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Thompson knows fans patience tested

Discussion in 'Packer Fan Forum' started by Heatherthepackgirl, Dec 8, 2006.

  1. Heatherthepackgirl

    Heatherthepackgirl Cheesehead

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    Green Bay - Patience isn't something football fans tend to display when their team gets whipped to the tune of a combined 73-10 in consecutive home games, but that's about the only thing the Green Bay Packers can ask of their faithful right now.


    Aside from some minor changes aimed at getting more players involved in the action and a vow from coach Mike McCarthy to cure the malaise that has struck his young team, the Packers can't offer much hope that things will get better soon.

    Depending on how you look at it, they are either a team in transition waiting for the gears to catch or a bona fide stinker with nothing going for them but a 57,000-person season-ticket waiting list. After losing, 38-10, to the New York Jets on Sunday, it's hard to imagine the Packers' fans having much more patience after seeing the team go 8-20 over the past two seasons.

    "That's an easy thing for me to say and a hard thing for fans to stomach," general manager Ted Thompson said Monday of being patient. "It's our responsibility to play better than we played, certainly (in) our two most recent home games. We're going to try to rectify that. But sometimes it's not a straight road you travel on."

    It's true that the Packers fit a solid effort against the defending NFC champion Seattle Seahawks between a 35-0 stinker against New England and the 28-point loss to the Jets, but it's three straight losses anyway you look at it. The fact the losses to the Patriots and Jets represent the worst two-game margin of defeat at home in the National Football League this season only serves as confirmation that this team is miles away from being a contender.

    Given its youth - Green Bay was the youngest team in the NFL at the start of the season and the roster consists of 19 rookies and first-year players - some thought this would be a team that struggled early and hit its stride late. Instead, it struggled early, hit its stride midseason and has swooned late.

    There are still four games left in the season, but after the loss Sunday it's hard to imagine the Packers winning more than one or two of them. The team that lost to the Patriots and Jets might be the team the Packers really are.

    "It's incumbent upon us to play better than that," Thompson said. "I think those are two pretty good teams, but that being said, I think all of us, myself included, are disappointed. Seattle was a Super Bowl team that we played fairly competitively on the road in kind of tough conditions. And we were making some strides prior to the New England game.

    "But I don't think it's some sort of indication where we're at. I think even though it's not a straight uphill climb, I think we are improving."

    Thompson said he didn't sleep much Sunday night and came to the office early Monday to watch the game video. He was most interested in seeing players' individual efforts.

    He came away convinced that the team hadn't quit on McCarthy.

    "You watch the tape and guys were playing," Thompson said. "Sometimes in the wrong direction, but they were playing and playing hard. I certainly thought that was a positive."

    What he didn't see was 53 players coming together and performing like a team. Thompson said he often viewed practice to see whether there is chemistry among the players and coaches, and from what he has observed there isn't a division among the ranks. But he also didn't see a team that was performing in sync Sunday.

    "There have been several games, some we've been able to win, some we lost, that I did see that coming together," Thompson said. "I'm not saying there was a splinter in our team, I'm just saying yesterday and against New England, I just don't think we played as a team as we probably could have and have.

    "It's an ongoing process. Sometimes you take two steps forward and two steps back and start over again. That's what we're working on now. I don't think that's a complete reflection (of where the team is at)."

    Before he met with reporters for his noon news conference, McCarthy, Thompson and the rest of the football staff discussed what they could do to make the most out of the final month of the season. McCarthy wasn't in favor of making dramatic changes, such as firing coaches or benching starters, but he and Thompson agreed it was time to look at other players.

    "We will be looking at opportunities created for some of our other players or how we use certain people," McCarthy said. "I mean, you have only so many options, and we are looking into them."

    There really isn't a lot the Packers can do as far as looking at young players because most of their young players are already playing, especially on offense. But they might want to look at rookie tight end Zac Alcorn in place of veteran Bubba Franks, who is playing poorly.

    On defense, defensive backs Jarrett Bush and Charlie Peprah might warrant some time in a six-defensive back scheme and Tyrone Culver could take time away from a struggling Nick Collins.

    "We're going to evaluate everybody and see if guys deserve a shot," defensive coordinator Bob Sanders said. "We'll try to evaluate everything here in the next 48 hours."
     
  2. warhawk

    warhawk Cheesehead

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    It won't just be the fans patience tested if we end up 5-11 or 6-10.

    One good thing I see coming if that does end up how we finish is more urgency on TT's part to do whatever's necessary to get us better faster.

    At 8-8 or 9-7 the attitude would be more in line with heading in the right direction. TT will pounce on the draft as this is his strength but what's going on right now with the team puts more pressure on him to go beyond that next season to a greater degree than he might have.

