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Weak Link?

Discussion in 'Packer Fan Forum' started by Pack93z, May 7, 2008.

  1. Pack93z

    Pack93z You retired too? .... Not me. I'm in my prime

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    I know it is before training camp and things can still happen, but if you had to pick on position or aspect of the Packers roster that will be the "weak link" next season and why you believe it to be true. IE, Guards, Pass Rush.. run blocking.. etc.

    I haven't seen a reason to change my view on this yet, I still believe our Guards overall will be our "Achilles Heal" so to speak. We are going into year 4 of not having our guard rotation pinned down and have consistent play week in and out in both the passing game and especially in run blocking. Someplace along the line we have to solve it, but adding rookies to an inconsistent lot already, doesn't seem like a remedy for the issue.

    I think Colledge has flaws in his game embedded there, I don't think he will be our answer at guard, time to move to Tackle where he seems like a natural fit for the upright style... I have hopes for Coston, but Spitzy seems like another player that either loses focus or just hasn't develop yet. Will this be the year, I hope so.. maybe the rookie inside will start to kick their tails into shape or Barbre comes in and solves the issue.

    Close second would be Pass Rush..
     
  2. cheesey

    cheesey Cheesehead

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    I can't dissagree with your assesment.
    I'm worried about our pass rush too.
    Too many times last year the QB had way too much time to find a receiver. We HAVE to do a better job of pressuring the QB. Maybe this will allow our DB's to play better, not having to cover for as long.
     
  3. porky88

    porky88 Cheesehead

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    I'm going to say running backs. If Ryan Grant goes down I'm not sure how the Packers will manage. Jackson is making progress in the weight room according to McCarthy and that's great but until I see it translate on the field, I'm going to be a little skeptical.

    I like Noah Herron as a 3rd down back but he's coming off an injury and hasn't played a full football game in almost a year.

    DeShawn Wynn is soft and needs to prove otherwise.

    Vernand Morency never lived up to the hype.

    So to me it's the running game. I've been a big believer that you need depth at that position and I'm not sure we have it.

    Truth be told, I like Lumpkin from Georgia so that is someone to watch in my opinion.

    I think the team is so deep that our worse problem might not be as big as other teams out there. Detroit's offensive line for example and I'd take our group of backs over Chicago's any day.
     
  4. cheesey

    cheesey Cheesehead

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    Some more great points!
    I think our running game has GREAT potential. But until it shows on the field, it's just that, potential. But i DO like the fact that we have that potential. Many teams don't even have that.
    Grant looks for real, and he's not soft. Wynn, IF he shows he's serious, can be a bruiser. The guy showed some flashes last year. Jackson too was looking ALOT better towards the end of the season. He was hitting the hole faster, not "thinking" too much, like i think he was doing early in the year.
    Herron........he does all things well, but none great in my view. Dependable, but not explosive.
     
  5. Zombieslayer

    Zombieslayer Cheesehead

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    This year, I'm not at all worried about our running backs. I actually think it's a strength. We're deep here.

    Our Achilles Heel? We have 2 - our OGs run blocking. These guys simply need to open up more holes. They beat up on the weaker teams but against the stronger teams, they simply don't open up holes. They did nothing against the Giants. Everyone was blaming either Al Harris or Favre's final INT for the loss, but Coughlin completely minimized our OL, especially our Gs. Grant was getting hit either behind the line or at the line the entire game. You can't win against top tier teams with 27 yards rushing.

    The 2nd is against top tier OLs, we don't generate enough pass rush. I was so frustrated seeing Tony Romo with all the time in the world to throw. I'm starting to really hate Romo, not as a person, but the guy has a top tier OL, the 2nd best WR in the NFL, and the media worships the guy. Sure, he's good, but let's see how good he is on an average team.

    If we're going to win the Super Bowl, we have to be able to sack Romo, Brady, and P Manning. Our DL is excellent against bad OLs, pretty good against mediocre OLs, and pathetic against top tier OLs. If the DL can't generate pressure, we're going to have to do a scheme change.

