Taysom Hill

gopkrs

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I know people have said Hill had a finger injury on his throwing hand. But I have not heard anyone possibly giving him a break from his poor performance because of it.
 

KiDcUdI

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It’s tough to evaluate Hill at all. The Saints offense last week may have the worst supporting cast in the league. They’ve got some competition from the Jets and Jags but the Saints don’t have a single player on offense I would have any interest in. Without Kamara or Michael Thomas they’re a useless bunch.

That said the contract the Saints have Hill is insane. He’s a good chess piece player but ultimately I have always found those types of players to be gimmicks that don’t work against good defenses when the playoffs come around.
 

Pkrjones

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I know people have said Hill had a finger injury on his throwing hand. But I have not heard anyone possibly giving him a break from his poor performance because of it.
Hill's INT's we're horrible decisions, not errant passes due to his finger. No breaks on bad decisions...sorry.
 

GreenNGold_81

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Hill isn't an upgrade over Siemian at quarterback at all.
He's an upgrade with his rushing ability, so there's something... Their average QB rating is pretty close actually 80.7 vs. 80.6 (career). So don't act like it's not close. I'd edge to Hill given he is more versatile.
 

Pokerbrat2000

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The Saints would most likely be better off using NFL caliber players at each of those positions instead of Hill. While he can have an impact at each of the positons you mentioned he's a downgrade for ever pro level player excelling at his respective position.
There is a difference between being "the best" at all those positions individually VS what he does as one player at many positions. You make it sound like he isn't even NFL caliber at any of the positions he plays. When you look at "the best" on each team at the positions we are talking about, his salary doesn't come close to top dollar for all those positions. The Saints are paying him for his ability to play a number of different positions, not for being a top level NFL player at each of those positions.

I don't think you and I will ever agree that the Saints value Hill for what he can do for the team and are paying him what they feel that value is worth. Trying to convince yourself that I or the Saints think that he is a starter that excels at anyone one of the many positions that he plays, is you trying to create a debate that has never existed.
 

captainWIMM

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Sean Payton seems to disagree with a couple of your points.

That's pretty obvious but doesn't mean the Saints and Payton signing Hill to that deal will ultimately end up being a good idea.

He's an upgrade with his rushing ability, so there's something... Their average QB rating is pretty close actually 80.7 vs. 80.6 (career). So don't act like it's not close. I'd edge to Hill given he is more versatile.

There's no doubt Hill presents an upgrade over Siemian running the ball. While their pass ratings are nearly identical I consider Siemian to be a superior passer.

There is a difference between being "the best" at all those positions individually VS what he does as one player at many positions. You make it sound like he isn't even NFL caliber at any of the positions he plays. When you look at "the best" on each team at the positions we are talking about, his salary doesn't come close to top dollar for all those positions. The Saints are paying him for his ability to play a number of different positions, not for being a top level NFL player at each of those positions.

I don't think you and I will ever agree that the Saints value Hill for what he can do for the team and are paying him what they feel that value is worth. Trying to convince yourself that I or the Saints think that he is a starter that excels at anyone one of the many positions that he plays, is you trying to create a debate that has never existed.

My point is that Hill shouldn't be paid more than a backup quarterback, a #3 running back or a #5 wide receiver as he doesn't do anything as good as another player solely playing one of those positions. The Saints might save a spot or two on the active roster because of him but that's not good enough to pay him that much money.
 

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as far as i'm concerned the Saints can pay him as much as they want, the more the better LOL

I'm not saying gadget players don't have value, but gadgets players don't tilt the playing field. They might provide a spark, but relied upon to do anymore they usually fail at both. he's not a good QB. He can throw better than a RB and he can run better than a QB. there's value, and if the Saints think it's 10M bucks, sweet. Double it !

But all that running he did the other night, set up a perfect wide open TD pass and he missed badly. What's the point? examples of it all night long and in every game he's had to be more than a gadget player in a specific situation.

If the Saints didn't have such a good defense, they'd be looking at double digit losses almost every week with Hill at QB.
 

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Sean Payton seems to disagree with a couple of your points.
Is there an injury problem with Siemian, or does Payton just prefer Hill? With all the injuries, it's hard to evaluate any player on that team fairly.
 

Schultz

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There was an injury problem with Hill. IMO that is why Siemian started the games he did. I believe Payton has always preferred Hill over Siemian. IMO. I am in no way asking anyone to believe me.
 

