Thanks again Brett!

[wpr]

DePack
How can you automatically assume that it is a stupid thread if someone dares to insinuate that Brett isn't physically the same player he was years ago?
The MVP Brett of 1995 1996 and 1997 was a superior player to the 2005 version.
I guess that is why he earned the league MVP award so many times.
Brett is still a great player so not every stat shows a decline but the tendency is definitely there.
Ironically his completion % is higher this year than in all 3 of his MVP years so we can't write it all off to his weaker supporting cast.
But Ints are up and they are not all tipped balls that the DBs are grabbing. The TDs are down. Thus his QB rating is down. As are his yards per pass along with his attempts and yards running the ball. (His 1st 9 years were all 100+ yards running. None of his last 6 years have been even close to 100 yards. Now I am not saying that I want him to take off and run all the time just that he has done so less often and with less results when he does run.

 

[Philtration]

See what I mean... Every excuse but Brett not getting the job done.

2 and 9..... It is time to move on.

Give the kid some snaps.


RP

Give the kid to the wolves eh? Get him discourgaged right? That would be the best idea EVER.

Down to 1 receiver
Two new guards from last year and now the line has been shuffled two fifths again.
the RB is the 5th starter at RB
top TE could be out for awhile

Then letse go another step, who the hell said Sherman is gonna be back next year? So why get him comfortable with this system when chances are its gonna be GONE.

Playing Rodgers simply does not make sense. Case in point, Carson Palmer.

Playing a rookie QB would be the end of the world right? (Bears 8-3 this season, Steelers 15-1 last year) Not only would you not win any games (like now) but he also may get some much-needed experience in the NFL for the next season and beyond. Just keep clinging to the notion that the Packers are still in the playoff hunt. If Favre retires then who will start at QB for the Packers? If it is Rodgers then don't you think that every snap that he takes in a real live game will not only help him but help the team to evaluate if he is the man for the job or not? Do you want to find out that he is the next Joey Harrington some time during week 12 of next season?
What are you so afraid of? Hurting Favre's feelings? The Packers will have a football team to run long after Favre calls it quits.

 

[musccy]

Phil...you are right...

If football is truly a business, as everyone says, then feelings and respect (within reason) are set aside and you do what's best for the organization.

If the Packers are no longer in the playoffs this year, then figuring out how the hell to get back there in the future is what is in the best interest of the team, and finding out if Rodgers is the future one example of this.

With that said, you still have to play to win, and even though Orton is having "success," and I admitedly can't stand a lot of Brett's antics, he's still the Pack's best chance to win.

I do think Rodgers needs to start getting some exposure somehow...not sure how long, I acknowledge hell will break lose if he gets PT over Brett, but truth be told, it's best for the long run.

 

[P@ck66]

Man some of you guys make me crazy with these ridiculous posts....

1. "Brett Favre is playing with NFL Europe caliber receivers"...if they're even that good....(and he's trying..and almost suceeding...to win football games....)

Which part of this statement do you not understand..? He doesn't have the receivers that Peyton Manning has...hell..he doesn't even have the receivers Eli Manning has...so how the hell do you expect him to do anything with this team? My question is..why isn't Sherman coaching these receivers to run different routes during the week so there may be some learning going on..and things are not so damn predictable?

2. If the Packers get some talent at receiver..solidify their O-Line..and get a decent running back...who do you think has the best chance of bringing this team to the show in the next 2, possibly 3 years....Aaron Rodgers?

Don't be ridiculous...no matter what that deluded Bear's fan thinks....his team will be exposed like "Big Ben" was last night.....

The only thing you will see from Aaron Rodgers is a lot of poor play and decision making for the next 6 games...and next year too..if many of you get your wish and force Favre into retirement.....

DePack...the rats are jumping off the sinking ship..and blaming Favre while they do so...(i personally think it's some kind of transference or rationalization because the can't believe their eyes..or accept reality that Sherman is such a **** poor coach...)

