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Reflecting on Gutey - Two Years In

Discussion in 'Green Bay Packers Fan Forum' started by tynimiller, Mar 18, 2020.

  1. tynimiller

    tynimiller Cheesehead

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    Had a guy yesterday (a Bear's fan) say something which struck me as odd, especially given his team of choice: "You know, I'd argue you're guys' new GM is literally batting 1000 with his decisions since taking over."

    While I made some jab at da Bears...it left me thinking and reflecting on all the decisions he has made in just two short years. No one gets every single decision right...and as we review we see Gutey may have hit a homerun in decisions in 2019...he isn't perfect. Quick brief overview of most, not all the notable things I could spur of the moment remember from memory (I promise I am missing items..and this is player centered..didn't include staffing decisions.

    2018 SEASON

    JORDY NELSON - Released...tough but probably right call given cost vs performance...but keeping him would have saved us from the Graham experiment....*60/40 (MISTAKE/NOT-MISTAKE) Hindsight is the issue judging this.
    DAMARIOUS RANDALL - Traded, good call.
    MORGAN BURNETT - Allowed to walk in Free Agency...good call.
    JIMMY GRAHAM - Signed....CLEARLY THIS IN THE END WAS A TERRIBLE DECISION. In hindsight however more than in the moment. While many couldn't believe we gave him the money we had, most agreed he should elevate the passing game for AR and made the team better. *MISTAKE
    TRAMON WILLIAMS
    - Signed, good call
    MO WILKERSON - Signed, good call
    DAVON HOUSE - Signed, good call
    MARCEDES LEWIS - Signed, good call
    BASHUAD BREELAND - Signed in September of that year. Excellent pick up and played awesome down the stretch for us.
    2018 DRAFT CLASS - As a whole it is impressive to see the entirety of the draft still active in the league, 8 of them on the Packers roster into the end of 2019 season and further possibly...however many would say while the back 2/3 of the draft he fair well and hit the first round out of the park with Jaire...we may have missed Round 2 and Round 3 entirely in Jackson and Burks. While there is still time for that to change, that sand in the hourglass is running thin.

    2019 SEASON


    BYRON BELL
    MO WILKERSON
    DAVON HOUSE
    LANCE KENDRICKS
    CLAY MATHEWS
    RANDALL COBB
    BASHUAD BREELAND
    JAKE RYAN
    KENTRELL BRICE

    ^^^All were let walk to other teams' and it left many a little shocked...but outside of Cobb, I don't think one could argue any of these were a BIG mistake doing so to. Breeland is an "arguable one either way" but that makes it not a BIG mistake.

    MIKE DANIELS - Released, which was an excellent move fiscally and performance wise, just wish the guy wasn't likable as no fan liked it despite agreeing with it.
    Nick PERRY - Released, was also a good move and sadly for Nick has not made a comeback anywhere since.

    ZA'DARIUS SMITH - Signed, HOME RUN
    PRESTON SMITH - Signed, HOME RUN
    ADRIAN AMOS - Signed, HOME RUN
    BILLY TURNER - Signed, good call

    2019 DRAFT CLASS - Easily better than the previous year from top to bottom IMO, but in a critical way the home runs were more in rounds 2-4, with the unknown in round 1. Gary cannot be judged as a whole yet, but it is justified to be critical drafting his position where we did. Jenkins was an absolute HOME RUN, Savage is excellent and Sternberger shows potential to be a solid TE (#2 type if nothing else).


    2020 Season

    CHRISTIAN KIRKSEY- Signed, I like it but decision cannot be judged yet.
    RICKY WAGNER - Signed, I like it but decision cannot be judged yet.

    JIMMY GRAHAM - Released....excellent decision, and arguably a year too late in some opinions.
    BRYAN BULAGA - Not pursued and allowed to go elsewhere...love him, but best decision for the team fiscally.
    BLAKE MARTINEZ - Not pursued and allowed to go elsewhere...love him, but best decision for the team fiscally.
    KYLER FACKRELL - Not pursued and allowed to go elsewhere...love him, but best decision for the team fiscally.



    In end mainly the mistakes I see all circulate around Jimmy Graham...Nelson was not worth the pay, BUT releasing him made signing Graham possible and in the end that is the only real true mistake Gute has on his record so far outside of smaller arguable ones we all have. Truly a tremendous 2 year stretch by a GM.
     
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  2. Do7

    Do7 Cheesehead

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    We probably could've kept Cobb and Matthews for one more year, especially considering Matthews said he was willing to take a discount just to stay. Cobb looking back I take a bit of pride in because I was one of the few people that was telling everyone here how it was a mistake for us to get rid of him, while everyone was so insistent that Allison would fill in that void.

