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Pittsburg-Vikings

Discussion in 'Packer Fan Forum' started by Skol guy, Oct 25, 2009.

  1. angryguy77

    angryguy77 Cheesehead

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    Saying that Favre cost them the game is pure ignorance. Taylor should have caught that ball palin and simple. By this logic I guess we can pipn every dropped ball for the packers on Rodgers.

    Just unbelieveable how anyone with any sort of football knowlege would say ti Favre's fault.
     
  2. jrpack

    jrpack Cheesehead

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    You are so right about the whole Holmgren thing and no one has been able to coach Favre since. Right now at the Vikes is amazing to watch the self control and discipline, but I don't think it's Chili's coaching, I think Favre is coaching himself.
     
  3. jrpack

    jrpack Cheesehead

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    If you give Favre all the credit for the receivers miracle catches when he is off, then you got to give him the blame for the misses. It works both ways for any QB.
     
  4. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    I dont think to many people are claiming Brett was to blame for the int

    But the fumble? That most defiantly can be put on him for not feleing the pressure..

    I said same thing when it happened to him vs the Rams a few years ago in GB when they were going in for a score

    The lineman should be blocking, but the q/b needs to feel the pressure
     
  5. jrpack

    jrpack Cheesehead

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    When Rodgers fumbled he said in his after-game press conference that it was his fault because he should have felt the pressure.
     
  6. Skol guy

    Skol guy Cheesehead

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    ha ha,you would be haveing a fulltime job if you want to be on the spelling police on this forum. OH No Hilda took her braids off and is after me. We get it you have no friends or a girl/guy or whatever. So you want to make a bunch of cyber buddies on here so I say stop with the fake knowledge or concern with the Vikings as the green bay packers are takeing applications as we speak to be apart of their special little clan. Those sly dogs already got one of our most loyal, respected and honored fans in jrPackers guy. Around the dome we just call him Benedict Arnold.
     
  7. Quientus

    Quientus Oenophile

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    If that is your definition of not playing well and for being "directly responsible" ... - I find that highly interesting ... Because by that logic ... then Rodgers is the "direct cause" that the Packers lost those 2 games against the Bengals and Vikings ... - Yet everyone was fast to blame it entirely on the offensive line ... Not to mention last seasons 6-10 record ...

    My point being ... some critique is well justified, however, when you are giving critique just for the sake of giving critique ... then it's not ..., and sound more like "sour grapes" ...

    Also look at the quarterback stats for the qb's (red zone stats) in the league as well ... before claiming anything ... - I'm sure those stats will tell you a different story ...

    Granted in some (a few situations) things could have been done better, however, ... I'll give more credit to the defensive line of the Steelers than the Minnesota offense for playing poorly in that particular game really ...

    Bottomline ... every player "should have" played better whenever a team loses ..., but when looking at the Steelers game ... come on ... atleast try to use some "factual" information and game situations before you make all kinds of claims lol ...


    - As for those "miracle" passes ... - Well ... I think it's pretty evident that no matter how much you dislike Favre ... there are just some throws that he is able to make better than almost any other quarterback in the league ...

    Not saying that he is doing that with every throw, however ... looking at the "tight rope pass" (and it was NOT a hail mary, all though all the critics say that ... makes me chuckle every time) against the 49'ers ... - it was a GREAT throw (put where only Lewis could catch it) AS WELL as a GREAT catch by Lewis ...

    Atleast try to be honest ... and look at Lewis in the Steelers game ... and tell me again (on that particular instance) whether or not it was "mostly" Favre or "mostly" Lewis ... - I would say that Favre would have made that throw regardless of who the receiver was really ... where as the receiver would NOT have made that same catch if it were another quarterback ... Hence why, in that particular situation ... it was actually more because of Favre than because of Lewis (but Lewis did in fact make an AMAZING catch).

    Another situation being the throw to Chester Taylor ... similar to the dropped pass by Donald Lee (in the Packers @ Vikings game) ... - Yet everyone seemed to blame it all on Donald Lee ? ... - Again my point being ... some times the critique just seems out of place ... and "fueled" solely by "dislike" and "bias" and not on the particular game situation itself ...


    Another thing which is rather funny to read it how Favre is being "blamed" for not making a tackle (the strip fumble) ... - Could Favre have made the tackle ? Most likely (as he seemed to be faster than the player who had the ball) ... but please remember how people were "all over him" for doing the same in other games ... Saying that he shouldn't put himself in such a "risky" situation ... And honestly ... I think him not making the "direct" tackle has more to do with what he has been told (by the coaching staff ?) than anything ...
     
