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The 2014 Johnny Jolly Thread

Discussion in 'Packer Fan Forum' started by El Guapo, Feb 28, 2014.

  1. El Guapo

    El Guapo Cheesehead

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    We had so many threads in 2013 that discussed the possible return of Jolly. There have been a few threads about free agents and the DL that have mentioned our consensus feel-good hero of 2013 (Lacy aside), but none that really discuss his status going into 2014.

    I've seen everything, including the end of the article below, that says that many factors will influence whether the Packers bring him back. Yeah, yeah. That's a cop-out statement for making a prediction. The reality is that Jolly came back and played pretty well for a 30-year old who spent the last few years out of football and in prison. The dude plays with attitude, brought it to the team, and filled a valuable role. On a young defense, Jolly was a veteran presence that was missed in the playoffs.

    I don't think anybody will be clamoring to sign him away in FA. He's coming back from neck surgery and still is likely a question mark in the minds of anyone outside of Green Bay. He should be re-signed for slightly more than the veteran minimum for a 2-year deal with an injury clause. I don't see one good reason not to have him on the line. He's still got a motor and the drive to succeed. I'm looking for TT to use both his busy hat and his heart to make this decision.

    Points? Counterpoints?

    http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/sports/247618881.html
     
  2. captainWIMM

    captainWIMM Cheesehead

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  3. NOMOFO

    NOMOFO Cheesehead

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    Sean Richardson had the same surgery as Jolly last January and did not play until Week 12 of last season. A logical conclusion from a logical person would be that this is typical agent speak (suggesting he'll be ready for camp). An analytical person would suggest it's probably best to wait to hear from the doctors regarding a possible return to the field.
     
  4. Oshkoshpackfan

    Oshkoshpackfan YUT !!!

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    For the right price, he deserves to come back. He performed well and was a good piece to the run defense. I personnally hope he makes a strong return.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  5. ThxJackVainisi

    ThxJackVainisi Lifelong Packers Fanatic

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    I hope Jolly is signed to a contract with PT incentives and I don't think Thompson has to use his heart to make that decision. Jolly definitely provided a spark on D - the only question I have is his health and how quickly he can get into game-playing shape.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  6. captainWIMM

    captainWIMM Cheesehead

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    Oh, forgot about your troubles reading and understanding stuff.

    Once again, just for you, I posted that HIS AGENT said he will be ready for camp. I didn't mention with a single word that I think he will be cleared by then.

    If he's cleared I want them (once again, just for you, that is now my opinion) to sign him to a deal close to the veterans minimum (another explanation, just for you: that was actually the topic this thread was started for and once again you didn't add any relevant information to it, nobody is surprised by that though anymore).
     
  7. NOMOFO

    NOMOFO Cheesehead

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    lol. Yep...that makes perfect sense captaingooglemeister!

    Your exact quote:
    "According to his agent Jolly had a C5-C6 fusion surgery after suffering the neck injury (the same procedure as Sean Richardson had) and should be ready for camp. I´m all in favour of bringing him back for a deal close to the veteran minimum.

    ahhhhhhhhh... just a tad misleading and uninformative ...and.... well....clueless to say the least. Pretty much par for the course. You reference Sean Richardson's case in the same sentence between "Jolly's agent" and "ready for camp". Then go on to say you are in favor of signing him.

    It's like writing.... "I am a vegetarian that will never eat meat and right after I eat this steak I'm going to go to my garden to eat a salad with bacon." You make perfect sense googleman!

    Had you actually captaingooglemeistered "Sean Richardson" you would have seen there's reason to be skeptical about his return by camp. ...but you didn't...and now you're left to backtracking as usual. It's ok, just don't let it happen again. We expect your google research to be much better than this. We need better google effort.
     
  8. captainWIMM

    captainWIMM Cheesehead

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    I should have known the brackets will leave you confused, sorry, my bad. Next time I'll try to formulate sentences that even you're capable of understanding.

    BTW you posted twice in a thread about Jolly without stating your opinion. It would be awesome if you would just post what you think about a specific topic (if you're capable of that) and stop with the BS you post here 95% of the time.
     
