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Discussion in 'Packer Fan Forum' started by Roddy_Alberse, Jul 5, 2006.

  1. Anubis

    Anubis Cheesehead

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    OK, Phil...

    Could you explain what you would have expected Pickett to do if not tackle? That is, seeing how you think tackling is such a "trivial" part of his job. :roll:

    GO PACK!!!

    Robert C. Hedley
     
  2. porky88

    porky88 Cheesehead

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    GB will probably finish 2nd or 3rd. I think 3rd in the division. Though last year most outside of Bear country thought the Bears would bring up the caboose in the NFC North so you of all people should know not to underestimate the underdog.

    You don't know much about the Pack if your going to base it off of what your neighbor who is a Packer fan or other Packer fans said on boards. A lot of Packer fans hate Ted Thompson and will say anything to make him look bad even if it means bashing the organization altogether.

    GB improved their team drastically this off season in every department except the offensive line. Instead they got younger and changed the scheme. Personnel wise I don't think they're much better.

    DB's... Manuel and Woodson are big upgrades. Woodson over Carroll is a huge upgrade. Injuries or not they're is no denying Charles Woodson on the field. He is a great player. Manuel will help out in the run a lot. People forget he’s a SS, not a FS. He’ll help with the run and on passing downs, Roman should be on the field.

    LB's AJ Hawk, Ben Taylor, and Abdul Hodge are huge upgrades over Paris Lenon, Nail Diggs, and Robert Thomas. Nick Barnett and Hawk are the lock too start. Taylor should start who had over 100 tackles in Cleveland. He won't be relied on to be the best LB on the field in Green Bay with Barnett. He should thrive like Hunter Hilliemeyer did in Chicago playing next to Briggs and Urlacher.

    DL Locking up Kampman was huge for this team. Great work ethnic and just all around solid player. Picket is an upgrade over Grady Jackson. Pickett lead the NFL in tackles among defensive lineman. For a run stuffing DT that is very important stat. That is the most important stat.

    WR's Last year we had Antonio Chatman, Robert Ferguson, and Donald Driver. We added Gardner for 2 games. So 3 WR's for most of the year. This year GB has Driver, Jennings, Boerigter, Ferguson, Gardner, and Rogers. Lucas as well. They have WR's on the roster this year all who are healthy. That's what matters. Anyone who thinks DD isn't a #1 in this league is very mistaken. He's been to the Pro Bowl as a #1 WR already. He's coming off his best year and he's probably the most reliable WR in the division. Jennings will prove to be this teams future #2 WR mid way through the year. Find some film on him. Watch his routes, hands, speed. He’s a great player. His pre draft workouts were great. His mini camps have been solid. I look forward too seeing him in pads.

    QB we bring Favre back. He should be able to play better this year. He's the wild card of the division. If he plays better, GB will be much better. If he plays the same, maybe a game better. As a Bear fan you must hate Favre, but I'm sure you respect him. I respected Walter Payton and I respect Urlacher. Don't mean I like them but I wouldn't doubt them on the field. If you doubt one of the greatest QB’s ever then, it’s out of despise and hatred.

    RB Could be a concern but it's the same as last year and they should be better off because they're healthy now. Green and Davenport are expect before the season start. Gado is getting the reps now.

    As for coaching, I wanted Bates or Kirk Ferientz. MM was the last guy I saw. Frankly people look at what he did last year and think bogus hire. What they don't know is McCarthy for 4 years in a row with Aaron Brooks as his QB, produced a top 10 offense in the NFL. GB fans don't dislike McCarthy. They were just mad that Bates wasn't the Head Coach.

    As for the Draft. Chicago didn't fill any of their weaknesses on offense. They added to their Defense. They're big signing is Brian Griese. Will Chicago be better than GB? Probably.. Will GB be better this year? Yes they will be. 7 to 9 wins is what I think they can do. Beat the easy teams like Lions, Jets, Niners, Saints, etc.. They should be able to win at least 7 this year. I have them at 8. That’s not asking much for a young rebuilding organization that should be able to add more key free agents next year because the money was spent wisely.
     
  3. pyledriver80

    pyledriver80 Cheesehead

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    I agree with your assessment Porky for the most part, but using this statement time after time to support your argument is going overboard.

    Several members have pointed out in detail the reason that they are concerned about TT. I don't look for a reason to bash the guy but when he does something that seems to several people to be boneheaded, we call him out.

    Lare had a great post on TT's downfalls, and they were well written with full explanations. These are VALID concerns, not just TT bashing. I just refuse to paint over everything TT does with a rosey brush. The O-Line is to me, TT's biggest shortcoming thus far, though Lare pointed out several other ones.


    I am not going to hash out the Wahle thing, it's been beaten to death already. I know it was posible for him to be resigned but others make the argument that it was just TO BIG of a job for TT to execute. Ok, so be it, though I thought that was his job. So TT thought Wahle was replaceable and we all agree it blew up in his face, so where was PLAN B? Was drafting Rookies or starting an inexperienced Coston his Plan B? I just don't get it.

