1. Welcome to Green Bay Packers NFL Football Forum & Community!

    Packer Forum is one of the largest online communities for the Green Bay Packers. You are currently viewing our community forums as a guest user.

    Sign Up or

    Having an account grants you additional privileges, such as creating and participating in discussions. Furthermore, we hide most of the ads once you register as a member!
    Dismiss Notice

Serious question about tutoring q/b

Discussion in 'Packer Fan Forum' started by longtimefan, Aug 25, 2012.

  1. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2005
    Messages:
    17,841
    Ratings:
    +3,485
    I have noticed since he became a starter that Rodgers is talking to the back q/b all the time during games..

    I am NOT TRYING to cause a storm with this question, but was brought up on a radio sports show..

    Did Brett ever do tutoring during games at all while with the Packers?
     
  2. toolkien

    toolkien Cheesehead

    Joined:
    May 9, 2011
    Messages:
    107
    Ratings:
    +71
  3. AmishMafia

    AmishMafia Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2010
    Messages:
    2,975
    Ratings:
    +2,226
    [​IMG]

    Brett: See, its right here. The soap suds makes it look smaller.
    Aaron: What's with the crocs?
    Brett: Nevermind that. This one I texted to the lady who babysits my daughter.


    Brett has stated that it was not his job to help or teach the other QBs. When asked about it Aaron talks in guarded language. I don't think Brett did much to help Aaron.
     
    • Funny Funny x 2
    • Agree Agree x 1
  4. ivo610

    ivo610 Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2010
    Messages:
    16,590
    Ratings:
    +4,273
    Brett isnt the teaching type. Its nothing personal, but he wasnt exactly a great Xs and Os kind of guy
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  5. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2005
    Messages:
    17,841
    Ratings:
    +3,485
    Awesome.I didnt want to believe the guys on the radio that Brett NEVER helped anyone..

    However, recall the Dallas game where Brett was hurt and Rodgers filled in?

    I seem to recall Brett on sideline not near anyone even when Rodgers came off the field
     
  6. DevilDon

    DevilDon Inclement Weather Fan

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2010
    Messages:
    1,392
    Ratings:
    +445
    Now don't take this as a softening on my stance but I think Ivo has a point. I don't think Brett ever once in his entire life worried about anybody other than Brett. Besides, how do you teach to throw on a wing and a prayer?
    I'm not leaning towards saying Brett was as cerebral a player as say a Joe Montana or Peyton or Aaron.
     
  7. greenbeard

    greenbeard Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2012
    Messages:
    25
    Ratings:
    +9
    sure, it would've been nice if favre did some tutoring. but why should he? aaron was drafted to take his job one day! Favre knew the better aaron was the bigger the chance he would be out. I don't wanna defend this behaviour but i understand it. And I'm sure walden doesn't do much tutoring to perry, or shields to house etc....
    Rodgers is fine with tutoring any backup as long he's the clear number 1, or Mathews can tutor Perry...they just aren't in a fight for a starting job.
     
  8. gwh11

    gwh11 Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2011
    Messages:
    231
    Ratings:
    +90
    Aaron Brooks is on record as saying Favre tutored him and Matt Hasselbeck.

    It's clear that Favre had little interest in helping Rodgers along at first. Rodgers compensated by listening to everything Favre said in meetings, taking tons of notes, just watching him like a hawk in practice, etc.

    However, by 2007 McCarthy started leaning on Favre to become more of a mentor to Rodgers. According to McCarthy. Favre really responded and did that, but that no one really heard much about that facet of the relationship.

    So, no, it wasn't true that Favre never mentored anyone. He neglected Rodgers at first, but warmed up at the end.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  9. TJV

    TJV Lifelong Packers Fanatic

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2011
    Messages:
    5,389
    Ratings:
    +4,176
    What's your source for this?

    IMO one of the lessons Rodgers learned from Favre was how not to be a leader. As soon as he was told he was the #1 QB he organized a party at his house at which everyone – from the stars of the team to the least known UDFA – was welcome. And from what we read and hear Rodgers continues to embrace everyone on the roster.

     
  10. gwh11

    gwh11 Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2011
    Messages:
    231
    Ratings:
    +90
    My source is right here: http://www.jsonline.com/sports/packers/32579374.html

    Here's a section of that text:

    Rodgers’ education continued into ’07. McCarthy urged Favre to spend more time mentoring Rodgers, and Favre responded.
    “My first year, he was kind of like, ‘Yeah, he needs to grow up and this and that,’ ” McCarthy said. “I told Brett, ‘You need to give back now. You’re at the point now where you’re older than most the quarterbacks coaches in the league. You can give back, not only to Aaron.’ Brett really embraced that. That’s one of the things you don’t really hear about.”
     
    • Like Like x 2
  11. toolkien

    toolkien Cheesehead

    Joined:
    May 9, 2011
    Messages:
    107
    Ratings:
    +71
    1) I am a staunch anti-Favrite, but not in a "he's the greatest QB ever and saved the franchise but he's a traitor so I hate him" way but in a "he chewed through his legacy trying to force a release that was never going to happen because he couldn't gracefully either (A) play his role especially when given the right of first refusal of the job, (B) retire, or (C) maturely work out a trade to a mutually agreeable team" sort of way.
    2) This is my conjecture but I think is likely true -

    I think Favre saw the inevitable evolution of the team was occurring around him, he wasn't allowed to dictate the construction of that evolution, and his preferred solution was to snap his fingers and have his "lifetime" contract go up in smoke so he could walk where he wanted to (as compared to actual options A/B/C above). When the Packers, somewhere in 2006ish/2007ish took the "a contract is a contract" approach to the dissolving relationship, that's when Favre countered with the "it's not in my contract" to train/mentor/tutor anyone. So he has a perfectly valid point and while I disagree with his graceless approach to The Divorce, particularly the final installment in 2008, if a "contract is contract" then indeed it is for all parties for all reasons. The Packers weren't obligated to let Favre go where ever he wanted, or trade him there, but he wasn't obligated to prepare his replacement either.
     
