pass" is untrue. It doesnt hold up in todays nfl. The Giants won the SB with the worst rushing attack in the league. We won it with a very limited rushing attack. A "balanced rushing attack" gets you an offense like the Buffalo Bills had last season, 15th in passing 13th in rushing. We have the best QB in the league, we need to use him. Our offense was the 2nd best in NFL HISTORY!!!!! last season and went 15-1. We won another NFL championship the season before. The fact that anyone is still trying to defend the their opinion that we should have acquired Lynch is just laughable.

    Wanna know when you need a running game? In fog games. I mean dense fog to the point you cant see a foot in front of you. Chicago had one about 20 years ago. Snow games? Nope, passing still works Tom Brady has proven that repeatedly. Really really windy games you do too, to some extent, but they are as rare as the fog game.

    You really seriously think Rodgers and Favre are interchangable in the discussion? That because Favre made terrible throws that Rodgers will too? Thats so ridiculous I dont even think it merits anymore discussion.
     
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  6. ivo610

    ivo610 Cheesehead

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    Aaron Rodgers averaged 33.4 throws a game last season. Only 1 game last season did he throw over 39 times.
     
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  7. Mr Pickle

    Mr Pickle Guest

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    Dude, your points are well received, Remember Edgar Bennett, Ahman Green, Dorsy Levens. What type of seasons did we have when these guys played? I have been a fan since 60, and you? I'm not here to name call, that's for children struggling to prove a point. When Rodgers is running for every 3rd down conversion or throwing for every 3rd and 1 (or his life, better yet, is our best rushing attack), remember this and my short sightedness. God take off the Thonmpson blinders, the guy is not God and everyone has flaws, his is "short sightedness" about a running game. Those lineman were built up around Rodgers, not a running game, give me a break. Something they failed to do when Favre was in his later years. Answer one question, what is James Jones making? Is he worth it, what about Hawk, is he? We have a tendency to be loyal to players that wouldn't probably play very much anywhere than Green Bay. There in lies a whole nother agenda. I apperciate all that Thompson has done, coach Mac too. I am a bleed Green and Gold Fan since you were sh***** yellow. But the team has needs.
     
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  8. Mr Pickle

    Mr Pickle Guest

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    Was that tops in the NFL? For QB throws?
     
  9. Mr Pickle

    Mr Pickle Guest

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    Yes, I know it was 'engrained' ... ;)
     
  10. Fanland

    Fanland Cheesehead

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    If I remember correctly, the potential Marshawn Lynch trade involved us sending A.J. Hawk to Buffalo. While Hawk will likely never reach the potential you expect from such a high draft, you can't overlook his presence with the injuries we've sustained at MLB. Don't get me wrong, I'd love to establish a more solid run game, but not pulling the trigger on Lynch may have been a blessing.


    www.fanland.com is an online community providing sports enthusiasts with a centralized venue to discuss all their favorite teams
     
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  11. Mr Pickle

    Mr Pickle Guest

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    I'm not and wasn't saying jump all over Lynch. I don't even like the guy, but we need a threat, what we have are unproven, constantly injured guys, I may be wrong, but wasn't Rodgers our leading rusher last year?
     
  12. Mr Pickle

    Mr Pickle Guest

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    Hawk is half of what Bennett was, I have always pulled for Hawk, but he will never be a solid MLB. Just a presence.
     
  13. Mr Pickle

    Mr Pickle Guest

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    And the Giants had a russing threat, didn't they?
     
  14. Mr Pickle

    Mr Pickle Guest

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  15. ivo610

    ivo610 Cheesehead

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    bennett?
     
  16. ivo610

    ivo610 Cheesehead

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    you clicked the "disagree" button. What part of those numbers are you disagreeing with?
     
  17. ivo610

    ivo610 Cheesehead

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    No, not even close. Aaron was middle of the road for attempts per game.
     
  18. ivo610

    ivo610 Cheesehead

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    so you click disagree on every post I have, when I am just stating facts on some? And have no rebuttle or anything?

    Yeah that makes total sense. Have fun being old and bitter.
     