    Look what Coughlin did. How come we can't do that? On one sack, the DT pretended to drop into coverage until the C looked elsewhere, then he ran in and drove Brady into the dirt. On other plays, the Giants DL got help. Brady had zero time to look at Moss deep, and you could tell the whole game he wanted to hit Moss deep but couldn't and got frustrated. But like a poor sport, he took out his frustration on Welker, the one guy who was playing his heart out. See, that's what happens when you get in a QB's face. He more often than not loses his cool.

    Our DC needs to adjust to the situation. If we can't generate enough pressure with the DL, then we're going to have to blitz. I hate seeing QBs having time to think. A top tier QB will kill you if he has time to think.
     
  6. cheesey

    cheesey Cheesehead

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    With the O-line, the ONE good thing is, Rodgers is alot faster running then Favre was. When Rodgers takes off, he's pretty fast for a QB.
     
  7. trippster

    trippster Cheesehead

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    The weak link is obviously Rodgers at this moment. Most likely he will struggle as he gets his feet under himself. However, I see his being the weak link only lasting 5-7 weeks.
     
  8. Greg C.

    Greg C. Cheesehead

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    I agree with everyone so far that the guards are the Achilles' heel, particularly their run blocking. (They did pretty well with pass blocking, except for a few games like the ones at KC and Dallas.) The best thing would be for Colledge and Spitz to grow into their roles, for the sake of continuity. But I don't feel confident that they will actually do that. I've got my fingers crossed.

    It's funny that guards have been Ted Thompson's nemesis ever since he got here, when he let Wahle and Rivera go. I agreed with that decision, but thus far we've had to make do with subpar players at the position.

    I think the RB's are fine, by the way. And as for the pass rush, it was very good for more than half the year, but Kampman, Jenkins, and Corey Williams seemed to wear down toward the end, partly because the injuries to Cole and Jolly shortened the D-line rotation. With Jolly and Cole coming back and Justin Thompson replacing Mike Montgomery, I'm hoping the pass rush can maintain a high level for the entire season.
     
  9. Timmons

    Timmons Cheesehead

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    I agree that our O line run blocking is the primary weakness.
     
  10. Bertram

    Bertram Cheesehead

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    You are not stronger than your weakest link.

    Our weakest links are:

    Defense: Secondary
    Offense: Offensive line
     
  11. Zombieslayer

    Zombieslayer Cheesehead

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    Well, to a point. You can compensate for your weaknesses.

    For example, forgive me for keep bringing up the SB, but here goes. The Giants DBs aren't that good. It's their weakness. You'd think that the Pats, the best O of all-time, would kill them. Well, Coughlin never gave Brady enough time to exploit their weaknesses. Moss may have been open deep but Brady was running for his life and didn't have time to check.

    That's what a good team does. It plays as a team. One part of the team falters so another part of the team realizes it and picks up.

    When Harris was getting burned, I was getting really pissed at our DC for not sending Bigby or Collins over to help. Or blitzing and not giving E Manning enough time to find Plaxico. You compensate. That's what a good team is supposed to do.
     
  12. Zombieslayer

    Zombieslayer Cheesehead

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    But nobody breaks tackles quite like Favre. Sure, Favre runs slowly, but he just doesn't go down. A 300 pound DT gets him by the waist and Favre spins and the DT goes flying, then Favre completes the pass to the TE.

    I see Rodgers as seeing one of his OL'men missing his block, but avoiding it entirely and taking off, picking up 8 yards.

    Kind of apples and oranges.
     
  13. c_mac

    c_mac Cheesehead

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    I really don't ever remember any "hype".
     
  14. Pack93z

    Pack93z You retired too? .... Not me. I'm in my prime

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    Probably, but to be brutally honest, I have more faith in an untested QB than I have in D. Colledge playing guard at this point. He needs a change of address along the offensive line.. Tackle or bust.
     