  8. PackersRS

    PackersRS Cheesehead

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    Don't we? We keep saying that he doesn't have "pocket awereness" but his receivers run wrong routes and are the worst unit in the NFL in dropped passes, yet noone says that.
     
  9. Hauschild

    Hauschild Cheesehead

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    Holy Moses - in one garbled and incoherent post, you've proven my point.
    :happy0005:
     
  10. PackersRS

    PackersRS Cheesehead

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    So he played well despite fumbling and being intercepted, because there's more to it.

    But when he threw the game winning touchdown, it was because "there are just some throws that he is able to make better than almost any other quarterback in the league ..."? Just to make it clear for the slow-minded lie me ;)
     
  11. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    You nailed it..Every player has a direct result in a win or loss..But some more than others..

    And when a player has an "error" so to speak, it is magnified specially when it results in points for the other team.

    Miracle passes? I do not buy into that OTHER then the Monday night game vs the Raiders..No way in hell those passes should have been completed..He threw ducks up and Walkers was coming down with them..

    Brett should be trying to tackle a player that gets a fumble or an int if that player is going in for a score....I want my q/b to try his hardest to stop a defensive player from taking his ball to the endzone


    But to block on a particular play or run down the field to block he shouldnt be..That is just my thoughts, not based on anything..
     
  12. PackersRS

    PackersRS Cheesehead

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    I've never read anything about him being blamed for not making the tackle, not in here anyway.
    -
    Nevermind, LT just did that.
     
  13. Quientus

    Quientus Oenophile

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    This is what I'm talking about ...

    There are different ways of "smack-talking" and on arguing your case ... however, doing it like you do will have the exact opposite effect ...

    I would consider you more of a "troll" than anything ... because it seems that you are more interested in "smack-talking" and "trolling" than actualy discussing football ... And whenever some one disagrees with you ... you start tossing out "insults" ...


    There is a huge difference in talking "face to face" and talking via boards ... - When you are discussing things on a board (any board, not just sports boards), it's rather vital that you are atleast able to stay "coherent" and "lucid" ... which means you have got to watch your syntax and grammar ... - Not doing so, really just makes you look rather "foolish" (I'm not saying you are, however, your writings doesn't exactly make people think you are not ...)
     
  14. Hauschild

    Hauschild Cheesehead

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    Not sure if you've read all the posts in the this thread, but I feel I laid out a pretty good case on why Favre played somewhat poorly. To recap:

    Favre SHOULD have tackled or, at the VERY LEAST, held up the defender on his fumble. He expended so much energy getting to that slow bugger, and then he did absolutely nothing - didn't even hang on a leg or arm to slow him down - pathetic. If I were his coach, he would hear about it. Ain't no time for lolly-gaggin' and Sally-boy football. Play football AT ALL TIMES like ya got a pair!

    The screen pass to Taylor was a POOR play call. They had just run a play to Taylor the previous play and they had 75 seconds and only 15 yards for at least a tie. That play was NOT the play anybody with much football instinct should call in that situation. Time was the enemy at that juncture NOT the scoreboard. Getting over that, the execution from Favre was AWFUL. He was not as rushed as his poor throw would lead to believe. The throw was way high and to Taylor's inside. Favre threw two picks last season on screen plays, and he's thrown more over his career. He should know better at this point.

    But, Favre's still performing well, overall. He's won Minnesota 3 games with his talents and he's only cost them 1 game with his occasional brain farts.
     
  15. Quientus

    Quientus Oenophile

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    The funny thing is ... that you know exactly what I mean, yet you are trying to argue semantics heh ...

    *cheers*
     
  16. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    I didnt mention it until a few minutes ago..

    Might be they are seeing it on other forums?

    But yeah he should be trying to tackle the guy if he is going in for a defensive TD

    Trying and actually TACKLING are two different things..
     
  17. Skol guy

    Skol guy Cheesehead

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    Does it matter, whos fault? I doubt all involved wanted the outcome and would you expect for a QB to call his own line out in the press by saying he had no time or the rec, couldn't get open? He is the leader and he put all on him like a good leader should. You know how the press would play statements made. As they did on ESPN when Favre signed and how the lockeroom is split but from what I have heard it was a kosher deal for all except T-jack and Sage maybe but right away favre was calling plays and took control of the huddle the first day. You have to respect that as a rookie or a vet. We will ride old man river as far as he will take us. like it, don't like it, that is the way it is. Either way will still be talking the same smack a year from now but sometimes the names change is all. I can't wait for Kickoff. Should be a classic that may get chippy.
     
