Shields' talks heating up

[JBlood]

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/10511740/sam-shields-green-bay-packers-attempting-complete-deal

I'll be surprised if he isn't signed by Mar. 3

 

[Deleted member 6794]

That sounds like a transcript of a TT or MM press conference. A lot of words, but no relevant information.

 

[adambr2]

The supposed rumor going around is for 4 years, $22.4M. http://www.acmepackingcompany.com/2...cb-sam-shields-seeks-4-year-22-4-million-deal

I have a hard time believing it. I would want to know if it is true why Ted Thompson didn't sign the contract months ago.

 

[7thFloorRA]

I read that too and am wondering the same thing. He would be better off taking the 11 mil tag offer....and then this same contract next year.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I read that too and am wondering the same thing. He would be better off taking the 11 mil tag offer....and then this same contract next year.

Well, so far the Packers haven´t put the franchise tag on him, so it´s not his decision.

 

[Ace]

I read that too and am wondering the same thing. He would be better off taking the 11 mil tag offer....and then this same contract next year.

I disagree with this. The rumored deal is something like 8-10 million guaranteed correct? So, he's pretty much already at the guaranteed $ that the tag would bring so why not add some financial security as well by taking the years on top of that?

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I disagree with this. The rumored deal is something like 8-10 million guaranteed correct? So, he's pretty much already at the guaranteed $ that the tag would bring so why not add some financial security as well by taking the years on top of that?

Actually the reported deal he is asking for is one close to the one that Tim Jennings signed with the Bears in January, which is for four years and $22.4 million, that´s an average of $5.6 million per season.

 

[Ace]

Actually the reported deal he is asking for is one close to the one that Tim Jennings signed with the Bears in January, which is for four years and $22.4 million, that´s an average of $5.6 million per season.

Right but I was referring to the guaranteed aspect of it responding to the above comment about him being better off taking the tag if we offered it. If the guaranteed money is a wash wouldn't he be better off taking the security with the years?

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Right but I was referring to the guaranteed aspect of it responding to the above comment about him being better off taking the tag if we offered it. If the guaranteed money is a wash wouldn't he be better off taking the security with the years?

OK, theoretically he could get released after one season though, so there´s no security involved in signing a long term contract other than the guaranteed money.

BTW I would be surprised if Shields isn´t asking for more money than Jennings got.

 

[Ace]

OK, theoretically he could get released after one season though, so there´s no security involved in signing a long term contract other than the guaranteed money.

BTW I would be surprised if Shields isn´t asking for more money than Jennings got.

You're absolutely right but that's 100% on him to avoid. If he plays well we won't release him, if we tag him and he blows out a knee, or underperforms more then likely he won't receive the money he is looking for. Ted has shown that he will hang onto his players, almost to a fault.

Agree with you on asking for more money also. I was pretty surprised that this is all he's rumored to be asking for.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Agree with you on asking for more money also. I was pretty surprised that this is all he's rumored to be asking for.

If the Packers let him go and he´ll sign a contract like that with another team I will be pissed.

 

[7thFloorRA]

I am assuming that he still gets a decent contract after the tag year so theoretically he would make more with that 11 mil bump from this year. Even if he plays somewhat down next year he would still get a nice contract. The worst case scenario would be a career threatening injury and he would still bank the 11 mil. I just forcing the packers to tag him will get him more leverage for a bigger contract I would see him asking for 4 years 26-28 mil.

 

[adambr2]

I've been a TT fan for a long time, but if the following turn out to be true:

1) Shields was just looking for about 4 years, $25M or less, and ends up signing elsewhere for about that,

2) We offered Raji $8M a year with $20M guaranteed last season

my confidence in him will be very shaken.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I am assuming that he still gets a decent contract after the tag year so theoretically he would make more with that 11 mil bump from this year. Even if he plays somewhat down next year he would still get a nice contract. The worst case scenario would be a career threatening injury and he would still bank the 11 mil. I just forcing the packers to tag him will get him more leverage for a bigger contract I would see him asking for 4 years 26-28 mil.

I just don´t think the Packers would franchise tag him if they don´t think they would be able to work out a long term contract before the season starts.

 

[adambr2]

I just don´t think the Packers would franchise tag him if they don´t think they would be able to work out a long term contract before the season starts.

I don't either. The projected franchise tag amount for a CB is $11.3M. Shields would almost surely prefer a long-term deal and the Packers would certainly rather not tie up that much cap space in Shields this year. It's really not a good thing for either side in this case.

 

[Ace]

I just don´t think the Packers would franchise tag him if they don´t think they would be able to work out a long term contract before the season starts.

I also think that we have a a certain amount of leverage in these negotiations too. I believe he needs to be resigned but if he isn't I still like what we have at CB for the upcoming season. The problem comes when Tramon becomes a free agent next year then where are we.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I also think that we have a a certain amount of leverage in these negotiations too. I believe he needs to be resigned but if he isn't I still like what we have at CB for the upcoming season. The problem comes when Tramon becomes a free agent next year then where are we.

I expect them to restructure and extend Tramon´s contract before the season starts.

 

[Ace]

I expect them to restructure and extend Tramon´s contract before the season starts.

100% on board with this as well.