  15. bozz_2006

    bozz_2006 Cheesehead

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    I agree 93z. It seems like some GM's (Thompson and others) value O-linemen who can play more than one position. Being able to play more than one position is great, but why force it? Ryan Grant may be able to play Safety, but just because he can, is that the best move for the team? Colledge is a tackle. Let him play tackle.
     
  16. Sadie

    Sadie Cheesehead

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    I couldn't agree more. I think the Packers need someone who can take some carries to make sure Grant doesn't get worn out as the season rolls along.
     
  17. cheesey

    cheesey Cheesehead

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    Oh! I agree! Favre had a way of getting away from guys that i haven't seen any other "slow" QB do. He could throw when he was on the ground.
    He had escapeability. I can't count how many times DE's would THINK they had him, and he'd still get the ball off.
     
  18. favre2driver

    favre2driver Cheesehead

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    What about Eli manning. Based on the sb, i think he is pretty good at escaping
     
  19. tromadz

    tromadz Cheesehead

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    I really don't understand the hate on the guards. They improved so much it's ridiculous. They're still not pro bowl guards(I guess that's what they have to do to get people off their back), but did Ryan Grant have all those great runs by himself? Did Favre have an amazing season all by himself? Hell, I just watched the A-Rod\Cowboys highlight on youtube and the announcer twice said "All kinds of time for Rodgers" but I'm sure the guards were on their butts and it was the tackles and center doing all the work.

    As for the weak link, I think it will be the cornerbacks. Harris is already on my poop list, but Woodson is an older guy too, I doubt they both have a lights out season for an entire season\playoff run, even though with the money they're paid and the way they run their mouths, they should be able to.
     
  20. retiredgrampa

    retiredgrampa Cheesehead

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    OG is still the weak link, IMO. Our big hope may be Barbre this year. But I've been disappointed too often to get my hopes too high. It might just be that Rodgers will move the pocket a lot more this year, out of necessity. But it might work. It sure looks, from our draft and UDFAs, that the passing game will be 2/3 of the offense. I'll be happy with 11-5 this year. I'm not as happy as some are with our RBs. It seems that they MUST have a big hole to get any yardage at all. I envy the Bears w/Forte.
     
  21. porky88

    porky88 Cheesehead

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    He averaged over 6 yards a carry during the teams 4 game win streak to close out 2006 which lead to him being the front runner for the 2007 starting job before he got hurt on I think the 1st day of training camp.

    All off season the Packers touted Morency to be the guy that replaces Ahman Green and he obviously never was. I actually think he's become a long shot to make the team for 08.
     
  22. bozz_2006

    bozz_2006 Cheesehead

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    I don't think Mo makes the team this season.
     
  23. tromadz

    tromadz Cheesehead

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    he got hurt. He was the most experienced, bulked up, was ready to rock, but he got hurt. It's not like he just didn't live up to expectations cuz he sucks, which most people think.
     
  24. IronMan

    IronMan Cheesehead

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    -Corner. Charles Woodson is solid. Al Harris however, doesn't have the ability, or mental toughness, to cover top recievers. He gets too caught up in talking trash, and loses focus. That, and he just doesn't make enough plays. When is the last time you can remember Al Harris making a game changing play?

    Woodson on the other hand...AWESOME.
    I worry somewhat about his health, as he has been banged up the last few years. I woud say sooner, rather than later, the ijuries will start to take their toll. I'm anxious to see how some of the young guys do this year.

    -Darren Colledge. He is just way too inconsistant. There were several times last year, where he just completely whiffed on his blocking assignment, and caused Brett to take some big hits. Colledge was the one who missed his blocking assignment on Favre's under-hand pass against the Seahawks. I hope he improves. I would hate to start over with someone new, as it seems offensive lines take a few years to "gel".
     
  25. cheesey

    cheesey Cheesehead

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    Thats ONE game. Favre did it for 17 years, consistantly. If Eli does it consistantly, then i'll give props to him.
     

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