 

[musccy]

P@ck66...

Nobody said Rodgers is better than Brett...However, since there is a good chance that Brett will retire this year, then it makes sense to see what the heck the Pack have with Rodgers b4 April's draft.

Listen to me...Brett is still the Pack's best qb, by far, but his decision making is, debatably, at an all time low

I'm tired of this NFL europe argument too.
Brett made it work in the past w/ one WR and then some other "studs" like Sanjay Beach, Anthony Morgan, Reggie Cobb, and Ron Lewis.

Yes his current crop is subpar, but is he the only QB in football w/ a crappy team? Do you see David Carr or Trent Dilfer throwing 19 picks this year?

 

[DePack]

I agree with you Pack66 except for the obligatory Sherman is a **** poor coach comment.

The fact that a BEAR fan thinks Rodgers should get some time should tell the anti-Favre gang something. Let's see we play the Bears twice in the next month. How has Brett done against these *******? I guarantee you we win AT LEAST one of the games against the bears BECAUSE of Brett. Besides...it's not like Rothlesburger or Orton had anybody ahead of them, and both these teams are winning on defense.

You know my motto: Aaron Rodgers isn't owed ****. Take your millions to hold a clipboard or beat out Brett for the starting job......it's that simple.

 

[Miskito]

I agree with you Pack66 except for the obligatory Sherman is a **** poor coach comment.

The fact that a BEAR fan thinks Rodgers should get some time should tell the anti-Favre gang something. Let's see we play the Bears twice in the next month. How has Brett done against these *******? I guarantee you we win AT LEAST one of the games against the bears BECAUSE of Brett. Besides...it's not like Rothlesburger or Orton had anybody ahead of them, and both these teams are winning on defense.

You know my motto: Aaron Rodgers isn't owed ****. Take your millions to hold a clipboard or beat out Brett for the starting job......it's that simple.

Such anger, DePack. shhh.. take a breath.... I will make this prediction - Brett will only be in for a quarter or so in the Christmas game (in order to keep his streak alive). BTW - Orton does have somebody who is creeping up behind him - Grossman. For all of Orton's success, he is still on a short leash.

 

[DePack]

SKITO....did you read my post? Where do you see the anger? If you are refering to the ******* comment, get real. A bear fan coming on a Packer forum having to read that his team is referred to as ******* really surprises you? Have you followed the rivalry over the years? I'm actually glad about their resurgence. I'm tired of the "recent" rivalry developed between the Pack and queens. Let's get the REAL rivalry back. Win the division over the "black and blue" wannabees.

Your credibility has been shot to hell....comparing Grossman to Favre. Not to worry, though, your history of intelligent posts overrides this. We'll give you a mulligan for that one. Must have had a brain fart.

 

[musccy]

DePack...

I don't think he was comparing Grossman to Brett. Just saying that Orton has someone nipping at his heels (if Gross. ever gets healthy)

 

[sunshine]

ok guys -

all of you calling for Rodgers from the bench...have ANY of you actually SEEN this guy play?? i was at 2 pre-season games & he was - expectedly -crappy!!!! like many have said - if he wants snaps - let him EARN 'em!!

and as far as favre being fundamentally a good player - of course not - he's one unique QB - always has been - always will be! no amount of "coaching" is gonna change that - thank GOD!! i don't know about the rest of you but the entire time he's been our QB, every single time he throws a long one, i hold my breath!! even in his MVP years - when he had an awesome team around him. I LOVE THAT about him!!!!! he has the ability to be brilliant & incredibly crazy at any given moment - never know which brett will show up - again one of the things i really like about the guy.

those trashing him will live to EAT YOUR FREAKIN words!!! the man is a legend - give him his props & shut up already!!! ok, it's gotta be time for a beer - meet y'all at the bar!! als:

 

[Miskito]

SKITO....did you read my post? Where do you see the anger? If you are refering to the ******* comment, get real. A bear fan coming on a Packer forum having to read that his team is referred to as ******* really surprises you? Have you followed the rivalry over the years? I'm actually glad about their resurgence. I'm tired of the "recent" rivalry developed between the Pack and queens. Let's get the REAL rivalry back. Win the division over the "black and blue" wannabees.

