The Browns (WR thread)

[Dantés]

You aren't the first person to say this. Graham's contract is for 2 more years. So either you didn't know that or you are banking on the Packers cutting Graham after this season?

Depending on the Packers feelings about that very question, they will either go after a TE early (Hochenson/Fant) or hold off and possibly draft someone like Kahale Warring or maybe a mid round on Jace Sternberger if he is there. The Packers had both Warring and Sternberger in as one of the 30 man visits.

I think its pretty safe to bank on the Packers cutting Graham after this season.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I think its pretty safe to bank on the Packers cutting Graham after this season.

If you are someone who is expecting him to have similar or worse numbers than 2018, I agree.

 

[Dantés]

If you are someone who is expecting him to have similar or worse numbers than 2018, I agree.

Even if he is better. His blocking is atrocious, and that's even more of a problem in LaFleur's offense. And the cap hits for the newly signed FA's double next offseason, so they will be needing to find some cap relief.

 

[brandon2348]

You aren't the first person to say this. Graham's contract is for 2 more years. So either you didn't know that or you are banking on the Packers cutting Graham after this season?

Depending on the Packers feelings about that very question, they will either go after a TE early (Hochenson/Fant) or hold off and possibly draft someone like Kahale Warring or maybe a mid round on Jace Sternberger if he is there. The Packers had both Warring and Sternberger in as one of the 30 man visits.

I understand Graham's contract and was responding to a HOLE AT TE NEXT YEAR. IMO Graham's future remains up in the air after 2019 but could see him sticking around in 2020 if he bounces back this year. Lewis will be gone next year and Tonyan developing. Overall IMO the TE position is pretty healthy with adding another developmental piece

Sternberger is the direction I would prefer them to go if a TE HAS TO BE DRAFTED as I have it at the bottom of the priority list heading into 2019 with more pressing needs.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Even if he is better. His blocking is atrocious, and that's even more of a problem in LaFleur's offense. And the cap hits for the newly signed FA's double next offseason, so they will be needing to find some cap relief.

Correct, but in the oft chance Graham and Rodgers have a great year together, I think that all goes out the window.

If we see the Packers use an early pick on Hochenson or Fant, I think we all have our answer as to what the Packers most probable plan for JG is. I think Gute could be tempted by TJ if he is there at #12, but I would prefer not using that pick on him.

The more I look at TE in this draft, the more I hope the Packers hold off on pulling the trigger on one until after the first round. This is about as deep of a TE draft as there has been in a long time and I don't think there is a big enough difference between a guy you take at #12 over a guy you can still get at #44 to warrant passing on a top OL or front 7 defensive guy that will be there at #12.

 

[Favre>Rodgers259]

Joes


Well Graham leaves a hole next year. Cobb leaving left a hole this year. I expect it to be addressed and we will find out soon.

Cobb didn't leave that much of a hole when he missed half the season and looked lethargic when he was playing....

Graham is another story however should he walk. The way I see it, Gute has 2 years to find a replacement.

 

[brandon2348]

Cobb didn't leave that much of a hole when he missed half the season and looked lethargic when he was playing....

Graham is another story however should he walk. The way I see it, Gute has 2 years to find a replacement.

They better have something cooking to improve the offense other then Day 3 picks developing is my point. Your not gonna add Billy Turner to this roster and exchange McCarthy for LaFleur and all the sudden have a top 5 offense.

 

[Dantés]

Cobb didn't leave that much of a hole when he missed half the season and looked lethargic when he was playing....

Graham is another story however should he walk. The way I see it, Gute has 2 years to find a replacement.

I would argue that part of the offensive futility of the past few seasons has been attributable to Cobb's decline/absence. Rodgers has needed to get the ball out quicker, but he's also lacked options than consistently uncover early in the down.

 

[GleefulGary]

Yes people are suggesting that were fine at receiver so that's simply not true. There are multiple posts suggesting our day 3 picks last year at receiver are sufficient. Not sure what your reading or SELECTIVELY READING. The whole receiver thing is like pulling teeth around here and I really don't understand with how the game has evolved and all the rule changes.

Jones is a nice RB but staying healthy is major concern. He has not proven he can carry a heavy work load or stay healthy so it is a bit far fetched to call him a PREMIER BACK IMO.