    Just an observation but I think TT realizes he won't be able to play the song "we are so young" again next year. We've bitten the bullet and put a lot of young and talented guys on the roster. Several will only get better and help the team more than they have been able to this year.

    Now go after three or four guys(Safety, DL, WR) that will make us winners. The way things have been going lately I don't see much choice. Utilizing rookies as the answer next year won't cut it.
     
  3. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Sort of how I feel..

    I gave him a break last year for MOST of the things that happened to the team since it was his 1st year...

    This year I didnt like Woodson pick up, but I am proven wrong..There are other things I think he did well, but some others should have handled differently..

    But he got what HE wanted this year for the most part I think, not record wise but the guys he liked..

    So next year THERE BETTER improvment or I will be on the fire Ted bandwagon..
     
  4. gopackgo

    gopackgo Cheesehead

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    I agree. We have too many talented young players to not mature into a winning team next season. I hope we can catch another Hawk or Jennings this next draft.
     
  5. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    I truly hope Ted and Mm sit down after the season and see the error of what is called Schott...
     
  6. yooperfan

    yooperfan Cheesehead

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    Teddy has to feel a sense of urgency going into next year. He has turned over this roster big time, over 2 drafts, 2 free agency periods and 2 cut downs from other teams. I think the blame Sherman game is beyond over, It's now put up or shut up time.
    IMHO more than half of the players on this roster don't even belong in the NFL and that now lies at the feet of Ted Thompson.
     
  7. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    I see 2 drafts, but his 1st free angency sort of hard to give him a full blown pass, or say he screwed it up..

    I just feel last years F.A, was going to suck no matter who was hired as the gm..

    This year F.A. I think is the true measure of what he would do given the resources...
     
  8. yooperfan

    yooperfan Cheesehead

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    I think he screwed up his 1st free agency big time.
    Klemm
    O'Dwyer
    Little
    Freeman
    Just to name four of his major signings and then we went into his NFLE caliber of player signings.
    The whole thing was hiddeous.
    And what did he get out of his 1st draft for a guy that is supposed to be a "draft guru", nothing, if you take into account how Collins is playing this year.
     
  9. dxbfan

    dxbfan Cheesehead

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    Might be more appropriate as a seperate topic but I think we need to define what next year's 'improvement' should be. Its almost certain that this year is going to be another losing record. What do we expect from TT and the team next year:

    1. Anything better than .500
    2. Playoffs
    3. Division Champs
    4. Better
     
  10. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    what I am saying is that last yearts F.A was going to suck no matter what..He had very little resources to work with...

    This past year is how I feel HE LIKES to handle F.A, when given the cap room...

    I agree his pick ups last year sucked big time, but cap wise he didnt have much choice, thats how I VIEW it...so rather not re-hash the whole wahle, sharper thing all over again..thats why I think to say he blew it , is hard for me to say..
     
  11. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Playoffs would be my guess cuz it seems no matter what if they dont make the playoffs, everyone is going to ask for heads to roll..
     
  12. porky88

    porky88 Cheesehead

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    I think if they contend for the wild card I'd be ok with them getting one more year. Kind of like the Bengals a few years back. 8-8 and 8-8 and then 11-5 Division Champs. If McCarthy goes 5-11 and then jumps to 8-8 I think he deserves another shot and the same goes for T.T. Though if there is any decline then my patience would of ran out.
     
  13. Packnic

    Packnic Cheesehead

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    i feel the same way long time. people will want playoffs. hell i want playoffs.


    i just dont think its a cut and dry situation. there really is no easy way of taking a 4-12 talent team to the superbowl. i think the steady approach that TT has taken is the right way. its the fiscally responsible way and its just smart. building the way a lot of packer fans want to is irresponsible and rarely if ever works.

    if we finish 8-8 this year. that HAS to be looked at as a huge improvment. people think because we didnt make the playoffs we arent going in the right direction. I think this is Basically TT's first year. you really cant count the Sherman year. it wasnt all TT and it wasnt TTs team.

    so if hes taken a 4-12 team to an 8-8 or even 7-9 record. he deserves credit for building with such young young talent. and when your evaluating his results. Dont look at him like youve done the past two years with a biased eye.

    Look at what hes done with the resources he has. i think if you step back look at the whole Sherman situation, i think youll find hes done a pretty damn decent job (with some mistakes) of turning it all around. he deserves at the very least 3 more years to let his plan unfold.
     
  14. P@ck66

    P@ck66 Banned Banned

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    Walks in..

    sees topic..

    Walks out.

