The REAL story on Coach Bates

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Bates, Packers reach settlement

By Rob Demovsky
[email protected]

The Green Bay Packers paid Jim Bates a lump sum of about $1.1 million in July even though the former defensive coordinator turned down at least one other job in the NFL and is out of coaching.


In a telephone interview on Thursday, Bates confirmed he and the Packers reached a settlement this summer but refused to divulge the details. Through interviews with various NFL sources, the Press-Gazette learned how the settlement went down, the terms of it and why the Packers felt compelled to pay him.

When the Packers passed over Bates for their head coach job in January, they agreed to fulfill his contract but did so knowing he would be a hot commodity and almost certainly would get a job as a defensive coordinator with another team, if not a head coach job.

That would mean the Packers would be off the hook for most, if not all, of his annual base salary, which was about $900,000.

Bates, who was under contract with the Packers through the 2007 season, was offered at least one defensive coordinator position - with the St. Louis Rams. Bates turned that job down, because he thought he was in line for the same position with the Dallas Cowboys, which might have been a better stepping stone to a head coaching job, but the job in Dallas surprisingly fell through.

“There were jobs that I thought I was going to get, and it was a weird deal and kind of crazy how it all went down,” Bates said. “There were a couple of jobs that I thought I had secured and ended up going in another direction.”

Had Bates taken the job in St. Louis, the Packers likely wouldn’t have owed him a dime, because the Rams were prepared to offer Bates more than $1 million a year.

Bates desperately wanted the Packers’ head coaching job that General Manager Ted Thompson gave to Mike McCarthy. Shortly after McCarthy was hired, he offered Bates the defensive coordinator job, but Bates turned it down.

At the time, there was some debate in the Packers’ organization about whether they owed Bates anything, because he technically wasn’t fired.

The Packers took the high road and honored the contract in part because they figured Bates would work somewhere in the NFL in 2006 and in part because they knew trying to get out of the contract completely would look bad and might send the wrong message to other potential coaching candidates.

As the offseason wore on and it became evident Bates would be out of football this season, the Packers contacted Bates to find out why. That’s when the negotiations began and a settlement for about 65 percent of his total remaining salary was reached.

“I really don’t want to get into the details, but everything between (him and the Packers) is fine,” Bates said. “We’re on good terms.”
Packers officials declined to comment on Bates’ settlement.
Because the Packers paid Bates a lump sump, they won’t get any relief even if Bates works in 2007, which he said on Thursday that he may do.

“I’ll approach it with an open mind, and I’ll see what’s out there,” said Bates, who turned 60 in May. “I do have an interest, and I’m going to search out everything at the end of this year.”

In the grand scheme of the NFL, a payment of a little over a million dollars isn’t huge and could be chalked up to the cost of doing business, but on the other hand it isn’t a pittance.

The Packers also are paying a large chunk of former coach Mike Sherman’s $3.2 million annual salary. Sherman, who was under contract with the Packers through 2007, was hired by the Houston Texans as their assistant head coach. Sherman’s salary with the Texans likely is less than $500,000, meaning the Packers have to pay him the difference between his head-coaching salary and his salary this season.

With Bates running the defense under Sherman last season, the Packers ranked seventh in the NFL in total defense and No. 1 in passing defense. Because McCarthy wanted to keep the same basic defensive scheme intact, he hired Bob Sanders, a defensive assistant under Bates since 2001.

Despite apparent upgrades in the secondary with free-agent pickups Charles Woodson and Marquand Manuel and at linebacker with first-round draft pick A.J. Hawk, the Packers defense has regressed and currently ranks 31st (or second-to-last) in the NFL in total defense.

Bates, who still is living in the Green Bay area, said he hasn’t seen enough of the Packers to offer an opinion on why they’re struggling.

“I only watched the Philadelphia game,” Bates said. “I’ve been so busy traveling. Sure I miss it, but it’s been good for me as far as being able to do some things that I haven’t been able to do over the years. I’m getting some rest for the first time in a long time.”

God, it's me. I have one simple request, PLEASE OH PLEASE LET JIM BATES RETURN AS THE PACKERS DC....PLEASE?! :pray:
 

tromadz

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Can we put the "He was fired" trash to bed now?

Hopefully we wont NEED to re-hire him. Hopefully Sanders works out. Why throw in the towel on a rookie DC with one of the youngest defenses?
 
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Can we put the "He was fired" trash to bed now?