    Davon House imo I don't think contributed enough to say it was a good sign as I believe he made a lot of bone headed mistakes more so than he made good plays. But considering the other options at the time, I suppose it was okay.

    Graham, while he wasn't as dynamic as we would've liked, and I do think it was the right decision to let him go at the price we were paying him, he was one of the top 10 TE in the league I believe in receiving and whatnot. He had the bad case of the dropsies but still he wasn't horrible. He wasn't the best signing, but wasn't the worst.
     
  3. tynimiller

    tynimiller Cheesehead

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    I hear ya on the contention of House one. We needed veteran depth and had to grab someone, I don't remember who else was out there though. Perhaps I leaned to good call more for the need of the signing and not necessarily the output of it in the end, which is arguable.

    Cobb is for sure the one where folks scratch their head on....all would have been fine had we possibly closed the gap on WR holes in that 2019 draft with a higher pick but we didn't and we definitely hurt because of it.
     
  4. Mondio

    Mondio Cheesehead

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    I think not keeping Mathews was the right thing, even with hindsight. Cobb was always, healthy he's good to have, not healthy it's a waste of money. He did have a decent year last year, but I'm not sold that he's going to play better or even to the same level consistently from here on out. I still think it was the right decision to let him go in the end, though obviously we could have used him "last year". But it could have easily have been he goes down with another injury, plays in 25% of the games with any production and St. Brown doesn't get hurt and was good for 40-50 catches and a couple TD's. So, you win some, you lose some.
     
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  5. Do7

    Do7 Cheesehead

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    Idk where this love for St Brown is coming from, but I did not see anything that would indicate he would do as well as most of you guys think he would've done. As for injuries, that can be said about anyone. Hell we lost Devante for roughly a quarter of the games last year. I don't think that's fair to use that as an excuse in regards to Cobb, especially when he a good year last year as a third option.
     
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  6. tynimiller

    tynimiller Cheesehead

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    It was his rookie year, late rounder and towards the seasons' end had garnered Rodgers trust and was starting to exhibit potential for sure. He is a VERY smart guy and student of the game, where his raw athletic skillset won't blow anyone away, the dude is a student of the game and when he got his chance he excelled given expectations. Had he not got injured it would have been nice to see what he would have done last year for us, as pretty much every WR got a chance to sink or float with more snaps.
     
  7. Mondio

    Mondio Cheesehead

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    There isn't love. he DOES have the physical attributes to be a very good receiver. Whether he is or not, I have no idea. It was going to be his 2nd year, i was excited to see what he could do. That's all. Just as I have no idea if Cobb earns his 10 million he would have gotten. he stays healthy, he's pretty good. We all knew that. But then it's been 3, almost 4 seasons since we've seen him healthy in GB.
     
  8. GleefulGary

    GleefulGary Cheesehead

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    Gutey has done really well, imo. Done great in FA, and I'd say above solid in the draft. You're not going to hit on every player.
     
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  9. elcid

    elcid Cheesehead

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    To me, Gute has been a revelation compared to TT. At least he brings excitement to the table every off season, as you can see he is pursuing all avenues to win us one more SB with AR.
     
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  10. GleefulGary

    GleefulGary Cheesehead

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    Important to remember there's a large element of luck at play too.

    I remember when Gute really wanted to sign Trumaine Johnson. Obviously got out-bid by the Jets, and thank goodness. Went after Sammy Watkins with a big contract as well. Maybe that one would've been okay, but who knows?

    I don't see how anybody could complain so far though.
     
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  11. lambeaulambo

    lambeaulambo Cheesehead

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    When you compare what Gute has done in comparison of Thompson it is night and day. Most of the moves made have been good decisions. Gary is still an incomplete grade but didn't flash this year. The influx of the Smith's on D has put the pack back on track. Now Gute just needs to build around them. The addition of Jenkins on the oline is an excellent one. The WR and TE positions need depth and I would bet will be addressed. RT is a big question mark right now. Overall I think the GM is doing all he can to build a winner. Gets an A grade from me so far.
     
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  12. RicFlairoftheNFL

    RicFlairoftheNFL Cheesehead

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    The thing you don't have in here is the Rodgers contract with I think considering age and number are a mistake. We're hamstring by this until the deal is done.
     
  13. tynimiller

    tynimiller Cheesehead

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    I'm fairly certain you need to research cost of franchise QBs across the NFL before making this statement. Sort by overall and by cost yearly, and just 2020.

    While he is definitely not the cheapest option, he is FAR from the most expensive or anyone would argue an issue given whom he is.
     
  14. Do7

    Do7 Cheesehead

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    Agreed. In the next upcoming years when Watson and Mahomes get their deals done, Rodgers' contract is going to look like a steal. Hell Minnesota just resigned Cousins.
     