    Now Porky, I know you are somewhat knowledgeable on building a Football team and the inner-workings. I think you know that you don't rebuild the O-line and WR corps at the same time, it's suicide. Where was the forsight in all of this? Granted, there were no Big Time FA guards out there, but there were veteran recievers. I'm not talking about Owens, but there were a dozen or so other guys that could have upgraded the WR corps.


    So now, since TT failed to address the O-line by resigning Wahle or replacing him with something other than Adrian Klemm last year, we will be starting 2 inexperienced Guards. On top of this we have 1 established WR and a bunch of underacheivers/rookies for Brett to throw the ball to in 2.5 seconds.{the time he will likely have to throw} Add to this a group of RB's coming off injuries that have to run behind an inexperienced line, and this offense just looks disasterous to me.


    Where did TT do anything to bolst this offense? The best thing that happened is at least some of our starters will be healthy. Some people like to give him credit for drafting Spitz and Colledge and think they are automatically an upgrade. Newsflash: These 2 guys have less experience than the guards we started last year. Am I supposed to be thrilled because they have bodies in that spot? Does that make it an upgrade? Save the "the reports are looking good on these guys" stuff as well. Last report I saw said they were STRUGGLING with pass blocking but it will be conveniently ignored in the Wonderland some members seem to live in.


    I just call it as I see it. You can say I am just a TT hater just because I don't agree with you, but I am just judging on what I see from him. I can easily label you a TT lover and disregard anything you say to that fact as well. To me, I just can't see where TT has done anything overly impressive to get me excited for the future. He has improved the Defense but has also made a lot of mistakes in my opinion.
     
  4. porky88

    porky88 Cheesehead

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    I didn't mention any names. You are consistent with your posts (though I did catch one :D ). Lare is as well. They're are some people on this board that just post out of despise for Ted Thompson. I did a lot more reading and I went back and looked at old posts and new posts and they're are some people who just contradict themselves just out of I'm guessing hatred of the Packers GM.

    I don't agree with building the offensive line like he is but I like what he did on the defensive side of the ball and ultimately he couldn't of done what he did to the defense and bring in offensive lineman at the same time. If he would of the Defense might not look as good and GB definitely probably wouldn't have the amount of cap for next year. Next year I think he absolutely needs to address the offensive line and sign at least one guard because of how he handled the cap situation this off-season, we’ll have money to do so.

    This year it wasn't deep at guard. We had the 5th pick and made the right choice probably for our team. Hawk wasn't the guy I wanted. I wanted Vernon Davis but from the sound of things, Davis wouldn't of signed with GB anyways so Hawk made the most sense.

    We picked up guys who fit the blocking scheme which is a plus. Daryn Colledge is a perfect fit. In free agency Hutchinson was paid 49 mil contract and GB in my opinion was smart to just not offer him a contract similar. Did we make contact. Sure.. Do we pay a guard 50 mil, no that's too much and that's when you start blowing your money away.

    I think the one thing Packer fans in general need to realize is that GB is in year 1 of rebuilding the Green Bay Packers. They're no longer a contender for a Super Bowl and to go deep in the playoffs. Favre probably won't get another Super Bowl ring. Favre did say realistic expectations would be 9-7, I think if fans took off the green and gold glasses, they'd agree with that assessment. No dis to the optimistic fans, it's only natural to want more but I think a little realism doesn't hurt. If GB was a contender I'd be upset about the offensive line but because we're rebuilding, I'd like too see what the young guys got. In particular Charles White. I think if the work him at RG, he could become a very solid player as the year goes on. I think it would have been nice to bring in one veteran though to be on the safe side. The line will get better as the year goes on but as luck would have it, they’re first test is against Chicago and the Bears defensive line is going to have a field day up the middle gaps.
     
  5. pyledriver80

    pyledriver80 Cheesehead

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    I am assuming you are talking about Chris White, not Charles White unless I'm missing something. Anyways, I feel the same way about him. He was getting some work at the Guard position so hopefully he makes the best of it. I believe he is also a Center and we definitely need a back-up there.


    I'm not sold on Colledge, he has the body to fit the system, but that doesn't make him effective. I thought it was a reach at 2. I would much rather see Coston and White.
     
  6. tromadz

    tromadz Cheesehead

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    and we still have coston and white, so whats the problem.
     
  7. pyledriver80

    pyledriver80 Cheesehead

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    Yep, and these are veteran experienced Lineman. Oh yeah, I forgot, since they have arms and legs and take up space they are sufficient. I guess thats good enough for some people including TT. To bad the last report I saw said these guys were struggling with pass-blocking.
     
  8. Lare

    Lare Cheesehead

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    Hey, I don't think it's entirely fair to be dissing guys like Coston & White. I mean, just because they've already been beat out by a couple of rookies for a chance to play on one of the worst OLs in the NFL doesn't mean they aren't any good.