GreenNGold_81

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There's no doubt Hill presents an upgrade over Siemian running the ball. While their pass ratings are nearly identical I consider Siemian to be a superior passer.
Except they're practically identical when passing is considered and Trevor is playing for his third franchise. Meanwhile, NO is certainly holding onto Hill and would have handed him the reigns if he was healthy.
 

captainWIMM

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Captain, I never said a single word about Hill's contract.

The whole discussion started when the Saints guaranteed to pay him $21.5 million. The contract needs to be taken into consideration when talking about Hill.

Except they're practically identical when passing is considered and Trevor is playing for his third franchise. Meanwhile, NO is certainly holding onto Hill and would have handed him the reigns if he was healthy.

Siemian isn't a starting caliber quarterback but he's still better at throwing the ball than Hill. Just like Lamar Jackson, Hill benefits from being a running threat on most plays resulting in easier throws based on the defense needing to contain him.

The Saints were definitely going with Winston as their starting quarterback for all of this season if he had stayed healthy.
 

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Next year Winston will likely be the main QB. He seemed less reckless when he played this year. He is not paid that much so he and Hill will equal one QB. And we will have to see, but it could be a good combination.
 

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Captain,
The conversation (as many do) veered off into a comparison of Hill vs. Siemian. Then and only then did I engage in such conversation merely pointing out that you think Siemian is the better QB while Sean Payton believes Hill is the better of the two.
 

GreenNGold_81

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Captain,
The conversation (as many do) veered off into a comparison of Hill vs. Siemian. Then and only then did I engage in such conversation merely pointing out that you think Siemian is the better QB while Sean Payton believes Hill is the better of the two.

I'd go so far as to say that most people think Hill is the better of the two. And Winston isn't even under contract next year. If Taysom plays well here on out, he could be the starter week 1 next year.
 

captainWIMM

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Captain,
The conversation (as many do) veered off into a comparison of Hill vs. Siemian. Then and only then did I engage in such conversation merely pointing out that you think Siemian is the better QB while Sean Payton believes Hill is the better of the two.

I'm fine with someone arguing that Hill is a better quarterback than Siemian. I don't understand a team guaranteeing to pay him $21.5 million as he's not a starting caliber player at any position though.

I'd go so far as to say that most people think Hill is the better of the two. And Winston isn't even under contract next year. If Taysom plays well here on out, he could be the starter week 1 next year.

Did you watch Hill vs. the Cowboys? I would be excited if the Saints make him the starter for next season as they would definitely struggle mightily.
 

Schultz

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I'm fine with someone arguing that Hill is a better quarterback than Siemian. I don't understand a team guaranteeing to pay him $21.5 million as he's not a starting caliber player at any position though.



Did you watch Hill vs. the Cowboys? I would be excited if the Saints make him the starter for next season as they would definitely struggle mightily.
I never disagreed with you on his contract. Kind of a mindboggling deal to me.
 

GreenNGold_81

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Did you watch Hill vs. the Cowboys? I would be excited if the Saints make him the starter for next season as they would definitely struggle mightily.
Sure did. Not his best showing. But as you know, you don't judge a player on one game. Otherwise, Favre would have been cut after his brutal showing against the Rams in 2002.

Maybe it'd be good for you to review just how many multiple interception games Trevor Siemian has, then compare to good ol' Taysom. Then you can come back and change your tune. ;)
 

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I can't say Hill has looked all that different in any of the games he's played that i've see. I think the last game is pretty much indicative of how he plays. I'm just fine with the Saints paying as much and starting him as much as they want. I'm hoping for multi year deals. It's better for us.
 

captainWIMM

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Sure did. Not his best showing. But as you know, you don't judge a player on one game. Otherwise, Favre would have been cut after his brutal showing against the Rams in 2002.

Maybe it'd be good for you to review just how many multiple interception games Trevor Siemian has, then compare to good ol' Taysom. Then you can come back and change your tune. ;)

My point remains that Hill isn't a starting caliber quarterback and it's insane to pay him that much money.

As a side note, I couldn't care less about Siemian but he has never thrown four interceptions in a single game.
 

Pokerbrat2000

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Not a cap expert, but what am I missing through 2023 that doesn't make it headline worthy?
"The New Orleans Saints and quarterback Taysom Hill have agreed to a one-of-a-kind four-year "hybrid" contract extension worth up to $90M, per reports."

When the story first broke, it appeared like crazy talk. However, once the details of the contract came out, it was obvious that it was a very complex contract, that would only pay that kind of money, if Hill became a very successful starting QB. Meanwhile, they will continue to pay him for what they are more than happy to have him doing.
 
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