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Pass to RBs more under Lafleur?

Discussion in 'Green Bay Packers Fan Forum' started by GreenBaySlacker, Jun 22, 2019.

  1. GreenBaySlacker

    GreenBaySlacker Cheesehead

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    I'm going to have my annual memory of Edgar Bennett diving like 10 yards down the sideline. Absolutely fully extended, he grabs the tip of the favre bomb and pancakes on the ground. Managing to hold onto the ball.....
    That was the greatest catch.

    So lets assume Lafleur isn't a dumbass, and will not snip rodgers nuts off this year. Lets hope the oline kicks *** so #12 can have some time.

    One of the things id like to see is that dump off to Jones. Get that electric mfer the ball after the defense is spread out.... The warner to faulk dump off was absolutely unstoppable with their 3 recievers and warner smoking everyone down field. It was too easy... Wr not open for 30? Give it to faulk for an easy 10. Like clock work....

    I would also like to mention that this was my money play in Madden.... Send wrs deep and wide. And sneak the rb out of the trenches and streak down the middle .Short fast more than a long bomb. Get him in the middle and hit him in stride....

    Also give rodgers the auto dump to jones or Graham. Once the pressure is felt. And then we can turn a streaky oline into a positive imo.
     
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  2. gopkrs

    gopkrs Cheesehead

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    I remember that play to Edgar. Someone on this board used to continually bad mouth Jones's hands. Totally unwarranted. It was akin to being in Mac's doghouse. Anyway, I certainly think we will see more of that. Both for gains and as a decoy. Well and for some dumping off.
     
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  3. Bob Vance Refrigeration

    Bob Vance Refrigeration Cheesehead

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    Getting Jones involved in the passing game is going to be HUGE for this offense and whether or not it will get back to the top of the league. Look at all the top offenses in the NFL nowadays, every one of them use their RB's in the passing game, A LOT. The Patriots, Saints, Rams and Chargers are all consistently at the top of the league and they all love to use RB's in the pass game. We need to do that as well.
     
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  4. captainWIMM

    captainWIMM Cheesehead

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    The Packers would definitely benefit from getting the running backs more involved in the passing game but Jones hasn't been above average in that area so far.
     
  5. McKnowledge

    McKnowledge Cheesehead

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    I would argue the lack of opportunities in his ability to catch the ball was based on perception. Aaron Jones is a volume based back. MM was on the hot seat (deservedly) all last year and had no patience after Aaron Jones would drop even one pass attempt. He was pushing his agenda of playing Jamaal Williams an equal amount of snaps when clearly (at least last season) Jones was better at running the ball. With this season being completely new as far a regime, scheme, and philosophy; everyone will get ample opportunity to prove themselves.
     
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  6. TomBrownFan40

    TomBrownFan40 Cheesehead

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    I've been lobbying for more check-down for a looooooooooooong time. It's been missing from the Packers offense for a long time. Favre preferred interceptions; Rodgers prefers sacks. I think it was more effective before Fullbackasaurs became extinct during the Jurassic period.
     
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  7. Southside

    Southside Cheesehead

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    The plan is to get the running backs more involved in the passing game. That is a part of the new offense.

    Throughout his career, the offenses in which Matt LaFleur has been involved have done a great job of getting the ball to running backs.

    Dating to his first NFL job in 2009, LaFleur’s teams have thrown the ball to running backs far more frequently than the Packers. Not counting his one season with Notre Dame, the top receiving back on LaFleur’s teams have averaged 47.8 catches per season for more than 400 yards.

    In that same stretch, the Packers’ leading receiving back has averaged just 32.8 catches per season for less than 270 yards.
     
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2019
  8. Packerpug

    Packerpug Cheesehead

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    I am disappointed that Rodgers isn't calling all the plays. He is smart as Payton Manning and should call the plays. I trust him.
     
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  9. Poppa San

    Poppa San Levelheaded Staff Member Moderator

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    The dump off and wheel routes were there last season. Rodgers just rarely took them. I don't have time to dig up all the threads we had on it.
     
