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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Magooch" data-source="post: 1073225" data-attributes="member: 17987">The case of LaFleur IMO is tough in both directions. No denying that at the end of the day his overall record is very, very, very good. And like Tyni said, on the whole it is somewhat rare that you push out that kind of coach and see immediate improvement. I guess you could make a case for the Eagles (Pederson to Sirianni), Broncos (Fox to Kubiak), Ravens (Billick to Harbaugh), maybe Seattle (Holmgren to Mora for a season before Carroll)...But at the same time I think that coaches making that late "jump" is somewhat rare as well. Like above we can point to guys like Reid, Schottenheimer, Dungy as examples of teams who fired good coaches and it backfired* on them and these coaches became more successful in the future...BUT the big common thread here is that all three saw those improvements *with a different team*. Yes Schottenheimer did well with KC, and the Browns are the Browns, but there's no guarantee he would've had the same success/sustained by staying in Cleveland. Yes Tony Dungy won the Super Bowl with the Colts, but who's to say that he would've had the same success with Tampa? Yes Andy Reid went from being a very good coach to IMO an all-timer in KC but again...would that have happened if he had stayed? That is anyone's guess.So IMO they are both very rare. Not a lot of teams immediately improve after jettisoning a top coach...but not many coaches spend the better part of a decade with the same team before finally getting over the hump, too. In that regard perhaps there is something to say for the message getting "stale". Of course if the goal is simply to win a Super Bowl then we are obviously talking about a terribly small sample size of coaches in the first place. But in any case that IS the goal, no? I guess what I am getting at is...how many coaches can we point to who spent a long time with one team in a state of being "almost there but not quite" before finally getting over the hump with the SAME team? I think it is probably a fairly short list.... *You could probably make a case that it didn't really negatively impact Philly that much either. Yes they had to go through the Chip Kelly years, but they won the SB in 2017 with Doug Pederson. Andy didn't make the SB or win it until 2019</blockquote>

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