  18. jrpack

    jrpack Cheesehead

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    Funny how you have to take things out of context to try to prove your point. You're not a politician are you? We all know how Favre gets all the credit for everything but none of the blame. It's kind of nice to see a little going the other way. It won't last, but nice to see.
     
  19. Quientus

    Quientus Oenophile

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    Please show me where I'm taking things out of context ... In fact I would beg the differ ... I've never said that old Greybeard should get the credit for everything ... - Those are your words, not mine, however, when you are making critique, atleast substantiate it ... - That's all I'm asking ...
     
  20. PackersRS

    PackersRS Cheesehead

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    I don't get it. You have bipolar syndrome or something? No offense, but you're perfectly capable of making rational, educated comments like this one. Yet, out of the blue, you start ranting and cursing people.
    -
    Cursing is never allowed, but you can allways talk smack without making any sense in the Smack Area. Just try to be reasonable in this part of the forum, please (pretty please).
    -

    About your post:
    I'm not talking about Favre not being accountable for his mistakes. I'm talking about fans not seeing him as reason to blame when he's directly responsable for losses, yet clamouring him the second comming when he's responsable for the wins. It's the double-standards that grinds my gears.

    And about the schism, I still think if things don't go well, the veterans will surely look back to the MANNER Favre was brought in, like they did in NY. There is a difference, as Favre never wanted to play in there. But he was all prankster with the guys in there as well.
     
  21. PackersRS

    PackersRS Cheesehead

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    I'm not arguing semantics.
    Let's make it pretty clear, then.

    Do you agree that Favre was directly responsable for both the SF game and the Pittsburgh game?

    OR do you think he was just a part of the team? That the whole team was responsable?
     
  22. jrpack

    jrpack Cheesehead

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    Sorry, thought I was answering one of Skol's. You are at least a grown-up. One of my posts got chopped and I lost track.
     
  23. jrpack

    jrpack Cheesehead

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    That's my point too. Favre gets lucky, he's a hero. Favre has some bad breaks, it's someone elses fault. It's always been that way and will always be that way no matter which team he is playing with. Just like when the other teams get all the bad calls and the Vikes get none, it can't be mentioned, but when the Vikes get a bad call against them, we've got to hear all the "If it wouldn't been for that bad call" we would have won.
     
  24. Quientus

    Quientus Oenophile

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    I'm sorry, but it's not as "clear-cut" and "black and white" as you would like it to be :)

    SF Game:

    Favre didn't exactly play "great" in that game overall ... - The winning drive ... was in fact "vintage" Favre ... - Not many other quarterbacks would have been able to "buy time" and get the ball down there as he did ... like him or not ... you'll have to admit that ... - I also wrote that Lewis did in fact make a GREAT catch, however, I also know that the pass *could* have gone incomplete (againt those "famous" marginals), but the "fact" remains ... only a very few quarterbacks in the league would have made that throw land where it did as well ...

    In this game the play makers were Favre and Lewis ...

    Pittsburg Game:

    Again, Favre did play pretty well overall in that game (aside from the strip fumble) - The interception (from the throw to Chester Taylor) could have been played differently, but it didn't ... and resulted in a turn over for TD ...

    In this game the play makers were the Steelers Defense (and the Minnesota Defense as well) ...


    I just don't see it as "black and white" as you do ...

    In fact I've been saying that all along ... - If you are going to "fault" players directly ... you should be consistent and not just "biased" ...
     
  25. angryguy77

    angryguy77 Cheesehead

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    That is the dumbest thing I have heard in a long time. For the most part his deep throws have been right on and not "'miracle" as some have claimed here. That deep throw in the ravens game that set them up for the winning score was right there.

    You guys are reaching.

    So by your logic, I will claim that 100% of all GB's sacks are due to AR holding the ball too long and ignore the bad o-line. In fact he sucks because he cant find a check down.

    I have heard a lot of complaining about dropped balls this year. 'the offense would be better but so and so dropped 2 passes...." So those are now Rodgers fault too.

    Lets be adults here and not let hatred make us into hypocrites ok.

    I can play the "lack of reason game" too
     

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