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  10. XPack

    XPack Cheesehead

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    Graham's performance on contested catches may have a lot to do that. Also I don't think they had time to gauge our RBs pass catching abilities.

    I think both AJ and JW have decent hands and this added element may keep defences guessing.
     
  11. gbgary

    gbgary Cheesehead

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    in your opening sentence you're saying one thing and then you're hoping the opposite. dump-off was eliminated from rodgers thinking a couple of years after the SB win. hell, when was the last time we ran a simple slant? the new offense is trying to reestablish the use of all his weapons and not just as a last resort but as a first option. there won't be a lot of holding the ball and praying the o-line can keep him upright while he finally does something. MLF says there's no need to play gunslinger anymore as the offense is designed to have an answer for everything. he simply has to run it as it's designed. by doing so it makes the O much less predictable, and takes a ton of pressure off rodgers AND the o-line. the opposing D can't key on anything/anyone. hopefully we're about to see everyone get a lot of touches.
     
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2019
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  12. gopkrs

    gopkrs Cheesehead

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    Just have a little disagreement with the "offense is designed to have an answer for everything" statement. Nice thought though. And I am looking forward to more open receivers.
     
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  13. captainWIMM

    captainWIMM Cheesehead

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    Jones has to prove that he's capable of staying healthy before anyone should advocate for him to get significantly more touches per game.

    LaFleur definitely benefitted from having Freeman, Gurley and Lewis on his teams. The Packers haven't had a running back being as talented catching the ball over the past few years.

    There's no way Rodgers could handle calling all plays.
     
  14. gopkrs

    gopkrs Cheesehead

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    As far as touches for AJ goes. I think you just have to go by the game situation. If he is needed out there; then he should be playing. I don't think you can say "I worry about him getting hurt and so I will limit his snaps." On the other hand, there is no reason to be playing him all the time as Williams ;) is capable of playing during the game and doing a good job. I just don't think it is a problem. Hopefully we don't have a coach ala Bum Philips who is going to run a RB into the ground. That is not the type of offense we have anyway.
     
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  15. sschind

    sschind Cheesehead

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    The offense may be designed to have an answer for everything but does that mean it will have an answer for everything. I agree that AR needs to run the plays as designed but MLF can't see everything. If he calls a play and as they line up and AR sees the defense in either a particularly good position to stop that play or in a bad position to stop something else he should be able to take advantage of that. That is what he is saying and that is what a lot of pundits are saying. He has 12 years in the league and I'm guessing he has learned a thing or two when it comes to reading defenses. From what I read, regarding his comments he never said he wouldn't run MLFs offense (which is what some in the media want to pretend) he is just said he doesn't want to give up his ability to take advantage of some of the things he has learned.

    On one extreme you could have the coach saying "just run the play I call" on the other you could have the QB saying "I'll run whatever I damn well please" If either ends up being the case we are in for a world of hurt as they (coach and QB) will not be able to coexist for very long. Hopefully its somewhere in between. Hopefully each one learns to trust the others decisions enough to work together. AR learns to trust that MLF is making the right calls and MLF learns to trust ARs on field decisions as to when a change in call is needed.
     
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  16. sschind

    sschind Cheesehead

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    If your two RBs are for the most part interchangeable then it doesn't really matter which one is on the field but if they bring two different styles to the table you need to have the right one on the field for the right situation. I AJ is the one who should be on the field for this particular play he should be the one on the field as long as he is able. You can't say "I'd really like it if Jones were in there to run this play but he already has 15 carries so I'll put in someone else" If the game plan calls for Jones' skill set he should be getting the touches. You can't change your game plan or bring in a lesser qualified back to run it just to keep the best qualified one from having too many snaps. If the plan next week lends itself more to Williams' skill set then let him get the touches.