Your credibility has been shot to hell....comparing Grossman to Favre. Not to worry, though, your history of intelligent posts overrides this. We'll give you a mulligan for that one. Must have had a brain fart.

OK, OK, point taken. Yes, your wording took me back a bit, simply because I haven't heard anybody this year, media or football fan refer to the Bears as "*******."
Also, Musscy is right, I was not referring to Grossman as Favre - you read into that a little too far.
You are right about rekindling this rivalry. It seems that all these years it has been the Bears who were keeping the rivalry alive and the Packers seeing the games as automatic wins (which usually happened). I do hope for the recovery of the Packers next year as well as continued success for, of course, the Bears.

 

[DePack]

touche' with the "*******" remark. This year you'll only hear that on a Packer board.

My Favre/Grossman point was that Phil mentioned Orton was given a chance and been successful so why not Rodgers. I pointed out that Orton wasn't playing behind a Favre. You brought up Grossman...hence the Favre/Grossman comment......damn I have a headache.....forget about it!

 

[PPierce]

Fact is the Packers as a team played up top the water level of the team.

Water always rises to its own level.

Fact is Brett did not have a good game. What does one expect? He is 36 years old and of course is an old dog that can not learn new tricks. Brett is not willing to adjust his game time decisions to adjust to his loss of athletic skills that come to us all at the age of 36.

When the draft comes along in 2006 this game will be a great loss for the Packers. It would have been a greater loss if the Texans did not choke, but then again perhaps the Texan' as a team have the right game plan.

Now that the Pack are eliminated from the playoffs in WEEK 11, do you think it might be time to build for the future? Do you think it might be a time to give the kid some snaps?

Of course not... Not for some people on this forum. Brett is God!

Brett could go 0 for 31 next week with 5 picks and some of you would blame it on the receivers, the play calling, the coach, the weather, astrology, karma, the political situation in Panama, the field, the trainers, the uniform itch effect due to a new soap used by the assistant trainer, the fact he misses his tractor, or even the fact that he has not been invited as a guest on the Dr. Phil show.

Fact is.... Realize it or not... Brett is not Brett any longer. It is not his fault and he will go down in history as a great QB with all football fans. He will go down as the greatest of all time with Packer fans.

But... either way he has gone down, and will stay down. It is life. It is being 36 in the NFL and there is nothing wrong with that. It is life.

Every loss from this point is a win for the future of the Packers.

I think the Texans' have got that figured out, Pack fans should too.

P.S. I know the math, but face it this team is eliminated from the play offs.


RP

This won't be popular with Packer fans on this forum, but I agree. Favre was a great, great, great franchise QB, but we have to look ahead, and building without including a young QB is insane. It won't work. All great QB's eventually have to retire and we'll be in hot water if we have nobody in the wings. I don't know if Brett is still Brett or not, since the rest of the team is so bad, but I do see him not adjusting to the rookies and he's throwing WAY too many interceptions. I'll always appreciate what he's done and still may do, but I want a glimpse of the future too and a big part of that is the QB. Teams without good QB's have a lot of trouble winning unless, and it pains me to say this, you're the '05 Bears (there, I said it anyways). We aren't them. We need to get somebody ready to take over for Brett. If it's going to be AR then he should get playing time this year.

 

[sunshine]

i'd say that's a BIG IF, pierce!! whoever said that AR is the heir apparent anyway?? just because he "won" the 2nd string job doesn't mean he's the future! and from what i've seen - Lord help us if he is!!

i wonder if all this concern about the future would be even remotely talked about if we were having a winning season this year?!? i HIGHLY doubt it!! favre would be DA MAN, you'd be saying "aaron rodgers - who dat?", & not one single time would you think "oh dear, we have to wet widdle aaron pway"!! :wink: :lol:

 

[P@ck66]

You know what..?