Ultimately I believe he needs to be on a 10-14 carry pitch count to be effective and gives him the best chance to stay healthy.

Saying people don't want an improved offense is not the same as people saying we are ok at WR. You can improve our offense with a pick at OL, RB, TE, and WR. Crazy, huh?!

 

[brandon2348]

Saying people don't want an improved offense is not the same as people saying we are ok at WR. You can improve our offense with a pick at OL, RB, TE, and WR. Crazy, huh?!

We will know here in a few more days. It is absolutely crucial the Packers get this draft right IMO. Chasing the wrong players or not addressing immediate needs will erase everything done so far this off season.

 

[OldSchool101]

It just makes sense to me that we’ve focused largely on D now going back a decade. Not only that but as of recently we’ve let starters walk or sent them packing or both. It was already time to focus on upgrading this O before kicking Monty and Cobb to the curb. We need to upgrade a couple OL and get set for Bulaga’s departure and then add a couple playmakers.
I don’t want to ignore D. I just want to lean Offense if there’s no difference in the two

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Saying people don't want an improved offense is not the same as people saying we are ok at WR. You can improve our offense with a pick at OL, RB, TE, and WR. Crazy, huh?!

I would also add that a healthy QB (not playing on a broken leg), 2nd year WR group, as well as a new play caller and overall cleansing of the old, is probably going to help the offense as well.

Don't get me wrong, I think we need to spend one of our first 3 picks on the OL, as well as a pick on a decent TE. If a quality slot guy is available mid rounds and he can also be a return guy his first few years, great.

 

[Dantés]

Correct, but in the oft chance Graham and Rodgers have a great year together, I think that all goes out the window.

If we see the Packers use an early pick on Hochenson or Fant, I think we all have our answer as to what the Packers most probable plan for JG is. I think Gute could be tempted by TJ if he is there at #12, but I would prefer not using that pick on him.

The more I look at TE in this draft, the more I hope the Packers hold off on pulling the trigger on one until after the first round. This is about as deep of a TE draft as there has been in a long time and I don't think there is a big enough difference between a guy you take at #12 over a guy you can still get at #44 to warrant passing on a top OL or front 7 defensive guy that will be there at #12.

Depends on who else is there for me. This is a deep class, but there is a massive drop from Hockenson to the 2nd guy, in my opinion. Whether your TE2 is Fant, Smith, Sternberger, or whoever... none of them can hold his jock. He's a once or twice a decade type of prospect.

 

[Fat Dogs]

It just makes sense to me that we’ve focused largely on D now going back a decade. Not only that but as of recently we’ve let starters walk or sent them packing or both. It was already time to focus on upgrading this O before kicking Monty and Cobb to the curb. We need to upgrade a couple OL and get set for Bulaga’s departure and then add a couple playmakers.
I don’t want to ignore D. I just want to lean Offense if there’s no difference in the two

I don’t think anyone disagrees with Wanting to improve the offense but we can’t dictate what the draft gives us. I would love to draft a Julio Jones, Hopkins, or A.J. Green but I really don’t see those kinds of offensive weapons at WR or RB in this class. Does Gute? We don’t know. Next years class might be litererrd with first round WR and RB talent. This class is deep at both positions but not real top heavy. The point is we can’t force what’s not there.

 

[Favre>Rodgers259]

@Fat Dogs brings up an important point, has anyone peeked at 2020? 2020 is an offensive explosion. Based on what I DO know, there are roughly 5-7 WRs who should have a solid 1st Round Grade. Now obviously a lot can happen, but I'm anticipating that number to extend to around 6-10. I haven't fully surveyed the RB position but it's safe to say just about any year that a starter can be found in Rounds 2 and 3. It's also pretty safe to say Rodgers will still be around for the next 4+ years, so after a year of evaluating our current trio of 2nd Years plus GMo in a contract year, I'm all on board for a 1st Round WR next year.

 

[brandon2348]

I don’t think anyone disagrees with Wanting to improve the offense but we can’t dictate what the draft gives us. I would love to draft a Julio Jones, Hopkins, or A.J. Green but I really don’t see those kinds of offensive weapons at WR or RB in this class. Does Gute? We don’t know. Next years class might be litererrd with first round WR and RB talent. This class is deep at both positions but not real top heavy. The point is we can’t force what’s not there.