 

[TJV]

The linked article questions how much truth there is to this rumor. Just like with the reported Raji offer, we just don’t know the details of any offer until its accepted. In the extremely unlikely case that Shields and his agent are offering to sign a very team-friendly deal I'm sure Thompson and Ball would do that deal ASAP.

I disagree with this. The rumored deal is something like 8-10 million guaranteed correct? So, he's pretty much already at the guaranteed $ that the tag would bring so why not add some financial security as well by taking the years on top of that?

If the guaranteed money is the same as the tag, the player is better off being tagged because after the season the player will either be tagged again (I believe teams can use the tag twice consecutively with a player) or hit the market. The guaranteed money is important to the player as insurance against serious injury or a significant decline in play. But if the guarantees are the same, the "insurance" is the same. Being tagged allows the player to get more guaranteed money next year, either by being tagged or signing a multi-year deal with guarantees. Signing a 4-year contract for example, means no more guaranteed money for 4 years. For very talented players, the guarantees on multi-year deals are usually more than the guaranteed tagged amount. And the team benefits with a multi-year deal because it can spread the cap hit over those years as opposed to taking the one-year hit of the entire tag amount.

 

[NelsonsLongCatch]

I read that too and am wondering the same thing. He would be better off taking the 11 mil tag offer....and then this same contract next year.

No player wants the tag. Please see Henry Melton last year.

 

[adambr2]

No player wants the tag. Please see Henry Melton last year.

There are some exceptions. Cutler had said before his contract that he would have no problem with it. Greg Hardy actually said he would love to get the franchise tag. In Cutler's case, he may have just been saying the right things, but in Hardy's guess, I bet he means every word of it. A guy who has made less than $3M his entire CAREER suddenly gets a guaranteed $12M for just one season and gets to stay where he's comfortable and then get another shot at a long-term deal?

That's the problem with the franchise tag really, it's not one size fits all. Guys like Brees and Rodgers would be ridiculously underpaid at the franchise tag amount relative to their market values. Same will apply for Graham if he actually does get a TE tender with the tag. A guy like Shields, as much as I like him, would be pretty overpaid if he signed a franchise tag. Even though he might not like it.

Look at Charles Woodson. Signed the franchise tag 2 straight years for the Raiders in 2004 and 2005. He made about $20M for those 2 years, for $10M a year (probably about $12-$13M a year now adjusted for inflation.)

Then he finally got a long-term deal which was worth $7M a year. Some guys make out pretty well on the tag. It's usually an overpay, it just puts the player at risk without a long-term contract. But I can tell you if I had a guaranteed $12M in front of me to sign for one year, that would be enough to set me and my family for life.

 

[NelsonsLongCatch]

There are some exceptions. Cutler had said before his contract that he would have no problem with it. Greg Hardy actually said he would love to get the franchise tag. In Cutler's case, he may have just been saying the right things, but in Hardy's guess, I bet he means every word of it. A guy who has made less than $3M his entire CAREER suddenly gets a guaranteed $12M for just one season and gets to stay where he's comfortable and then get another shot at a long-term deal?

That's the problem with the franchise tag really, it's not one size fits all. Guys like Brees and Rodgers would be ridiculously underpaid at the franchise tag amount relative to their market values. Same will apply for Graham if he actually does get a TE tender with the tag. A guy like Shields, as much as I like him, would be pretty overpaid if he signed a franchise tag. Even though he might not like it.

Look at Charles Woodson. Signed the franchise tag 2 straight years for the Raiders in 2004 and 2005. He made about $20M for those 2 years, for $10M a year (probably about $12-$13M a year now adjusted for inflation.)

Then he finally got a long-term deal which was worth $7M a year. Some guys make out pretty well on the tag. It's usually an overpay, it just puts the player at risk without a long-term contract. But I can tell you if I had a guaranteed $12M in front of me to sign for one year, that would be enough to set me and my family for life.

All of that is true, but if the player gets injured during that year (such as an ACL tear), the long term money goes out the window. So if Shields signs the franchise tag, makes $11M next year and tears his ACL, his CAREER earnings would be $14m. He'd be 26 years-old and out of a job.

 

[7thFloorRA]

That contract that was floated had 8 M guaranteed over the 4 year contract. The tag would get him 11 guaranteed over 1 year. There is a strong chance he does not suffer a career threatening injury this upcoming season so the odds are that he would get a new contract with another guaranteed amount of money. So lets remove 11 mil and a year from that proposed contract. Now its a 3 year 13 mil deal. I think that even if he has a significant injury he could still get that much on the market. If he has a good year then lets add 1 year and 11 to the deal and its now a 5 year 35 mil deal and 19 mil of it is guaranteed.

 

[rodell330]

Just pay the man and fix the other holes in the D. If i were Shields id get as much as i can..he has the leverage. He makes plays for a defense that doesn't make many plays. Where is TT's leverage? Jarrett Bush? Devon House? Yea, pay the man.

 

[7thFloorRA]

Just pay the man and fix the other holes in the D. If i were Shields id get as much as i can..he has the leverage. He makes plays for a defense that doesn't make many plays. Where is TT's leverage? Jarrett Bush? Devon House? Yea, pay the man.

Shields' leverage scares me. He should demand twice the contract Burnett got and you really couldn't argue with his logic in wanting that. That is the contract is the gift that keeps on giving........me headaches.