    Well,..... Ok, it may mean they aren't any good but it's still probably not very nice to be dissing them. They could very well turn out to be very good Arena League or CFL football players some day. :roll:
     
  9. porky88

    porky88 Cheesehead

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    We have youth and that's it. We have no vets. Klemm and that's about it but Klemm is getting worked at LT instead of LG.
     
  10. Anubis

    Anubis Cheesehead

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    The problem is, that our o-line is abysmal. Green was coming off a Pro-Bowl year in 2004. With the loss of Wahle and Rivera however, he was ineffective up to his injury.

    Perhaps that does not mean much to you, but to me a player who was touted as "Green has been the NFL’s most prolific offensive player" in 2004, come off 4 consecutive Pro Bowl appearances, and not able to break 20 yards on a single carry in 2005 concerns me... especially when all that changed was the o-line.

    GO PACK!!!

    Robert C. Hedley
     
  11. Zero2Cool

    Zero2Cool I own a website

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    Sometime during the end of the 2004 season Green got injured. He muscled through it. During the 2005 season the injury finally blew out which is why it was so severe. He should have had it fixed over the offseason but felt it would heal or perhaps his doctors said it would heal. It didn't.

    The point I'm making is Green wasn't 100% at all during the 2005 season.
     
  12. tromadz

    tromadz Cheesehead

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    no, zero, it was all the line. lol. some people. and did someone say having Klemm on the team is good, cuz hes a veteran?

    Id rather have youth than Klemm. Id rather have Cheesey than klemm. get the F outta here with that junk, boy.
     
  13. NDPackerFan

    NDPackerFan Cheesehead

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    The O-Line is going to be better than last year's because of scheme and personnel. Klemm will be standing on the sidelines if he's lucky and some more athletic people will be on the field with nasty streaks. Watch the running game surprise many on this board.

    Packers are going back to the playoffs. Believe it!
     
  14. pyledriver80

    pyledriver80 Cheesehead

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    Adrien Klemm = TT's replacement plan for one OG spot. Since that failed now the plan is for some rookie to do it.


    I'm glad we agree Trom.
     
  15. Zero2Cool

    Zero2Cool I own a website

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    Holy crap, trom made a funny! A real funny this time! :)
     
  16. cheesey

    cheesey Cheesehead

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    Hey......you think i have a chance??? :wink:

    Trom.....you really think i'm that good? (I know......you were making a point!LOLOLOL!!!)
    Hey......maybe i could get the "D" linemen laughing, thus making them useless, and Green could run past them before they recover!!! :lol: :lol: :lol:
     
  17. all about da packers

    all about da packers Cheesehead

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    Or, cheesy you could get them to flirt with you... :shock:
     
  18. cheesey

    cheesey Cheesehead

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    That would only work when we play the Bears or the Vikings!!! :lol:
     
  19. pyledriver80

    pyledriver80 Cheesehead

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    Yeah, that would render them useless for sure.......oh wait they already are useless.
     
  20. Anubis

    Anubis Cheesehead

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    I am not sure what team you thought you were watching, but Green Bay's O-line sucked azz last season. End of story. We have done jack in terms of fixing this (granted the market for FA guards was slim to none). I am really curious as to why you are implying that there was no problem with the line last season, and we have some kind of powerhouse in store for this season.

    I really would like to hope so. However, for such drastic improvement, the players are going to have to get a handle on this scheme ASAP. Last I heard, Gado was having a lot of trouble with it, and Green and Davenport were not yet cleared to play. I am hopeful that the team will be able to pull it off, but I think there are legitimate reasons for my skepticism. If the rookies we have catch on to this scheme AND we have the right players to get the job done, maybe. However, there are far too many question marks right now for me to believe it will happen this season. Once we see what these guys can do in pads, we should have a better idea of what their chances are this year.

    Regardless of the problems on our offense, we have an easy schedule, a solid defense and a weak division. I am still optimistic we can regain the NFC North if a few key guys can step up. :wink:

    GO PACK!!!

    Robert C. Hedley
     
  21. porky88

    porky88 Cheesehead

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    I agree based on potential. This o-line has more potential than last years offensive line. I expect Colledge to play much better as a rookie than Will Whitticker did as a rookie. This offensive line has potential but that's about all they have going for them in the interior.
     
  22. warhawk

    warhawk Cheesehead

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    First of all before nailing Woodson you guys need to go find a cornerback of your own. Having played all the patsy offenses in the league last year it's questionable that you guys are any better than one and out.

    Adding Pickett and Allen to go along with some pretty solid young DL, retaining Kampman, Woodson vs. Carroll, Hawk vs. Digg's or Lenon, Manuel vs Roman and you have ask if we think this teams been improved?

    I would say they've improved enough to give the mighty Bears offense all they can handle. Probably not doing them justice since that's not really saying much is it?
     
  23. Zero2Cool

    Zero2Cool I own a website

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    Thousands over a span of 40 years, lol.

    Woodson did good. Arrington got hurt and has another major injury to overcome. (I say another because I belive he had a major knee injury early in his career) Pickett was a very good addition and Manuel, well his highlight came in the first game vs Detroit and that's pretty much all that can be said about the guy.
     

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