Hopefully we wont NEED to re-hire him. Hopefully Sanders works out. Why throw in the towel on a rookie DC with one of the youngest defenses?

Trom, would you rather have Sanders or Bates? Bates wins it everytime for me.

Sanders may yet be a good DC, but he clearly can't prove his real value when he has assistants on his staff that he never chose.

Plus Sanders hasn't really shown a whole lot to make you believe he is the next coming of Coach Bates...
 

tromadz

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To be honest, part of me doesnt want a guy who throws a temper tantrum cuz he didnt get a promotion, and was rumored to have the job, but blew it cuz he couldnt keep secrets "in-house."

Sanders stresses putting guys in the position to make plays, and it looks to me that is what he does. Missed tackles, dropped ints can't be blamed on him. Blown coverages though, no matter how young or crappy a DB is though, should fall on him and his coaches though. For the most part, the guys are in great position(not all the time, no doubt) they just aren't executing right now. I don't see why that couldnt change.

We'll see how it all works out.
 
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To be honest, part of me doesnt want a guy who throws a temper tantrum cuz he didnt get a promotion, and was rumored to have the job, but blew it cuz he couldnt keep secrets "in-house."

We'll see how it all works out.


Rumours from individuals higher than Joe Arrigo say that McCarthy didn't want Bates around, due to a fear on McCarthy's part.

Some reporter for the PG stated that on his chat, and also stated Bates could still be lured back into GB.
 
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Sanders stresses putting guys in the position to make plays, and it looks to me that is what he does. Missed tackles, dropped ints can't be blamed on him. Blown coverages though, no matter how young or crappy a DB is though, should fall on him and his coaches though. For the most part, the guys are in great position(not all the time, no doubt) they just aren't executing right now. I don't see why that couldnt change.

After 5 weeks, he still can't get 11 friggin guys on the field? How hard could that be?

Not to attack you, but I'm just peeved at the inability of the D to come together. The onus should be on Sanders to develop this unit, or alter his scheme to get the most out of his players, neither of which I've seen.
 

tromadz

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all about da packers said:
Some reporter for the PG stated that on his chat, and also stated Bates could still be lured back into GB.

Well...yeah. He's unemployed.

- Decline GB DC Job - Strike 1
- Decline Rams DC Job - Strike 2
- Hope for Dallas DC Job and not get it - Strike 3

I like Bates, I wish it all worked out, and he never left in the first place(but he did), but he really went about things silly(in my opinion).

If Sanders doesn't work out, yeah no doubt I would like Bates back. But I am not giving up on the rookie DC until he gets better DB coaches, and then fails, cuz other than those areas, he isnt bad at all(and hes not in any dead pools, cuz hes not 60 like bates).
 

tromadz

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I'd hope they all(mm,sanders,tt) talk about it and do what they think is best. You cant give a rookie DC cart blanche, but working together they should see(and I assume they do, cuz everyone and their mothers see the DBs are killing us, not the Dline\LBs) that this isn't working, and Sanders has NO experience coaching DBs, so they need to get him adequate help.

Im done with the subject, cuz this is coming near page 2, and its just been me and you, so yeah.

Sanders deserves a chance.
 

longtimefan

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Im done with the subject, cuz this is coming near page 2, and its just been me and you

but you two are playing so well together and look so gosh darn cute!! :rotflmao: :moo:
 

Zombieslayer

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all about da packers said:
Source.



God, it's me. I have one simple request, PLEASE OH PLEASE LET JIM BATES RETURN AS THE PACKERS DC....PLEASE?! :pray:

I second that prayer. Bates came in and our defense immediately improved. He left and it turned to ****. Bates had a history of good defenses. Didn't he never have a defense that was worse than the top 10 in his career? That's pretty impressive.
 

Yared-Yam

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Oh my sweet Jim.

If only I had sold my Jim Bates cereal recipe earlier. Can't you just imagine it? Kids sitting at the breakfast table and what do they want? Cheerios? Please.

"Hey pass the Bates!"
 

NiVeK

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Bates should have gotten the HC position. He deserved it, McCarthy certainly did not. Why TT did what he did....I have no idea...?
 

4packgirl

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i'm not so sure that bates would have been our saving grace. i liked his style of coaching on the D & maybe that would have translated to an excellent HC but maybe not.
would you still want bates here if we were 4-1 & not 1-4?? just curious.
 

