All Sitton & Lang & OL threads merged

[jrock645]

I have to ask... What exactly was wrong with my assessment of the offensive line? I clearly stated it as my thoughts.

 

[sschind]

Cut and trade everybody!

Except Janis of course, gotta keep Janis. He's the only one worth a damn and he's cheap.

 

[Packerlover]

Eh, I see this group as being very overrated. They're not physically dominant enough to be considered one of the best. Yeah they go through stretches where they play great as a unit but... There's a big difference between playing great and actually being great. This is a unit that relies heavily on timing, chemistry and rhythm. Hey either all look good or they look flat out awful together. None of them are good enough to have an individual performance stand on its own. With the way this unit plays, I'll never be able to consider them as a top oline.

I have to ask... What exactly was wrong with my assessment of the offensive line? I clearly stated it as my thoughts.

First off, Sitton is a perennial Pro Bowler so his individual performances must stand alone.
Second, the Packers ARE a pass first, rhythm type offense, so the O'line must be able to play as a unit in order to be effective. Timing and chemistry are a priority.
Third, being a pass first offense the Packers do not need road graders as Offensive linemen. They need to have some finesse/athleticism in their repertoire. Our O'line shows me that because we do have a power running game with lacy AND a one cut style running attack with Starks. That shows me that our O'line can adapt to certain game plans where other teams could not.

I think our O'line is first rate and hope they stay together for a couple of more years!

 

[jrock645]

First off, Sitton is a perennial Pro Bowler so his individual performances must stand alone.
Second, the Packers ARE a pass first, rhythm type offense, so the O'line must be able to play as a unit in order to be effective. Timing and chemistry are a priority.
Third, being a pass first offense the Packers do not need road graders as Offensive linemen. They need to have some finesse/athleticism in their repertoire. Our O'line shows me that because we do have a power running game with lacy AND a one cut style running attack with Starks. That shows me that our O'line can adapt to certain game plans where other teams could not.

I think our O'line is first rate and hope they stay together for a couple of more years!

Eh, id beg to differ on not needing roadgraders. His team cant convert 3rd and shorts for anything. All that finesse blocking does nothing in shirt yrdage and goal line situtions.

 

[Packerlover]

Eh, id beg to differ on not needing roadgraders. His team cant convert 3rd and shorts for anything. All that finesse blocking does nothing in shirt yrdage and goal line situtions.

That may be more of lapses in play calling vs the o'lines ability

 

[jrock645]

That may be more of lapses in play calling vs the o'lines ability

I know what you mean, but i think the struggle has been too consistent for that. It went back to 2014, highlighted by the failures in the Seattle game. Its a rhythm line that just isnt capable of pushing the line of scrimmage.

 

[Packerlover]

I know what you mean, but i think the struggle has been too consistent for that. It went back to 2014, highlighted by the failures in the Seattle game. Its a rhythm line that just isnt capable of pushing the line of scrimmage.

Football is a team sport, there is no way around that. If the TEAM is hitting on all cylinders then there's no problem, if a part of the team breaks down then all working components break down and it's easy to point out failures and lack of ability or effort or how one sees that. The players we have are ones that TT and MM deem necessary to be competitive on a regular basis and there's no argument there, the team has won the division on a consistent basis and made the playoffs on a consistent basis. making that next big step. going to the Super Bowl is up to those in charge and I think they are doing a great job. with that said, I expect to see TT draft a lineman or 2 to increase competition at certain positions and that helps the team and creates a winning attitude.

 

[NelsonsLongCatch]

Except Janis of course, gotta keep Janis. He's the only one worth a damn and he's cheap.

Only keep cheap players!

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I know what you mean, but i think the struggle has been too consistent for that. It went back to 2014, highlighted by the failures in the Seattle game. Its a rhythm line that just isnt capable of pushing the line of scrimmage.

The Packers were tied for 7th in 2014 during the regular season in converting third and fourth downs with two or less yards to go. For whatever reason the team dropped to 31st this year but I don´t think the offensive line is the only unit to blame for it.

 

[GreenBaySlacker]

We have time to replace them now, before their contracts are up. We already budgeted for their current deals. What we need is stability right now, and they give it.

The problem is we seemingly quit building the oline after bahk and lindsley. Our o and d lines need constant investment every year! Too important to have a solid, if not dominant lines...

 

[Mondio]

We have time to replace them now, before their contracts are up. We already budgeted for their current deals. What we need is stability right now, and they give it.

The problem is we seemingly quit building the oline after bahk and lindsley. Our o and d lines need constant investment every year! Too important to have a solid, if not dominant lines...

I don't think they "quit building" there is an entire team that needs refreshing. Every year teams lose players to age, injury, FA, attitude, etc. The entire team needs to be addressed constantly and you only get so many opportunities to do so. You can't pick high at every position every year. you pick guys, try and develop them and then move on. They have picked a fair number of Olinemen in the past few years, the problem results when they don't progress like you want them too. But do we take 2 higher O and D linemen at the expense of Randall and Rollins? Maybe a late pick LIke Hundley will never amount to anything, maybe he will, right now I wouldn't trade him for a late round Olineman either. Maybe we didn't need Ty last year? Or maybe we did and he just wasn't healthy, but I have a feeling if he was, nobody wouldn't have wanted a back up Dlinemen in the 3rd round over him either.