You guys are right..Favre sucks..he's definitely lost it....maybe 5 years ago according to some here....

Let's sign Sherman to 10 more years because it's unfair to judge him on only 5....

and let's put in Aaron Rodgers....

(and watch the kid get CREAMED for the next 5 weeks....)

Because as you know...after 5 weeks this year....day one next year he's a pro....and we won't lose a step.....

(so long Brett...been good to know ya'...)

 

[PPierce]

i'd say that's a BIG IF, pierce!! whoever said that AR is the heir apparent anyway?? just because he "won" the 2nd string job doesn't mean he's the future! and from what i've seen - Lord help us if he is!!

i wonder if all this concern about the future would be even remotely talked about if we were having a winning season this year?!? i HIGHLY doubt it!! favre would be DA MAN, you'd be saying "aaron rodgers - who dat?", & not one single time would you think "oh dear, we have to wet widdle aaron pway"!! :wink: :lol:

Well, I agree with you...and also disagree. I do agree that Rodgers may not be able to cut it in the NFL, and I think it's good to know if he can or can't. As for me, regardless of what kind of year we had this year I'm forward thinking and Brett is not our future. I'd want to have a QB in place who can play in the NFL when he retires, because he will soon. If AR plays a little and we see the kid can't cut it at all then we'll have some high draft picks and can pick a better prospect. People who refuse to look beyond Brett, because of his past accomplishments, imo are writing off the future of the Packers. I admire Favre for all he's done, but I don't think that just because he will be in th HOF we should put the franchise on hold until he decides to tell us he's retiring. Nor do I think Rodgers should NEVER play. Since we are clearly out of it this year, Rodgers SHOULD play a little so we can see what he can or can't do. No matter how you slice is, Brett was a legend, but is in the winter of his career. Without a good QB to take over for him, we are really screwed.

 

[wpr]

You know just b/c fans have said Rodgers should get a few snaps doesn't mean we are saying cut Brett right now and send him packing back to Kiln.
Rodgers hasn't earned anything. That is true. But to give him a series in the 1st half and another one in the 2nd half is not mutiny nor p!ssing all over Brett.
Believe it or not, there actually is a middle ground between the two schools of thought:
1) BRETT IS GOD ray:
2) Brett is a worthless old turd and all the Packer problems are soley his fault. :cane:

 

[WinnipegPackFan]

Well, it's come to this eh ? One bad season and it's bench Brett because "We have to look to our future". How Pathetic. After all this guy has done for our team don't you think "our future" might be set aside for a few months and don't you think he needs Packer support more now then ever ? This is the guy that played injured for "you fans", played a day after his fathers funeral for "you fans", helped bring a Superbowl home for "you" fans, helped bring how many ? division championships and winning seasons home for "you" fans. But hey, we gotta think about our future now, bye bye Brett. PATHETIC.,

 

[Philtration]

If the Packers get some talent at receiver..solidify their O-Line..and get a decent running back...who do you think has the best chance of bringing this team to the show in the next 2, possibly 3 years....Aaron Rodgers?


The only thing you will see from Aaron Rodgers is a lot of poor play and decision making for the next 6 games...and next year too..if many of you get your wish and force Favre into retirement.....

First of all, do you believe that the Packers are suddenly going to get "some talent at receiver..solidify their O-Line..and get a decent running back" just like that? If it were that easy then woulden't every team just do it?

Second, what is this crap about forcing Favre into retirement? He has been toying with that idea all by himself for the last 5 years and he is the one who says that it is a 50/50 chance that he wont be back.