    :wtf:
     
  15. warhawk

    warhawk Cheesehead

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    You can't grade TT for '05. He had $2mil to work with. One of the worst cap positions in the league. In todays NFL thats about enough to pull in an Assistant Trainer.

    He is cautious in FA because the competition can inflate a players value and when you get a stinker(which we have seen in the past) it can hurt for years. KGB's contract for example is hurting us there. He's not worth nearly what he is being paid.

    He will pull his weight in the draft. I'm just saying he will not be able to win people over with rookies as the answer again next year. It was not a mistake IMO to pull a bunch of young talent in. We needed that.

    He did this while keeping the cap situation in a position to be able to make some moves and I think what has happened of late will push him to do so to a greater degree than he might have had things gone better.

    He will have to deal with Harris and determine if Green is worth whatever the market shows but a lot of teams will have to address many more players that will be either leaving or staying with a new contract. That will soak up a lot of cash before they can look at who else they can bring in.

    You have to look at the teams cap and who they have to try and resign and subtract that from the total before knowing what kind of cap space they really have. If a team has three or four Kampman's like we had last year that they really need to keep it can dig into their cap reserve pretty quickly.

    Minny for example will be in good shape initially but thats because several defensive guys roll off the payroll. By the time they resign or replace those guys and get back to square one it will be a different story.

    We are in good shape in this regards so TT should be in position to be fairly aggressive. After seeing him redo Kampman's deal and signing Woodson and Pickett he is not, IMO, adverse to FA, and will be feeling the heat to take it even further next year.
     
  16. CaliforniaCheez

    CaliforniaCheez Cheesehead

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    "It's an ongoing process. Sometimes you take two steps forward and two steps back and start over again. That's what we're working on now. I don't think that's a complete reflection (of where the team is at)."

    Was his coaching staff decisions two steps back?
     
  17. dxbfan

    dxbfan Cheesehead

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    I think the point you're perhaps disregarding here is that this is a business. Go back all the way to Lombardi and he recognised it in saying that "In handling that pigskin or in handling a product, both of us are looking for the same thing - the pleasing of our customers and winning and keeping their loyalty."

    As a purist you can find numerous arguments in defense of the situation the team finds itself in and numerous merits in the approach that TT has taken. But the reality is that its not just about returning a team to winning ways its about how soon you can do it.

    We as fans who express our opinions on here are a drop in the ocean. What will determine TT's future is less to do with what we think and more to do with the 70,000 odd fans who buy tickets every home game, the hundreds of thousands who buy No. 4 jerseys & team memorabilia and the millions who want entertainment every sunday.

    And all of them want to see the Pack win, sooner rather than later and they dont give a toss whether 6-10 is better than 4-12.
     
  18. Chamuko

    Chamuko Cheesehead

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    Like 10 steps back...
     
  19. gotarace27

    gotarace27 Cheesehead

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    TT feeling the heat....he should. This is a team on the field that looks confused at best. It's not just a matter of the free agents and draft choices he put on the field but it also includes the coaching staff he assembled. To me this team looks poorly coached and this would make any player look slow to respond to a game speed stituation. This coaching staff can not respond to what they are seeing on the field and make corrections to stop the bleeding for entire games at a time. TT better wake up quick.
     
  20. agopackgo4

    agopackgo4 Cheesehead

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    I liked the point that he made about the team not having the best chemistry. Thtats not a good situation. Espicially when you have a young/a team with not a lot of talent. You are going to struggle if you dont unify and come together as ONE. Not saying that players are being selfish. But they need to learn to do it.
     
  21. porky88

    porky88 Cheesehead

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    Point made on the radio today about Ted Thompson is people want him to spend money but when he does spend money they complain he overpaid for someone such as Charles Woodson. They also complain because it's not the guy they wanted.

    I think Ted Thompson needs to do it his way. Mike Holmgrem and Paul Allen give him a lot of credit to the foundation of the Seattle Seahawks. You can make excuses about how he wasn't the GM but both feel he was a big reason why they have some of the talent they have now.
     
  22. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Waits for it.............

    Someone will say that is a lie
     
  23. chibiabos

    chibiabos Cheesehead

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    Finally the head coach says he'll try out other players. One woulfd think that should have been his decision all season long! Course we're not rebuilding, right? Which copaches are in danger of being replaced at seasons end as well? As a business the Pack is a poorly run one! In a business two yrs. of loss usually results in CEO replacement. In football I will give TT & MM another season. No better then 9 & 7; it's so long, been nice to know ya!
     
  24. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    As a "business" the pack rank 13th out of the 32 teams...Its on forbes.com

    I think your wording "poorly run as a business" is the wrong phrase to use..
     

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