    From what I have seen and heard Jones is a better fit for what MLF wants to do the majority of the time so he should get the majority of the snaps. I don't care how talented a player is you are limiting yourself as an offense if you go in with the mindset that you are only going to give that player 12-15 carries a game no matter what. If the game situation calls for 12-15 carries so be it but if it calls for 25 you can't be afraid to go with that either. If you have to say "we aren't going to give him 20 carries a game because he hasn't shown he can do it I question whether he is the right player for the team.
     
  17. sschind

    sschind Cheesehead

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    and how do you propose he proves he is capable of getting significantly more touches a game if he doesn't get significantly more touches a game? If he goes through the first 6 games with no more than 15 touches and he is healthy does that mean he can finally get 25 carries in game 7?
     
  18. HardRightEdge

    HardRightEdge Cheesehead

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    He's always passed up those throws. Losing just got people noticing them.
     
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  19. captainWIMM

    captainWIMM Cheesehead

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    The coaches definitely have to consider durability when deciding on a player's snap count. It doesn't make any sense to feed Jones the ball if his body can't deal with the punishment.

    Jones staying healthy while receiving more than 160 touches a season would be a good start.
     
  20. gbgary

    gbgary Cheesehead

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    those are the coach's words...not mine.
     
  21. gbgary

    gbgary Cheesehead

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    outside of the two-minute o, scrambling, or the defense doing something completely stupid (like not enough men on the field (or too many), lining up and completely ignoring someone, or something similar) there's no need for rodgers to go off-script and i don't want to see it. it's not just rodgers being defiant, he'd be encouraging it from others...undermining MLF, and making the whole process a waste of time...when there isn't any to waste.
     
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2019
  22. sschind

    sschind Cheesehead

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    You don't know his body can't deal with the punishment until he gets hurt though and if you put him on a snap count you won't know if he is capable of staying healthy or not.

    If you are using the 160 touches he got last year as a bench mark (12 games) does that mean once you get to 13 touches a game you stop using him.

    I'm not saying run him 25 times a game no matter what but if he is being effective and is not hurting you don't pull him just because he reached some arbitrary number of touches or snaps in that particular game. If he gets 25 touches in a game and you are worried he needs a break then you work out a game plan for the following week where he isn't as pivotal.
     
  23. sschind

    sschind Cheesehead

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    I disagree. If Rodgers sees something LaFluer missed and can take advantage of a serious mismatch I don't have a problem with him making the call. Likewise if the defense makes a good guess on the play call and Rodgers thinks they have a good chance of stopping the play and he can change it I'm OK with that as well. For him to change the play just because he wants something different then no, he should't be doing that but he has definitely learned a lot in his 12 years and he should be allowed to use it if the situation warrants it.
     
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  24. Mondio

    Mondio Cheesehead

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    You have a QB like Goff or Eli manning run an offense where the design is what makes it work or fail. If you have Petyon Manning or Aaron Rodgers you don't limit them by saying stick to the script. It doesn't mean they have free reign to do whatever they want, but you do loosen the strings and let them take over at certain times.
     
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  25. FalconsFan2019

    FalconsFan2019 Cheesehead

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    You will like LaFleur. There is a reason he doesn’t want his QB’s to audible. I’m a Falcons fan and remember our fan base being upset when Shannahan did this to Ryan.

    First & Foremost, your offense will be fast paced and rarely huddle. You’ll get to the LOS with 20 seconds left on the play clock. The mic in Rodgers ear won’t shut off until 14 seconds so LaFleur can make the audibles at the LOS in most situations. Inside the RZ, Rodgers should have authority to audible.

    Much of LaFleur’s offense involves pre-snap activity, including extensive use of motion. By the time the protection is set and the eligibles motion, there simply may not be enough time to find the “best” play to run.

    Secondly, it’s about play sequencing in this offense. Rodgers audibled at the LOS on 35% of plays last year. That doesn’t work in this offense. Each play has a purpose that Rodgers may not see.

    Personnel groupings and plays are run in order to set up something else down line or try to get the defense to show its cards. On its face, the play may or may not be ideal in a specific situation, but it may also allow Rodgers, LaFleur, et al to exploit a look later on.
     
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