Pack vs Bears stud n dud

[Mondio]

Studs: Davante Adams (again).
Honorable mention: Mason Crosby.

Duds: Lack of a pass rush (again).
Inconsistent offense.
Punt coverage, on one vital occasion.


I think this team played about as well as it was capable of....Despite playing with a depleted offensive line and their best running back, they kept it from being a blowout to a clearly superior (and healthier) opponent on the road. The Pack lacks big play capability on offense and generates little pressure on defense, and that's a bad combination.

April 25th cannot come fast enough.

That punt was horrible, with the camera angle from the runners back, you could see about 7 GBPackers in an almost vertical line to his right and maybe 3 guys at various levels to his left and a huge gaping lane up the middle and to the left. Horrible, horrible coverage. No discipline, no team concept, just a bunch of guys running down the field to where they haven't quite figured out yet. Critical error during an important time in the game. Again

 

[PackerDNA]

This game was a microcosm of the season. We just can't make the big plays when we need to.

 

[Mondio]

This game was a microcosm of the season. We just can't make the big plays when we need to.

and there were more than a handful out there to make. and when we did make one, the part that needed to take advantage of it laid a big fat turd.

 

[Curly Calhoun]

That punt was horrible, with the camera angle from the runners back, you could see about 7 GBPackers in an almost vertical line to his right and maybe 3 guys at various levels to his left and a huge gaping lane up the middle and to the left. Horrible, horrible coverage. No discipline, no team concept, just a bunch of guys running down the field to where they haven't quite figured out yet. Critical error during an important time in the game. Again

Agreed.

Scott's punts have been mostly unreturnable this season, due to his good hang time. This one was, and the coverage unit got exposed.

The knee-jerk reaction will be "Fire Zook", and perhaps that is part of the problem. Honestly, though, I don't remember when the Pack has had really good special teams (with regard to kick/punt coverage). It's been awhile...….

 

[AmishMafia]

I have no idea why you're doting on Spriggs but he was awful in pass protection. While he might be a decent run blocker there's no reason to believe he will develop into a decent starter at any point.

Wouldn't say I'm doting, but he is playing much better than most realize. What do your buddies at PFF think?

I think many posters are prejudiced based on his struggles last year and dont actually watch him play. As I said, Mack made Bahktiari look really bad on one play. Spriggs could have done better, of course, but he wasnt the garbage posters want to believe.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

The knee-jerk reaction will be "Fire Zook", and perhaps that is part of the problem. Honestly, though, I don't remember when the Pack has had really good special teams (with regard to kick/punt coverage). It's been awhile...….

I wouldn't call firing Zook knee-jerk at all and the second part of your post says why, the Packers special teams has been consistently bad under Zook. Let's hope the new special teams coach can be a bit more creative, teach his players to commit fewer penalties, mental mistakes and poor decisions.

Of all the coaches still on the Packers staff, I am most confident that Zook is gone at the end of the year.

 

[Stanger37]

and there were more than a handful out there to make. and when we did make one, the part that needed to take advantage of it laid a big fat turd.

I live in Chicago, and after the recovered fumble by the Pack. Everyone that is a Bear fan at the house were silent because they're so used to what typically happens. And the big plays were there and Rodgers missed them both. MVS was scoring and had the game 21-14. As soon as they did not capitalize there, the game was all but over. I didn't have my hopes up, but as the game went into the 4th and the Packers were still in it, I started to think the miracle could happen again just to shut these fans up. But that dream was shattered and let's hope Rodgers returns to himself and heals up from this season and makes something happen next year. Not spending on Mack vs. how Rodgers looks right now could be a painful next 4 years.

 

[gopkrs]

Duds:
JK Scott he has underwhelmed. Maybe he is just young and does not have a really good coach.
Arod He had good stats but missed on three open receivers deep
Petine I like what he has done but will give a dud to anyone using a 2 or 3 man rush

Studs:
Davante
And I would say Kendricks. Nice to see him getting involved

 

[Cornelius Weems]

Rodgers is just a mediocre quarterback...