  15. elcid

    elcid Cheesehead

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    Sure, Rodgers' contract would look like a steal, given that he would still perform like a top 5 QB. He has not done that the last 2 years. While I am willing to give him the benefit of doubt since in 2018 he has been injured and last year, he just didn't have the weapons. But this year he has to prove that the contract he got was warranted.
     
  16. Do7

    Do7 Cheesehead

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    Uh...Last year he was top 5, plus the fact that at this point in his career Rodgers is judged on how he does in the postseason rather than what he does in the regular season. For pete's sake we went 13-3 and made it to the NFC Championship game and while I get The Superbowl is the ultimate goal, but getting to another conference championship, which he also did the last time he was in the playoffs is not bad either. So which one is it, do we judge him by his regular season or by what he does in the postseason?
     
  17. Dantés

    Dantés Gute Loot

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    His net performance in free agency has been excellent. Jimmy Graham is really the only blotch on his record.

    Za'Darius Smith: Vastly exceeded expectations
    Preston Smith: Exceeded expectations
    Billy Turner: Exceeded expectations
    Tramon Williams: Exceeded expectations
    Adrian Amos: Met expectations
    Marcedes Lewis: Met expectations
    Jimmy Graham: Flopped

    It's too early for me to judge his draft performance. I think his first class is fair game after this next season, as that will have been three years.
     
  18. elcid

    elcid Cheesehead

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    Please, I am not going to have this discussion again. AR wasn't bad by any means, but he was no where near top 5 either. He was not the reason we got to the NFC CG. A healthy roster, a good schedule, and a defense which turned up when we needed them were the reasons for that.
     
  19. PackAttack12

    PackAttack12 R-E-L-A-X

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    maybe not “the” reason the way you would define it, but he was certainly “a” reason. Not many quarterbacks in the NFL could have closed as many games out in the 4th quarter that he was able to help close out. Key final drives to bleed the clock, making all of the correct decisions.

    Also made all of the money throws down the stretch against Seattle to prevent them from getting the ball back. He was great in that game, which was obviously the game needed to make it to the west coast for the NFCCG.

    He didn’t have gaudy stats like he’s had in the past, but he closed many games in a fashion which only a small handful of guys in this league are able to do.
     
  20. Mondio

    Mondio Cheesehead

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    I think you take almost every qb that was “better” stats wise last year and they lose easily twice the games in similar situations in GB
     
  21. tynimiller

    tynimiller Cheesehead

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    While it is fair to be critical of Aaron at times, this statement above is 100% correct IMO.
     
  22. Do7

    Do7 Cheesehead

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    So what you're implying is that any QB could've lead this squad to the NFC Championship? Gimme a break dude!

    There are 2 QBs I would make the argument had the better season than Rodgers, the rest are debatable.
    1. Lamar
    2. Wilson

    Brees didn't finish the season. Mahomes was banged up. Who else is there? Dak? Cousins? Watson? Brady? (Please say Brady had a better season! I dare you. XD )


    Rodgers wasn't the "sole" reason, but he was a big contributing factor for us getting there.
     
  23. Dantés

    Dantés Gute Loot

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    In my own mind, based on how Rodgers has played in recent seasons, Wilson, Mahomes, Jackson, and Brees are better right now in the context of their offenses.

    Beyond that, Carson Wentz, Deshaun Watson, and Matt Ryan are in that conversation with Rodgers for me.

    So depending on where he came out in that group, he's somewhere from #5 to #8.

    That said, I think there's a potential for a big step forward in 2020, as it will be his second year in this new system.
     
  24. Do7

    Do7 Cheesehead

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    Brees missed several games this past season so that is why I said he didn't have the better year. Same with Mahomes. Now based on the past two years I can understand the argument made for the two of them being better right now, and after this year Wilson had I'll put him up there as well (begrudgingly). Lamar had one good year so the jury is still out on him, and I feel he has to play a certain way to play well and Tennessee exposed him in a sense. He's good playing with leads.

    So I have him Rodgers at the 4-5 spot. I'll give him the 5 spot simply because Lamar was the MVP and deserves respect, but as a QB I still think Rodgers is better. Lamar is the better athlete. Also bare in mind this was the first year under MLF's new offense, so some growing pains were to be expected. I expect Rodgers to once again remind everyone why he's one of the best in the business.

    But this is what baffles me. Let's say Rodgers has another MVP season, but we get bounced out early in the playoffs, you know there are going to be people on here criticizing Rodgers for not getting his team further into the playoffs whether it be fair or unfair. That is why I said at this point Rodgers is judged by what he does in the post season.
     
  25. Pugger

    Pugger Cheesehead

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    Matt Ryan? Ryan wasn't very good last year and his WR corps is better than what we have.
     

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