  19. Mr Pickle

    Mr Pickle Guest

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    None, that are worth discussing with someone old and bitter
     
  20. TJV

    TJV Lifelong Packers Fanatic

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    Well that was almost a civil response, dude. How long have I been a Packers fan? As I posted in my first post here in the "Introduce Yourself" forum: "Like many here, I was 'born into' Packers fandom and by a stroke of fantastic lucky timing, I became an avid fan a year before Vince Lombardi came to Green Bay." http://www.packerforum.com/threads/life-long-packers-fan.26963/

    My forum name is a tribute to Jack Vainisi who IMO was more responsible for "setting up" Lombardi's success (including helping bring Vince to Green Bay) than anyone else in Green Bay before Vince arrived. As someone who "am bleed Green and Gold" honestly answer whether or not you ever heard of Vainisi before this post. Anyway, you may have asked that question to point out my lack of perspective, in not witnessing the awesome running game Lombardi championed or having just become a Packers fan lately. Obviously neither is true so you may want to ask yourself when you were sh***** yellow? In any event, here's a clue for you: This is no longer the NFL of days gone by: Like it or not, the passing game is now preeminent. Just because I love Lombardi's legacy and the way Ray Nitschke punished opponents doesn't mean I live in the past. And BTW, if Rodgers is running for his life it will be much more likely because of the problems on the OL than because of the failure of a RB (unless he missed a blitz pickup).

    I've posted Thompson's biggest mistakes as GM were drafting Justin Harrell, not re-signing Jenkins, and extending Hawk. I don't have blinders on, I just recognize his good moves far, far outweigh his bad ones. And he has demonstrated he knows how to build an NFL roster.

    You bring up some Packers RBs and ask what type of seasons did we have? Of course both Bennett and Levens were on the Super Bowl XXXI team. Over their Packers career Bennett averaged 3.6 ypr (yards per rush) and Levens 3.9 ypr. Are you pinning for that kind of back? Or can you recognize that while Starks' problems have been injuries - and brain farts - his career 4.3 ypr is better? Guess what Ryan Grant's ypr average was in Green Bay: Also 4.3 ypr.

    But how about Ahman Green? Man, there was a running back! His Packers career 4.5 ypr was outstanding right? A full 0.2 yards per carry better than Starks and Grant. And there is no denying HC Mike Sherman put together a fantasic rushing team in 2003, didn't he? Remember that season - his offense averaged 5.0 ypr! Of course per your reasoning that meant another Lombardi trophy on the Packers' shelf, right? Look, the RBs you mentioned played for the Packers from '92-'96; '94-'01; and '00-'06, and '09. Titles during those time periods? One. Titles since Thompson/McCarthy took over? One. Finally look at NFL stats to see where McCarthy's offenses have ranked in the league since his ascension to HC. The problem in Green Bay has not been the offense or the running game.
     
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  21. ivo610

    ivo610 Cheesehead

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    Pickle, in this article/thread "run more? dont expect it" http://www.packerforum.com/threads/run-more-dont-expect-it.38132/#post-457118 you say
    Please, tell me how this seasons offense is going to be so much different than last season that we will just fall apart without a running game?

    And I look forward to your week 7 posts. :)
     
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  22. Mr Pickle

    Mr Pickle Guest

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    IVO, I am happy that you have such Packer heritage. I guess all of those 40+ years of my following pale in comparison (probably pretty much worthless).... I'm not here to get into a pissing contest with anyone. Are we not all packer fans? I do not have the time to crunch every stat... I work for a living and enjoy my free time to much to sit at a desk and use a computer to calculate who ran for 3.9 a carry or 4.2.... bottom line is, you're wrong and we beg to differ. I suppose it will always be that way.... by the way, how bout those mets huh?
     
  23. ivo610

    ivo610 Cheesehead

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    you dont have 5 minutes to come up with any way to dispute anything I said? Or you know you cant? Hope you have time to come back week 7 and talk trash to, as you put it, "arrogant snobs".

    The 40+ years of following the packers comment just comes across as bitter.
     
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  24. Mr Pickle

    Mr Pickle Guest

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    Hopefully IVO whenever Ted decides to leave and hits the HOF he'll have you do the induction.
     
  25. Mr Pickle

    Mr Pickle Guest

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    Point out where that was said, and if it was, it was meant towards you only.... if the shoe fits.... ;)
     
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