Anubis

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i'm not so sure that bates would have been our saving grace. i liked his style of coaching on the D & maybe that would have translated to an excellent HC but maybe not.
would you still want bates here if we were 4-1 & not 1-4?? just curious.

The problem is we are not 4-1, we are 1-4, and our defense (or lack thereof) is a big reason why we have that record. Under Sanders, we have slid from the #7th ranked overall defense to the 31st, while utilizing the same scheme Bates implemented and with alleged "upgrades" in personnel. IMO, there is absolutely no evidence to support even the slightest comparison between Sanders and Bates, other than one worked under the other and they have both been employed as DC of the Green Bay Packers.

However to answer your question, if we were 4-1 and were the 31st ranked defense in the league, I would certainly want to see Bates back in Green Bay.

GO PACK!!!

Robert C. Hedley
 

Heatherthepackgirl

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IMO I think its to soon to give up on MM, but I sure do wished we would have hired Bates as head coach right away...

He is the type of coach that actually runs on the field with the guys and gets in their face, that is why I think our defense pulled together last year, sometimes the little things is all it takes...
 

TOPackerFan

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i'm not so sure that bates would have been our saving grace. i liked his style of coaching on the D & maybe that would have translated to an excellent HC but maybe not.
would you still want bates here if we were 4-1 & not 1-4?? just curious.

Yes.

I'd love to see what AJ Hawk could do under Jim Bates' coaching.
 

longtimefan

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Bates and co. did an outstanding job last year, better than I thought they were going to do.......

If he was such an awesome coach why did he not get hired by Miami when he was interviewed there, same situation as with GB..

However, it has been said b4, but that #7 ranking last year is not really a TRUE measure on how this D was last year..

I might get ripped for this but o well........People have been haging their hat on that #7 ranking and that #1 ranking to much...

The main reason they were ranked so high is cuz of the #1 pass D.

#1 ya say that is awesome?? Well N.O the Jets and the Browns were ranked right behind the Pack last year..Great group to be together with..

Does everyone know how that is ranked, or at least how the NFL ranks the D?? It is by yards given up and that alone, nothing about TDS given up, 1st downs, plays per game..Plain and simple YARDS only...So yeah #1 vs the pass and #7, of yards given up..

So ya woohohohoooo PARTY!!!! they gave up least amount of passing and rushing yards...But they were in BOTTOM 3RD of tds given up with 22...

Consider this, 3 of the BOTTOM 5 in pass D were playoff teams..

4 of the TOP in pass d WERE NOT playoff teams..


I dont care how you slice it, and this really is not an opinion type of debate, these are solid facts that the D was not as special as people think..

If you want to look at it for your self..


2005 D stats


Look at the site, go to each section, rushing yards, scoring, 1st downs etc....Packers are ranked either in bottom 3rd or in the middle of almost EVERY stat other than yards given up...Which we all know is what gets the D ranked #1 and #7..

notice this is not me bashing Bates at all I think he is outstanding..

This is just on how AVERAGE that D was last year...
 

bigdave

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There is no doubt that Bates is a good defensive coordinator with a lot of passion. Unfortunately he takes rejection too personally. He did the same with us when we hired Saban over him. I'm not sure what makes him think he could be a good head coach. He did a better job than Wannstedt did, but that isn't saying anything. In the USFL he sucked as head coach, but that was many moons ago. He should have just stayed on with the Packers and helped rebuild that defebse to build up his stock.
 

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There were a lot of HC jobs out there and from what I could tell from the list of candidates teams were looking at Bates was not very high up there and the results are obvious. Nobody else wanted him as their HC either.

This tells me that we don't know what the the guys in the NFL that make these decisions do know. We can all be assured that the inner circle of NFL people keep a pretty good handle on what all these guys can do.

There is so much turnover in coaching staff year in and year out they have to. Even if it's not the HC most teams are hunting assistants for some opening that comes up every year.

There is obviously something about Bates as it relates to the HC position that has teams shying away from him. Whatever the "book" on Bates is doesn't read well in those closed door round table discussions by those on the line for whatever decision is ultimately made.
 

4packgirl

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agreed, warhawk.

if he'd have walked into a HC job right away somewhere else, i'd be VERY concerned/upset about our not keeping him. since he didn't, something in the back of my mind says i'm ok with him not being our HC.
 

Timmons

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Here's what I know, I miss Jim Bates. He may not have made our D #7, but he sure fired them up. It's too bad we couldn't keep him as DC. I'll bet the rumours tat he was going to be HC didn't help.
 

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