  9. adambr2

    adambr2 Cheesehead

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    If healthy and in shape by training camp, I would absolutely bring him back on another 1 year vet minimum deal.
     
  10. El Guapo

    El Guapo Cheesehead

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    Actually, Tom Silverstein is the one who spoke with neck specialists and wrote in the article that since Jolly is a D-lineman instead of a safety, he should be ready to play at the start of the season. I think that's a reasonable assumption for a reasonable person to make.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  11. NOMOFO

    NOMOFO Cheesehead

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    ? I was talking about captaingoogle quoting the agent. i never saw any quote from silverstein.

    not exactly sure however how any "reasonable assumption" could be made that just because a guy is a d-lineman he can come back sooner than a safety? in fact, I would almost think the opposite but I'm not a doctor. playing d-line in the nfl is like having multiple car crashes in a 3 hour span every single week. not saying it's not true if the "experts" say it is... but I would hardly call it a "reasonable assumption".
     
  12. HardRightEdge

    HardRightEdge Cheesehead

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    If he was healthy and in shape for training camp somebody else will sign him for meaningfully more than the puny vet minimum of $715,000. We don't get a risk-free option here.

    Even if an incentive-based contract is contemplated, some judgement on the likelihood of Jolly's ability to play needs to be made before the draft. Do we go higher in the draft for Jolly's replacement because he's still seriously in doubt for 2014 or do we merely hedge our bets and go lower in the draft for a base D-Lineman because we like Jolly's odds.

    "Dunno" means we'll need to draft higher if he's not already replaced in free agency. And I sure hope it's ain't Raji doing the replacing.
     
  13. adambr2

    adambr2 Cheesehead

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    Meaningfully more? Based on what?

    Don't take this the wrong way, because I'm a big fan of Johnny Jolly and what he's accomplished. I just don't see this. He was out of football for 3 years and came back at age 30. He came back and made the team and played okay. Then he suffered a significant injury which makes him a question mark yet again. I hardly think there will be a ton of teams clamoring for his services.

    I guess it's possible he gets a 1 year offer for $1M-$1.5M if you consider that to be meaningfully more, but I sure don't think he's going to be any kind of major commodity on the FA market.
     
  14. ivo610

    ivo610 Cheesehead

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    I think it will be well into free agency before we knock on his door. 30% chance of returning is my guess
     
  15. El Guapo

    El Guapo Cheesehead

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    Really, only 30% chance? Is that because you think we will choose not to re-sign him, because he isn't phycially able to play, or because you believe that another team will sign him?
     
  16. NOMOFO

    NOMOFO Cheesehead

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    He's exactly the type of guy that a team will take a flyer on. If he stays healthy and plays the entire year, 3 mil a season could be a steal for some team. It really is a minimal risk for a potential high reward.
     
  17. HardRightEdge

    HardRightEdge Cheesehead

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    The fact he was out of football for 3 years is a moot point since he showed in 2013 that he can still play. If anything, being out for 3 years works in his favor...that's 3 years less wear and tear.

    As for the injury, you overlooked the proviso, "if he was healthy and in shape for camp". That oversight is somewhat mystifying since that was YOUR proviso I was replying to.

    He proved himself to be a decent player in a hard-to-find type...a nimble big man. When run-of-the-mill players like Eric Walden or Brad Jones get paid $4 mil per year, a healthy Jolly should command at least a couple million per year for a couple of years.

    That's not to say I believe he could be "healthy and in shape for camp". I don't. I was expressing a baseline opinion of his "healthy and in shape" worth.
     
  18. adambr2

    adambr2 Cheesehead

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    By "healthy and in shape for camp", I mean I would offer him that contract if he is healed to the point where he can participate in training camp. That doesn't mean that teams won't have reservations about him coming off an injury.

    Pro Football Focus graded Jolly out negatively both as a pass rusher and run defender. Again, I hate saying that because I like Jolly and I think he has more value than that. But given that, given his past baggage, etc, I don't see a market for him for a multi-year deal. I don't see any possible way he gets $3M a season. Bad contracts given to younger linebackers seems like apples and oranges to me. For every one of those, there's an average veteran who can't even find work.

    If I'm wrong, I will be very happy for Jolly.
     
  19. adambr2

    adambr2 Cheesehead

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