Um, Bears fan? Vikings fan? Joke? Maybe you shouldn't post if you don't know what you are talking about, sheesh. Our only other option is DK. He looked terrible when he played. Posting utter garbage like this is absurd. So what if he hasn't looked up to his standard this year? He set the bar really, really high. I wasn't expecting much after MM was fired anyway. Time to cut some people and reload."Rodgers is just a mediocre quarterback". If that's how you feel, then please, stop posting.

 

[Stanger37]

We ended up getting Jaire with our highest pick, so the Derwin James move isn't a disaster. I think Jackson will be better year 2, at least he better be. I don't know many people that liked the Graham signing from the start.

I am not expert by any means, but it seems like Josh has a chance to make plays, but he throws himself at the WR to make a tackle instead of just wrapping them up and making a play. Alexander does the same thing at times. But it was especially prevalent yesterday on a few plays Jackson whiffed on. I think all the young DBs will be better year two. Their depth has gone directly down the toilet and I think a lot more was expected out of them this year than originally anticipated. Next year will be a true test.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I am not expert by any means, but it seems like Josh has a chance to make plays, but he throws himself at the WR to make a tackle instead of just wrapping them up and making a play. Alexander does the same thing at times. But it was especially prevalent yesterday on a few plays Jackson whiffed on. I think all the young DBs will be better year two. Their depth has gone directly down the toilet and I think a lot more was expected out of them this year than originally anticipated. Next year will be a true test.

I know there will be a few posters who disagree with me here and we don't need to bring up the "Joe Whitt debate" again, but I am hopeful that some new coaches will do more with the players we already have on defense, especially the secondary. Time to find some coaches who actually coach these guys up!

 

[Mondio]

Um, Bears fan? Vikings fan? Joke? Maybe you shouldn't post if you don't know what you are talking about, sheesh. Our only other option is DK. He looked terrible when he played. Posting utter garbage like this is absurd. So what if he hasn't looked up to his standard this year? He set the bar really, really high. I wasn't expecting much after MM was fired anyway. Time to cut some people and reload."Rodgers is just a mediocre quarterback". If that's how you feel, then please, stop posting.

There are a lot of QB's making those passes in the NFL and they aren't making 30+million dollars per year. I'll say, I am absolutely fine if this is all Rodgers is going to be from here on out. It's an acceptable level, but give us half that cap space back so we can go get other players. If he is going to be paid like the best, then he must play far better than he has, yesterday included. So many times at critical moments this year i've seen some bad passes

The dirt pass to MVS one week on a crucial 3rd down. The next week, dirt pass on a 2 yard 3rd down play to EQ and then overthrow a 10 yard pass to a wide open Adams in the Endzone on the very next play. It's been on a week to week basis. Just yesterday, we get a giant break, one I thought we'd take the lead and ride it to victory and i saw the most uninspiring offense ever. Over threw wide open Cobb and then badly badly missed MVS. I know that was a long throw, but it was also a TD and at 30+ million he should be able to hit at least 1 of them. But there were 3-4 poor to bad misses of Cobb yesterday, and one nice one that Cobb then dropped. Over throw to MVS that would have been a TD. Him and EQ couldn't connect on another drive and the play was right there to be made instead it was another missed opportunity. Graham needs to make catches, but you can't keep a defender off you and make the catch when the ball is zipped behind you. I blame both of them for that. There were 21 points in missed opportunities in just 3 plays all involving the QB. Make at least 1 of them. that's not expecting him to be superman.

 

[swhitset]

Agreed.

Scott's punts have been mostly unreturnable this season, due to his good hang time. This one was, and the coverage unit got exposed.

The knee-jerk reaction will be "Fire Zook", and perhaps that is part of the problem. Honestly, though, I don't remember when the Pack has had really good special teams (with regard to kick/punt coverage). It's been awhile...….

I’m not defending Zook, but it has been pretty well established that this team needs a talent upgrade. One should consider that special teams is filled with non starters. If the team is not deep on talent, it stands to reason that special teams will not be filled with great players.