Like it or not, Favre's days as the Packers QB are almost over and you will have to move on. The Bears did not go out of business when Walter Payton hung them up and I don't see the Broncos crying about John Elway not taking snaps for Denver either.
The Packers need to sit down with Favre and ask him if he is coming back next year or not. He owes them a straight answer because they have done as much for him as he has done for the Packers.

 

[carol k]

I agree with you winnipeg pack fan. I am so sick and tired of favre bashing. I wonder how many of these bashers could do better or even as well as favre does. This guy has done so much for this team both on and off the field, and people are still bashing him. Why don't all of you people who are bashing favre apply for his job and we'll see how well you can do without any good players around you.

 

[P@ck66]

First of all..

We really don't care what YOU think Bear's fan......

and for Pierce and all the other so called Packer fans....there's an old saying...

"Don't start wishing for tomorrow because your ******** all over today.."

What if Brett says he'll play another 2-3 years? What then..?

Do you say..no thanks..we've got Aaron Rodgers now....?

Do you honestly think that Rodgers has a better chance to take the Pack to the SB in those 2-3 year than Brett Favre?

Especially if they got some talent around him?

(Don't listen to the Bear fans because they are biased and don't know what they're talking about...they're delusional because they have 8 wins and think they're going somewhere in the playoffs....)

 

[DePack]

66...if you were a bear fan wouldn't you want Favre to retire?

 

[musccy]

Why can't we criticize Brett?!? I'd like someone to tell me that. Also keep these things in mind...

-He's leading the NFL in ints by SIX (next closest TEAM is Balt...3 behind)
-He's had a string of recent poor playoff performances
-The Pack just drafted his "successor"
-Brett will count 12.3 mil v. the cap next yr.
-Has hinted at retirement for ~5 consec. years

So why are ppl so stunned and or personally offended by any mention of Aaron Rodger's name (even just suggesting he takes 2 snaps b4 season's end) or any talk of Brett retirement?

Btw...good post philtration. IMO getting a dif. perspective from a fan of another team is a welcome addition to this board.
-

 

[DePack]

musccy...you can criticize Brett all you want. Guys like Pack66 and myself can defend him all we like. That's what this forum is about.

I will address your complaints item by item.

- the only reasons he leads the NFL in ints is because Daunte Culpeper got hurt. That and the fact that he is throwing to a makeshift receiving corps. I won't go into the complexities of their passing offense and how difficult it is to play QB with different receivers every week.

- he HAS had a string of recent poor playoff performances. So what? It happens....the whole team has had a string of poor playoff performances. Peyton Manning has had a recent string of poor playoff performances. Should he be benched?

- The Pack just drafted a guy that 24 teams didn't want anything to do with. Did you see anyone trade up to get this guy with the 20th pick. Naming him successor is a little premature. Until he wins the job he is just a first round clipboard holder.

- Brett will count for 12.3 mil of the cap. Is this any reason to criticize him? For years he has redone his contract to help the team stay a winner. If he is our starting QB next year he will be worth 12.3 mil of the cap space.

- so what if he has hinted about retirement? Every player wonders about retirement 10 years into their career. Brett is just an icon. People keep asking him about it and, God forbid, he gives them an honest answer every time. He has never wavered about this. He will retire when he feels the time is right.

Finally....in my opinion getting a different perspective from a fan of another team doesn't mean ****...especially when that team has been treated like a redheaded stepchild by Brett Favre. The bears have been his bithches for the past 15 years.

 

[musccy]

DePack...

W/ the ints...the Pack aren't the only team with inconsitency at the wr position, yet Brett/Pack lead every other team in ints by at least 3. And picks like the 2 he had on the final drive on sunday have little to do w/ new wrs, he just forced balls into double and triple coverage.

I agree w/ most of the rest of your points though...I was just bringing those topics up because I'm frustrated w/ ppl who are deeply offended by ppl criticizing Brett, or saying I'm less of a Packer fan because of it. IMO, the reasons I listed are legit topics that are at least worthy of a discussion.