They won't have to force it at pick 30. There will be someone that is a potential GAME CHANGER that plays OFFENSE.

If the Packers have been forcing anything its countless reaches on the defensive side of the ball. Just the facts and we let several skilled players on offense slip through the cracks.

 

[brandon2348]

@Fat Dogs I'm all on board for a 1st Round WR next year.

AND THERE IT IS!. The yearly promise to be on board with a top selection on a offensive skill player NEXT YEAR. I've been waiting for that proclamation patiently as IT'S BEEN SAID FOR YEARS NOW only to never have anyone actually follow through.

Once again you guys really need to keep playing your tricks on each other cause nobody else is buying it. Certainly not me.

 

[OldSchool101]

There’s some pretty darn good WR’s definitively in that day 2 range. It takes a year or two to get acclimated so every season we pass at WR is one more year we wait for any real kind of production.

I kinda relate to Brandon’s frustration, it’s lots of excuses about how this draft doesn’t have quality WRs, yet while I’m hearing that sentiment in here, some of the most educated guys in the business are saying the complete opposite. I’m hearing this draft is filled with WR potential just maybe not that 1-2 elite level guys we would often see in the top 20.

That said, I actually do agree with history and our early day 2 WR successes. We need not risk #12 overall without a definitive top 10 prospect but we should be looking very closely by pick #30-#75 range at the latest unless there’s an anomaly of quality guys off the board (which I doubt).

I’d even consider a TE or RB with kick return or pass catching proficiency if one presents itself in addition to another WR by round 4 at the latest (preferably before they get thoroughly picked over).

 

[Fat Dogs]

AND THERE IT IS!. The yearly promise to be on board with a top selection on a offensive skill player NEXT YEAR. I've been waiting for that proclamation patiently as IT'S BEEN SAID FOR YEARS NOW only to never have anyone actually follow through.

Once again you guys really need to keep playing your tricks on each other cause nobody else is buying it. Certainly not me.

I think I’ve been pretty consistent about wanting the B.P.A. Weather it be on O or D. I’ve even mentioned Josh Jacobs at #30 so my stance hasn’t changed. I’m ok with drafting one at #30 if it’s Brown only because I think he’s the only one worth a first.
That being said, I’m no expert on talent evaluating so who knows if Gute sees Campbell, N’Keal, Butler, Marquise, or anyone else as a first rounder and I’ll cheer just as loud as the rest of you on Sundays if one is drafted and balls out. It’s just my own personal opinion that none of these guys are 2 rounds more talented than the receivers We can get In the 3rd.

 

[brandon2348]

There’s some pretty darn good WR’s definitively in that day 2 range. It takes a year or two to get acclimated so every season we pass at WR is one more year we wait for any real kind of production.

I kinda relate to Brandon’s frustration, it’s lots of excuses about how this draft doesn’t have quality WRs, yet while I’m hearing that sentiment in here, some of the most educated guys in the business are saying the complete opposite. I’m hearing this draft is filled with WR potential just maybe not that 1-2 elite level guys we would often see in the top 20.

That said, I actually do agree with history and our early day 2 WR successes. We need not risk #12 overall without a definitive top 10 prospect but we should be looking very closely by pick #30-#75 range at the latest unless there’s an anomaly of quality guys off the board (which I doubt).

I’d even consider a TE or RB with kick return or pass catching proficiency if one presents itself in addition to another WR by round 4 at the latest (preferably before they get thoroughly picked over).

Your right. They need to do it now with the potential development time involved. We simply cant wait another year with the way everything else is set up.

My offseason plan was to throw $ in free agency on defense and use this draft to round out the offense for a 4-5 year run having some marquee offensive players on rookie contracts. They didnt exactly get the guys I wanted in free agency but they no doubt made the pass rush and safety position better then it was so I'm fine with it. However, with our current cap situation it will be next to impossible to sign a top tier WR free agent anytime soon.

So now it is time to focus on phase two which is getting the guys they love on offense and not holding back. Whether its DK Metcalf, Parris Campbell, AJ Brown or N'keal Harry that they LOVE they will have a shot at one of them and should aggressively pursue that player.