 

[Cornelius Weems]

There are a lot of QB's making those passes in the NFL and they aren't making 30+million dollars per year. I'll say, I am absolutely fine if this is all Rodgers is going to be from here on out. It's an acceptable level, but give us half that cap space back so we can go get other players. If he is going to be paid like the best, then he must play far better than he has, yesterday included. So many times at critical moments this year i've seen some bad passes

The dirt pass to MVS one week on a crucial 3rd down. The next week, dirt pass on a 2 yard 3rd down play to EQ and then overthrow a 10 yard pass to a wide open Adams in the Endzone on the very next play. It's been on a week to week basis. Just yesterday, we get a giant break, one I thought we'd take the lead and ride it to victory and i saw the most uninspiring offense ever. Over threw wide open Cobb and then badly badly missed MVS. I know that was a long throw, but it was also a TD and at 30+ million he should be able to hit at least 1 of them. But there were 3-4 poor to bad misses of Cobb yesterday, and one nice one that Cobb then dropped. Over throw to MVS that would have been a TD. Him and EQ couldn't connect on another drive and the play was right there to be made instead it was another missed opportunity. Graham needs to make catches, but you can't keep a defender off you and make the catch when the ball is zipped behind you. I blame both of them for that. There were 21 points in missed opportunities in just 3 plays all involving the QB. Make at least 1 of them. that's not expecting him to be superman.

I'm not arguing that he has been stellar this year, but our only other options, are really bad. Just let's keep in mind that we would only be thinking about the Farve years kindly (recently), if we didn't draft him. Look this is the going rate for QB's these days. Of course he was going to set the Market. Hell, the Queens gave Cousins 84 million guaranteed. I was expecting MM to be fired years ago. Yesterday was no big shocker. The Bears have one of, if not the best defense in the league. Let's not forget that we only won that 1st game because of Rodgers (with a little help from Cobb). Studs: there really weren't any. Duds: the whole team, no one gets a pass.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I’m not defending Zook, but it has been pretty well established that this team needs a talent upgrade. One should consider that special teams is filled with non starters. If the team is not deep on talent, it stands to reason that special teams will not be filled with great players.

While I would agree that the Packers need some more talented players and better depth, Zook wasn't a very good coach even when the Packers were making the playoffs in 2014 (Zook was assistant special teams coordinator), 2015 and 2016.

https://www.acmepackingcompany.com/...able-for-the-packers-incoherent-special-teams

 

[swhitset]

While I would agree that the Packers need some more talented players and better depth, Zook wasn't a very good coach even when the Packers were making the playoffs in 2014 (Zook was assistant special teams coordinator), 2015 and 2016.

https://www.acmepackingcompany.com/...able-for-the-packers-incoherent-special-teams

No argument from me... I too think Zook needs to go.

 

[Mondio]

he's going, he's going

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

No argument from me... I too think Zook needs to go.

Glad I convinced you LOL.....I knew you were already on board

I don't expect miracles and gadget plays on every special teams play, but Zook shows no imagination with his special teams units. But even more important, his units seem to play with a lack of knowledge and discipline.

First Bear punt yesterday, Cobb is back calling for a fair catch and I think it was S Eddie Pleasant engages with a Bear and takes himself and the Bear player right into Cobb. Surprised Cobb held onto the ball or it didn't deflect off Pleasant. But come on, either Cobb isn't yelling loud enough or Pleasant isn't listening or.....Zook hasn't coached this simple fundamental of getting away from the punted ball and return man who just called for a fair catch. Given that it isn't the first time its happened, I have to start pointing fingers at the coach.

 

[El Guapo]

First Bear punt yesterday, Cobb is back calling for a fair catch and I think it was S Eddie Pleasant engages with a Bear and takes himself and the Bear player right into Cobb. Surprised Cobb held onto the ball or it didn't deflect off Pleasant. But come on, either Cobb isn't yelling loud enough or Pleasant isn't listening or.....Zook hasn't coached this simple fundamental of getting away from the punted ball and return man who just called for a fair catch. Given that it isn't the first time its happened, I have to start pointing fingers at the coach.

Third option is that Pleasant wasn't smart enough to have the field awareness. He's been here only two weeks so I'm not sure about his strengths and weaknesses. They through him in to the LB position yesterday for goodness sakes!