  12. TJV

    TJV Lifelong Packers Fanatic

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2011
    Messages:
    5,389
    Ratings:
    +4,176
    toolkien, in what way did the Packers take a “‘a contract is a contract’ approach to the dissolving relationship” in 2006-2007ish? And how was the relationship “dissolving” particularly during 2007 (you remember the 2007 season don’t you?). And if the relationship was dissolving why were the Packers ready to welcome Favre back in April of 2008, after his “retirement”? BTW, Favre didn’t tutor Rodgers in 2005 – 2006. As gwh11’s link above shows he did in 2007.

    Here is my conjecture: Thompson and McCarthy wanted Favre to commit to playing the 2008 season early enough for him to participate in the off-season workouts which they viewed (and still view) as a crucial element in the team-building process and particularly helpful for younger players to integrate with the vets. Favre clearly loathed pre-training camp obligations so when he was asked for a decision, he “retired”. The evidence suggests he thought he could “unretire” before training camp and be welcomed back with open arms. Luckily for us, after Favre “retired”, contemplated “unretiring” a month later, and “retired” again Thompson and McCarthy decided to move onto Rodgers.
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  13. 13 Times Champs

    13 Times Champs Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2011
    Messages:
    3,924
    Ratings:
    +1,379
    I remembered that as well. Thanks for the link. I think Farve's understanding of the game evolved over time and he had a very good knowledge of how to play QB in his later years. So I do think he had knowledge to pass on. Did he do it to the extent he should have..probably not. And before someone says something, that didn't stop him from taking risks with the ball we were all accustomed to.
     
  14. lambeaulambo

    lambeaulambo Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2010
    Messages:
    628
    Ratings:
    +206
    Most likely Brett probably waffled over the mentoring job as well.
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  15. toolkien

    toolkien Cheesehead

    Joined:
    May 9, 2011
    Messages:
    107
    Ratings:
    +71
    You remember Favre whining "trade me" in April of 2007, don't you? Miss all the dead eyed press conferences by Favre in the offseason of 2007? The same during training camp press conferences? And miss the Greta interviews where Favre listed his grievances against the team going back to 2005? The relationship had been dissolving for quite some time, but the Moss issue was huge, and it's no coincidence that Favre retired the day after Moss wasn't signed the second time in 2008. Favre wasn't simply waffling, he wanted the team constructed a certain way to "win now" in 2006/2007, and he felt TT was rebuilding instead. And Favre was stuck in his "lifetime" contract thru 2010 and apparently didn't want the use the trade route (for the same reason he didn't want Sherman let go - he didn't want to have to do any new learning). But the Viking situation became an ever enticing option in his mind way back, but there was no way the Packers would let him walk to the Vikings. So they danced around that and Favre kept playing even though he wanted his release. But the Packers were not simply going to release him or make any modifications, and at some point Favre released his frustration with the public statement about mentoring not being in his contract.

    In the end, I think the relationship became very frosty from nearly the start, with Rodgers being brought in and Sherman being let go even though Favre said if Sherman were gone he probably wouldn't come back (even though he did). And that was back in 2005. And then on Greta Favre complained about the linemen not signed which pissed him off, also in 2005. And the Packer brass was getting tired of the waffling/public ultimatums. And then the Moss thing in 2007 which apparently frosted Favre but good. And then the retirement, and Favre then saying, in 2009, that the drafting of two QB's pretty much sealed his "mistrust" (meaning hate) of TT and I feel fueled his desire for vengeance and his unretirement and trying to FORCE a release by disrupting the Packers financial orderliness.

    So given Favre's statements in early 2007, it was clear he had had just about enough and the relationship was on the rocks. And even though the Packers made it as far as they did, Favre had his records in hand and he was mentally tired. He felt all the pressure was on him, and he didn't know if he was still wanted to play (poor guy). And when Moss re-signed with NE, Favre didn't have enough faith or desire to play anymore, and exercised one of his options - to retire. But, again, TT "closed the door" by drafting two QB's and suddenly Favre was energized again to play AGAINST the Packers.

    So, anyway, 2008 didn't happen in a crucible. The relationship had been strained for years, and was on the brink of dissolving in 2007 with the "trade me" talk but was patched over for another year. But Favre felt trapped, knew he wasn't going to get out of his contract scott free, and I don't think he felt obliged to train his replacement as he wasn't allowed to dictate the elements to "win now" or be allowed to walk.

    Rodgers himself says the first year was tough, but after that things seemed fine - for a while, but obviously Favre worked himself up into a pique of rage and anger which began to boil over in 2007. And the relationship went south and the mentoring with it. If Favre was that unhappy, he simply should have motivated a trade around 2006-ish and been done with it. But he was ALWAYS conflicted and turned a yes or no into a 20 part cluster-F that he couldn't navigate through and the beat just went on into that 2007 rant and then on from there. In the end, Favre wanted to either construct the team his way or be allowed to walk with a snap of the fingers. If he'd just gracefully played, retired, or worked out a mutually agreeable trade, a whole lot of negative B.S. would have been avoided.
     
  16. DevilDon

    DevilDon Inclement Weather Fan

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2010
    Messages:
    1,392
    Ratings:
    +445
    Which is why it's interesting to note that even Brett thought he was on his way down in his career else why the threat? When you're a superstar you tutor, ala Aaron and Clay.
     

Share This Page