You are also right that this is a very deep receiver class. Way deeper then last year so the Packers need to identify the right one. I've pleaded my case on who I think they should get but there are several that would be an immediate improvement over what we have now.

 

[brandon2348]

I think I’ve been pretty consistent about wanting the B.P.A. Weather it be on O or D. I’ve even mentioned Josh Jacobs at #30 so my stance hasn’t changed. I’m ok with drafting one at #30 if it’s Brown only because I think he’s the only one worth a first.
That being said, I’m no expert on talent evaluating so who knows if Gute sees Campbell, N’Keal, Butler, Marquise, or anyone else as a first rounder and I’ll cheer just as loud as the rest of you on Sundays if one is drafted and balls out. It’s just my own personal opinion that none of these guys are 2 rounds more talented than the receivers We can get In the 3rd.

Parris Campbell is gonna be special. If we let him slip by us we will be kicking ourselves for years is my opinion. His fluid body movement with field speed and explosion is very unique. To me he projects to a faster version of an Odell Beckham ceiling with some development. The talent is there and he has the mindset and attitude to match. He will eventually be able to line up outside or inside. 1ST ROUND GRADE

In round 3 you would probably get the poor man's version with much more limited game in Danny Isabella. Shorter and not nearly as fluid with a much smaller catch radius. Basically a one dimensional slot that cant line up outside.


AJ Brown projects to me as a Devante Adam's type being able to big body db's with his strong compact frame and the ability to seperate in close coverage at the last second. A very unique ability and a better top gear then Adams. I would of preferred Courtland Sutton last year but AJ Brown is a nice prospect. 1ST ROUND GRADE

In the 3rd round you would probably get the slower poor man's version in Kelvin Harmon. Lacks the deep speed and could potentially have issues separating in the NFL. Not nearly as explosive.

I could go on and on with other prospects but I think this gives a good analysis the difference between round 1and round 3.

Weve been putting marginal talent overall around Rodgers for far to long. I believe people will be pleasantly surprised what Rodgers can do with some A GRADE WEAPONS.

 

[brandon2348]

Even Ted Thompson drafted quality receivers in the 2nd round. When he stopped doing that is when we started this down hill slide on offense.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Hollywood Brown or AJ Brown would give the Packers the best and deepest receiving Corp in the league.

I know some people don’t think the Packers need another WR. That’s fair. But what happens if Davante Adams gets hurt. They go from one of the better groups in the league, to one of the worst? We need insurance. AJ Brown is Davante Adams Jr. and Hollywood Brown is Tyreek Hill Jr.

The Packers drafting either of the Browns or any other wide receiver for that matter won't result in them having the best receiving corps in the league.

He thought he could get CUTE and get guys later that would be good. Thompson did the same thing at the RB position the previous year. The jury is still out but as I've posted the probabilities or chances is not in our favor.

It doesn't matter which round the Packers drafted wide receivers in last year. MVS had a pretty solid rookie season (sixth in receptions and yards) and EQ came along during the year as well finishing in the top 15 in both categories.

Don't get me wrong, the team has to improve at the position in my opinion though.

Sternberger is the direction I would prefer them to go if a TE HAS TO BE DRAFTED as I have it at the bottom of the priority list heading into 2019 with more pressing needs.

The Packers definitely have a need at tight end with Graham and Lewis most likely being gone after this season and only Tonyan and Baylis being the only others currently on the roster.

 

[Mondio]

It’s just my own personal opinion that none of these guys are 2 rounds more talented than the receivers We can get In the 3rd.

I hope you don't mind if I share your opinion

 

[elcid]

We are in luck as the OL, WR, TE and DL classes are deep and we can use help at all these positions. During the first 2 days of the draft we WILL add a solid receiving weapon for Aaron, you can bank on that.

I agree that instead of ******* a certain pick on a position, we should draft BPA in the first round, which imo will probably result in linemen, be it on offense or defense. I'd start considering the TE's at 30 but the Iowa studs will probably be gone by then. The only WR I'd take in a heartbeat at 30 is AJ Brown, all others I'd rather pass on until 44 (Hollywood, Campbell, Metcalf, Samuel). Ditto for S.