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Third option is that Pleasant wasn't smart enough to have the field awareness. He's been here only two weeks so I'm not sure about his strengths and weaknesses. They through him in to the LB position yesterday for goodness sakes!

I thought about that so I had to look Eddie up. The dude has been in the league since 2012! Field awareness on special teams is probably something he should know by now. Now coordinating it with the 10 new guys he is working with, that is the Coaches job to coach him on.

I still would love to know what communications Zook has the punt returner use with the other 10 guys, because whatever it is, it doesn't seem to work. Way to often I see a Packer returner make his decision (fair catch, let it hit or return it) and it appears that his teammates have no clue what the plan is.

 

[HardRightEdge]

I thought about that so I had to look Eddie up. The dude has been in the league since 2012! Field awareness on special teams is probably something he should know by now. Now coordinating it with the 10 new guys he is working with, that is the Coaches job to coach him on.

I still would love to know what communications Zook has the punt returner use with the other 10 guys, because whatever it is, it doesn't seem to work. Way to often I see a Packer returner make his decision (fair catch, let it hit or return it) and it appears that his teammates have no clue what the plan is.

How can you have a "plan" on a punt return when nobody knows where the ball is going in advance, and once it is kicked they're busy blocking and can't actually be tracking the ball. Somebody might be yelling where the ball is heading or the blocker might get a glimpse of its general direction, but it's not like a blocker can be looking up to reckon where it is going to land with any precision. The blocker probably has a better idea of where it is going by where the guy he's blocking is running. For example, if a right side gunner is trying to angle toward the middle, the blocker probably isn't seeing the ball at all and must reckon the kick is going left. In that case he'd want to seal block him away from the middle.

The returner doesn't "plan" to fair catch, return or let the ball hit the ground until the play is well underway, around the last second before the ball lands.

Put returns are kind of a loosly structured free-for-all. Successful returns boil down to enough blockers slowing down enough tacklers to give the returner space while mostly having to do with the returner's knack for the job.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I'm pretty sure and this video somewhat confirms at least "poison" or "peter" is yelled by the returner in the event of a Fair catch or him planning on letting the ball bounce. I guess Zook and the Packers don't know what a "poison peter" is.

https://www.facebook.com/NFLFilms/v...from-the-football-on-a-pun/10154929034328615/

 

[PackAttack12]

The Packers have never had an elite special teams unit under Zook's watch.

Buh-bye.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

Wouldn't say I'm doting, but he is playing much better than most realize. What do your buddies at PFF think?

I think many posters are prejudiced based on his struggles last year and dont actually watch him play. As I said, Mack made Bahktiari look really bad on one play. Spriggs could have done better, of course, but he wasnt the garbage posters want to believe.

Oddly enough, considering how bad he was earlier, he's currently the 52nd ranked tackle, which is a big improvement. According to PFF, he was pretty decent against AZ and ATL (not great but awful) and then was awful against the Bears. Looking at his season, he's been decent against teams where he can be helped against an elite pass rusher (AZ) but he's pretty bad when a team can't consistently help him against great pass rushers (Minn, Chi). I base that statement on my biased view as a fan that views him as yet another wasted TT pick coupled with looking at a bar chart from PFF's website.

I also enjoy the disdain that some hold for PFF. They aren't perfect but until someone else can point me in the direction of someone who rates every player on every team, I'll take their relative rankings over fans who only watch one team and have no actual context.

 

[sschind]

The contract we gave him was just the price of doing business when paying QBs. You really can't second-guess it.

With that said, he's not worth it by a long shot at this point, and if the rest of his career is going to be similar it's going to be awhile before we turn this around.

I'm not sure any of these guys will ever be worth the deals they get but its something that needs to be done if you don't want to be looking for a new QB every time your current one's rookie deal is up. Franchise QBs will always get paid and if you have one you want to keep them.

I agree they could have waited but most people who wanted to wait were wondering if the shoulder would hold up and IMO it wasn't/isn't the shoulder that is causing him problems its the leg and between the shoulders (and a little higher up for those who would reply "his neck")