I think cutting either of them now is crazy. They're signed, playing well, and at a contract you've budgeted for and expected. I agree they do need to maybe look for replacement, but I think they always are it just depends on other needs and other factors that come up like injury. it would be a lot easier if every variable could be accounted for when picking players

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I don't think they "quit building" there is an entire team that needs refreshing. Every year teams lose players to age, injury, FA, attitude, etc. The entire team needs to be addressed constantly and you only get so many opportunities to do so. You can't pick high at every position every year. you pick guys, try and develop them and then move on. They have picked a fair number of Olinemen in the past few years, the problem results when they don't progress like you want them too. But do we take 2 higher O and D linemen at the expense of Randall and Rollins? Maybe a late pick LIke Hundley will never amount to anything, maybe he will, right now I wouldn't trade him for a late round Olineman either. Maybe we didn't need Ty last year? Or maybe we did and he just wasn't healthy, but I have a feeling if he was, nobody wouldn't have wanted a back up Dlinemen in the 3rd round over him either.

It seems that by now you have bought that much into Thompson´s philosophy that you have already forgot that there are other ways to acquire talent than the draft.

 

[jrock645]

Well, losing sherrod so early was a huge setback. Cant plan for that sorta thing. Then the scott wells decision is one id hope tes would like to do over. Granted, we're in a good spot now with linsley but we lost wells and didnt have to.

I wouldnt say weve stopped building, i think weve developed great interior depth but tackle has been a struggle due to injury. Losing sherrod and all the missed time with bulaga. Hard to build when you keep losing time like that. Im not a bakh fan but id have to say hes done well for a guy that probably was never intended to be the starter anytime soon.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Well, losing sherrod so early was a huge setback. Cant plan for that sorta thing. Then the scott wells decision is one id hope tes would like to do over. Granted, we're in a good spot now with linsley but we lost wells and didnt have to.

Thompson made the right decision letting Wells walk away in free agency in 2012 and not to match the Rams offer for four years and $24 million. He only started 35 games for St. Louis and didn´t see the end of the contract.

 

[jrock645]

Thompson made the right decision letting Wells walk away in free agency in 2012 and not to match the Rams offer for four years and $24 million. He only started 35 games for St. Louis and didn´t see the end of the contract.

Obviously wells wanted to bank on his last contract, but reports at the time said the packers didnt even make him an offer. Yeah $6m a year was a bit much but they didnt even try to keep him and then we got to saturday disaster.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Obviously wells wanted to bank on his last contract, but reports at the time said the packers didnt even make him an offer. Yeah $6m a year was a bit much but they didnt even try to keep him and then we got to saturday disaster.

There´s no denying that Thompson made a mistake replacing Wells with Saturday.

 

[adambr2]

Well, losing sherrod so early was a huge setback. Cant plan for that sorta thing. Then the scott wells decision is one id hope tes would like to do over. Granted, we're in a good spot now with linsley but we lost wells and didnt have to.

I wouldnt say weve stopped building, i think weve developed great interior depth but tackle has been a struggle due to injury. Losing sherrod and all the missed time with bulaga. Hard to build when you keep losing time like that. Im not a bakh fan but id have to say hes done well for a guy that probably was never intended to be the starter anytime soon.

Wells was the worst center in the NFL with the Rams, is now 34, and is injury prone. I'd sure hope letting him walk is NOT a decision Ted would like to do over.

 

[jrock645]

Wells was the worst center in the NFL with the Rams, is now 34, and is injury prone. I'd sure hope letting him walk is NOT a decision Ted would like to do over.

Like i said, were in a good spot now but we werent the first two years without him, and he wasnt the worst when we let him walk. He could very easily not have seen the end of a contract we gave him, too. Front load any bonus money and you dont get hit for releasing him.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Like i said, were in a good spot now but we werent the first two years without him, and he wasnt the worst when we let him walk.

EDS did a decent job for more than a season after replacing Saturday late in 2012. As I've posted above letting Wells leave was the right decision.

 

[jrock645]

EDS did a decent job for more than a season after replacing Saturday late in 2012. As I've posted above letting Wells leave was the right decision.

In your opinion.

 

[adambr2]

Like i said, were in a good spot now but we werent the first two years without him, and he wasnt the worst when we let him walk. He could very easily not have seen the end of a contract we gave him, too. Front load any bonus money and you dont get hit for releasing him.

We still obviously would have overpaid if we had front loaded the deal, how does that make sense that it would have been okay?

Saturday wasn't good, but Wells missed most of 2012 on IR anyway, so it's not like he would have been an upgrade. Since 2012 EDS and Linsley have been upgrades from what Wells has done.

How is it even debatable that letting him walk was clearly the right move? He got a big deal from the Rams, we let him walk, and he hasn't been good since then.

 

[jrock645]

We still obviously would have overpaid if we had front loaded the deal, how does that make sense that it would have been okay?

Saturday wasn't good, but Wells missed most of 2012 on IR anyway, so it's not like he would have been an upgrade. Since 2012 EDS and Linsley have been upgrades from what Wells has done.

How is it even debatable that letting him walk was clearly the right move? He got a big deal from the Rams, we let him walk, and he hasn't been good since then.

Its debatable because i dont agree with your argument in its entirety, and i dont have to.

 

[Mondio]

I thought at the time it was the right move letting Wells go. Saturday couldn't hack it in the end, but it was ok, we moved on. With the benefit of hindsight I think it becomes more obvious just how "right" letting him go was. He's an expensive injured player that doesn't contribute on the field and pretty much has been since we let him go.

 

[TJV]

Its debatable because i dont agree with your argument in its entirety, and i dont have to.

Of course you don't. But some opinions are supported by facts and some aren't. Yours on this issue is the latter group.

 

[jrock645]

Of course you don't. But some opinions are supported by facts and some aren't. Yours on this issue is the latter group.

Again, in your opinion. The facts of jeff saturday put plenty on my side of the table. Ignore them as you wish, people like you usually do.

Enjoy the rest of your day!